Do you believe in god? Why?

[GnRNightrain]

And that's absolutely true.  Our national motto "One nation under God" does not in any way state "One nation under Jesus".  Christians like to believe our government was founded on Christian ideology.  See, a Christian will point to laws against murder, rape, stealing, etc, and say that based on those, our government is based on Christian principles.

If these are not Christian concepts, but general concepts, then why are they challenged under establishment of religion?

If our laws were founded on the principles of Christianity...

Why is taking the lord's name in vain not a crime?

Free speech

Why is it not a crime to work on the Sabbath day?  (the bible states that he who does this shall be killed!)
Why is it not a crime to engage in premarital sex?
Why is it not a crime to commit adultery?
Why is divorce legal?
Why is it not a crime to marry someone who has been divorced?

Ill bet if you look through history you can find laws in most states that are similar to all of these.  However, many of them are challenged today for being unconstitutional that is one reason why they no longer exist, furthermore much of this stuff is more socially accepted now.

Does anyone honestly believe that murder would not be a crime were it not for Christianity?  Do you think that I wouldn't know better than to kill someone if Christianity were not there to teach me that?

Ask the moral relativists why murder is wrong?

I say bollocks, the human race is indeed intuitive enough to know why it isn't good to kill, rape, and steal.  They are basic principles of humanity, and they feasibly existed long before the bible was written.  

Ask many of the Muslims in the middle east, they dont follow your basic principles.

Just because some of our laws happen to coincide with Christianity does not make America a nation founded upon Christian principles.  

Your right, but the fact that these people were influenced by religion when passing these laws does.  IN fact these are laws that were around from Common Law which is basically derived from Christian ideals.

If it were, none of us would enjoy the freedom we do.  And I don't even need to explain that; just look at any nation in the world governed by a religion, you have suicide bombings, excessive religious fanaticism, extreme oppression, and overall mass chaos.

Most of these countries just happen to be islamic also.  Interesting.
 

Christianity gets a good name because of our democracy, not vice versa.  It's the adament separation of church and state which set us apart from all third world countries ravaged by religion.

Well you have to realize that the people that created this country were strongly religious and Christian.  Its an adament of capitalism, democracy and limited government.  In fact you will see that most religion in schools and government etc wasnt challenged in the Supreme Court till the 20th century.

[Mattman]

Recently someone very, very close to me died - my dog.  He had had cancer, and I prayed to God to help him get better, but obviously it didn't work.  Does prayer ever really work?  I know that whenever I go to church, they always pray for world peace and for leaders to make wise decisions.  Ha ha, good one.  I think I'm starting to believe that prayer doesn't really work, that God is unconcerned with human affairs.

I believe in God.  I suppose that originates in that it is the way I was brought up.  My family is Anglican Christian, and we go to church maybe once or twice a month.  That said, my beliefs are more varied than that, and sometimes I wonder if I'm even Christian at all, strictly speaking.  Let's see...I believe in God, and I believe that Jesus was the Messiah and God's son.  So I suppose that that makes me a Christian, as it is the central point of my religious beliefs.  But there's a lot of things I think that doesn't agree necessarily with Christian dogma.  Liberal Christian, I suppose you might call me.  I'm pro-choice, support gay marriage, and of course I believe evolution.  But here's the clincher.  I don't think, like a lot of religious people, that theirs is the only right religion.  Personally, I think all God wants is for you to believe in Him/Her/It, and doesn't care whether you're Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.

I don't believe that all atheists are doomed to hell.  See, the thing is, whether you're religious or not really has very little bearing on whether or not you're a good person.  I know lots of atheists who are really good people, very caring.  And then you have the Taliban, who are complete bastards, but very religious.  Basically, the problem with religion lies in interpretation.  So many atrocities have been justified in the name of religion.  I don't think that a just God would send 9/11 terrorists to heaven and the nice atheist lady from down the street to hell, just for that reason.  I think that if you live a good life and live by the principles of the Ten Commandments, even unconsciously or if you're an atheist, you should go to heaven.

