22 Killed in US school Shooting

[25]

Do some research and don't discredit someone just because they're advocating a side. 

Lott doesn't need to be discredited for advocating anything, he has already discredited his own work (on the initial "More Guns, Less Crime" paper) when he asked to have his name removed from it - even though he was the primary author. He discredited his own data by changing his coding to manipulate the outcomes, especially in the Replies between himself and the Ayres & Donohue  papers. And he discredited his integrity when he admitted to using a pseudonym to argue with his critics online and to shill for his papers, telling people to download them as often as possible so that they get more attention, and writing fake reviews of his books on frigging Amazon.com.

Lott is not a credible source. If you weren't aware of that, I suggest doing your own research instead of assuming the ignorance of others.

[SLCPUNK]

(Waiting for Ann Coulter clip n paste job.)

[cliffburton]

(Waiting for Ann Coulter clip n paste job.)

Don't worry I have no more interest in getting involved in disucssion with you.  After the low blow you/Bud Fox took yesterday accusing me of numerous lies and crimes against you, I've realized you have no intention of following any code of ethics or fair debate.  When you can't outwit or debate someone, you result to the lowest forms of attack possible.  Shame on you for dishonoring those 32 vicitims by using that tragedy in your libel.

[Timothy]

(Waiting for Ann Coulter clip n paste job.)

Don't worry I have no more interest in getting involved in disucssion with you.  After the low blow you/Bud Fox took yesterday accusing me of numerous lies and crimes against you, I've realized you have no intention of following any code of ethics or fair debate.  When you can't outwit or debate someone, you result to the lowest forms of attack possible.  Shame on you for dishonoring those 32 vicitims by using that tragedy in your libel.

yet you just did....

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

are you guys still talking about v tech ?

south africa shows just got cancelled guys !!!!!!! DO YOU UNDERSTAND !!!!111!?!!!!

[Edward Rose]

Americans will never learn. The truth will never come out about why this happened. The reason the truth will never come out is because ever since Ronald Reagan was sworn in, mental health in this country has taken a back seat as crazy people were literally let out onto the streets in droves. The money that should be used to treat those people is now lining the pockets of fat mafia fucks and crooked politicians.

Your (U.S.) news media now has over 40 video clips sent to NBC by the shooter. They won't show them and they never will, using the excuse that it's taseless and insulting to the famlies of the victims. BOLLOCKS!

You will never know the reasons and so the problems that cause this kind of thing will never be addressed. You are powerless to do nothing more than wait for the next soldiers in Jodie Foster's Army, and hope that YOUR children aren't their next victims.

(JFA / Jodie Foster's Army, is a punk band from the 80's that was named after an idea... an idea of what would happen when crazy people are ignored in a country with little or no gun control. The actresses name was used because the schizophrenic who shot at Ronald Reagan in 1981 was "doing it for Jodie Foster")

[SLCPUNK]

Don't worry I have no more interest in getting involved in disucssion with you.  After the low blow you/Bud Fox took yesterday accusing me of numerous lies and crimes against you, I've realized you have no intention of following any code of ethics or fair debate.  When you can't outwit or debate someone, you result to the lowest forms of attack possible.  Shame on you for dishonoring those 32 vicitims by using that tragedy in your libel.

I have no idea of what you are talking about.

It's odd that everything you accuse others of doing, actually mirrors your actions. Veiled threats, false identities, personal attacks, dishonesty etc...nobody here buys your Karl Rove tactics. Most of the right wing morons have either left or been banned by now, and the "say it, 'til it becomes the truth" doesn't work for the remaining posters here. Don't get me wrong, you are free to say it, but the only person you are fooling is yourself.

And on the contrary you have done nothing in this thread but use the death of these kids to push your gun agenda with discredited data. Now go cry about being picked on somewhere else, nobody gives a shit.

[LunsJail]

Americans will never learn. The truth will never come out about why this happened. The reason the truth will never come out is because ever since Ronald Reagan was sworn in, mental health in this country has taken a back seat as crazy people were literally let out onto the streets in droves. The money that should be used to treat those people is now lining the pockets of fat mafia fucks and crooked politicians.

Your (U.S.) news media now has over 40 video clips sent to NBC by the shooter. They won't show them and they never will, using the excuse that it's taseless and insulting to the famlies of the victims. BOLLOCKS!

Actually, NBC and other news outlets showed many of those video clips and only stopped when victims families dropped out of interviews with NBC.? Most people didn't like the fact that the killer was getting what he wanted all along by painting his whole martyr self-portrait on national television.

Don't think for a second that the problem of mental illness is somehow limited to the US.  There are millions of mentally ill people all over the world, most of them don't walk in a building and kill 31 other people.

