Tackles, balls and Seaman - The footie thread

[GNR_Green]

Ya know it would be a rascist view to suggest all Spanish (or even a majority) where rascist? Think about it.

The Spanish coach said that about the English and look at the stick he's getting.  People are overreacting and questioning the morality of the entire country, which is exactly what they're condemning this bloke for.

Banning Spain from football tournaments for a few idiots would be wrong.  Izzy is right here, it was definately only a tiny minority, you can tell if you really listen.  I don't think you can justify banning a team from anything unless you get a serious problem, like English clubs in the 80's.  We deserved a ban for that and compared to incidents like Heysel this racist abuse is not a massive problem.  People will always bring their political views into football, right or wrong, but banning football teams from stuff won't solve the problem.  Also, if you were gonna ban Spain for this then you'd have to band pretty much every other country as well.

p.s. I do actually think that racism is extremely narrow minded and pathetic, but it exists and it's up to society to change that, not football.

[Izzy]

Ya know it would be a rascist view to suggest all Spanish (or even a majority) where rascist? Think about it.

The Spanish coach said that about the English and look at the stick he's getting.? People are overreacting and questioning the morality of the entire country, which is exactly what they're condemning this bloke for.

Banning Spain from football tournaments for a few idiots would be wrong.? Izzy is right here, it was definately only a tiny minority, you can tell if you really listen.? I don't think you can justify banning a team from anything unless you get a serious problem, like English clubs in the 80's.? We deserved a ban for that and compared to incidents like Heysel this racist abuse is not a massive problem.? People will always bring their political views into football, right or wrong, but banning football teams from stuff won't solve the problem.? Also, if you were gonna ban Spain for this then you'd have to band pretty much every other country as well.

p.s. I do actually think that racism is extremely narrow minded and pathetic, but it exists and it's up to society to change that, not football.

Amen brother, some good points.

[Jim]

And look at us now, they'd thrash us cos our team's fallen apart and we're shit again!? That might not be sven's fault but he should've taken it into consideration before making us a laughing stock.

No. To be honest, you're wrong. And I feel that is more than just my 'opinion' on the matter. You're wrong on two points:

1. In a competetive game, there is not a snowballs chance in hell that they would beat us. Svens turned all England friendlys into a joke, but that's an entirely different matter. And, I don't know how much you can remember about the Australia game, but I think that you should recall these facts:
We changed our entire team at half time.
We actually 'won' the second half, so to put it.

How do you expect a team entirely changed at the break to get back into it? I don't think that we conceeded after the break, but that's what my memory tells me. If our front 11 had finished the match, we would have won.

2. We're not shit. We play(ed) shit. Us playing shit does not equvilate us being called shit. An example?

Did you watch Madrid / Barecelona on Saturday night? If so then my point is proven. Madrid were awful, truly awful. Yet I gaurantee you that if Arsenal were drawn against Madrid in the Champions League, Danny and his fellow Gooners would shit themselves.

England are a good team and have had a genuine chance of the winning the last two tournaments they have been to. We just need to realise that potential.

(okay, we lack a goalkeeper good enough even to be called third division standard)

I think you know you're wrong.?

Robinson is a fantastic keeper (shut up, I said that when he was at Leeds), and Liverpools Kirkland is a very exciting prospect for the future.

How you can moan about our goalkeepers in the country without mentioning the fools we have running down the left wing.....

edit: It was actually Barcelona / Madrid.

[axl_rose_700]

Leeds win 6-1!!   

Deano, Deano, Deano, lmao

[Danny Top Hat]

Like i said the self righteous brigade are out in force.

Oh fuck off, this is nothing to do with me being self-righteous, this is just you doing what you always like to do - going against popular opinion because it's sooo fucking cool.?

So i should be claiming all Spanish people are rascist and should be banned from the world cup?

No, but when you hear monkey noises being made towards black players in the year 2004, you should be very angry and insist that the people making them are punished.? What you should not do is rolls your eyes and make excuses for them.? The rest of the crowd were being silent, the news crews turned it up, you're always gonna get idiots in a football crowd - you're blaming everything else but them!

bursting into tears when u realise the world is not as cuddly as u thought will get nowhere

Stop fucking patronising me.? I'm not a complete idiot.? Just because everyone knows the world isn't cuddly and fluffy, are you saying that makes racism okay?? I don't actually understand your logic at all.? The fact is that in one of the biggest stadiums in the world, monkey noises could clearly be heard from all around.? It wasn't just the news channels turning it up, I could hear it extremely clearly while watching it live, as could everyone else and as could the England fans who travelled to the game.? It was not just 5 people.

