Here's a cool article circa 2001 with Billy Duffy discussing Bob Rock, his guitar sound for "Beyond Good and Evil" and a few points in between:
By Darrin Fox
"This album sounds like a Cult record should sound," says Billy Duffy about the group's first album in seven
years, Beyond Good and Evil [Atlantic]. "The production is very stark and dark. It's an aggressive -- even
violent -- record in places."
When the Cult's 1984 debut album, Dreamtime, was released in England, the group piqued interest with its
Goth-tinged sound and Duffy's trippy guitar textures. However, it was 1985's Love, and the track "She Sells
Sanctuary," that put the Cult on the map. The band's next record, Electric, shocked fans. Teaming with producer
Rick Rubin, the Cult shed their brooding sound, and opted for a crunching, bare-knuckled approach. "We saw a
movement back to basic rock," says Duffy, "and we wanted to be a part of that energy. We wanted to take our
music to another level, and get away from the Gothic '80s. Rick was a good conduit for that."
The Cult reached the height of their success in 1989, when Sonic Temple reached the Top Ten. However the
group's subsequent records were disappointments, and the Cult disbanded in 1995.
Now Duffy and singer Ian Astbury have regrouped, and the duo is eager to regain its rightful place in the rock
world. With seminal producer Bob Rock at the helm, Beyond Good and Evil reeks of a band that is fired up and
ready to throw down -- a feeling Duffy enthusiastically confirmed when he spoke to GP from London.
Beyond Good and Evil is surprisingly heavy.
Yeah, a lot of people are surprised, but I don't know what they expected -- a folk album? When Ian and I got the
band back together, we wanted to make a brutal, heavy, and uncomplicated record.
Why?
I think sometimes you have to make the message very, very simple in order to communicate. To an extent, we
wanted Beyond Good and Evil to be easy for people to digest. The Electric album, for example, is an incredibly
simplistic record that lots of people hold very dear.
Your tones really run the gamut on the new album.
That's one of the joys of having Bob Rock as a producer. I mean, if you want heavy, Bob knows heavy. He's a
guitar player, and he's into all of the nuances of guitar tone and its placement in the mix. He made my heavy
sounds heavier and my lighter sounds lighter.
What's it like working with Bob Rock, as opposed to Rick Rubin?
Well, you're talking about two different time periods for us. Both Rick and Bob are very strong characters, and I
think that's essential if you're going to produce the Cult. Ian and I will give you a very bad time if you're weak.
Rick doesn't approach music as an accomplished musician. He's more of a stylist who understands what he
wants to hear. Bob is more of a hands-on producer who still sees himself as a guitar player and songwriter.
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Guitar Player Online - Heavy Hitter: The Cult's Billy Duffy
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As producers, each one seems to be a guitarist's dream.
Bob is very passionate about the guitar, and he understands what you need to do to get sounds. Rick knows
what he wants to hear, and he doesn't care how you do it, as long as you do it. Sometimes Rick would give you
a solution, whereas Bob could be part of the solution.
Did you have your tones fully realized before going into the studio?
I had some ideas. One thing Bob did was get me to listen to our early records. He said, "Remember some of the
more frail tones you got on the Love album? They're good." So I went out and re-invested in a Roland JC-120
amplifier -- which I used all over Love -- and plugged in my old Gretsch White Falcon. Most of the record was
tracked with Les Pauls, however.
"Nico" is a swirl of guitars.
That song was the most difficult one to capture on the entire record! Ian brought it in, and I was trying to find
different ways to approach the chords. That tune was one of the few times I played a different guitar on the
album -- a Gibson ES-335 -- and I used a lot of delays to make the track wooshy and atmospheric. So there
aren't as many guitar tracks as you may think, they're just kind of wet. On the tunes that are really big-sounding,
the guitars were usually quadruple tracked.
The solo on "Speed of Light" sounds very energetic. Do you get into a certain frame of mind when tracking a
solo?
