The CD release date rumor / speculation thread

[Buddha_Master]

Appetite homie, is what I would clasify as a Masterpiece. Its perfect. Perfection = Masterpiece. Like say my giant Jew schlong...its a friggin masterpiece.

[Ali]

Appetite homie, is what I would clasify as a Masterpiece. Its perfect. Perfection = Masterpiece. Like say my giant Jew schlong...its a friggin masterpiece.

I agree that Appetite is a masterpiece.  I'm hoping that Chinese Democracy will be a masterpiece as well.  I don't want CD to be perfect.  I want it to be beautifully imperfect so it can show the humanity of the band who created it.

Ali

[POPmetal]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

[jimmythegent]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

you make a good point but theres also 'over-prduction' to factor

I want  a polished, complete record, not some thrown together cheaply recorded, poorly mixed album...BUT.... if it's too polished, too layered and too laboured over, that can stifle the human ness and emotion out - so it is a balancing act but still something to be aware of

[liquidvirus]

Yay!!! Mysteron's back...long time no see man...glad to see you busy..atleast someone's got alife ...anyways, from the potential "hints" hes given us, i guess its safe to say that the album should be out end of the year....so hopefully the marketing and other promotional tools are gonna start rolling

[Ali]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

I didn't mean imperfect and raw from a production point-of-view.  I meant the material itself.  I meant not striving to make every single note perfect because that's a process that could go on forever!  Does that sound familiar?  Besides just the shear length of time it would take to create a 'perfect' record, it's the imperfections in any piece of art that help to define its identity.  But again, that's my opinion.

Ali

[cineater]

You know Axl made this bed himself and it's now time to lie in it.  He's going to get the adult response to that--lol  Lay back and take it like a man.  How long can they fuck with you?

[jameslofton29]

If we hadn't waited 12 years, I would find this shit extremely funny. Axl's fear of judgement is pathetic. THERE IS NO MEDIA CONSPIRACY!! Wake up! Out of the thousands of articles and interviews about GNR, you can count on your fingers how many were negative. Every review of GNR albums were great. Illusions 1 and 2 got 4 and 5 stars consistently. AFD was deemed a perfect record, and Lies also got critical praise. They could have dumped on TSI, but they didn't. Axl has always been treated fairly by the media. CD will be the same. If its great, they'll say its great. If it sucks, they'll say it sucks. Then they will move on. There's plenty of targets in our celebrity obsessed culture. If the thing holding CD up is a possible media rejection of CD, then this wait was for nothing. The conspiracy doesn't exist, and it never did. It only existed in Axl's mind.

[jimmythegent]

yeah Axl imo, got a pretty fair rap from the media and to a lesser extent still does. He certainly has a persecution complex and has to realise he can't control every view or opinion that is expressed about him.

[POPmetal]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

you make a good point but theres also 'over-prduction' to factor

I want? a polished, complete record, not some thrown together cheaply recorded, poorly mixed album...BUT.... if it's too polished, too layered and too laboured over, that can stifle the human ness and emotion out - so it is a balancing act but still something to be aware of

But where do you draw the line between what's "over-produced" and what's not? We could argue forever whether November Rain is "over-produced" or not. And if something is "over-produced" does that in and of itself make it bad?

"Over-production" is just another one of those artificial catch-phrases: conveniently vague enough so it can be applied to art the industry does not want and not applied to art the industry does want.

[-Jack-]

Hey RnT I also have an empty space on my wall for the Chinese Democracy album art.

Lol. Right to the left of AFD

[Jonx]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

you make a good point but theres also 'over-prduction' to factor

I want  a polished, complete record, not some thrown together cheaply recorded, poorly mixed album...BUT.... if it's too polished, too layered and too laboured over, that can stifle the human ness and emotion out - so it is a balancing act but still something to be aware of

But where do you draw the line between what's "over-produced" and what's not? We could argue forever whether November Rain is "over-produced" or not. And if something is "over-produced" does that in and of itself make it bad?

"Over-production" is just another one of those artificial catch-phrases: conveniently vague enough so it can be applied to art the industry does not want and not applied to art the industry does want.

My thoughts:

I think you can draw the line when a song sounds completly different when its played live by the musicians in the band, whereas on the CD its a musical masterpiece which includes multiple  layered guitars, a 12 piece orchestra etc.... However with the addition of Pittman maybe this wont be a problem for the band, Pittman can reproduce the majority of the sounds, Madagascar and the Blues both proove this is possible and that they sound amazing.

Jonx

[madagas]

For people expecting an announcement about cd 3-4 months in advance of the release date: the Stones just announced a Sept 6th release date for their new album-only 1 month and 2 weeks in advance. I would keep this in mind when we don't hear anything in Aug and Sept.

[Walapino]

For people expecting an announcement about cd 3-4 months in advance of the release date: the Stones just announced a Sept 6th release date for their new album-only 1 month and 2 weeks in advance. I would keep this in mind when we don't hear anything in Aug and Sept.

Very true but they did a tour press conference several weeks ago stating an album was out due with the tour, so it wasnt an announcement out of the blue either. We need to keep that in mind too 

[Thorazine Shuffle]

Also, The Stones know that they won't sell many records, they haven't sold many since the 70's.  They know they make their money with the $500.00 a seat tickets.

[PeterCoffin]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

I agree 100%. It's why that emo shit is so popular.

[jimmythegent]

But where do you draw the line between what's "over-produced" and what's not? We could argue forever whether November Rain is "over-produced" or not. And if something is "over-produced" does that in and of itself make it bad?

