Dont Get Upset About Delay This TIme

[Perfect Criminal]

1/100,000,000th?

the lunatically loyal are the only reason HE even still has a chance at a career. In the US, with zero promotion, you think it's casual people going to the concerts?

like i said in a post that got deleted for some reason (hmmm), it's getting to the point (and the point comes when the announced tour dates run out and there's no CD) where we have to realize that there might not even be an album, since NO ONE is talking about it that was involved in the creative process, and that the concert tour is the record company forcing Axl's hand to recoup money spent on the damn mythic album. i hope i'm proved wrong, but at this point, as i type this, there's no reason tobelieve otherwise.

think about it....his baby, his creative apex, the thing he's spent his heart and soul on for fifteen years, the concert tour bearing the album's name...and not ONCE does he utter the words Chinese Democracy in public? not ONCE does he say "and this is Better/ the Blues/ TWAT/ Madagascar etc from our soon to be released album..." or something even remotely along those lines?

about a year and a half ago i posted a thread that i asked Jarmo to delete because the guy who told me the info was taking some serious heat for it....the gist was that the engineers that were working on the album at the studio, can't remember the name, said there's nothing but a whole bunch of instrumental tracks with scratch vocals on it, meaning HE hadn't recorded vox to any of the songs. Theguy who told me, from another message board, was a respected producer or collaborator or something in LA, and i provided the right info in the post to back it up, got heat within hours after me posting the thread here. He told me he was at the bottom of the hill with all the shit rolling down towards him, to paraphrase, because of what he told me. He asked me to delete the posts in the other forum and here, which i did.

a year and a half later, what has changed? we have proof of, what, 6 songs, and some poster board showing a seventh that they've decided not to play yet?

look, again, prove me wrong Axl. In Calgary, call me out, use my name, i'll be there.

just waiting for the damn thing for 11 years is no big deal. i'm on the net anyway, might as well check in here. but when he's exploiting that loyalty (if that's what he's doing) by going out on tour and teasing us with this thing, taking our money with the implicit promise that THIS TIME it's coming...then he OWES us something. at this point we ARE his career.

original poster says dont get upset this time.....THIS time. As if the other times over the past decade were alright, but this time there's a good reason for the misinformation. what possible explanation could there be for HIS silence, short of it aint coming out? suprise release, well then, just talk about it vaguely.

bottom line, if it doesn't come out, or have an iron clad release date by the end of this tour cycle, how can any of us reasonably be expected to stay o board? this is like the fourth or fifth time we've been strung along to this point, with ZERO explanation. How can any of us/ you, still believe all of this shit if it doesn't happen this time? there is simply no excuse anymore, and if it doesn't come out this time, there's no chance HE has left. He'll be finished as a relevant current artist. Can you envision a THIRD Chinese Democracy world tour? maybe he'll tour with Tom Petty so they can duet Free Fallin' so all the fluffers on board here can wax ecstatic about "see, he IS changing the setlist!!!".....down on the farm...gimme a fucking break. cool song, but when you've relased three albums ever, and you won't play anything off of two of them but two hits and two covers, another cover is the last thing his credibility needs.

that siad, i'll be in calgary, i'll be excited, but it's getting harder to know what to feel for the guy.

Great great post and dead on.  I agree with every single thing you said.  There is no excuse that works past 2006.  He needs to release and live up to his word this time or he can join the rest of the 80's bands that never made it past 1993.  How can any of you excuse this if it happens? 

[Lord Kayoss]

Bach won't be on the album... thank God.

Co-sign.

Bach is horrible.  He butchered My Michelle on a nightly basis during the Euro tour.  I'm glad he and Axl are good friends and all that, but the guy is over rated.

[echrisl]

I dont believe Axl and Merc purposefully lie to fans

That one's a very very VERY distant maybe ... (although I do not buy it, personally)

I dont believe Axl lies to fans.

But that one is a completely indefensible position.  Multiple times now Axl has unequivocally stated that the album will come out this year.  If it does not, then he has lied.  You can't spin it any other way, that is a fucking lie!  Deal with it.

