Why Estranged is so underrated?

[PrettyTiedUp763]

Estranged has to be one of my favorite GNR songs of all time. The lyrics are amazing. Axl did a wonderful job. I also love Slash's solo. I never understood why this song was so underrated myself. But I agree with most people that the video was not all that great and I think music was just changing around that time anyway...

[TOPGUNner]

I love Estranged, and I like the fact it wasn't a huge successful smash hit. Songs like Estranged and Coma become fan-owned songs.

[the dirt]

I generally don't like videos; at all.

What's so bad about this one to you guys?

[Bono]

Estranged is my favorite Gn'R video. It's failure if you wanna call it that was that it was released at the tail end of the Illusions era and by that time "grunge" was rueling the airwaves and a 9+ minute epic was not gonna do so well. The tieming of it's relase doomed it.

[Lucky]

Axl should re-release it

I know it'd be blasphemy for some of you,
but imagine a remix of it, one one of the future albums? (not CD of course)

[the dirt]

Axl should re-release it

Yeah, let's see if the new band can play the fuck out of it.

[Nighteyes]

Estranged has to be one of my favorite GNR songs of all time. The lyrics are amazing. Axl did a wonderful job. I also love Slash's solo.

I agree. I think it's very..unique..I really can't describe what I feel when I hear it.I just feel very weird..Like emptiness and sadness..It's one fuckin amazing song,the music,the lyrics,everything.
And maybe the video isn't the best(but i don't dislike it),but there is some awesome scenes (IMO) like when Slash rises from the water..I think the video kinda fits the song (or maybe that's because I'm used to it) really epic..

[Bono]

Axl should re-release it

Yeah, let's see if the new band can play the fuck out of it.

No no no. No need to further encourage them to continue as the  cover band they are. they've got that down already. let's move on to new stuff. I say scrap all the old songs except for 3(no ballads). Do like VR and tour their own material.

[thelostrose]

I listened to estranged 1000 times or more...idk... it's my favourite gnr song ever. the solos, the piano, axl's voice, the changes, everything is just perfect.
and...i know it's bold but still... for this song is the best ever. there are lots of really great awesome songs from different genres, but estranged stands out just a little bit. when i die some day... i want this song to be played at my funeral (maybe i'm crazy, but still...) ?

[Buddha_Master]

I think it has to do with the video more then anything else. I agree with the timing of this single as mentioned as well.

Estranged became more about the video then the song itself which is really fucked. The video IMO represents everything that was wrong with GNR at the time. Completely bloated and so far off the beaten path that GNR started becoming the very thing they first killed off. You know the part in the November Rain video where everybody at the party starting running for there lives when the Rain came and hid under tables and jumped into cakes and shit. The estranged video is like that, but strung out for 9 minutes and turned up to the enth degree in its ridiculousness. Total diservice to the song itself. The song is masterpiece. And it was raped by the video. During something that should have been emotional imagery, we had shit that completely pulls you away from the song. The video is funny more then anything else. Even if it wasn't meant to be.

GNR were onto something with the Don't Cry video. With imagery that I think suited the song great and inspired its own story that went beyong just this song. The shit with Axl 6 feet under, and shivering, as an example. Estranged should have played off that. This was suppose to be a trilogy and it pretty much failed.

I have always really been bitter about this stage of GNR, having lived through it as a hardcore fan. and the handling of Estranged goes right with it.

[the dirt]

Thanks for giving me a good answer Buddha.

I'm sure I've seen it at least once but I don't remember it at all.

[Bono]

I think it has to do with the video more then anything else. I agree with the timing of this single as mentioned as well.

Estranged became more about the video then the song itself which is really fucked. The video IMO represents everything that was wrong with GNR at the time. Completely bloated and so far off the beaten path that GNR started becoming the very thing they first killed off. You know the part in the November Rain video where everybody at the party starting running for there lives when the Rain came and hid under tables and jumped into cakes and shit. The estranged video is like that, but strung out for 9 minutes and turned up to the enth degree in its ridiculousness. Total diservice to the song itself. The song is masterpiece. And it was raped by the video. During something that should have been emotional imagery, we had shit that completely pulls you away from the song. The video is funny more then anything else. Even if it wasn't meant to be.

GNR were onto something with the Don't Cry video. With imagery that I think suited the song great and inspired its own story that went beyong just this song. The shit with Axl 6 feet under, and shivering, as an example. Estranged should have played off that. This was suppose to be a trilogy and it pretty much failed.

