Sirius radio

[darknemus]

Maybe we'll all get lucky and Sirius / XM will merge into some super-satellite radio company.  That way we get video, killer equipment, gps, great programming (Both for Stern AND for O&A fans), and no FCC interference.  This is so totally off-topic.. but oh well.  As I've expressed before - about the only reason I'm so "Anti-Stern" (and that's not a dis at his talent.. I think the guy is enormously talented) is because of how he treated O&A and the roadblocks he put in front of them when he saw that they were getting a following.  This is way back when in the terrestrial days.  That's just always bugged me. 

I think its great for SATELLITE RADIO that Stern went to Sirius.  I think its great for SATELLITE RADIO that XM has the RIR broadcast.  The bottom line is, the success of both companies is a good thing for those of us that like options for our entertainment dollar. 

I just hope the revenue Howard brings into Sirius can get their R&D guys to make some better equipment..

Also - back on-topic, again: Because of the XM / DirecTV partnership - any possibility this thing might get some TV coverage here in the States? I know someone suggested a PPV - but I'd love to see the whole setlist, myself.. not some chopped up production.

-darknemus

[axlrosegnr]

wow, you guys are really getting into this....well heres my thoughts  XM has only about 2 channels I listen to regularly....while Sirius has about 10, so I prefer Sirius

[1badapple]

Doesn't mean GN'R will be brodcasted. I hope so though.

They are playing, ?I called XM to check and they said eveyr band on the main stage is being broadcasted it's contractual between the organizers and XM...

Don't worry I'll have a nice digital recording of it!

upload that shit asap after you get it please. thanks

[Buddha_Master]

Maybe we'll all get lucky and Sirius / XM will merge into some super-satellite radio company.? That way we get video, killer equipment, gps, great programming (Both for Stern AND for O&A fans), and no FCC interference.? This is so totally off-topic.. but oh well.? As I've expressed before - about the only reason I'm so "Anti-Stern" (and that's not a dis at his talent.. I think the guy is enormously talented) is because of how he treated O&A and the roadblocks he put in front of them when he saw that they were getting a following.? This is way back when in the terrestrial days.? That's just always bugged me.?

I think its great for SATELLITE RADIO that Stern went to Sirius.? I think its great for SATELLITE RADIO that XM has the RIR broadcast.? The bottom line is, the success of both companies is a good thing for those of us that like options for our entertainment dollar.?

I just hope the revenue Howard brings into Sirius can get their R&D guys to make some better equipment..

Also - back on-topic, again: Because of the XM / DirecTV partnership - any possibility this thing might get some TV coverage here in the States? I know someone suggested a PPV - but I'd love to see the whole setlist, myself.. not some chopped up production.

-darknemus

First the Sirius S50 fucking rules. The portable unit is also coming (and a portable one that promises to actually work good). When that happens its over for testical radio. And what roadblocks man? I was listening to Stern saying he wishes them luck. Going back to FM isn't something he will ever do, but he said he wishes them luck. He honestly doesn't give a shit about them. What the fuck does he care. But when he is asked for a response he always answers. Instead of saying some trash, umm...hehe o n'a fans should just say thank you. If Stern didnt move on to this better place, then those two wouldnt be back on lame who gives a shit radio. They are afterall in the slot Stern happily pissed on.

[pilferk]

First the Sirius S50 fucking rules. The portable unit is also coming (and a portable one that promises to actually work good). When that happens its over for testical radio. And what roadblocks man? I was listening to Stern saying he wishes them luck. Going back to FM isn't something he will ever do, but he said he wishes them luck. He honestly doesn't give a shit about them. What the fuck does he care. But when he is asked for a response he always answers. Instead of saying some trash, umm...hehe o n'a fans should just say thank you. If Stern didnt move on to this better place, then those two wouldnt be back on lame who gives a shit radio. They are afterall in the slot Stern happily pissed on.

darks talking about "way back when".? When O&A and Stern were both on CBS stations and, supposedly, Stern talked to Mel K and had a "gag order" put on O&A so they had to stop talking about Stern.

I say supposedly only because, while I've seen the claims made, and they're well documented, other people have denied it's true.? Personaly, I think it MIGHT be true, but I'm not SURE that Stern had as much to do with it all as O&A insist he did.? But, in all reality, I don't really care enough to stand steadfast with that opinion.? None of the BS between them really matters that much to me...it's sorta juvenile.

Though, what I do find interesting is that any serious business discussion about XM and Sirius quickly degenerates into an O&A vs Howard discussion.  Weird, no?   