To get the best performance out of me, Bob would often try to gauge what kind of mood I was in, and match it
to an appropriate track. If I still couldn't get the vibe, he'd help me understand the essentials needed for the solo
to communicate. The "Speed of Light" solo is a particularly good one, but I'm not thrilled with "Ashes and
Ghosts." We didn't have a lot of studio time available to go back and recut solos. Sometimes you have to be a
big boy.
But the solo on "Ashes and Ghosts" is one of my favorites.
Well, I trust Bob. Sometimes my judgment about myself isn't that great.
Are your solos improvised or constructed?
I usually have some kind of framework. I concentrate on getting a good beginning and a good ending, because
the note you go in on, and the note you go out on are pivotal.
Most of the solos were cut with an old JMP Marshall and a reissue Gibson goldtop. I also used a wah, but more
like Mick Ronson used it back in the day with Bowie. I work the pedal until I find the right voice for the guitar,
and then I leave it in that position.
What gear are you using to replicate the album's tones onstage?
I'm touring with a four-amp setup designed to give me a spectrum from heavy to light and everything in
between. I use a Roland JC-120 for clean tones, a Matchless DC30 for some clean grind, a Marshall JCM 800
for a fat tone with strong mids, and a Mesa/Boogie Dual Rectifier for a heavy, percussive tone. I can switch
between any combination of all four amps, but switching the amps onstage can be a ridiculous tap dance.
What effects are you using?
I've always used a lot of Boss stuff. Their delay pedals -- analog and digital -- get that authentic "She Sells
Sanctuary" sound. I still use my MXR Phase 100. Our old bass player gave me his Boss Super Overdrive, and
I've used one ever since. Lately, I've been using an Ibanez Tube Screamer. I can't tell the difference between the
Super Overdrive and the Tube Screamer -- I defy anyone to tell the difference.
Have you been influenced at all by current rock guitarists?
Not too much. I mean, I like to be aware of my surroundings. There are certain things I've heard from young
guitar players that make me think, "That doesn't sound a million miles away from what we were doing on the
Love album."
To me, a lot of the new guys are a bit the same. I don't want to be some old guy criticizing -- this is just what I
hear. Too many of them are conforming to one super-heavy sound and one clean sound. It's very safe. I can't
really distinguish any of those guys from the new school except Tom Morello. He was doing some
ground-breaking stuff for a while.
Do you still practice?
Not nearly as much as I should. There were times on the Electric album where the dog was taking me for a
walk, you know? On Sonic Temple, Bob helped me a lot by comping multiple solo takes to get what we wanted.
On this album, however, I felt more in control of what I was doing. I'll keep improving as long as I never stop
Guitar Player Online - Heavy Hitter: The Cult's Billy Duffy
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learning -- and I feel like I've been learning lately.
What's something you've learned recently?
On Beyond Good and Evil, almost everything is dropped-D tuning -- which is absolutely not a new trick to
anyone except me. It's something I just got into, and it gave me a whole new lease on riff writing. It made me
play familiar things differently. It's no big deal to many people, but for us, it made the sound of this record.
Do you remember when you first realized you had stumbled onto something?
The first riff I did with the dropped-D was for the song "Breath," and that was a pivotal moment in the making
of this album. I even started changing the keys of other songs so I could play them in dropped tuning. Suddenly
the album had a voice.
Were you in a rut?
Maybe. There was no shortage of tunes, but I was having a hard time finding riffs that came out and said,
"Make me a song." The dropped-D tuning changed everything.
What are Billy Duffy's stylistic signatures?
It's difficult to be objective about yourself. I think being English and growing up with punk rock has instilled
the quest to find something musically unusual. I like to ride on the verge of experimental sounds. That concept
has always held more for me than being able to play every Jimmy Page solo.
In this band, I had one era with the Gretsch White Falcon and the mid-'80s, jangly guitar thing, like on "She
Sells Sanctuary." But another part of me is Les Paul, Marshall, wah-wah, and tunes like "Fire Woman." I think
those are my two things. People like to see me play the Gretsch. It's a visual image of me they're comfortable
with -- the guy in the Cult with the big white guitar."
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