Jim Barber (a&r for Geffen) on Chinese in 98-99

[BabyGorilla]

As my first post, I must agree 100% with everything gnfnr2k has to say. None of us should complain about Axl. We should just accept him for who he is. If Axl decides to leave his band and his fans in the cold by not showing up to a concert (like in Philly), and not give the fans any response or any reason why he failed to show than tough luck! The fans who ended up sitting for hours only to be told to go home should not bitch! They should just accept it and not ask questions. If Axl decides he wants to beat up his wife and girlfriend then tough for them. They should just accept Axl for being Axl and stop bitching about getting hit. Hell, if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place. Stupid bitches. I LOVE YOU AXL!

complain about the album being out if thats what floats your boat.  just don't get pissy when others say what they have to say about it. 

and WTF does any of that BS you posted about have to do with the album 

It has to do with what gnfnr2k said about accepting Axl for being Axl and not questioning his actions or motives. Axl is our Fuehrer and we are the Gestapo. We should not question anything Axl does, just aceept them and take what is given to us. No complaining. If you complain...you get discipline! Do you like discipline!?

[darknemus]

All this complaining about new music not being out is going to become pretty pointless relatively soon.  Of course, that's just my opinion, so please view it as such

Rock on and all that,

-darknemus

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

It's called faith dude. ?
The choice is clear. Anyone who can't see that isn't seeing clearly. ?

One can be a cynic but still have the F word...

how so? ?

faith = belief /cynic = non-believer
cynacism = ?hopelessness / faith = hope

the way i see it, either you have it or you don't.

As my first post, I must agree 100% with everything gnfnr2k has to say. None of us should complain about Axl. We should just accept him for who he is. If Axl decides to leave his band and his fans in the cold by not showing up to a concert (like in Philly), and not give the fans any response or any reason why he failed to show than tough luck! The fans who ended up sitting for hours only to be told to go home should not bitch! They should just accept it and not ask questions. If Axl decides he wants to beat up his wife and girlfriend then tough for them. They should just accept Axl for being Axl and stop bitching about getting hit. Hell, if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place. Stupid bitches. I LOVE YOU AXL!

complain about the album being out if thats what floats your boat. just don't get pissy when others say what they have to say about it.

and WTF does any of that BS you posted about have to do with the album

It has to do with what gnfnr2k said about accepting Axl for being Axl and not questioning his actions or motives. Axl is our Fuehrer and we are the Gestapo. We should not question anything Axl does, just aceept them and take what is given to us. No complaining. If you complain...you get discipline! Do you like discipline!?

Axl isn't anyone's god damn Fuehrer. ? lol!
What fucking discipline are you going on about?
What is your major malfunction? ?

Why the fuck do I have to question Axl?
I have my own life to live.
No one ASKS much less FORCES you to give a shit what Axl does or doesn't do or why - as if you even knew what the fuck he is doing or isn't doing or why!  If you give a shit and it sticks in your craw that you don't know, that is your problem....
You can bitch all you want about it but what's your point?
That we should all be bitching little whining punks?
And if we're not then that means we're the losers?
Now thats fucking twisted man. ?
Axl is who he is and does what he does - yep Dave said that.
And what's your problem with that?
We should not accept him as he is? ?lol! ?So now you think you own the guy! ?And we're the psychos? ?

[mikegiuliana]

Why do people get pissed when someone eevry so often vents about the album?? Not everyone is as patient and understanding as others.. For some that have been around since day one in the gnr world are just trying to look forward without making up hypothetical setlists and what might be played on tours.. As a gnr community we complain some and it's only normal, we only want to move on and experience all the stuff everyone is calling mind blowing and amazing earth shattering etc.. We want to see the new guys have their day in the sun as well..

I may bitch but it's not because of the material or because I have anything against axl rose.. I have followed the man since 87 along with each changing of the guard in gnr.. I only bitch because I feel let down and some days for me personally it's harder to deal with and see the same people so overly positive.. Nothing wrong with being optomistic.. But not everyone is as sure as the rest.. Some of us enjoyed the new material, but not to the point where we are still playing those tunes on a regular basis so please understand I am looking for the newer stuff.
I just want to get out there (like we all do) and enjoy the fruits of the labor and get my tickets to shows and actually turn on thre radio and hear a new single..

I mean fuck I heard 92.3 K-rock the other day and a ny dj julie slater talked a few secs about new material before playing mr brownstone.. She was like I hear a few members are stil in gnr that have been working on material for years but it never sees the light of day.. Nowe she is a big rock dj in nyc and that little speech wasn't soemthing reassuring when you are expecting something so grand and sooner then later..


maybe I rub people the wrong way but you must see it from both sides.. I try to expres my feelings and not hold back.. I like people who say what;'s on their minds and are honest.. I am not a sugar coater.. I am not the one who resurected guns and gave subtle hints and numerous shows with hints and actuall statements that showed shit should have happened.. So everyone is different.. The realistic people aka the whiners may be annoying to some, but so are the people who act like hey it's going to happen and have no doubts in the world and almost act like they don't expect anything or care yet they devote their lives to 5-6 tunes that are like 5-6 years old..

