Will Velvet Revolver Survive Chinese Democracy?

[whpprsnpprr]

do you think that VR can survive chinese democracy. once it is released i think that they wont stand a chance. although i am a VR fan, i cannot see an album co produced by pharrel williams and leny kravitz a success but i hope that they prove me wrong!!! i think that the rise of gnr and the slight decline of VR,which may lead to their down fall will provide us with a reunion tour! i think that once the greatest album ever ie chinese democracy is released VR will begin to regret actions fromt the past. i also hope that the law suit will eventually bring about a mutual respect amongst slash, duff and axl!! time will tell!!!!!!! so what do you think...................................?

No offense but are you like 12?

[snakepipero]

    i didn't see this topic before


I think the question should be:
will axl n' roses release chinese democracy before 2020?     or
will axl survive to his demons?

[RageNirvanaNIN]

Here is where the problem lies , Axl has made this album seem like its "perfect" where it's mind blowing and such. Critics are going to nit pick it to death , VR just want to put out bad ass rock n roll , GNR wants to do something life changing. In this business if you hype something too much it comes to a point where no matter how amazing it is , people will always find its faults before accepting its decency.

[JDA]

When/If it is ever released then you can discuss it.  Otherwise, what is the point.

[COMAMOTIVE]

VR just want to put out bad ass rock n roll ,

Let me know when they actually do this please......

[ibelieveinaxl]

When/If it is ever released then you can discuss it.? Otherwise, what is the point.

good point. lets hope we can discuss "soon."

[Ali]

Nonsense
Chinese Democracy will sell great initially because of the history of hype its riding on, and it will be a great album, don't get me wrong,
but it will not be the ground breaking masterpiece, alot of people make it out to be, my estimation is it will be GNR without out the rock, but with the overtop ballads (which is cool) mixed with a wee bit of sterotype early 90s metal (check out bridge in better) which is also cool but none of is ground breaking,
it will be an excellant album and I do look forward to it, but this is not going to be in the league of Real Guns N Roses, and Velvet Revolver shouldn't worry, as they are also selling a quality product...

Agreed.
CD won't be that great. It will be OK, not earth-shaking.

VR shouldn't worry.

Disagreed. ?CD will be fantastic, an excellent album. ?There is no stereotypical 90's metal aspect to "Better" or any other song. ?The songs are amalgamations of a different set of influences than Appetite-era GN'R, but still pulled through the filter of melodic, guitar driven rock music.

More to the point, Velvet Revolver's survival has nothing to do with what GN'R does. ?

[Ali]

Here is where the problem lies , Axl has made this album seem like its "perfect" where it's mind blowing and such. Critics are going to nit pick it to death , VR just want to put out bad ass rock n roll , GNR wants to do something life changing. In this business if you hype something too much it comes to a point where no matter how amazing it is , people will always find its faults before accepting its decency.

Axl has not made this album seem like anything, it is the media that has done that.  You are just buying into what the media has made it out to be that Axl is doing or trying to do.  Axl has never said he wants to make the "perfect" record, nor has he said anything remotely on that level.

Ali

[fuckin crazy]

It is apples and oranges ... I like all kinds of fruit.

[Ali]

It is apples and oranges ... I like all kinds of fruit.

Best point of all.  There's room to like both.  Like I said, what happens to Velvet Revolver or Guns N' Roses will be unrelated to the other.

Ali

[Wheres Izzy]

It is apples and oranges ... I like all kinds of fruit.

Best point of all.? There's room to like both.? Like I said, what happens to Velvet Revolver or Guns N' Roses will be unrelated to the other.

Ali

Agreed. The only effect I think CD would have on VR would actually be a boost in album sales. If CD comes out and is successful theres sure to be alot of the questions about the old band VR get but in reverse to Axl. And if people who have never heard VR and are newer GNR fans dig CD curiosity might lead them to picking up a VR album.

[Eazy E]

VR will have the same problem all bands second albums have...labels expect them to sell without promotion

This post was made a year ago.. almost to the day... how prophetic!

[ShotgunBlues1978]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.  A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.  A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.  Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.  When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

[Wheres Izzy]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.? A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.? A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.? Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.? When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

Not to be too much of an Izzy fanatic but I think VR's not the only one missing Izzy's songwriting talents. Of the songs I've heard I really LOVE half of em, the other half I can't get into-and I've tried. Not a very good ratio for over a decade of work. Meanwhile I have almost equal sentiment to alot of VR. I really like Contraband and Libertad alot but theres some stuff on there that I will never get into. On the contrary Izzy has released WAY more material than everyone else and I truly believe it's all fantastic. Some of Izzy's lyrics are repetative and not that great but musically it's all there. The only post guns stuff I think anyone has done that gives him a run for his money is Duff's "Beautiful Disease".

