Libanon - Israel - Iran - Syria - 3rd world war (no politics, promise!)

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Can we talk about it in a calm way ?
sorry i snapped in the other thread, but some people were a bit too extreme.

So can we talk about what's happening. cause if a 3rd world war starts in a year, we'll look at this israeli soldier kidnapped as the little thing that started it all, just like for world war 1.

I can understand how Tsahal is trying to put the hezbolah down, but you just dont behave like that when their are civilians around.
same thing with a hostages situations, you just dont blow up everybody.

 

[Danny Top Hat]

I've asked Jarmo whether this thread can live so we'll have to wait for his verdict.? There's no way you can promise no politics - it is a political thread - but I personally think this is interesting and important enough for an exception to be made.? We'll see..

[Lucky]

no WWIII yet.
maybe in 20 years, but not now.

[Danny Top Hat]

Jarmo gave the all clear, so the thread lives!

You're only getting one chance with this so don't screw it up.  If the thread gets locked it stays locked, and anyone who tries to start trouble will be smited on sight.  No complaining - no whining - no insulting - no "just let the bastards kill each other" - no racism - etc...

Be very careful.

[Shirell]

I sympathise with both sides of the arguement here.  Both Isreal and Lebannon have good arguements for their sides of things. I cant agree with the escalation of violence though.  Its the innocent who will suffer, its the same in every war.  I just hope someone can bring both sides to the table so they can talk instead of shoot to eachother.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Yeah I like everybody ...... 

[Slashead]

Hezbollah (Party of God) is very dangerous. They are run by Iran.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Hezbollah (Party of God) is very dangerous. They are run by Iran.

yeah we know. what's your point ?

i got one too
Putting your hand (the extremity of your arm) in fire is dangerous, it burns.

[Slashead]

Hezbollah (Party of God) is very dangerous. They are run by Iran.

yeah we know. what's your point ?

i got one too
Putting your hand (the extremity of your arm) in fire is dangerous, it burns.

My point is that the end justifies the means.

[Mandy.]

I just hope someone can bring both sides to the table so they can talk instead of shoot to eachother.

You think they haven't tried? It's a very delicate issue, they don't want peace accords, whatsoever. Remember when Sadat was assassinated by his allies because he tried to make peace with Israel? If someone tries the same, history will keep repeating itself.

[Lucky]

there wont be a resolution in the near future.
someone needs to make some drastic action to change the situation there.
this way the agony goes on and on...

[SLCPUNK]

Best case scenario, the Jews learn how to become the victim again.
Worst case scenario is the Muslims gain power by playing the role of the victim.

If they don't learn soon, there won't be anything left to fight over..........

[Slashead]

Best case scenario, the Jews learn how to become the victim again.

Unlikely to say the least.

[Genesis]

Let's hope this thing ends quickly... I knew, nothing good would come out of Hamas forming the government. I'm not against them or anything, but don't the Palestinians have an iota of sense? What's the use of voting a terrorist group into power? One thing that they ensured is that they won't have any peace... 

[SLCPUNK]

Best case scenario, the Jews learn how to become the victim again.

Unlikely to say the least.

You didn't happen to hear anything whiz over your head did you?

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Let's hope this thing ends quickly... I knew, nothing good would come out of Hamas forming the government. I'm not against them or anything, but don't the Palestinians have an iota of sense? What's the use of voting a terrorist group into power? One thing that they ensured is that they won't have any peace...?

it's more complicated than man. rational reasoning don't work when you are:

poor
hungry
in prison
people build a wall in the desert around you
fighting over land
fighting over religious and racial issues

oh wait ! all the conditions are met !

hamas, hezbolah, they're just little parameters in a global issue.
it could have been settled down in 67 if, like kids, israeli and palestinian agreed to do 50/50. but no.
some people refused.

edit: 50 people today killed.
the port of beyrouth was bombed.

[Slashead]

Jacques Chirac stated that there are nations behind Hamas and Hezbollah's provocations...

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

but attacking the airport and all the civil infra-structures ?
why ?
they have nothing to do with the hezbollah, the airport was 100% civil.

israeli top ministers say that it's a mean of pressure on the libanese governement to deal with the hezbollah. The government had to deal with terrorist attacks and assissanation for 20 years, they have no hands on the hezbollah. Pressuring the governement by washing away all the economical hopes (this summer was about to be the 1st big touristic summer for Lebanon) is conuter-productive.
It will make the hate bigger
It will give even more reason to support the hezbollah. Because, as terroris this organization is, they are responsible of kicking Israel out of lebanon in 82, and the lebanese know that.

