Hamas captures election majority, officials say

[nesquick]

I think this is the first time a terrorist regime has taken power peacefully. I have a feeling there wont be another election when the time comes. Hamas will re write the law to give them absolute power over all aspects of Palestinean life as the Taliban did in Afghanistan. I think this election is the height of democracy for them, it all goes downhill from here.

It is the first time indeed. It also shows how much the "average" Palestinian of the street is fanatized. They chose to vote for them, you know, it clearly means "we want war, we support terrorism, we want to destruct Israel". That's the voice of the Palestinian citizens. I think there is no future with the Arabic World, We had better work with China, India, more generally Asia, and help Africa and South America, that's where the future is. We have nothing to get from Ayatollahs. They live in the middle-age and it seems they are not ready to evolve politically and economically. They are in a strategy of war and confruntation with the rest of the world, not in a position of cooperation, negociation and peace. They are in a strategy of radicalisation.
Anyway, let's see what happens, but Iran + Syria + Hamas don't smell good at all for the Middle east.

[SLCPUNK]

It is the first time indeed. It also shows how much the "average" Palestinian of the street is fanatized.

I don't believe this is true.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

from what Ive heard Hamas is involved with a lot of charitable work for Palestinians and the Fatah party was pretty corrupt.  Voting for Hamas was more a vote against Fatah. Whatever the reasoning, they have elected a terrorist organization to run things and its going to hurt them in the long run.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

from what Ive heard Hamas is involved with a lot of charitable work for Palestinians and the Fatah party was pretty corrupt.  Voting for Hamas was more a vote against Fatah. Whatever the reasoning, they have elected a terrorist organization to run things and its going to hurt them in the long run.

yeah hamas won because they went straighth to the streets and used the *emotion* of the palestinian and their revolt.
what people tend to forget is that the Fatah comes from the OLP (arafat movement at first) and this was a agressive / military / terrorist organization too.

war is terrorism too. israel are terrorist. killing people with expensive weapons dont make you the good guy.

there is also 2 paradoxes here:
- george bush is now facing a wierd situation, where what he is fighting (terrorism) emerged from what he advocates (democratic vote) ... interesting ....
- the Hamas can't really go 100% their way. because they will need all the money the EU is sending there .... but the EU has ranked the Hamas as a terrorist organization in 2002 ... so funding a hamas government would be agains the EU laws.
and following the peace process, if the EU stops funding palestine ... Israel is obligated to do so !!!

moreover, for nesquick and everybody : think with your head not your heart.
nesquick is drown deep inside this issue because of his origins and faith, therefore he thinks with his emotions and heart instaed of being objective.

I, for exemple, am anti religion and neither palestinian nor isrealian, i would easily burn both islamists and israel extremists.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

from what Ive heard Hamas is involved with a lot of charitable work for Palestinians and the Fatah party was pretty corrupt.? Voting for Hamas was more a vote against Fatah. Whatever the reasoning, they have elected a terrorist organization to run things and its going to hurt them in the long run.

yeah hamas won because they went straighth to the streets and used the *emotion* of the palestinian and their revolt.
what people tend to forget is that the Fatah comes from the OLP (arafat movement at first) and this was a agressive / military / terrorist organization too.

war is terrorism too. israel are terrorist. killing people with expensive weapons dont make you the good guy.

there is also 2 paradoxes here:
- george bush is now facing a wierd situation, where what he is fighting (terrorism) emerged from what he advocates (democratic vote) ... interesting ....
- the Hamas can't really go 100% their way. because they will need all the money the EU is sending there .... but the EU has ranked the Hamas as a terrorist organization in 2002 ... so funding a hamas government would be agains the EU laws.
and following the peace process, if the EU stops funding palestine ... Israel is obligated to do so !!!

moreover, for nesquick and everybody : think with your head not your heart.
nesquick is drown deep inside this issue because of his origins and faith, therefore he thinks with his emotions and heart instaed of being objective.

I, for exemple, am anti religion and neither palestinian nor isrealian, i would easily burn both islamists and israel extremists.

Is the OLP the PLO for dyslexics? 

War is not terrorism.