[Continental Drift]

1/100,000,000th?

the lunatically loyal are the only reason HE even still has a chance at a career. In the US, with zero promotion, you think it's casual people going to the concerts?

like i said in a post that got deleted for some reason (hmmm), it's getting to the point (and the point comes when the announced tour dates run out and there's no CD) where we have to realize that there might not even be an album, since NO ONE is talking about it that was involved in the creative process, and that the concert tour is the record company forcing Axl's hand to recoup money spent on the damn mythic album. i hope i'm proved wrong, but at this point, as i type this, there's no reason tobelieve otherwise.

think about it....his baby, his creative apex, the thing he's spent his heart and soul on for fifteen years, the concert tour bearing the album's name...and not ONCE does he utter the words Chinese Democracy in public? not ONCE does he say "and this is Better/ the Blues/ TWAT/ Madagascar etc from our soon to be released album..." or something even remotely along those lines?

about a year and a half ago i posted a thread that i asked Jarmo to delete because the guy who told me the info was taking some serious heat for it....the gist was that the engineers that were working on the album at the studio, can't remember the name, said there's nothing but a whole bunch of instrumental tracks with scratch vocals on it, meaning HE hadn't recorded vox to any of the songs. Theguy who told me, from another message board, was a respected producer or collaborator or something in LA, and i provided the right info in the post to back it up, got heat within hours after me posting the thread here. He told me he was at the bottom of the hill with all the shit rolling down towards him, to paraphrase, because of what he told me. He asked me to delete the posts in the other forum and here, which i did.

a year and a half later, what has changed? we have proof of, what, 6 songs, and some poster board showing a seventh that they've decided not to play yet?

look, again, prove me wrong Axl. In Calgary, call me out, use my name, i'll be there.

just waiting for the damn thing for 11 years is no big deal. i'm on the net anyway, might as well check in here. but when he's exploiting that loyalty (if that's what he's doing) by going out on tour and teasing us with this thing, taking our money with the implicit promise that THIS TIME it's coming...then he OWES us something. at this point we ARE his career.

original poster says dont get upset this time.....THIS time. As if the other times over the past decade were alright, but this time there's a good reason for the misinformation. what possible explanation could there be for HIS silence, short of it aint coming out? suprise release, well then, just talk about it vaguely.

bottom line, if it doesn't come out, or have an iron clad release date by the end of this tour cycle, how can any of us reasonably be expected to stay o board? this is like the fourth or fifth time we've been strung along to this point, with ZERO explanation. How can any of us/ you, still believe all of this shit if it doesn't happen this time? there is simply no excuse anymore, and if it doesn't come out this time, there's no chance HE has left. He'll be finished as a relevant current artist. Can you envision a THIRD Chinese Democracy world tour? maybe he'll tour with Tom Petty so they can duet Free Fallin' so all the fluffers on board here can wax ecstatic about "see, he IS changing the setlist!!!".....down on the farm...gimme a fucking break. cool song, but when you've relased three albums ever, and you won't play anything off of two of them but two hits and two covers, another cover is the last thing his credibility needs.

that siad, i'll be in calgary, i'll be excited, but it's getting harder to know what to feel for the guy.

Dude. I don't disagree with much of what you've said. I'm just trying to point out that we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking us "die hards" hold any leverage in the matter. If CD drops in 2007... or in 2011... it will still receive a ton of international media attention... if it's good... it will be HUGE b/c the vast majority of the people out there don't feel like they're being constantly dicked over or let down by the band or Merck b/c as of right now... GN'R is the furthest fucking thing from their mind. A broken promise to deliver an album in 2006... that only several thousand die-hards heard and are holding Merck/Axl to... will NOT submarine this. And as we all know, if and when CD drops- the majority of the most pissed off jaded die-hards will be right in line buying it and checking out the band when they hit their town.