So is Israel trying to punish Iran and Syria through lebanon ? Are the USA behind that again ?
There are limits.

19 ?people died, 9 kids (!!) in a bus. burned alive. while fleeing . israel just dropped a bomb on the bus. come on.


edit : 50 dead just for today. 40 civilians. good job.

[The Dog]

but attacking the airport and all the civil infra-structures ?
why ?
they have nothing to do with the hezbollah, the airport was 100% civil.

israeli top ministers say that it's a mean of pressure on the libanese governement to deal with the hezbollah. The government had to deal with terrorist attacks and assissanation for 20 years, they have no hands on the hezbollah. Pressuring the governement by washing away all the economical hopes (this summer was about to be the 1st big touristic summer for Lebanon) is conuter-productive.
It will make the hate bigger
It will give even more reason to support the hezbollah. Because, as terroris this organization is, they are responsible of kicking Israel out of lebanon in 82, and the lebanese know that.

So is Israel trying to punish Iran and Syria through lebanon ? Are the USA behind that again ?
There are limits.

19  people died, 9 kids (!!) in a bus. burned alive. while fleeing . israel just dropped a bomb on the bus. come on.


edit : 50 dead just for today. 40 civilians. good job.

For someone who wants to talk about this so bad you are walking a fine line between discussing it and trying to stir things up....why even mention the USA, we are staying pretty far away from this in case you haven't noticed. 

For all of your statistics about innocent people dying (just on the Arab side I notice too, hmm, biased much? - as if innocent israelis aren't/haven't been targets as well?) you haven't suggested what you think Israel SHOULD do in this situation.  Best of all, you act like the kidnapping of "a few soldiers" is no big deal.  !?!?HUH!?!?   Quite frankly, if the government can't control Hezbollah then they ARE to blame for some of this.  Hezbollah is most to blame - they crossed a border, attacked/killed soldiers and they took some prisoner.  You honestly mean to tell me if that happened to people in your country you would just say "c'est la vie" and go on with your day? You wouldn't want a response?  You wouldn't want your government to send a message to your enemies and say "enough is enough"? 

To say the gov't has "no hands" on Hezbollah is naive.  They know Hezbollah operates in the southern part of Lebanon, they know they are recognized by the WORLD as a terrorist group, they know that they conduct terrorist activity and yet what have they done to get rid of them? 

To say that is the equivalent of the Taliban saying they had no control over Al Queda in Afghanistan - and we all know that wasn't the case.  Its the governments job to ensure that activity inside its own borders isn't going to bring negative outside attention.

I do think Israel's response is very excessive, but I honestly don't know what else they should do.  I will agree with you that the people I feel the most for are the innocents, but on BOTH sides of this conflict.  Don't mention one side suffering innocent casulties and not the other......that just shows a lot of bias.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

fair enough.
is it happening to your country ?

The israeli death are sad in the same ways. i mentionned the libanese ones, cause they were today, and 9 kids. that's all.
No bias here.
i'm sorry if i am naive enough to get on the lebanese side, i guess that's human nature to get on the weaks side.

Gov't problem ? Well yeah. Bombing the airport won't help. That's all.

And i dont think i'm being naive in getting the USA in the issue. Europe and Russia are in it in a way too.


Maybe it's a matter of morals and education, but i don't believe in punishing X when you can't reach Y. In a hostage situation the SWAT team do NOT blow the school with kids in it. They don't go " well, you let the criminals in, you're to blame !"
see. same thing.
There is a violence problem here. There are countries in the world that feel obligated to use violence to answer violence. And i'm sure you, or some others, will tell me that it's normal. You're feeding on violence i guess.

I'm just here, watching the news, readin the paper. For 5 years. And violence haven't solved a thing.
Now some will come back with the infamous theory " so what should we do ? let terror happen ? "
This is how stuck we are.
Israel won't stop violence until things go their way. unfortunatly things won't change until violence stops. Vicious circle ?

about the one side suffering thing.
they are two different matters.
israeli suffers from evil terrorist. of course people blame that. but it's not a surprise to see a terrorist killing civilians, that's their job.

those lebanese kids got nuked by a F-16 jet fighter. direct hit. that's something else. who's terrorist?