Lately I've been reading about God and talking about it in my Philosophy class, and I've heard some arguments for the existence of God.  To me, the most compelling is this.  Everything has a cause and effect relationship. For everything that happens, there is a cause, and for each of those causes there is a cause, stretching all the way back to the beginning of time.  But what about the first cause, at the beginning of time?  Like, what caused the Big Bang?  What caused the first spark of life on Earth?  To me, the only answer is God.  At the very least, God is the Original Cause, of life and the universe.  I have no idea about anything else, but I am firm in my belief of God as Creator.

Something that bothers me is the current perception of religious people, and especially Christians, in modern society.  When I say, "I'm Christian", you think: he's always talking about Jesus, he's conservative and right-wing, he likes Christian rock.  Gimme a break.  I don't like it how we have this narrow perception of Christians.  Before, most people were Christian and you didn't think too much about it, it was just a thing.  Nowadays, when there's a lot of people who aren't religious, when they think of "Christians" they think of the Moral Majority.  Maybe it's just me, but I'm just a normal guy who happens to be Christian, I don't go around knocking on people's doors.  I go to church, but I wear Iron Maiden t-shirts.  You know, just do my own thing.  I think a lot of Christians are the same way, but they get overshadowed by the God Squad clique.

[SLCPUNK]

Christianity gets a good name because of our democracy, not vice versa.  It's the adament separation of church and state which set us apart from all third world countries ravaged by religion.

 Yes.  If fundamentalist Christians had their way they would impose their moral laws on the people.  Thus taking away from a true democracy.

Look at cultures run by religion. Hell, even the Mormon culture is oppresive towards their women. The non Mormons in my state HATE the Mormons because they actually run the state and pass laws that are entirely based on their religious beliefs. That is not democracy. That is religion running the state. They may have one token non-Mormon on certain boards to say it's fair. But anybody with a brain understands what goes on here.

How do you define democracy?  Democracy is the will of the people.  Usually majority rule.  Therefore, if they can pass the law by being in the majority how it that non-democratic?

Democracy that this country is founded on. That is how I define democracy. The LDS culture here goes against everything this country was founded on. Yes, obviously it is the majority, but they take their beliefs and incorporate them in the law here. So that is in direct violation of church and state.

If the department of alcohol and beverage control has 4 out of 5 memebers who are LDS, how is that democratic?

[D]

sometimes matt u dont get any answers cause u ask the wrong questions

death is inevitable for every living thing, u cannot pray not to die, cause we all die in the end

for instance u cant pray for a new car and wake up the next day and a new car be sitting in your driveway

sometimes what u may think u need really isnt

things happen when they are suppose to happen

i use to be cynical and not believe in fate and destiny but a bunch of shit happened to me that made me believe otherwise

i dont believe GOD is pulling on the strings, i think he created the universe and created life and everything  buti think ultimately alot of stuff is up to us to figure out on our own


GOD constantly tests us, u have to go thru tribulations and hard times to find the light at the end of the tunnel

no matter how horrible my life has been ive never cursed GOD or blamed GOD and going thru all ive went thru has really shaped me and made me so strong and i have an inner strength that no body can touch or inflitrate

before i went thru all i went thru i didnt have that

thats why people who do drugs and drink and what have u to get over pain are robbing themselves

there is so much clarity and beauty in pain, so much u can learn about yourself and so much growing u do during that pain and people ignore that by medicated themselves where as they could be on the road to inner peace and clarity but have no faith to get thru those hard times

i never lose my faith, my heart never dies and im alive and typing on this computer rightnow because of my faith


what ive been thru most people wouldve committed suicide, oded be in a psychiatric hospital or prison

but faith has saw me thru and now i feel GOD everywhere!

[Chris Misfit]

maybe its fear instilled in me since i was a child but i would be scared to death to blashpheme like some of u have on here

So you admit that your belief may only be there because it was forced? I ain't knocking your belief, but how can you say there's a good god alive when you see the pain in the world. He must be a sadistic bastard (well if you've read the bible you'll already know he's a bit of a psycotic killer).

Like i said on the board before. I believe there is a higher power, I have no proof, but it's what I believe. If the bible god existed, I believe he's now dead, because there'd be no way he could stand back and let the shit that happens today, er, happen.