[darknemus]

Again, off-topic, but I'll respond.

A. What roadblocks: Back when O&A were on Terrestrial, Howard was not real happy with them mentioning his name.  In fact, he went so far as to demand that the company they worked for (remember, they both worked for the same organization at the time) ban O&A from mentioning him or he would walk.  One of the reasons O&A were off the air so long after the 'sex for sam' thing was that their employers at the time refused to release them from their contract unless they signed a statement basically saying "If we mention Howard, ever, we pay $10,000 per incident".  There are some much better breakdowns than this than i'm providing available - but here's a quick one from Wiki:

Howard Stern - During Opie and Anthony's WNEW days, Stern had a gag order put on Opie and Anthony to stop them from joking him or his family. [8] He also was quoted as saying "That's right. I believe in censoring anyone who is my enemy," as well as, "I believe in censorship when it benefits me." Opie and Anthony also dispute Stern's claims that other broadcasters steal his material, claiming that Stern himself has used bits from other jocks. Commonly called "Hoo Hoo" by Opie and Anthony and show callers, this name is a spoof on Stern's laugh. Opie and Anthony's recent return to free radio took over his initial time slot (vacated by presumed "fall guy" David Lee Roth[9]).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opie_%26_Anthony#Radio_Enemies

B. The Sirius S50 - Sorry, but unless something has changed, the unit doesn't 'rule'.  As it doesn't have the ability to do its main function (receive Sat broadcasts) when away from its dock.  (If I am wrong, please correct me on this)

C. Going back to Howard - your statements about him are in reference to 'recent Stern' - my opinion of him is based, in a large part, about how he was in the past to O&A - I just have a problem with things being.. unfair.

(FYI, at the time - there was no gag order back on Howard - he could say what he wanted about them.. he just didn't want them saying anything about him)

-darknemus

[Buddha_Master]

First the Sirius S50 fucking rules. The portable unit is also coming (and a portable one that promises to actually work good). When that happens its over for testical radio. And what roadblocks man? I was listening to Stern saying he wishes them luck. Going back to FM isn't something he will ever do, but he said he wishes them luck. He honestly doesn't give a shit about them. What the fuck does he care. But when he is asked for a response he always answers. Instead of saying some trash, umm...hehe o n'a fans should just say thank you. If Stern didnt move on to this better place, then those two wouldnt be back on lame who gives a shit radio. They are afterall in the slot Stern happily pissed on.

darks talking about "way back when".? When O&A and Stern were both on CBS stations and, supposedly, Stern talked to Mel K and had a "gag order" put on O&A so they had to stop talking about Stern.

I say supposedly only because, while I've seen the claims made, and they're well documented, other people have denied it's true.? Personaly, I think it MIGHT be true, but I'm not SURE that Stern had as much to do with it all as O&A insist he did.? But, in all reality, I don't really care enough to stand steadfast with that opinion.? None of the BS between them really matters that much to me...it's sorta juvenile.

Though, what I do find interesting is that any serious business discussion about XM and Sirius quickly degenerates into an O&A vs Howard discussion.? Weird, no?? ?

Its very weird. Stern is the King and its weird to have twiddle dee and Twiddle who gives a fuck mentioned ever in the same sentence with him. Its like some N'Sinc fans saying that nsinc is better then the Beatles and that the Beatles did something to N'Sinc.

[Booker Floyd]

Various business and stock analysts when the announcement was made.  And I believe them over O&A who are not going to cop to "yeah, this is a way to bilk our listeners out of a couple of extra bucks a month".

Not exactly the solid source I was looking for, but it sounds like those analysts were speculating anyway.  O&A wouldnt cop to anything since they were against it all along; youll remember that broadcasting to more people is really important to them, and a premium channel doesnt work to do that.  Im not saying the premium channel wasnt two or three-fold, because it was: 1. It keeps O&A off of the general platform and provides padding for XM in case something happens (which XM was absolutely nervous about) 2. It gauges interest in the show and 3. It brings in some extra money.  O&A made it their goal to be on the general platform and they did just that.  Eric Logan came to the company, became their advocate and made it happen. 

The number of premium subs to get O&A as being less than 100k?  Various sources.  Howard says 75k, O&A said 150k, other places I've seen about 95K.  I took the middle number.

Again, pretty vague sources.  O&A said 150,000?  Where?  The reality is XM never officially revealed the numbers, and I dont recall O&A doing so either.  Ive never seen solid evidence of their expectations either.