[Edward Rose]

Americans will never learn. The truth will never come out about why this happened. The reason the truth will never come out is because ever since Ronald Reagan was sworn in, mental health in this country has taken a back seat as crazy people were literally let out onto the streets in droves. The money that should be used to treat those people is now lining the pockets of fat mafia fucks and crooked politicians.

Your (U.S.) news media now has over 40 video clips sent to NBC by the shooter. They won't show them and they never will, using the excuse that it's taseless and insulting to the famlies of the victims. BOLLOCKS!

Actually, NBC and other news outlets showed many of those video clips and only stopped when victims families dropped out of interviews with NBC.  Most people didn't like the fact that the killer was getting what he wanted all along by painting his whole martyr self-portrait on national television.

That's what happens every time. This is a free country. We even have YOUTUBE now. Those media outlets should have the right to post every clip without fear from a bunch of psychophant victims' relatives. There was a time when Americans were curious to learn what made people do things like this and try to learn from it and prevent it. Now everyone plays into the bollocks.

Don't think for a second that the problem of mental illness is somehow limited to the US.  There are millions of mentally ill people all over the world, most of them don't walk in a building and kill 31 other people.

Of course mental illness isn't limited to the U.S. But the U.S. just has more gun stores than gas stations.  And the U.S. ignores more mentally ill people than any advanced country because tax dollars are funneling into the pockets of fat mafia fucks and crooked politicians. The money is actually GONE now. They can't even reverse if they wanted to. That's why more people are going to die. And every time anti-deppresants cause shit like this you never hear mcuh about it because it's a multi-billion dollar drug industry. The fucking prescription pills are being given out like candy. You think that South Park episode was a joke? Think again. 

The POLICE were even called on this kid... school administartors. NOT A WORD ABOUT THAT NOW! People should be fired or go to jail for this. But it won't happen. Just like no one who let 9/11 happen were punished and no one who let those black people in New Orleans drown were punished.

The irony is what cracks ME up. Reagan was the one who started letting these mentally ill people onto the streets, and then he was shot by a schizophrenic               

There was this old TV show from the mid-70's... before they let the crazy people go, called "Welcome Back Cotter." Some of the 30+ crowd here probably remember it. But there were always these scenes where they would pick up some crazy guy and throw him into the holding cell to be "processed into Belvue," which was a famous New York City mental hospital.

Well guess what? The reasons for which they were arresting those guys, are things that happen on city steets every day now.... UNCHECKED!

Perspective my friend, perspective. Jodie Foster's Army will continue their battle, and YOUR children might be next.

(JFA / Jodie Foster's Army, is a punk band from the 80's that was named after an idea... an idea of what would happen when crazy people are ignored in a country with little or no gun control. The actresses name was used because the schizophrenic who shot at Ronald Reagan in 1981 was "doing it for Jodie Foster")

[25]

The money that should be used to treat those people is now lining the pockets of fat mafia fucks and crooked politicians.

You mean HMOs and their lobbyists?

[freedom78]

The irony is what cracks ME up. Reagan was the one who started letting these mentally ill people onto the streets, and then he was shot by a schizophrenic               

Glad to know someone took joy in that. 

Oh...and much love to the hypocrites who hate the US for being involved worldwide, yet jump on a crisis like this as an opportunity to tell us what's wrong with our country and how it should be run.   

[Krispy Kreme]

Back on topic: this makes me incredibly sad. I work with college-aged kids every day, and they have their whole lives in front of them. Some will go on to do great things and help society. To lose any one of them is a sadness, not only to the families, but also  to society. I am so sorry.

[Edward Rose]

I just realized that the S. African shows were cancelled 2 days after it was discovered that the V-Tech shooter used the Mr. Brownstone lyrics in one of his plays. Might be unrealted, but it's been a reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeealy long time now with no word from gunsnroses.com since cancelling the S.A. shows. (3 days and still no official word aout S.A. dates)

[TAP]

http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=195909

An Emmanuel College professor has been fired after re-enacting the Virginia Tech massacre in his classroom in order to air a pro-gun viewpoint that offended students at the Catholic liberal arts school, the professor charged yesterday.
     Nicholas Winset said he was terminated and permanently barred from campus following a Wednesday lecture in which he dramatized the massacre to show that deranged gunman Cho Seung-Hui could have been stopped if another student had been carrying a gun.
     ?If there were more guns in society, the response time to the (rampage) might have been much faster,? said Winset, an adjunct professor of financial accounting. ?Someone might have been able to do something to stop it.?