[Mal Brossard]

now some people in myopinion go way overboard with it

like athletes

"GOD allowed me to win tonight" he helped me score that touchdown

thats is crap,

i hate when athletes give GOD human characteristics like he is up in heaven rooting for  a particular team

Like George Carlin says, where's God when they lose?  What, did the good Lord come down and knock the ball away from you at the last second?  Jesus forced the fumble on the two yard line?

[D]

thats a good one duffman!

i meant the fear of GOD was instilled in me


i believe in GOD regardless


yes the world is a horrible place but its not like we are pawns in GODs chess game

the Devil has alot to do with the evils of the world as well

the Devil tempts us and promotes evil within us

like i said

i think GOD created the universe, gave us life but its up to us to figure out how to live and what to do with that life and to make the best possible decisions for our lives to be happy and content

[matt88]

Nope...never have. Way to far fetched to be real.

If god or jesus had the power to stop shit that goes on in the world then i'd like to see him do it.

[Dot]

I believe in God for lots of reasons, I?ve had things happen in my life that can?t be just due to pure fate,also, I think that life?s too complicated to go at it alone without the guidance of a higher power. Ther are things in life that are just too perfect or nearly perfect to have been created on their own without any intentions to create them(take the human body for example). Has any of you seen the Pope? man, what you feel when you see him is something undescribable, can?t find the words to explain. those are my reasons.

Matt88, if someone doesn?t do something for you, don?t you think it means that he/she just doesn?t want to for some reason?

[journey]

I love and believe in God.  Why? Because, he's my best friend.

I went to church for 14 years, from the time I was an infant until I was 14. My family and I stopped going for personal reasons. From going to church, I learned all the facts about Jesus, I knew the bible songs, and I memorized the prayer to recite, but I never felt close to God. I always thought that only the 'higher ups' could communicate with God on a one to one level.   But, as I got older life became more overwhelming and I needed emotional support and spiritual guidance. So, I started to pray and things began to change in me.  Great things have happened that I can't really explain. It's just something that everyone has to feel in order to understand.

A lot of people doubt God's existence, because of all the bad things that happen in the world, but like SLC said, we create our own misery and suffering. We're supposed to take care of one another, not hurt each other. It's like when you have children, you can't always be there with them wherever they are, you just have to hope that they make good decisions and treat others with respect. Because, God gave us all free will, so that we could learn to make our own decisions. That's the only way we can learn anything.

"I believe God loves the world through us. We are real carriers of His love. Especially in times like these when people are trying to make God 'was', it is you and I, by our love, by the purity of our lives, by our compassion, who prove to the world that God 'is'." - Mother Teresa

[D]

I love and believe in God.  Why? Because, he's my best friend.

I went to church for 14 years, from the time I was an infant until I was 14. My family and I stopped going for personal reasons. From going to church, I learned all the facts about Jesus, I knew the bible songs, and I memorized the prayer to recite, but I never felt close to God. I always thought that only the 'higher ups' could communicate with God on a one to one level.   But, as I got older life became more overwhelming and I needed emotional support and spiritual guidance. So, I started to pray and things began to change in me.  Great things have happened that I can't really explain. It's just something that everyone has to feel in order to understand.

A lot of people doubt God's existence, because of all the bad things that happen in the world, but like SLC said, we create our own misery and suffering. We're supposed to take care of one another, not hurt each other. It's like when you have children, you can't always be there with them wherever they are, you just have to hope that they make good decisions and treat others with respect. Because, God gave us all free will, so that we could learn to make our own decisions. That's the only way we can learn anything.

"I believe God loves the world through us. We are real carriers of His love. Especially in times like these when people are trying to make God 'was', it is you and I, by our love, by the purity of our lives, by our compassion, who prove to the world that God 'is'." - Mother Teresa

well put

i cant understand anyones logic in not believing, but everyone has their rights, so im not gonna tell someone they are wrong for believing a certain way

i just hope they see the light b4 its to late

[SLCPUNK]

I love and believe in God.  Why? Because, he's my best friend.