Ya know it would be a rascist view to suggest all Spanish (or even a majority) where rascist? Think about it.

Thank God I never said that then.  How stupid do you think I am?

[Metallifuck]

I don't know who you would have replace him. An Englishman I hope. I'd rather an Englishman, regardless of how good the foreign manager is. As long as he has the pride, drive and determination. The manager of the England national team must be English.

I agree, what's the point of international football if it it just the players? I personally think it should be all the staff including the manager that should be English so that the whole England  team represents England, not a pick N' mix of Europe.

These monkey chants are disgusting and Spain should sort those minority of racist's out, but what really is hurrendous is Wayne Roony's fouling which was not much short of assault

[GNR_Green]

And look at us now, they'd thrash us cos our team's fallen apart and we're shit again!  That might not be sven's fault but he should've taken it into consideration before making us a laughing stock.

No. To be honest, you're wrong. And I feel that is more than just my 'opinion' on the matter. You're wrong on two points:

1. In a competetive game, there is not a snowballs chance in hell that they would beat us. Svens turned all England friendlys into a joke, but that's an entirely different matter. And, I don't know how much you can remember about the Australia game, but I think that you should recall these facts:
We changed our entire team at half time.
We actually 'won' the second half, so to put it.

How do you expect a team entirely changed at the break to get back into it? I don't think that we conceeded after the break, but that's what my memory tells me. If our front 11 had finished the match, we would have won.

2. We're not shit. We play(ed) shit. Us playing shit does not equvilate us being called shit. An example?

Did you watch Madrid / Barecelona on Saturday night? If so then my point is proven. Madrid were awful, truly awful. Yet I gaurantee you that if Arsenal were drawn against Madrid in the Champions League, Danny and his fellow Gooners would shit themselves.

England are a good team and have had a genuine chance of the winning the last two tournaments they have been to. We just need to realise that potential.

(okay, we lack a goalkeeper good enough even to be called third division standard)

You've taken my quote about being shit and that they'd thrash us out of context mate - I meant the rugby team!!  Sorry, my original post went off on a bit of a tangent.  I do agree that we'd beat Australia in a competitive game and understand your reasons for losing the friendly, but the point is that we lost.

The goalkeeper quote was Izzy's I think, but I think Robinson's better than 3rd division standard, although he's no Seaman either.

[Jim]

I meant the rugby team!!

What, and it's all Sven's fault that our rugby team has fallen apart and is shit again...

I've read your post again in the context that you're refering to the rugby team, and that makes no sense. 

Because, anyway, you must not have watched the rugby at the weekend. We were awesome. But, this isn't a rugby thread, so I won't elaborate.

And I know it was Izzy's quote...I never said it wasn't.

And, am I the only one childish enough to laugh at this:

but I think Robinson's better than 3rd division standard, although he's no Seaman either.

And Seaman after around 2000, I would say Robo is as good as, or almost.

[Izzy]

this is just you doing what you always like to do - going against popular opinion because it's sooo fucking cool.?

Er? Can i have an example of that please, one shouldn't be too hard to find as i'm ''doing what I always like to do'', must be many examples to be found! Don't pretend you know me

No, but when you hear monkey noises being made towards black players in the year 2004, you should be very angry and insist that the people making them are punished.? What you should not do is rolls your eyes and make excuses for them.? The rest of the crowd were being silent, the news crews turned it up, you're always gonna get idiots in a football crowd - you're blaming everything else but them!

Again - where did i make excuses for them? I said they are idiots and it was out of line (check back a page and you'll find it, its the post you first replied too ) I said to keep it in perspective - there were 40,000 people not making monkey noises remember?

Stop fucking patronising me.? I'm not a complete idiot.? Just because everyone knows the world isn't cuddly and fluffy, are you saying that makes racism okay?

Yes. Where i actually said they are idiots i of course meant its great and everyone should join in Clearly my post suggested it was okay, u cleverly decoded what i really meant!

Okay have it your way

Alas! The entire of Spain was hurling abuse at the players, those wicked sinful Spaniards! I'll boycott Spanish products from now on!

Spanish people are no more and no less rascist that your average British citizen. Idiots are idiots and I refuse to be carried away by a media with nothing better to do than blow the actions of a few wacko's into an internation incident.

How stupid do you think I am?

Well, judging from the way you misread or just invented things in your post.....

[Jim]

Hey, don't talk to a moderator like that, he could have you killed. Or even worse, banned.

To throw my 50 cents in, I agree with Danny. You cannot take the situation lightly at all. It's called complacency. As long as the problem exists at all, then it is a problem regardless.

[Izzy]

Hey, don't talk to a moderator like that, he could have you killed. Or even worse, banned.