    In an interview yesterday, Winset also decried media coverage of the massacre, saying, ?Just because everyone is portraying this as the national tragedy of the year doesn?t mean it is. More people died of AIDS today? than in the massacre, he said.
     Administrators at the college apparently did not appreciate Winset?s classroom message. They quickly fired him via a one-page letter delivered by courier yesterday.
     ?You are hereby directed not to enter the College campus or any College owned property at any time for any reason,? the letter states. ?Also enclosed . . .is the Commonwealth of Massachusetts form, How to File for Unemployment Insurance Benefits.?
     A spokeswoman for Emmanuel College, Molly Honan, would not give the college?s rationale for firing Winset. She said the school?s policy is not to comment on personnel issues.
     Winset, 37, of Newton called the college?s decision to fire him ?pathetic,? and said it will have a ?chilling effect? on professors? willingness to engage in open discussions about controversial issues.
     ?A classroom is supposed to be a place for academic exploration,? he said. ?It?s just gotten so politically correct. It?s sad that we have come to this point.?
     Winset said he gave students a disclaimer before he started his Virginia Tech re-enactment, which involved him pointing a Magic Marker at students and saying, ?Pow.? He then had another student shoot him with an imaginary gun to make the point that Cho could have been stopped by another student with a firearm.
     Winset said the skit was meant to be a somewhat tenuous segue into an assignment asking students to examine whether the massacre has had an impact on the financial markets, which have remained healthy in tragedy?s aftermath. He said he wanted students to see that intense media focus on a story does not always mean it has the same relevance to the markets or to society in general.?

[cliffburton]

I read about this earlier.  Just goes to show how open minded and free speech oriented people in academia really are.  You have Ward Churchills who never even get reprimanded and this guy makes a very valid, down to earth point and they fire his ass.  I guess the cardinal rule is don't break a liberal's fragile ego and comfort zone.  Maybe they can fire the next gunman who comes in and waste people, I'm sure he'll care.

[The Dog]

I read about this earlier.? Just goes to show how open minded and free speech oriented people in academia really are.? You have Ward Churchills who never even get reprimanded and this guy makes a very valid, down to earth point and they fire his ass.? I guess the cardinal rule is don't break a liberal's fragile ego and comfort zone.? Maybe they can fire the next gunman who comes in and waste people, I'm sure he'll care.

Welcome back Flagg 

I actually agree with you here, this was absolutely ridiculous.  But lets not pretend this is happening all over the country.  its an isolated incident.

[The Dog]

The irony is what cracks ME up. Reagan was the one who started letting these mentally ill people onto the streets, and then he was shot by a schizophrenic? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

Glad to know someone took joy in that.?

Oh...and much love to the hypocrites who hate the US for being involved worldwide, yet jump on a crisis like this as an opportunity to tell us what's wrong with our country and how it should be run.? ?

well said my friend. 

[SLCPUNK]

I actually agree with you here, this was absolutely ridiculous.  But lets not pretend this is happening all over the country.  its an isolated incident.

It was too soon after the tragedy. If he had done this exercise 6-12 months down the road I doubt the reaction would have been as drastic.

[Timothy]

I actually agree with you here, this was absolutely ridiculous.  But lets not pretend this is happening all over the country.  its an isolated incident.

It was too soon after the tragedy. If he had done this exercise 6-12 months down the road I doubt the reaction would have been as drastic.

yeah it was just a little to soon . I don't think that dude should have been fired.when you start telling teacher how to teach their class's then why the hell have them.

[Edward Rose]

From The Q Daily...

-----------------------------------------------------

http://news.q4music.com/2007/04/q_blog_virginia_tech_massacre.html

Virginia Tech massacre



Yesterday we predicted that it was only a matter of time before some band or artist was blamed for warping the mind of Cho Seung-Hui, the Virginia Tech gunman. After the Columbine shootings in 1999, much was made of the fact that the students responsible, Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris, were Marilyn Manson fans. This later turned out to be false - but Manson was pilloried all the same, forced to cancel his US tour under pressure from Christian protest groups. His career never recovered.

Well, lo and behold, today the media is buzzing with speculation that Cho Seung-Hui may have been incited to murder by Guns N' Roses. Details are sketchy but it seems the killer once wrote a play which takes its name from the GN'R song Mr. Brownstone. It tells of a gang of 17-year-olds who skip school to gamble at a casino and fantasize about murdering their teacher. The play apparently goes through the lyrics of the entire GN'R song, relating Mr. Brownstone to the teacher the main characters want to kill.

Once again, a rock band comes under fire for the actions of an unhinged individual. Why this need to find a scapegoat? If anyone is responsible, beyond the killer himself, it is surely those responsible for upholding America's gun laws, which ensure that getting hold of murderous weapons remains laughably easy, even as the murder rate spirals out of control.

But the NRA is too vast and nebulous a target. People need easy targets, and that's why we can expect to see Axl Rose denounced by ill-informed moral guardians in the coming weeks.

Entirely gratuitously, here's a live version of Mr Brownstone, from back when Guns N'Roses really were the 'most dangerous band in the world'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9O82ydYL_c