Student kicked out of school for myspace parody

[Skeba]

And you are absolutely sure that it was the principle who leaked the information, and that the thing couldn't have leaked from anywhere else. If it was the principle, then he has acted outside of his authority.. He had no business doing that.

But concerning the your dirst statement. Let me put it this way: If you had a job, and you made a website like that about your boss. What do you think would be the chances of you having that job the next week if he found out about it? And do you think that it would matter to him if you did in your own time, and if you didn't even use the company computer?

If I'm right that he is in that school out of his own will, than that is his job. There's no excuse for publicly humiliating his boss. Even if it was a junior high kid, that sort of behavior should not be tolerated. The punishment was too hard, I agree. But he was very wrong to do that.

[Sterlingdog]

And you are absolutely sure that it was the principle who leaked the information, and that the thing couldn't have leaked from anywhere else. If it was the principle, then he has acted outside of his authority.. He had no business doing that.

But concerning the your dirst statement. Let me put it this way: If you had a job, and you made a website like that about your boss. What do you think would be the chances of you having that job the next week if he found out about it? And do you think that it would matter to him if you did in your own time, and if you didn't even use the company computer?

If I'm right that he is in that school out of his own will, than that is his job. There's no excuse for publicly humiliating his boss. Even if it was a junior high kid, that sort of behavior should not be tolerated. The punishment was too hard, I agree. But he was very wrong to do that.

No, I'm not sure who leaked the information, and I think I said the principal or someone else. 

You're right, if you did that to your boss, it would be stupid, but legal.  I don't think you could be fired for it, at least not directly.  It would depend on the nature of the statements, for example if they qualified as harrassment.

As far as if he is in school out of his own will, the answer is probably murky.  He could probably drop out, but if he's not 18, he's subject to his parents will, not his own.  They could demand he stay in school. 

What should have happened is that the principal should have called him in, explained why even if it was a joke, it could cause problems, told him to take it down, and that should have been the end of it.  Instead he went absolutley nuts, and is trying to destroy this kid.  I think the principal must have some power issues if he doesn't know how to handle something as silly as this. 

And once again, this kid didn't do anything illegal.  Satire is protected speech in this country.  But he's being treated like he did some horrible thing. 

[Skeba]

I guess in a country where people are shooting each other in schools, this would not be concidered horrible...

Well... Actually.. I too, don't concider it to be horrible. But I do think it was wrong.. And the fact that the kid fucked up, was punished for it, and is now crying foul speaks volumes of his personality.

But I really don't give a fuck. Especially seeing as I'm a bit wasted at the moment..

[journey]

I agree that it was a bit extreme to kick the student out of school. However, he was falsely impersonating someone, and to my knowledge, that's illegal for anyone. It's not about free speech. If it were, he could've made a blog or whatever and just made jokes about the principal and that would have been ok. But like I said, he was pretending to be the principal. If a parent saw that, they would probably get upset and not think it was so funny, even if the majority of the students knew it was fake. It's a defamation of character.

[Surfrider]

Satire is protected speech in this country.? But he's being treated like he did some horrible thing.?

Sorry, but defamation is not protected.  It is not like there was some joke disclaimer on the website.  I have thought about this before, it would be easy to fake being someone else over the internet by using a fake email address.  I don't think that this is necessarily a good thing to let kids get away with.  To argue that anything that happens off of school grounds is beyond the school's control is absurd in my opinion.  Schools have deteriorated enough in this country.  To turn this kid into the victim is just wrong. 

[Prometheus]

I guess in a country where people are shooting each other in schools, this would not be concidered horrible...

Well... Actually.. I too, don't concider it to be horrible. But I do think it was wrong.. And the fact that the kid fucked up, was punished for it, and is now crying foul speaks volumes of his personality.

But I really don't give a fuck. Especially seeing as I'm a bit wasted at the moment..

I see that this is where you miss what the point is, his punishemnt is really not in question, the severity of it is. An essential banishment from the masses to the small selct few of learing defuctants is the problem IMO. Susppend him sure if you feel as an educator it is necessary, take away his privillage of services that are reall of extra curricular in nature, makes sence to me. however without fulla ccess to his personal file, the removal of the student from the normal class structure to one of those that are destined to the bowls of society is putting the child at a disadvantage.

Several question are need to be answered: Does this kid have a history of disruption in the class room enviroment? Is the kids marks on a down slide away from the average and to the realms that extra help may be required through remidial studies? Are th students of this remidal class recieve aducate teaching?
If it can be proven that this new set up will benifit the entire class then the punishment does fit the crime, however if by his removal that no benifits and it really does affect the student, then the educators need to take the role that they should have been taking for years before, and that is that the future of the student is what they are really there for. It is not the role of the teacher to raise the child, but for the most part they are witht he students for more hours a day then the parents, they take a great role in shaping the minds of the ones that they teach. In a way they are responsible for the life that the student can attain. These days it is becoming more rare to find a teacher that really does care about the students, and do not just look at them as cattle they must throw education at and if they get it they get it if not they dont who cares. If the day of the actual careing teacher does come back it will be a better day for all.