[ShotgunBlues1978]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.  A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.  A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.  Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.  When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

Not to be too much of an Izzy fanatic but I think VR's not the only one missing Izzy's songwriting talents. Of the songs I've heard I really LOVE half of em, the other half I can't get into-and I've tried. Not a very good ratio for over a decade of work. Meanwhile I have almost equal sentiment to alot of VR. I really like Contraband and Libertad alot but theres some stuff on there that I will never get into. On the contrary Izzy has released WAY more material than everyone else and I truly believe it's all fantastic. Some of Izzy's lyrics are repetative and not that great but musically it's all there. The only post guns stuff I think anyone has done that gives him a run for his money is Duff's "Beautiful Disease".

I'm sure Axl does miss Izzy too, you can't have a songwriter as gifted as Izzy leave your band and not feel the consequences.  But the one thing Axl has going for him is that he was wise enough to go a different musical direction so that people can't say he's just making inferior rehashes of the music the old GnR made.  With VR, they keep saying they're trying to make down and dirty rock n' roll so it's more notable how much they miss Izzy's great ability to create bluesy, hard rocking tunes

Meanwhile Axl is off trying to make this epic progressive hard rock/metal album that's more influenced by Queen and NIN than by The Stones and Aerosmith, so the loss of Izzy is not as pronounced in the style of music he's making.  But it would be great if after, fingers crossed, CD finally comes out, if Izzy would join Axl and the rest of the new lineup they would write at least a couple songs for the next GnR album even if Izzy doesn't rejoin the band or tour with them

[Ali]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.? A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.? A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.? Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.? When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

Not to be too much of an Izzy fanatic but I think VR's not the only one missing Izzy's songwriting talents. Of the songs I've heard I really LOVE half of em, the other half I can't get into-and I've tried. Not a very good ratio for over a decade of work. Meanwhile I have almost equal sentiment to alot of VR. I really like Contraband and Libertad alot but theres some stuff on there that I will never get into. On the contrary Izzy has released WAY more material than everyone else and I truly believe it's all fantastic. Some of Izzy's lyrics are repetative and not that great but musically it's all there. The only post guns stuff I think anyone has done that gives him a run for his money is Duff's "Beautiful Disease".

I'm sure Axl does miss Izzy too, you can't have a songwriter as gifted as Izzy leave your band and not feel the consequences.? But the one thing Axl has going for him is that he was wise enough to go a different musical direction so that people can't say he's just making inferior rehashes of the music the old GnR made.? With VR, they keep saying they're trying to make down and dirty rock n' roll so it's more notable how much they miss Izzy's great ability to create bluesy, hard rocking tunes

Meanwhile Axl is off trying to make this epic progressive hard rock/metal album that's more influenced by Queen and NIN than by The Stones and Aerosmith, so the loss of Izzy is not as pronounced in the style of music he's making.? But it would be great if after, fingers crossed, CD finally comes out, if Izzy would join Axl and the rest of the new lineup they would write at least a couple songs for the next GnR album even if Izzy doesn't rejoin the band or tour with them

When people mention the loss of Izzy and how that may affect the quality of the new GN'R songs, I think two things:  1)  It's a valid concern.  2)  Thank God I have Tommy Stinson's record because in my estimation, that record shows he's a strong writer in his own right.  That second point makes me forget the first point and its importance.

Again, final judgement has to be reserved until the record comes out.  Keep in mind, we have no idea what songs we've heard demos of will and will not be on the record for sure.

Ali

[ShotgunBlues1978]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.  A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.  A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.  Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.  When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

Not to be too much of an Izzy fanatic but I think VR's not the only one missing Izzy's songwriting talents. Of the songs I've heard I really LOVE half of em, the other half I can't get into-and I've tried. Not a very good ratio for over a decade of work. Meanwhile I have almost equal sentiment to alot of VR. I really like Contraband and Libertad alot but theres some stuff on there that I will never get into. On the contrary Izzy has released WAY more material than everyone else and I truly believe it's all fantastic. Some of Izzy's lyrics are repetative and not that great but musically it's all there. The only post guns stuff I think anyone has done that gives him a run for his money is Duff's "Beautiful Disease".

I'm sure Axl does miss Izzy too, you can't have a songwriter as gifted as Izzy leave your band and not feel the consequences.  But the one thing Axl has going for him is that he was wise enough to go a different musical direction so that people can't say he's just making inferior rehashes of the music the old GnR made.  With VR, they keep saying they're trying to make down and dirty rock n' roll so it's more notable how much they miss Izzy's great ability to create bluesy, hard rocking tunes

Meanwhile Axl is off trying to make this epic progressive hard rock/metal album that's more influenced by Queen and NIN than by The Stones and Aerosmith, so the loss of Izzy is not as pronounced in the style of music he's making.  But it would be great if after, fingers crossed, CD finally comes out, if Izzy would join Axl and the rest of the new lineup they would write at least a couple songs for the next GnR album even if Izzy doesn't rejoin the band or tour with them

When people mention the loss of Izzy and how that may affect the quality of the new GN'R songs, I think two things:  1)  It's a valid concern.  2)  Thank God I have Tommy Stinson's record because in my estimation, that record shows he's a strong writer in his own right.  That second point makes me forget the first point and its importance.