I have always really been bitter about this stage of GNR, having lived through it as a hardcore fan. and the handling of Estranged goes right with it.

I disagree completely. I think Estranged played off Don't Cry more so than November Rain ever did. The only problem was that by the time they got around to filming Estranged Axl and Stefanie had split so it made it hard to actually complete the trilogy as Axl had likely intended. To me November Rain is a piece of shit bloated video. Estranged is one of my favorite videos ever. It has some great emotional imagery even if it's a  bit over the top. The scene where axl jumps of the tanker is awesome and the opening scene where the SWAT team is raiding his house is great.   I know  some people think the Dolphins are cheesy but for me they work in the video.  For me Estranged video seems much more conected to the song than the NR video does.

[KillKurtzKids]

It's a long song, towards the end of the second part of a double album that wasn't released as a single. And it also had a  video of quite embarrassing proportions! Which in fairness, should make it more famous.

I love the end of the song, the beginning I'm not at all fussed on. As good as Slash's solo's are towards the end, he makes the beginning of the song sound like a cheap porno guitar track.

[the dirt]

Check this out off of Wikipedia:

For many fans, especially die-hard hard rock fans, the video for "Estranged" was seen as a huge disappointment and represented Axl Rose (who had taken an active role in the production of the band's videos) succumbing to rock star excesses with such self-indulgent images of Axl swimming with dolphins, the costly abandoned ship sequence, and the overly indulgent nature of the band's videos. Many felt the video damaged or outright killed Guns N' Roses' credibility as hard rock superstars and for many, the video marked the moment in which Guns N' Roses jumped the shark creatively.

Some critics have argued that the backlash against the video was not an isolated incident, but instead a flashpoint towards a building backlash against Guns N' Roses. The rise of grunge, anger at Axl Rose's increasingly hostile prima donna behavior, and the excessiveness of the band's previous videos, including "November Rain", led many to use "Estranged" as a flashpoint for attacking the band.

However, among many hardcore Guns N? Roses fans, "Estranged" is regarded as the band?s masterpiece.

[Buddha_Master]

I think it has to do with the video more then anything else. I agree with the timing of this single as mentioned as well.

Estranged became more about the video then the song itself which is really fucked. The video IMO represents everything that was wrong with GNR at the time. Completely bloated and so far off the beaten path that GNR started becoming the very thing they first killed off. You know the part in the November Rain video where everybody at the party starting running for there lives when the Rain came and hid under tables and jumped into cakes and shit. The estranged video is like that, but strung out for 9 minutes and turned up to the enth degree in its ridiculousness. Total diservice to the song itself. The song is masterpiece. And it was raped by the video. During something that should have been emotional imagery, we had shit that completely pulls you away from the song. The video is funny more then anything else. Even if it wasn't meant to be.

GNR were onto something with the Don't Cry video. With imagery that I think suited the song great and inspired its own story that went beyong just this song. The shit with Axl 6 feet under, and shivering, as an example. Estranged should have played off that. This was suppose to be a trilogy and it pretty much failed.

I have always really been bitter about this stage of GNR, having lived through it as a hardcore fan. and the handling of Estranged goes right with it.

I disagree completely. I think Estranged played off Don't Cry more so than November Rain ever did. The only problem was that by the time they got around to filming Estranged Axl and Stefanie had split so it made it hard to actually complete the trilogy as Axl had likely intended. To me November Rain is a piece of shit bloated video. Estranged is one of my favorite videos ever. It has some great emotional imagery even if it's a? bit over the top. The scene where axl jumps of the tanker is awesome and the opening scene where the SWAT team is raiding his house is great.? ?I know? some people think the Dolphins are cheesy but for me they work in the video.? For me Estranged video seems much more conected to the song than the NR video does.

I am not going to disagree about the bloated shit, but Estranged was certaintly more then anything else. At least the majority of the video had the band performing the song which allows the viewer to focus in on the song itself. And it succeeded in doing that in spades. The mainstrean understands the beauty of November Rain. But the imagery in Estranged was very distracting, to the point that the casuals (and I am saying this from hearing it first hand as I am sure many of you have as well) say shit in regards to them recollecting Estranged as "Oh is that the one where Axl Jumps off the ship and swims with dolphins."