I've been pissed off at GN'R on several occasions [including cancelled shows in Berlin ('01) and Nashville ('06)]... but I've also accepted the fact that I am but one in a sea of millions of potential CD purchasers out there- and also that I don't have the ability to simply walk away from the band and block them out as a matter of principle... I love the music too much. So here I am. What I do do though is refrain from doing cartwheels and reserving a space in my cd rack for each time Merck or Axl has something promising to say about CD. It's the mantra of so many on this board that it's played out... but it is the right one... WHEN CD IS IN MY HANDS I'LL BELIEVE IT. If you can buy into that reality... you'll save yourself a lot of grief. If not delivering it in 2006 is too much for you to bare and you walk for good... cheers to you... you're a better man than me.  

[bigbri]

He can just rework shit and add guest musicians for a CD after Chinese Democracy. At this point, he should either shit or get off the pot concerning Chinese Democracy.

[eggers]

Every thread like this I actually post in gets deleted but anyway. I AM upset if there is a delay, I really wouldnt be surprised if we are here next year discussing the same shit.

[1badapple]

I wouldn't say upset is the word for it. Let down and disappointed with GnR would be more appropriate, I guess.

Axl had absolutely no right to go on record atleast 3 times this year saying cd would be out before year's end unless he was 150% positive!! No matter what kind of spin "management" tries to put on it, it's still ultimately Axl's fault. He's the one that made promises, so it all falls on his head.

That's all assuming that cd doesn't come out this year.

[misterID]

What pisses me off the most is that not only has he had a year since he said it would be out this year, he's played the album several times since that statement, and besides a vague "only {insert number here} tuesdays left" there has been nothing but silence.

Remember Axl stating Bucket was gone and he was going to announce the release date in a few months? yeah......... same old bullshit.

[MrMojoRisin]

Every thread like this I actually post in gets deleted but anyway. I AM upset if there is a delay, I really wouldnt be surprised if we are here next year discussing the same shit.

I wont be... If 2007 comes and there is no album...i will stop following them.... whats the point??? No album, no "new" songs,  same ol setlists, no merch, no DVD's....

I have been following this shit for years now..... Im loosing intrest in this project fast.. I dont even check the "show update" threads anymore since i know what they will say.... Band starts late,...  1/2 full crowd but they are into it, ... same setlist..... no updates....

At least RockStar SuperNova comes out on the 21st.... I know ill be buying a decent rock record this month....


yeah i know "if i dont like it fuck off"

[Wooody]

Well, If it doesnt come out this year, Im going to download it. I refuse to buy it, I don't like lies.

[muffinass]

1/100,000,000th?

the lunatically loyal are the only reason HE even still has a chance at a career. In the US, with zero promotion, you think it's casual people going to the concerts?

? Yes, yes I do. and from what i've read for the past tour, i'm sure that's a fact. How many people did you guys hear singing along and recognizing the new songs? In toronto, i'd say maybe 5% of the crowd (hell it probably was just a handful)...
 
  Stop it with this "we made you Axl!!" attitude... It's not the HARDCORE fans that bought the majority of the tickets for the concerts...

? So yes...DON'T get upset about delay times (at least don't take it personallY), because you're not owed anything...I'm as anxious as any of you here, but to claim that Axl NEEDS to do this/that...it's absurd...it's become more of a gossip-column for stay-at-home wives...

? I'm not agreeing with the situtation...i think it's complete shite...the band could've been more damn open when it comes to releasing dates, etc, and at least placate us for a while, but stop whining like your parents didn't get you the toy you wanted for christmas...it's funny how when they cancelled the Portland show, they were quick to issue a press statement, but now that all the negativity in th epress, etc is coming out...nothing. Although, the album coming out WITH all this press behind it will probably create much more of an impact.

[neon2002]

If its not out this year its going to suck major harry horse cock.


but i dont think its going to come out this year.