I have no great love for Israel, but there is a difference between bombing Hamas leaders headquarters and blowing yourself up on a bus taking with you 50-60 working class civilians.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

from what Ive heard Hamas is involved with a lot of charitable work for Palestinians and the Fatah party was pretty corrupt.? Voting for Hamas was more a vote against Fatah. Whatever the reasoning, they have elected a terrorist organization to run things and its going to hurt them in the long run.

yeah hamas won because they went straighth to the streets and used the *emotion* of the palestinian and their revolt.
what people tend to forget is that the Fatah comes from the OLP (arafat movement at first) and this was a agressive / military / terrorist organization too.

war is terrorism too. israel are terrorist. killing people with expensive weapons dont make you the good guy.

there is also 2 paradoxes here:
- george bush is now facing a wierd situation, where what he is fighting (terrorism) emerged from what he advocates (democratic vote) ... interesting ....
- the Hamas can't really go 100% their way. because they will need all the money the EU is sending there .... but the EU has ranked the Hamas as a terrorist organization in 2002 ... so funding a hamas government would be agains the EU laws.
and following the peace process, if the EU stops funding palestine ... Israel is obligated to do so !!!

moreover, for nesquick and everybody : think with your head not your heart.
nesquick is drown deep inside this issue because of his origins and faith, therefore he thinks with his emotions and heart instaed of being objective.

I, for exemple, am anti religion and neither palestinian nor isrealian, i would easily burn both islamists and israel extremists.

Is the OLP the PLO for dyslexics? 

War is not terrorism.

I have no great love for Israel, but there is a difference between bombing Hamas leaders headquarters and blowing yourself up on a bus taking with you 50-60 working class civilians.

tell that to leia and luke skywalker. terrorism is the weapon of the weaks.

yeah PLO what ever, i only knew the french tag, didnt have time to guess the english one

what i think, is that , this issue is tangled in emotions and irrational arguments (coran, tora, god promises ...) that a external entity should judge all that : UN. in a serious way. no "peace process" > orders.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

from what Ive heard Hamas is involved with a lot of charitable work for Palestinians and the Fatah party was pretty corrupt.? Voting for Hamas was more a vote against Fatah. Whatever the reasoning, they have elected a terrorist organization to run things and its going to hurt them in the long run.

yeah hamas won because they went straighth to the streets and used the *emotion* of the palestinian and their revolt.
what people tend to forget is that the Fatah comes from the OLP (arafat movement at first) and this was a agressive / military / terrorist organization too.

war is terrorism too. israel are terrorist. killing people with expensive weapons dont make you the good guy.

there is also 2 paradoxes here:
- george bush is now facing a wierd situation, where what he is fighting (terrorism) emerged from what he advocates (democratic vote) ... interesting ....
- the Hamas can't really go 100% their way. because they will need all the money the EU is sending there .... but the EU has ranked the Hamas as a terrorist organization in 2002 ... so funding a hamas government would be agains the EU laws.
and following the peace process, if the EU stops funding palestine ... Israel is obligated to do so !!!

moreover, for nesquick and everybody : think with your head not your heart.
nesquick is drown deep inside this issue because of his origins and faith, therefore he thinks with his emotions and heart instaed of being objective.

I, for exemple, am anti religion and neither palestinian nor isrealian, i would easily burn both islamists and israel extremists.

Is the OLP the PLO for dyslexics??

War is not terrorism.

I have no great love for Israel, but there is a difference between bombing Hamas leaders headquarters and blowing yourself up on a bus taking with you 50-60 working class civilians.

tell that to leia and luke skywalker. terrorism is the weapon of the weaks.

yeah PLO what ever, i only knew the french tag, didnt have time to guess the english one

what i think, is that , this issue is tangled in emotions and irrational arguments (coran, tora, god promises ...) that a external entity should judge all that : UN. in a serious way. no "peace process" > orders.

I agree, rational thought gets twisted & distorted when you kill your enemy in the name of religion.

Luke did not exactly kill women and children.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

ooo am sure the rebellion did some awful stuff ... like blowing the death star with all the *civilians* working in the administration of the empire and all ....

[Dr. Blutarsky]

ooo am sure the rebellion did some awful stuff ... like blowing the death star with all the *civilians* working in the administration of the empire and all ....

Luke never went to the bathroom either 

[BA]

all i can say is oh dear.this will not do anyone any good.dangerous times we are living in.
there will be another attempt to destroy israel from the surrounding countries and alot of people will die and they wont get what they want.probably be a nother 6 day war.

very sad that people just cant along regardless of some small fundamental differrences,rediculous.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

Religious fundamentalists are always the ones killing in the name of God. Thats what Hamas is. How can you negotiate with that?

The Catholic Church in the middle ages did the same thing.

[Surfrider]

I agree.
Besides, you give the Palestinian the democracy, you make effort for them to vote and express themself, you give them the chance to make peace, and in return they choose one of the most radical terrorist organization of the middle-east. nice!