And not 150,000.  15,000.  Do the math yourself.  You don't think the difference between a 14.99 a month sub and a 12.99 a month sub might compel 15,000 people to jump on board?  With the addition of the price drops in receiver hardware?

My apology, I misread.  At the time, XM was 10.99 a month, 12.99 with O&A.  Do I think the surcharge kept 15,000 people from subscribing?  Do I think that XM thought that?  I have absolutely no clue.  However I do know that its nothing more than speculation.  15,000 is an arbitrary number created to make the math more equal, but it has no substantive basis.

And I didn't credit Howard with 3.5 million subs.  I said that since he signed his deal, Sirius brought in 3.5 million subs, mostly on Howards back.

Not to get down to semantics, but this is what you said:

3.5 million all on Howards back (or nearly so).

Not according to the published reports.  They all say CBS approached O&A.  I think even O&A said as much in the PR.

As a listener, I can tell you that they said "We tried to make this happen back when Howard announced his move."  Now "we" might refer to O&A and XM, since Eric Logan has spoken of Hugh Panero approaching Joel Hollander.  But it certainly wasnt CBS approaching XM.

It's whoring them out in hopes to increase subscription rates.  That's what it is.  You can paint it in whatever language you feel most comfortable with, but it is what it is.  It's giving away what was ONCE entirely exclusive to you,  to someone else for your profit.  That's the very definition of whoring, for gods sake!

So, essentially, you're not saying it's not true.  You just have issue with the semantics?

Its called syndication.  So was Stern a whore when he was an Infinity employee on Clear Channel stations? 

But it's not important to me, the consumer. 

Okay, but the context was whats important to O&A and it seemed to me that you added that audience size was really important to O&A as if it is somehow out of the ordinary when it really just goes without saying.

And, seemingly, not really that important to other broadcasters who prefer to
a) make more money
b) not have to broadcast within the constraints of the FCC
c) Have better working conditions
d) have a more high profile gig
and/or
e) create more and better content.

No, its still really important and not at all exclusive.  Its important enough for Howard to say ""I was just at my psychiatrist and I said, `I just got great news: We hit the 4 million mark. And I'm angry. It should be 20 million."

Youre also suggesting that O&A have chosen the audience in lieu of the other priorities, which isnt the case.  In addition to audience, theyre making more money, are more high-profile and have better working conditions - and they still do an uncensored, FCC-free show.  Every broadcaster wants to speak to as many people as possible is the point, I dont think youd disagree with that.

I already have.  Can you provide evidence to the contrary?

Im sorry, I missed it.

But, really, it doesn't matter, does it?  There's been confirmation that at least ONE offer was made, right?

No, theres been no confirmation.  NY Post identified Citadel, Citadel didnt confirm anything.  That doesnt prove that Citadel didnt offer, obviously they wouldnt say they did, but I wouldnt call it confirmation. 

I say supposedly only because, while I've seen the claims made, and they're well documented, other people have denied it's true.  Personaly, I think it MIGHT be true, but I'm not SURE that Stern had as much to do with it all as O&A insist he did.

Stern outright admitted it on Sean Hannitys radio show a few months back.  But he actually admitted it in the week after O&As 2002 cancellation, saying "I told Mel to put a muzzle on them."  I believe the date was September 4th, 2002.  I actually have it on casette tape somewhere.  Its noteworthy because its the first time he used their names on-air.

[Bostonrose]

darks talking about "way back when".? When O&A and Stern were both on CBS stations and, supposedly, Stern talked to Mel K and had a "gag order" put on O&A so they had to stop talking about Stern.

I say supposedly only because, while I've seen the claims made, and they're well documented, other people have denied it's true.? Personaly, I think it MIGHT be true, but I'm not SURE that Stern had as much to do with it all as O&A insist he did.? But, in all reality, I don't really care enough to stand steadfast with that opinion.? None of the BS between them really matters that much to me...it's sorta juvenile.

Though, what I do find interesting is that any serious business discussion about XM and Sirius quickly degenerates into an O&A vs Howard discussion.? Weird, no?? ?

Umm,. Howard said he did on the Sean Hannity show and his own show.. he put a gag order on them, Imus, Mancow and everyone else so he wouldn't have to deal with them

[Booker Floyd]

Umm,. Howard said he did on the Sean Hannity show and his own show.. he put a gag order on them, Imus, Mancow and everyone else so he wouldn't have to deal with them

Thats inaccurate.  Mancow isnt on Infinity.  Im also not sure it really extended to Imus, (though it might have), but it extended to everyone else (Don & Mike, O&A, Ron & Fez). 