I went to church for 14 years, from the time I was an infant until I was 14. My family and I stopped going for personal reasons. From going to church, I learned all the facts about Jesus, I knew the bible songs, and I memorized the prayer to recite, but I never felt close to God. I always thought that only the 'higher ups' could communicate with God on a one to one level.   But, as I got older life became more overwhelming and I needed emotional support and spiritual guidance. So, I started to pray and things began to change in me.  Great things have happened that I can't really explain. It's just something that everyone has to feel in order to understand.

A lot of people doubt God's existence, because of all the bad things that happen in the world, but like SLC said, we create our own misery and suffering. We're supposed to take care of one another, not hurt each other. It's like when you have children, you can't always be there with them wherever they are, you just have to hope that they make good decisions and treat others with respect. Because, God gave us all free will, so that we could learn to make our own decisions. That's the only way we can learn anything.

"I believe God loves the world through us. We are real carriers of His love. Especially in times like these when people are trying to make God 'was', it is you and I, by our love, by the purity of our lives, by our compassion, who prove to the world that God 'is'." - Mother Teresa

i just hope they see the light b4 its to late

I can't imagine God creating us and giving us the ability to question his/her existence. Then be upset with us because we choose not to believe in a higher power. But that is just my way of thinking anyway.

My father is not a religious man by any means. But he is the most gentle, kind caring man I have ever met. I can't imagine him going to 'hell' because he didn't believe in God.

[D]

i think its based on our hearts and how we live our lives

thats my opinion

i dont necessarily believe u have to go to church etc

i think if u are good at heart and are a genuine person and try as hard as u can to be a good person and good to others  u will go to heaven

its like a preacher told me once though

if im driving down the road and a cop has a roadblock and says "son, the road is washed up ahead u need to turn and go another way"

and i ignore him and drive over a cliff and die, its my fault i was warned

same with heaven, we have been taught and told that if u dont believe in god and dont take jesus as your savior u go to hell
so i dont know

life is like a man giving a woman a diamond ring, and she throwing the ring away and keeping the box

thats what humans do, the soul is the diamond but we throw it away and worry bout our bodies or the box

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

in 342 BEFORE Jesus Christ , Epicure said a very intersting thing on god and evil on earth:

************************************************
god
1 - or WANTS to remove evil but CAN'T do it,
2 - or DOESN'T WANT to remove evil  and CAN'T do it (anyway...)
3 - or DOESN'T WANT to remove evil , nor CAN'T do it
4 - or WANTS to remove evil and CAN.

(these are the 4 only possibilities)
now with the global definition of god : almighty and GOOD.

1 >> so he is not almighty : doesnt work
2 >> so he is evil : doesnt work
3 >> evil and not almighty  : yeah right
4 >> yeah ! thats the one we want .... oh wait, so why evil ?

**********************************************************

to me , people's god is like a father that is watching his daughter getting raped, and he sees it, he could easily save her, but stay where he is.

and also, you never can argue with people with faith cause they will always
- praise god for what's good
- blame humanity for whats bad
i say that is TOOO easy.
come on, ok you believe in god, great for you, but you don't have to blindly agree with everything that is written on a god damn (ooops) book.

as long as you believe in (a) god personnaly, if it's your choice, personnal, thats fine. i think that actually everybody believes in something deeply, some call it God, Love, hate, pride, soccer ....

but when the community feeling and the word religion comes in the game, well that dont work anymore.

 

[Man Of Soul]

Ok,see i believe in god but im not religious.

[Dizzy]

and also, you never can argue with people with faith cause they will always
- praise god for what's good
- blame humanity for whats bad

So true.  God always gets credit for everything good.  Not us.  None of us are responsible for any good that we do.  But when it comes to evil, it's the other way around.  God suddenly becomes a hapless bystander when it comes to the evil done by mankind.

If you're going to believe in God as the "creator" of everything, you'd better believe that means EVERYTHING.  Including evil.  Keep in mind Lucifier didn't create himself.  He was created by God.  And any evil inclinations Lucifer had and continues to have, had to have been instilled by God.  Because Lucifer wouldn't have just come up with the idea on his own to rebel against God, those inclinations had to have been put there by somebody.  Perhaps the creator, hmmmm?