Again, final judgement has to be reserved until the record comes out.  Keep in mind, we have no idea what songs we've heard demos of will and will not be on the record for sure.

Ali

Well, as I said while certainly losing someone with Izzy's writing talent will hurt any band, I don't feel it that much in GnR's new music just because it's a long ways from the type of stuff that Izzy writes stylistically.  The new GnR songs IMO are great, and show that the guys in the current lineup are fully capable of writing great music themselves, but they sound nothing like anything Izzy would've had a hand in writing.  If Axl was trying to make a sleazy blues rock songs I think Izzy's absence would be a lot more evident.  My basic point was just that I'm sure Axl and Slash/Duff all miss their chemistry with him and his ability to write, but that his absence is a lot more pronounced with the guys in VR than it is with Axl just because of how the type of music each of these guys are making now.  But I would still love to hear Izzy get together and write with Axl again at some point in the future

[Ali]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad are both connected to GnR but not Chinese Democracy or the new lineup.? A lot of people underestimated or were ignorant to how important Axl and Izzy were to GnR's sound.? A lot of people went in thinking that Slash's presence meant VR would sound just like GnR except with a different singer.? Obviously that didn't happen

Axl has at least been wise in one way, in that he has always maintained that he's not trying to make the same style of music that the old lineup made, that he's trying something different, and the new songs reflect that.? When Chinese Democracy comes out nobody who has listened to his words or his new music should be expecting something that sounds like AFD

Not to be too much of an Izzy fanatic but I think VR's not the only one missing Izzy's songwriting talents. Of the songs I've heard I really LOVE half of em, the other half I can't get into-and I've tried. Not a very good ratio for over a decade of work. Meanwhile I have almost equal sentiment to alot of VR. I really like Contraband and Libertad alot but theres some stuff on there that I will never get into. On the contrary Izzy has released WAY more material than everyone else and I truly believe it's all fantastic. Some of Izzy's lyrics are repetative and not that great but musically it's all there. The only post guns stuff I think anyone has done that gives him a run for his money is Duff's "Beautiful Disease".

I'm sure Axl does miss Izzy too, you can't have a songwriter as gifted as Izzy leave your band and not feel the consequences.? But the one thing Axl has going for him is that he was wise enough to go a different musical direction so that people can't say he's just making inferior rehashes of the music the old GnR made.? With VR, they keep saying they're trying to make down and dirty rock n' roll so it's more notable how much they miss Izzy's great ability to create bluesy, hard rocking tunes

Meanwhile Axl is off trying to make this epic progressive hard rock/metal album that's more influenced by Queen and NIN than by The Stones and Aerosmith, so the loss of Izzy is not as pronounced in the style of music he's making.? But it would be great if after, fingers crossed, CD finally comes out, if Izzy would join Axl and the rest of the new lineup they would write at least a couple songs for the next GnR album even if Izzy doesn't rejoin the band or tour with them

When people mention the loss of Izzy and how that may affect the quality of the new GN'R songs, I think two things:? 1)? It's a valid concern.? 2)? Thank God I have Tommy Stinson's record because in my estimation, that record shows he's a strong writer in his own right.? That second point makes me forget the first point and its importance.

Again, final judgement has to be reserved until the record comes out.? Keep in mind, we have no idea what songs we've heard demos of will and will not be on the record for sure.

Ali

Well, as I said while certainly losing someone with Izzy's writing talent will hurt any band, I don't feel it that much in GnR's new music just because it's a long ways from the type of stuff that Izzy writes stylistically.? The new GnR songs IMO are great, and show that the guys in the current lineup are fully capable of writing great music themselves, but they sound nothing like anything Izzy would've had a hand in writing.? If Axl was trying to make a sleazy blues rock songs I think Izzy's absence would be a lot more evident.? My basic point was just that I'm sure Axl and Slash/Duff all miss their chemistry with him and his ability to write, but that his absence is a lot more pronounced with the guys in VR than it is with Axl just because of how the type of music each of these guys are making now.? But I would still love to hear Izzy get together and write with Axl again at some point in the future

I agree.  I think Axl is aware of that and that's why he's not trying to make a blues-based rock record without those guys.  But, also, Tommy Stinson is a great writer, so it's not like all the songwriting pressure has to be on him, just like in the old band, Izzy was a great writer who along with Axl wrote a lot of great songs.

Maybe Axl and Izzy and the new band have written together, maybe they did some writing last summer?

Ali

[GeraldFord]

By the time Chinese Democracy comes out, Libertad will already have run it's course.

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad...

Failure? Let's not pull the plug just yet....

[Falcon]

The success of Contraband and failure of Libertad...

Failure? Let's not pull the plug just yet....

Exactly.  Some are a bit premature on their pronoucements.

Let's not forget the upcoming VR/AIC tour and how that may affect how long Libertad stays around.   It's easily the best rock show scheduled stateside for the coming months and will no doubt have a positive impact on sales.