For whats it worth, Ron & Fez probably do the best radio show around.  Theyre two genuinely brilliant broadcasters.

[Buddha_Master]

Umm,. Howard said he did on the Sean Hannity show and his own show.. he put a gag order on them, Imus, Mancow and everyone else so he wouldn't have to deal with them

For whats it worth, Ron & Fez probably do the best radio show around.? Theyre two genuinely brilliant broadcasters.

But are they funny?

[jimb0]

Dudes, fuck even reading all this shit.  Sirius rules.  I know b/c I'm addicted.  And if I have bad taste... why am I here?

BTW Jarmo, it was never on topic and belongs probably in the jungle but we are just fucking nuts about who we give 13 bux a month to.

[darknemus]

Umm,. Howard said he did on the Sean Hannity show and his own show.. he put a gag order on them, Imus, Mancow and everyone else so he wouldn't have to deal with them

For whats it worth, Ron & Fez probably do the best radio show around.  Theyre two genuinely brilliant broadcasters.

But are they funny?

Yes, they are.

-darknemus

[pilferk]

Not exactly the solid source I was looking for, but it sounds like those analysts were speculating anyway.? O&A wouldnt cop to anything since they were against it all along; youll remember that broadcasting to more people is really important to them, and a premium channel doesnt work to do that.? Im not saying the premium channel wasnt two or three-fold, because it was: 1. It keeps O&A off of the general platform and provides padding for XM in case something happens (which XM was absolutely nervous about) 2. It gauges interest in the show and 3. It brings in some extra money.? O&A made it their goal to be on the general platform and they did just that.?

Again, I'd say O&A are a less reputable source than the business and stock analysts are on the subject. ?In addition, O& A had distinct reasons to be disingenious on the subject. ?And, in addition to that, you're talking about O&A's reasons for fighting XM's mandate they'd be on a premium service....not XM's reasons for putting them there.

XM, had they been making oodles of money, wouldn't have moved them off the premium platform. ?Because doing so would hurt their revenue stream. ?And no businsess is going to do that.

Again, pretty vague sources.? O&A said 150,000?? Where?? The reality is XM never officially revealed the numbers, and I dont recall O&A doing so either.? Ive never seen solid evidence of their expectations either.

http://www.freetimes.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=2078

from late 2004, and included the free trial numbers, but many questioned as slightly exagerated (since the free trial went to every XM sub).

http://www.longislandpress.com/index.php?show=article&cp=188&a_id=7091

"When O&A finally inked a multiyear deal with XM, there were fewer than a million subscribers to the XM service. Their biggest problem, says Opie, was that The O&A Show was on a premium channel, like the HBO premium television channel, and billed as a separate cost for each subscriber. The early days on XM were a bit discouraging.

"We went from having a show that was syndicated in 17 major markets to having a few thousand listeners. But we believed in the show," says Opie. ""

And I KNOW I've seen them, in rebutting Stern's 75,000 number, that it was "more like double that" or something to that effect.

My apology, I misread.? At the time, XM was 10.99 a month, 12.99 with O&A.? Do I think the surcharge kept 15,000 people from subscribing?? Do I think that XM thought that?? I have absolutely no clue.? However I do know that its nothing more than speculation.? 15,000 is an arbitrary number created to make the math more equal, but it has no substantive basis.

No, it's the approximate calculated break even point when switching over. It's neither arbitrary, nor is it speculation. ?And it's substantiation is in doing the math. ?It doesn't need any more than that.

In addition, it's such a small number that it's an easy case to make that the $2 a month "reduction" could pull in that many subs.

And the actual price is not really relevant (except that, from a pure marketing standpoint, that 10.99 number is an attractive price set). ?The 2 dollar differance is. ?Oh, and actually with O&A, your service was 12.98.

Not to get down to semantics, but this is what you said:

3.5 million all on Howards back (or nearly so).

Thanks.

Notice (or nearly so). ?I'd say 2.5 million of 3.5 million is pretty much "nearly so". ?That's why I qualified what I said.

As a listener, I can tell you that they said "We tried to make this happen back when Howard announced his move."? Now "we" might refer to O&A and XM, since Eric Logan has spoken of Hugh Panero approaching Joel Hollander.? But it certainly wasnt CBS approaching XM.

Really? ?So you think, after DLR went on the air, O&A continued to contact CBS about coming over? ?I'm sure DLR and his attornies would like to know that...considering he'd have a good case for contract interference.