My theory is that the Christian God created Lucifer to portray himself in the light of goodness.  Nobody would know how wonderful God is without another deity which is evil.  It's that "balance" thing I've mentioned on other threads; you have to have clearly defined evil in order to have good, otherwise, the two would be indistinguishable.

So in other words, creating Lucifer was God's way of saying, "Hey everybody look at me and how wonderful I am compared to that guy!"  If you read the bible, it's obvious the Christian God has a knack for stroking his own ego, so it's unsurprising really.  I mean hell, the bible makes it a point to pervasively emphasize how horrible and evil human beings are, and how wonderful God is, so it's obvious God has a problem with his own self-esteem.  Reminds me of that schoolyard bully theory, "build yourself up by putting others down".  The Christian God definitely seems to have that complex about himself.

[Slashly]

I do belive in God.
And for people who say prayers doesn?t  work I have to say this:
God ain?t no magician, he is not gonna change every bad thing with a magic wand.God acts wisely.And also think that  if everything in your life (from th minute you were born to the last second of your life) was happy then you wouldn?t enjoy it that much.



Baby Slash//

[D]

I do belive in God.
And for people who say prayers doesn?t  work I have to say this:
God ain?t no magician, he is not gonna change every bad thing with a magic wand.God acts wisely.And also think that  if everything in your life (from th minute you were born to the last second of your life) was happy then you wouldn?t enjoy it that much.



Baby Slash//

very well said slashly and this dude is what? 13!

very wise for your age bro

i believe that, gotta take the good with the bad and just because u go thru shit in your lifes doesnt mean there isnt a GOD

life is what we make it, i think GOD gave us life and its ours to figure out, i think we are judged based on what we do with our lives and how well we play the game

people who rape and kill others get to spend eternity in hell, whats more punishing than that?

if someone is a christian and they get murdered, whoever murdered them sent them home to heaven which really is a great thing not a bad thing

death is the beginning not the end and death is the easiest part about living! after we struggle thru life we are rewarded with the keys to the kingdom of heaven and thats gonna be the greatest!

[SLCPUNK]

I do belive in God.
And for people who say prayers doesn?t  work I have to say this:
God ain?t no magician, he is not gonna change every bad thing with a magic wand.God acts wisely.And also think that  if everything in your life (from th minute you were born to the last second of your life) was happy then you wouldn?t enjoy it that much.



Baby Slash//

Good job.

Just remember that when things are tough for you in your life too. They will be, but like you said, that is part of life. It's not always icecream and cake.

[GnRNightrain]

Christianity gets a good name because of our democracy, not vice versa.  It's the adament separation of church and state which set us apart from all third world countries ravaged by religion.

 Yes.  If fundamentalist Christians had their way they would impose their moral laws on the people.  Thus taking away from a true democracy.

Look at cultures run by religion. Hell, even the Mormon culture is oppresive towards their women. The non Mormons in my state HATE the Mormons because they actually run the state and pass laws that are entirely based on their religious beliefs. That is not democracy. That is religion running the state. They may have one token non-Mormon on certain boards to say it's fair. But anybody with a brain understands what goes on here.

How do you define democracy?  Democracy is the will of the people.  Usually majority rule.  Therefore, if they can pass the law by being in the majority how it that non-democratic?

Democracy that this country is founded on. That is how I define democracy. The LDS culture here goes against everything this country was founded on. Yes, obviously it is the majority, but they take their beliefs and incorporate them in the law here. So that is in direct violation of church and state.

If the department of alcohol and beverage control has 4 out of 5 memebers who are LDS, how is that democratic?

Are they voted in?  This country wasnt founded on pure democratic principles, read Federalist 10.  However, you begged the question.  Its not like the LDS have performed a coup de etat and taken over the government.  They are voted in based on the majority of the peoples votes?  Isnt that right?  Now you can say that they take account of minority interests, but that is why I am asking how you define democracy.  Is it majority rule?  Proportional representation (although even with this, at some time you have to get to majority rule).  Should the minority of people control what is going on?