And if it doesn't come out in 2006, then what?

http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?showtopic=83734

 

[bringu2yourknees]

Dude. I don't disagree with much of what you've said. I'm just trying to point out that we shouldn't delude ourselves into thinking us "die hards" hold any leverage in the matter. If CD drops in 2007... or in 2011... it will still receive a ton of international media attention... if it's good... it will be HUGE b/c the vast majority of the people out there don't feel like they're being constantly dicked over or let down by the band or Merck b/c as of right now... GN'R is the furthest fucking thing from their mind. A broken promise to deliver an album in 2006... that only several thousand die-hards heard and are holding Merck/Axl to... will NOT submarine this. And as we all know, if and when CD drops- the majority of the most pissed off jaded die-hards will be right in line buying it and checking out the band when they hit their town.

I've been pissed off at GN'R on several occasions [including cancelled shows in Berlin ('01) and Nashville ('06)]... but I've also accepted the fact that I am but one in a sea of millions of potential CD purchasers out there- and also that I don't have the ability to simply walk away from the band and block them out as a matter of principle... I love the music too much. So here I am. What I do do though is refrain from doing cartwheels and reserving a space in my cd rack for each time Merck or Axl has something promising to say about CD. It's the mantra of so many on this board that it's played out... but it is the right one... WHEN CD IS IN MY HANDS I'LL BELIEVE IT. If you can buy into that reality... you'll save yourself a lot of grief. If not delivering it in 2006 is too much for you to bare and you walk for good... cheers to you... you're a better man than me. ?

You hit the nail on the head! ?So many people take the quotes that we get here and there, and they treat them as gospel. ?But in reality, 99% of the time it's just to generate a buzz. ?Now that is not saying I don't wish and hope for some of these rumors and such to be true, because I fall for them just as much as the next guy. ?But at the end of the day, when all we're left with is disappointment, we bring that on ourselves. ?Believe it or not, we are the minority when it comes to GnR fans. ?I'd be willing to bet that other than us on here and other GNR boards, most other Guns N' Roses fans have no idea of the 21st rumor, the Better HD ad, hell I bet a small number didn't even find out about the tour until last minute, if at all.

Point being, as the days go by and the end of the year draws closer, of course I'm disappointed with the lack of a release date or anything for that matter. ?But I'm also to blame for the disappointment because I'm the one buying into all of the hype. ?And there is nothing wrong with that as long as I know to point the finger at myself and not Axl or anyone else involved with GnR at the moment.

[stardustonmyfeet]

If its not out this year its going to suck major harry horse cock.


but i dont think its going to come out this year.

And if it doesn't come out in 2006, then what?

http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?showtopic=83734

 

give up all hope and find a band to follow that actually keeps its word

[veritas55]

If its not out this year its going to suck major harry horse cock.


but i dont think its going to come out this year.

And if it doesn't come out in 2006, then what?

http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?showtopic=83734

 

you continue living your life.  I always like Axl's quote about waiting for the return of Jesus.

[hunterwh]

It's too bad if they delay the album yet again. There is a difference between perfection and just anal... there will always be some exscuse it seems. But on the bright side the band kicks ass live. Would like to hear more new songs and stuff like "Yesterdays".

[Bubba St. Rose]

It's too bad if they delay the album yet again. There is a difference between perfection and just anal... there will always be some exscuse it seems. But on the bright side the band kicks ass live. Would like to hear more new songs and stuff like "Yesterdays".

Who said it was delayed? Democracy in China... never gonna happen. Chinese Democracy... we'll see.

[CheapJon]

i can't believe i spend hours a day reading this.........

you and me both....

And me, although im beginning to feel i won't be around here for much longer.

why do you keep on reading them? i never read thiese kind of threads, just a waste of time IMO

If its not out this year its going to suck major harry horse cock.

so a horse's dick is hairy? never knew that, how do you know that?

[polluxlm]

Edit: Not good enough

[freedom78]

Bach won't be on the album... thank God.

Co-sign.

Bach is horrible.  He butchered My Michelle on a nightly basis during the Euro tour.  I'm glad he and Axl are good friends and all that, but the guy is over rated.

I don't think Bach is overrated.  His vox with Skid Row were quite good.  I DON'T think he's the right voice for GNR material, but different doesn't equate with bad.