While I've no doubt maybe O&A made overatures when Stern left CBS, it would obviously need to be CBS who initated talks once DLR was on the air. ?Sure, you could argue they were revisiting an old offer, but it certainly was them starting the actual process that made the deal.

and "we" could just as easily have meant CBS and O&A...and given the semantics are out of context, there's no way for me to tell....but it doesn't say who contacted who.

Its called syndication.? So was Stern a whore when he was an Infinity employee on Clear Channel stations??

Aside from the fact the situations are completely and utterly different....given exclusivity on a national level sure is different than allowing syndication in markets you don't have room for someone in, I sure do.

CBS whored him out to whoever would pay for him, in the markets they couldn't/wouldn't put him in...he was a CBS employee. ?He was paid to be a whore.

Okay, but the context was whats important to O&A and it seemed to me that you added that audience size was really important to O&A as if it is somehow out of the ordinary when it really just goes without saying.

On the contrary, it should be said. ?It's seemingly important enough to them that they'd agree to deal with the FCC and a tight corporate leesh on their content.....allowing someone to produce what is, in essence, a watered down version of their show for their new "audience", moving away from what are, reportedly, pretty nice XM digs....and a host of other new headaches. ?

No, its still really important and not at all exclusive.? Its important enough for Howard to say ""I was just at my psychiatrist and I said, `I just got great news: We hit the 4 million mark. And I'm angry. It should be 20 million."

Might be a good idea to actually find out the ENTIRE conversation, and not just quote the piece that O&A (and the media) latched on to. ?It might also be a good idea to hunt down Stern's explanation for his comments....in full.

Because, in all honestly, what you just quoted had NOTHING to do, whatsoever, with what you're ascribing it to mean.

The final gyst of the comments you're quoting is that he fully realized that having what he has at Sirius was worth sacrificing whatever portion of his audience he needed to sacrifice....but that being said he's a neurotic shit who could never be happy with what he'd done, no matter what it was. ?If he'd gotten 20 million, he'd want 40 million. ?If he just put on the best radio show that was humanly possible, the next day he'd want to do a better one. It wasn't really about the audience or subscriber rate. ?It was about Howard's neurosis.

Youre also suggesting that O&A have chosen the audience in lieu of the other priorities, which isnt the case.? In addition to audience, theyre making more money, are more high-profile and have better working conditions - and they still do an uncensored, FCC-free show.? Every broadcaster wants to speak to as many people as possible is the point, I dont think youd disagree with that.

No, I'm saying that the larger audience seems to be very important to them. ?It's one of their priorities. ?It's NOT every broadcasters priority. ?Hell, DJ's leave large markets to go work in smaller markets, in more high profile gigs, or gigs with more freedom, or better hours, or whatever strikes their fancy every day. ?They might lose audience size...but that's not THE most important thing for them.

Yes, every broadcaster wants to speek to as many people as possible. ?It's ONE of the priorities. ?For O&A, it seems to be pretty high on the list.

With O&A, it seems to be one of their priorites, even if it means now dealing with the FCC and a tight corporate leash for much of their show. ?Even if it means that new audience is getting a watered down version of thier show on FM. ?Even if it means not having their "best product" out on the airwaves, because of the regulations.

That's fine. ?I have no issue with them for making that decision. ?It is what it is....a tradeoff. ?I hope it works out for them...

No, theres been no confirmation. ?NY Post identified Citadel, Citadel didnt confirm anything. ?That doesnt prove that Citadel didnt offer, obviously they wouldnt say they did, but I wouldnt call it confirmation.

So you dont' call a major media outlet saying one of the offers came from Citadel confirmation? ?Well, I do. ?Not that everything you read in the media is true, but.....I didn't see a denial from Citadel. ?In fact, I saw nothing of the sort. ?

But if you wanna turn a blind eye to that, more power to ya.

I still say it's confirmation that an offer was made.

Stern outright admitted it on Sean Hannitys radio show a few months back.? But he actually admitted it in the week after O&As 2002 cancellation, saying "I told Mel to put a muzzle on them."? I believe the date was September 4th, 2002.? I actually have it on casette tape somewhere.? Its noteworthy because its the first time he used their names on-air.

Like I said, I don't really care enough about the issue to hold much of an opinion, or to have really done much digging on the subject. ?It just doesn't effect me in any way. ?If he said it, and he did it....I could care less. ?Doesn't make his show any less entertaining to me...nor does it have any effect on HIS effect on Sirius' business.