"Over-production" is just another one of those artificial catch-phrases: conveniently vague enough so it can be applied to art the industry does not want and not applied to art the industry does want.

i would disagree with you there that the term is an industry conspiracy. There have been many examples over the years of this ailment

An example of overproduction? Where every instrument sounds perfect to the point where it is impossible to tell if a human played it or nor, that is, the human aspect of art (which is the most important aspect of great art) is reduced or missing entirely. This can be caused by too much time in the studio playing the same piece over and over and over. It becomes so rote, that all emotion is drained from said piece. Now this is not to say that in the studio, you just rock up and do it in one take regardless if it sounds unrehearsed and like shit basically. But there is a point where you want to leave a little sponteinaity in the mix I believe. Appetite and countless other classics have this element.

Another example is when too many layers are added in the studio , to the point where the music can't 'breathe'. Again, a symptom of too long in a recording studio.

And finally, the effects that are added to each instruments can make a song or recording sound overproduced as well. Too much reverb, chorus, delay, compression etc.. etc... can make a record sound too 'studio'.

It is indeed a fine line between under-done and over-done. Im certainly not wanting CD to be a garage record, but I also hope that it's not a bloated, excessive mastubatory exercise either.

[HoldenCaulfield]

Axl knows there's no such thing as a "perfect" record, but he knows that you can put out the best record of your career, and that's all he's striving for with this album. He's put so much time and effort into this record and he knows that if he looks back 20 years from now and sees a blinding flaw, he will realize those 10 years were in vain, in a way. He's reached such mythic heights that in his subconscious, if he doesn't deliver the record of the century, he will, as an artist, be looked at as a flop. Just like everyone else, I'm dying to hear this album. This thing has manifested into such a wanted thing in my life, I'm dying to hear it. It's reached a point that it feels that something HUGE is missing from my life. But we just have to think about how amazing it will be when the day comes when Axl says "Alright. It's time to put this thing out". We will get to hear 10 years of this man's life journey, not to mention an amazing band setting the background. Good things come to those who wait...?

[POPmetal]

But where do you draw the line between what's "over-produced" and what's not? We could argue forever whether November Rain is "over-produced" or not. And if something is "over-produced" does that in and of itself make it bad?

"Over-production" is just another one of those artificial catch-phrases: conveniently vague enough so it can be applied to art the industry does not want and not applied to art the industry does want.

i would disagree with you there that the term is an industry conspiracy.

What conspiracy? I never said or thought there was a conspiracy. It's just marketing. The big 4 oligopoly is simply trying to bring down production costs and increase profits. It's as simple as that.

There have been many examples over the years of this ailment

An example of overproduction? Where every instrument sounds perfect to the point where it is impossible to tell if a human played it or nor, that is, the human aspect of art (which is the most important aspect of great art) is reduced or missing entirely. This can be caused by too much time in the studio playing the same piece over and over and over. It becomes so rote, that all emotion is drained from said piece. Now this is not to stay that in the studio, you just rock up and do it in one take regardless if it sounds unrehearsed and like shit basically. But there is a point where you want to leave a little sponteinaity in the mix I believe. Appetite and countless other classics have this element.

Another example is when too many layers are added in the studio , to the point where the music can't 'breathe'. Again, a symptom of too long in a recording studio.

And finally, the effects that are added to each instruments can make a song or recording sound overproduced as well. Too much reverb, chorus, delay, compression etc.. etc... can make a record sound too 'studio'.

It is indeed a fine line between under-done and over-done. Im certainly not wanting CD to be a garage record, but I also hope that it's not a bloated, excessive mastubatory exercise either.

You said there were many "examples," but you neglected to mention even one. NIN? Def Leppard? Queen? The Illusion albums? What?

And your description of what you consider overproduction is still subjective. Most people have different opinions as to what "the most important aspect of great art" is, and then as to what the "human aspect" actually means. You may not be able to tell whether a human played a certain piece or not, but maybe I can. Furthermore, different humans have different capabilities and some are able to play better than others. Are Slash or Buckethead not human because they have the talent to play more perfectly than Kurt Cobain? Enough of this vagueness. If there is a "fine line," define it in concrete terms!

[POPmetal]

The whole "raw" and "imperfect" thing has become banal. It was cool when Too Fast For Lave or Kill 'Em All or Appetite came out cuz it really was real, but when you now have Metallica artificially hampering their talent so they would artificially sound like a garage band (when they're working with a budget bigger than some 3rd world countries' GDP), it's the most fake and ridiculous thing in the world. It's fucking gay. Why pretend you're something that you're not? I'm glad Axl isn't going down that road. It would be just as ridiculous for GN'R to pretend that it's a garage band.

And the rock audience is not stupid. It's just that we've been told that over and over by the industry to the point that we've started to believe it. A well produced, perfectionist album is not "inaccessible" to the general audience! (Queen, Def Leppard, and Led Zeppelin proved that a long time ago) The music industry just tells us they are inaccessible so they can market underproduced, cheap crap to us; in this way lowering their production cost and increasing their profits. Why pay a band like Queen millions of dollars to produce an opus when they can get a piece of shit, no talent band like Blink 182 and market it as "raw" and "real"? Maybe when Axl releases Chinese Democracy, we'll wake up and start demanding quality music again instead of being hoodwinked by marketing catch phrases. Yeah ... 'hip hop is not just music' ... 'it's a way of life.' My ass!

I agree 100%. It's why that emo shit is so popular.

Thanks Peter Emo is a perfect example!