To throw my 50 cents in, I agree with Danny. You cannot take the situation lightly at all. It's called complacency. As long as the problem exists at all, then it is a problem regardless.

Again - where did i take the situation lightly? I said they were idiots and it was out of line - i also said banning Spain from the World Cup was stupid, why punish millions for the crimes of a handful?

I am mystified as to what there is to misunderstand in my post

Summarised here once and for all - racism bad, racists bad - however short of actually finding those responsible you can't put in place any fair punishment so we shouldn't get carried away, what would u have me say, I've said its out of line, do u want me to write it in blood? Hang it from Tower Bridge? Get it tatooed into my soul? - i have been as condemning as the rest.

If a few Spurs fans did the same should they be banned from the league? Closed down? Forced to pay a fine? Of course not.

[axl_rose_700]

I'm gunna stick up for and agree with Izzy on this one.

What those few did was disgusting but it was only a few, couldn't say how many, one is too many but it wasn't the entire stadium was it?!

The Spanish FA need to be punished but to throw them out of World Cup's is going too far, what would you say if FIFA threatened to throw England out of the World Cup if say 100 fans made monkey noises? You'd say England were being picked on!

[Danny Top Hat]

I had to re-read your post to find out where you said 'out of line'.  Turns out you said "while thats out of line, we're talking about 5 people in a stadium of 40,000" - you can't really blame me for missing it.  I never said I thought Spain should be banned from anything, that would be hypocritical because racism is a problem in football around lots of European countries, certainly not just Spain.

I've been saying racism is a problem for ages, because Arsenal have had loads of problems with it in the past in Europe but those weren't England games, so nobody cared.  What i'm hoping is that this incident in Spain will wake people up a bit and bring the problem out into the open, so maybe it can be sorted out.  What annoyed me the most about your post was how you seemed to brush aside the problem, saying "yeah, they were idiots and all, but the news probably turned it up to make it look worse".

You ask where you made excuses for them, and then go on to talk about the 40,000 people not making noises.  We're not talking about those people, we're talking about the considerably larger number of people than 5 that were making the noises.  I've even seen footage of security guards joining in with the dancing.  I never, ever said all Spanish people are racist, I think you made that bit up, but you can't deny that the Spanish FA are taking the situation a little bit lightly, can you?

Have you seen the footage of the security guards joining in with the monkey dancing yet?

Don't pretend you know me

This coming from the guy who dubbed me the self-righteous brigade.

[Jim]

what would you say if FIFA threatened to throw England out of the World Cup if say 100 fans made monkey noises? You'd say England were being picked on!

100 fans? 5 in the whole stadium? (Not your quote, I know...)
You're joking. Did you hear it? The Dwight Yorke thing was an extreme minority...What happened in Madrid was not so.

Oh, and I assume that you mean how did I feel when England were threatened to be kicked out the (Europeon) Cup?

Or have you forgotten about that horrible, horrible mess during qualification for Portugal '04?

[Metallifuck]

Wayne Roony should be banned or else he'll get England into trouble.

[Metallifuck]

Wanye Roony should be banned.

[axl_rose_700]

what would you say if FIFA threatened to throw England out of the World Cup if say 100 fans made monkey noises? You'd say England were being picked on!

100 fans? 5 in the whole stadium? (Not your quote, I know...)
You're joking. Did you hear it? The Dwight Yorke thing was an extreme minority...What happened in Madrid was not so.

Oh, and I assume that you mean how did I feel when England were threatened to be kicked out the (Europeon) Cup?

Or have you forgotten about that horrible, horrible mess during qualification for Portugal '04?

Yea, it was worse than 100 but TV stations can turn it up to make it sound worse than it is! Although like I said, 1 person doing it is bad enough

[MadmanDan]

Could we get back to Football,please??   Real really blows tonight,but that's not anything new.

Everyone picks on Beckham,but how can he perform as well as he did when he played for Man Utd when he's being played as a defensive midfielder?

[badapple81]

Could we get back to Football,please?? Real really blows tonight,but that's not anything new.

Everyone picks on Beckham,but how can he perform as well as he did when he played for Man Utd when he's being played as a defensive midfielder?

Well he did make an issue of announcing how much he loves and wants a cental role. What role did he think he was going to have? Zidane is an attacking midfielder, and Figo is a much better winger than Beckham.

Let's face it.. Beckham's best role is sitting out on the right, putting in some good crosses and scoring the odd free kick.

[Danny Top Hat]

I felt very sorry for Liverpool last night.  The goal was definately a handball, and the players had stopped playing because they were so sure the free kick would be given.

Campbell could be starting tonight.  Shame really, I was just starting to like Cygan...