This does kind of turn W's premise, that free people engaged in free elections won't choose terrorism, on it's head. Does it not?

This kind of turns the premise that the Palestinians want peace on its head also.? Eh?


While it is certainly an unhappy result, it is useful in many respects. First, and most importantly, it forces the US (and perhaps some in Israel but not, I think, the Sharonites) to face up to the fact that their plans were founded on an illusion. The Palestinians are to a great extent supporters of terrorism and the destruction of Israel. There is no denying that now, although it will be denied.

Second, Fatah and the PA were corrupt and could not, in the current state, be the legitimate rulers of the Palestinians without the use of force. Individual rights, property rights, and the rule of law are sorely needed, but Fatah is just another kleptocracy. The US largely closed its eyes to that.

Third, there is an important division between Fatah and Hamas that US policy ignored. It is quite possible that the Palestinians will have a civil war, and perhaps they need one. They have to decide what they stand for.

Fourth, Hamas may have to face up to its own illusions. It cannot win a war with Israel, and Gaza is behind a fence. (Hopefully, the full Palestinian West Bank will be behind another fence soon.) If it does not moderate its position, it will be in a difficult position. It will be held responsible in the long run by Palestinians. The responsibilities of power may actually allow it to moderate enough so that the civil war between Fatah and Hamas will be avoided.

The great danger for the US and Europe would be to suddenly change their position and bargain with terrorists. But I am thinking that the US government at least understands this, even if it is willing to ignore many other inconvenient facts.

[Surfrider]

Unfortunately, one of the things that would both weaken the US and have devestating consequences for the world is actually constitutional, albeit unlikely: Making Jimmy Carter President of the US again. Carter's most recent gem:


"Carter, who led an 85-member international observer team from around the world organized by the 'National Democratic Institute' in partnership with 'The Carter Center,' urged the international community to directly or indirectly fund the new Palestinian Government even though it will be led by an internationally-declared foreign terror organization. "

"The Palestinian Government is destitute, and in desperate financial straits. I hope that support for the new government will be forthcoming," Carter said at a Jerusalem press conference."

He added that if international law barred donor countries from directly funding a Hamas-led government than the US and the EU should bypass the Palestinian Authority and provide the "much-needed" money to the Palestinians via non-governmental channels such as UN agencies."

"Regardless of the government, I would hope that potential donors find alternative means to be generous to the Palestinian people [even] if the donor decides to bypass the Palestinian government completely," Carter said, stressing that his main concern was to avert the "suffering" of the Palestinian people, which he said could lead to a new cycle of violence."
Remarkably, Carter embraces the democracy among the Palestinians but does not seem to recognize that the Palestinians are responsible for having freely chosen radical terrorists to run their country. Yeah, we should help them and "avert their suffering."


It would be interesting to imagine what the world would look like under this boob, but you don't really have to do so: It is in the history books: 1977-1980.
What is unbelieveable is that anyone listens to this guy.

[SLCPUNK]

I agree.
Besides, you give the Palestinian the democracy, you make effort for them to vote and express themself, you give them the chance to make peace, and in return they choose one of the most radical terrorist organization of the middle-east. nice!

This does kind of turn W's premise, that free people engaged in free elections won't choose terrorism, on it's head. Does it not?

This kind of turns the premise that the Palestinians want peace on its head also.  Eh?

The post that followed explained why they probably voted the way they did.

No need to start the spin machine.......

[SLCPUNK]

What is unbelieveable is that anyone listens to this guy.

Guess somebody did............

Jimmy Carter:

The Nobel Peace Prize 2002

"for his decades of untiring effort to find peaceful solutions to international conflicts, to advance democracy and human rights, and to promote economic and social development"
 

[Walk]

Arafat won the Nobel Peace Prize. It is meaningless now at best.

This just shows that democracy is not always the answer; usually it isn't. Most cultures are incapable of it. It requires an intelligent, educated populace with respect and obedience for authority. Hamas are the guys with the biggest guns. That's why they won. Palestinians have no respect for ideals, only power.

It's time we disinfected Israel. Jordan has plenty of room, and is culturally more suitable for the Palestinians. They would be happy living there instead of a 1st world country.

[Izzy]

It's time we disinfected Israel. Jordan has plenty of room, and is culturally more suitable for the Palestinians. They would be happy living there instead of a 1st world country.

 

The day u get banned will be a sad one, I would miss posts such as these

Why not just kill them all?