To walk, on the elitest point of education, if it is so possible for everyone to get through university education then why is it that the US is lagging behind many of the industralised countries in producing qualified university educated persons? Why does the US have to go outside of the ountry to attract people to come work for them? the answer is certainly not by reducing the amount of people that go to University, but increasing the quality of the education that all receive in teh grade school and secondary school levels is it not?

[Skeba]

I think both things have to be concidered.. The amount of students that are let in schools should be controlled, as well as the level of education in general... The world can only have so many bosses.. The ground work needs to be done too. Everyone should be given the appropriate chance to advance though. Over here, where a year in a university costs about 150 euros (200 dollars max, prolly less actually). the money isn't an issue. We do, give the places to people who deserve them. And it is somewhat working. But we're still producing more highly educated people than our society has jobs for... So this has to be taken into account.

But to answer the original point... I didn't miss the point. I just think that it is stupid that he played with fire, and now crying because he got burnt... I said that I agreed that the punishment was prolly waaaaay too big when taken the 'crime' in concideration. But. I'd never do such a thing, so I wouldn't know how this certain individual thought that he would accomplish by doing this. I do think that he showed remorse by apologizing, and it should've stopped there. But I guess I just don't feel too much sympathy for the kid because I feel that he should've know that what he did in the first place was wrong and stupid... I guess that I haven't really given the whole situation that much of thought, since I don't live there, there for know the practices you have about this sort of behavior, or really thought the whole thing through, since my opinion will have nothing to do with the outcome of this event.

[Walk]

To walk, on the elitest point of education, if it is so possible for everyone to get through university education then why is it that the US is lagging behind many of the industralised countries in producing qualified university educated persons? Why does the US have to go outside of the ountry to attract people to come work for them? the answer is certainly not by reducing the amount of people that go to University, but increasing the quality of the education that all receive in teh grade school and secondary school levels is it not?

I think mandatory math and science classes would fix our colleges up. Calculus, organic chemistry, physics, etc. Lots of people go through college on sociology, Asian pottery, French art, and journalism classes. A few real classes would weed out a lot of the poseurs.

[Jim]

I think mandatory math and science classes would fix our colleges up. Calculus, organic chemistry, physics, etc. Lots of people go through college on sociology, Asian pottery, French art, and journalism classes. A few real classes would weed out a lot of the poseurs.

Don't forget Film. I'm going through the education system studying Film.

What a free ticket. 

[Sterlingdog]

Satire is protected speech in this country.? But he's being treated like he did some horrible thing.?

Sorry, but defamation is not protected.? It is not like there was some joke disclaimer on the website.? I have thought about this before, it would be easy to fake being someone else over the internet by using a fake email address.? I don't think that this is necessarily a good thing to let kids get away with.? To argue that anything that happens off of school grounds is beyond the school's control is absurd in my opinion.? Schools have deteriorated enough in this country.? To turn this kid into the victim is just wrong.?

I'm sure you know more about the law than I do, but I don't recall SNL ever running a disclaimer that the actors portraying Bush or Clinton are just actors.? Maybe they do at the end, I can't be sure.? But I know "Evil Dave Letterman" appears on Howard Stern frequently and there is no disclaimer.? Along with someone who sounds just like Arnold Swartzenegger.? I think the question comes down to if a reasonable person would believe that the "fake" is the real person.? And what this kid wrote sounds far too extreme for a reasonable person to have thought it was actually the principal.? I'm glad they are suing on his behalf, because I think we are too quick to give up our freedom of speech in this country, frequently in the name of political correctness.? If its not a free speech issue, then I guess the court will throw it out.?

I agree with the post above about not knowing this kids history in school.? If he was a consistent behavior problem, or someone who needed remedial studies, that would be a different story.? But it sounds from the article as though he was already accepted to Penn State,? so he must not have been doing too badly.? And if he's an otherwise decent kid who did one stupid thing, then they are being ridiculous in their punishment.

I think mandatory math and science classes would fix our colleges up. Calculus, organic chemistry, physics, etc. Lots of people go through college on sociology, Asian pottery, French art, and journalism classes. A few real classes would weed out a lot of the poseurs.

Did you go to college?? Because I'm pretty sure when I went Math and Science classes were mandatory.? Doubt I would have taken them if they weren't.

[Walk]

Don't forget Film. I'm going through the education system studying Film.

What a free ticket. 

Damn straight.  I'm taking film now, too. After a rough semester of Biology (still worth it, though), I need something easy! I'm definitely in favor of keeping the fun classes, but some hard stuff should be required.

[Walk]

Did you go to college?  Because I'm pretty sure when I went Math and Science classes were mandatory.  Doubt I would have taken them if they weren't.

People tend to take geology, environmental science, statistics, pure math, etc. They avoid calculus, physics, biology, and other classes. That's how it is at my college.

[chineseblues]

Did you go to college?  Because I'm pretty sure when I went Math and Science classes were mandatory.  Doubt I would have taken them if they weren't.