It pains me (the video) because I love the song so fucking much. The best video of the big UYI songs was by far the YCBM one. GNR still looked and sounded like they were still badasses. It was a reminder and wake up call for mainstream. When I see Estranged, I see the beginning of the end for the old GNR

[russtcb]

Check this out off of Wikipedia:

For many fans, especially die-hard hard rock fans, the video for "Estranged" was seen as a huge disappointment and represented Axl Rose (who had taken an active role in the production of the band's videos) succumbing to rock star excesses with such self-indulgent images of Axl swimming with dolphins, the costly abandoned ship sequence, and the overly indulgent nature of the band's videos. Many felt the video damaged or outright killed Guns N' Roses' credibility as hard rock superstars and for many, the video marked the moment in which Guns N' Roses jumped the shark creatively.

Some critics have argued that the backlash against the video was not an isolated incident, but instead a flashpoint towards a building backlash against Guns N' Roses. The rise of grunge, anger at Axl Rose's increasingly hostile prima donna behavior, and the excessiveness of the band's previous videos, including "November Rain", led many to use "Estranged" as a flashpoint for attacking the band.

However, among many hardcore Guns N? Roses fans, "Estranged" is regarded as the band?s masterpiece.

Wow, there's a ccouple inaccuracies in there, but for the most part it seems correct!

[ThatGuy]

Check this out off of Wikipedia:

For many fans, especially die-hard hard rock fans, the video for "Estranged" was seen as a huge disappointment and represented Axl Rose (who had taken an active role in the production of the band's videos) succumbing to rock star excesses with such self-indulgent images of Axl swimming with dolphins, the costly abandoned ship sequence, and the overly indulgent nature of the band's videos. Many felt the video damaged or outright killed Guns N' Roses' credibility as hard rock superstars and for many, the video marked the moment in which Guns N' Roses jumped the shark creatively.

Some critics have argued that the backlash against the video was not an isolated incident, but instead a flashpoint towards a building backlash against Guns N' Roses. The rise of grunge, anger at Axl Rose's increasingly hostile prima donna behavior, and the excessiveness of the band's previous videos, including "November Rain", led many to use "Estranged" as a flashpoint for attacking the band.

However, among many hardcore Guns N? Roses fans, "Estranged" is regarded as the band?s masterpiece.

Wow, there's a ccouple inaccuracies in there, but for the most part it seems correct!

estranged was actually considered one of the worst 100 songs of all time on VH1 (not that vh1 polls mean dick), which sort of gives you a hint as to what many people think about the song/video.  to many, the song is boring and too long, and the video a bit excessive and over the top.  furthermore, as many of you have already said, the video was released at a time when not many bands outside of seattle were warmly welcomed. 

in my opinion, estranged is a wonderfully written song, with great guitar work by slash and great lyrics by axl.  the piano in the song is excellent.  the changes are good.  as far as the video is concerned, i havent seen it in years, probably since its release, but i remember liking the video and thinking it was pretty cool.  estranged may be the current masterpiece of gnr, but i think its place is about to be taken by TWAT.

[metallex78]

I think it's a result of two things.

1. The song is pretty long, and not the amped up motivator that Paradise City is.
2. At the time of it's release, GnR was being overshadowed by 'alternative rock'. You really had to live thru it to understand, but bands like Nirvana, Soundgarden, AIC & Smashing Pumpkins were huge from 92-94. And if I'm correct Estranged was one of the latter songs released off UYI, the tides of rock music had shifted by then. I remember only seeing the 'Estranged' video a few times (Something about Axl jumping off a ship) whereas Pearl Jam's Jeremy was being played Non-stop.

When Estranged debuted here in Australia, it was a pretty big deal. True, alternative rock was popular, but the Estranged filmclip was made a pretty big deal out of on a local Top 40 countdown show. I still remember sitting there anticipating it with my VCR recorder at the ready.

I think the single charted ok too, didn't go top 10 or anything, but it was in the Top 40 for a few weeks.

Man, those were good times...

[GeraldFord]

-The song is too long and complex for most people
-video released in late '93

"nuff said.  Great fucking song, btw. If you don't like "Estranged," you don't like GN'R.

[justynius]

It seems the Use Your Illusion albums were viewed as a single release, and some might argue that technically they were.

No matter how good they are, you're not going to have multiple 8+ minute hits from the same release. It's just too much.

November Rain was the one that hit radios first so that was the huge hit, while Estranged was not.

I think Estranged could have been a big hit if (a) it was a single before 'November Rain' or (b) Use Your Illusion II wasn't released until around 1993 and Estranged was the lead single.

Also, it does not help that Estranged was frequently left off the setlists during the tour.