People tend to take geology, environmental science, statistics, pure math, etc. They avoid calculus, physics, biology, and other classes. That's how it is at my college.

Maybe people actually like geology, environmental science, statistics and pure math. Did you ever think that? I myself know alot of people who just can't stant calculus, physics, biology etc because it's just boring.

[Surfrider]

Satire is protected speech in this country.? But he's being treated like he did some horrible thing.?

Sorry, but defamation is not protected.? It is not like there was some joke disclaimer on the website.? I have thought about this before, it would be easy to fake being someone else over the internet by using a fake email address.? I don't think that this is necessarily a good thing to let kids get away with.? To argue that anything that happens off of school grounds is beyond the school's control is absurd in my opinion.? Schools have deteriorated enough in this country.? To turn this kid into the victim is just wrong.?

I'm sure you know more about the law than I do, but I don't recall SNL ever running a disclaimer that the actors portraying Bush or Clinton are just actors.? Maybe they do at the end, I can't be sure.? But I know "Evil Dave Letterman" appears on Howard Stern frequently and there is no disclaimer.? Along with someone who sounds just like Arnold Swartzenegger.? I think the question comes down to if a reasonable person would believe that the "fake" is the real person.? And what this kid wrote sounds far too extreme for a reasonable person to have thought it was actually the principal.? I'm glad they are suing on his behalf, because I think we are too quick to give up our freedom of speech in this country, frequently in the name of political correctness.? If its not a free speech issue, then I guess the court will throw it out.?

First, there are different standards for famous or political people.  Second, it is understood that those shows are parody shows and that they are poking fun at the people.  Certainly, noone would believe that Will Ferrell is actually George W. Bush. 

[chineseblues]

Then certainly no one would believe a high school principal would make a myspace page and put stuff like"what did you do on your last birthday?" "too drunk to remember" on it. At least not anyone with an IQ above 15.....

[Prometheus]

Did you go to college?? Because I'm pretty sure when I went Math and Science classes were mandatory.? Doubt I would have taken them if they weren't.

People tend to take geology, environmental science, statistics, pure math, etc. They avoid calculus, physics, biology, and other classes. That's how it is at my college.

well at my university, it is a requirement that all feilds have a grasp on math a couple sciences, as well as english(no comments please :p)

the math is credits of a intro calculus and calculus course, physics or bio or chem 2 courses each. english same thing 2 courses, plus a second language for arts degrees.

right now im not attending the University, done 3 years of that and got fed up with not knowing whata prof was saying casue they couldnt speak english! Now im going to a pure technology college, where we are required 4 maths 4 phys and chem and Electro (physics derative) plus technical english and a few specifc courses to give us a basic understanding of Auto cad if not required for your course. if it is then you have somethign like 9 different courses...... and alot od specic for your program. Petroleum is what im doing and it has a huge Chem and physics back Bone plus geology and geo physics......... insanely hard courses.....

but from the university as i said you are required regardless of your major to cover teh basics... and that is true through Canada i beleive

[Sterlingdog]

Did you go to college?? Because I'm pretty sure when I went Math and Science classes were mandatory.? Doubt I would have taken them if they weren't.

People tend to take geology, environmental science, statistics, pure math, etc. They avoid calculus, physics, biology, and other classes. That's how it is at my college.

Unless its differs greatly by state, there is no choice if you want a degree.  There are certain classes you have to take in order to complete your lower division general ed., then you have some upper division courses as well.  I know I didn't take physics or biology  for fun, it had to be required. 

[Walk]

Those are some hardcore classes, Prometheus. Good luck.

[RichardNixon]

To walk, on the elitest point of education, if it is so possible for everyone to get through university education then why is it that the US is lagging behind many of the industralised countries in producing qualified university educated persons? Why does the US have to go outside of the ountry to attract people to come work for them? the answer is certainly not by reducing the amount of people that go to University, but increasing the quality of the education that all receive in teh grade school and secondary school levels is it not?

I think mandatory math and science classes would fix our colleges up. Calculus, organic chemistry, physics, etc. Lots of people go through college on sociology, Asian pottery, French art, and journalism classes. A few real classes would weed out a lot of the poseurs.

Ever stop and think that not every productive member of society needs to know, or even have a rudimentary understanding of calculus, organic chemistry, or physics? And no one "gets though college" on lightweight-fluff courses alone. Everyone needs to pass English, College Algebra, etc.? I may not be a genius, but I worked very hard and graduated a State College to get a BA in psychology, something I am very proud of. I find your attitude to be extremely arrogant and offensive. Who the fuck are you to judge who should or should not get a higher education, or who is a "poseur" because they aren't good in organic chemistry....Do you think Bush would have passed anything like that without a tutor?

[Skeba]

Don't bring Bush in the conversation in every topic.. From here it looks like you're only trying to start a fight.

I think that it would be healthy for everyone to learn the basics in both phsyics and chemistry just so that people understand the basic stuff on how everything is working... About chemical reactions and the laws of physics.

Of course, it has to be up to the student how far he/she wants to take it, but the basics in both, plus math of course should be mandatory.