As fans we deserve resepct.. I bought many new things from new gnr, supported them on their tour in 02, and defended axl many times on the vh1 boards after the vmas.. man has limits and those with a spine will feel lied to after a while and  get a bit pissed.. We deserve an update to say the least.

it's a gnr message aboard you can't agree with eevryone

[BabyGorilla]

I don't understand where all this is coming from. I am agreeing with you and gnfnr2k. We should accept Axl for who he is. If Axl is the kind of person who doesn't feel the need to explain himself for missing out on a show and leaving his band in the cold than we should accept it and get on with our lives. I really do not connect with these "fans" who are promised an album in 2005 yet complain when it doesn't come out. I mean which country do they think they live in? America? There is a reason why this album is called Chinese Democracy. Because a Chinese democracy would not be a real democracy. It would just appear as so on the surface but underneath it all, those who question or complain about the authority will be DISIPLINED by their peers. OR we can get along with these so-called "fans." Oh yes, I will get along with them. Then, I will hug some snakes...yes! Then, I will hug and kiss some poisonous SNAKES! 

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

I don't understand where all this is coming from. I am agreeing with you and gnfnr2k. We should accept Axl for who he is. If Axl is the kind of person who doesn't feel the need to explain himself for missing out on a show and leaving his band in the cold than we should accept it and get on with our lives. I really do not connect with these "fans" who are promised an album in 2005 yet complain when it doesn't come out. I mean which country do they think they live in? America? There is a reason why this album is called Chinese Democracy. Because a Chinese democracy would not be a real democracy. It would just appear as so on the surface but underneath it all, those who question or complain about the authority will be DISIPLINED by their peers. OR we can get along with these so-called "fans." Oh yes, I will get along with them. Then, I will hug some snakes...yes! Then, I will hug and kiss some poisonous SNAKES!?

as for agreeing with me and dave you're posts are getting more twisted by the minute

if you're looking for snakes you are in the wrong section of the board. 

what's all this talk about discipline?  lol!
you into S&M or something?  lol!

mikegiuliana.....   I doesn't bother me if anyone wants to vent their frustration about the album coming out.  what irks me is when some fans accuse fans like dave or I of being up Axl's ass just because we're not frustrated.

[lynn1961]

As my first post, I must agree 100% with everything gnfnr2k has to say. None of us should complain about Axl. We should just accept him for who he is. If Axl decides to leave his band and his fans in the cold by not showing up to a concert (like in Philly), and not give the fans any response or any reason why he failed to show than tough luck! The fans who ended up sitting for hours only to be told to go home should not bitch! They should just accept it and not ask questions. If Axl decides he wants to beat up his wife and girlfriend then tough for them. They should just accept Axl for being Axl and stop bitching about getting hit. Hell, if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place. Stupid bitches. I LOVE YOU AXL!

Oh my God.? You're sick, you know that?? I just can't even believe you posted that or that I'm reading it, specifically, "..if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place.? Stupid bitches."? ? You scare me!

Anyway, I can accept Axl for who he is.? He's Axl.? I have no respect for him anymore.? Compassion, maybe, because he obviously has issues, but no respect.? If you want to pay money for shows that he either doesn't show up for or gets pissed and leaves, then all the more power to you.? (Actually, to see him get pissed & leave might be worth the money, because that's classic Axl!)?

Does anyone, other than a couple of us, see the ludicracy in all of this?? There were promises in 1999, 2002, 2005, and other times in between.? If, in fact, in 2000, Axl had the vocals laid down, then why did he not release it?? Someone said that "he wants to make the best album possible and when he feels it's right he will release it."? Come on...you could wait forever, if that's the case.? Like I said before, it's been 12 yrs.? It doesn't take 12 yrs to make a "perfect" album.? I still think he's just afraid to release it - fear of failure or something.? Admittedly, I haven't been one that's been waiting for this, but I was a huge fan of GnR (back in the day, of course).? But, for those who are, don't you feel, by this time, that you are being just strung along in the name of Axl's supposed "perfection"?

If he doesn't release CD, he will, if nothing else, go down in rock n' roll history as the "madman of rock n' roll".? ?I'm already beginning to think he is.?

Anyway, why do I post here, if I feel this way?? Because I loved GnR.? Axl's made this into a joke.? For those of us who feel this way, our opinion means something, as well.? (Plus, I love to see people get all freaked out about this.? Can't help it.)? ? ? ? ?

[BabyGorilla]

As my first post, I must agree 100% with everything gnfnr2k has to say. None of us should complain about Axl. We should just accept him for who he is. If Axl decides to leave his band and his fans in the cold by not showing up to a concert (like in Philly), and not give the fans any response or any reason why he failed to show than tough luck! The fans who ended up sitting for hours only to be told to go home should not bitch! They should just accept it and not ask questions. If Axl decides he wants to beat up his wife and girlfriend then tough for them. They should just accept Axl for being Axl and stop bitching about getting hit. Hell, if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place. Stupid bitches. I LOVE YOU AXL!

Oh my God.  You're sick, you know that?  I just can't even believe you posted that or that I'm reading it, specifically, "..if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place.  Stupid bitches."    You scare me!

If you thought gnfn2k was a blind fanboy then you haven't seen nothing yet. ::puts on my Jack Nicholson Joker voice:: Wait'll you guys get a load of me. This board needs an enema! 

[lynn1961]

Go right ahead.? Give it an enema.? You'd probably like that.? 

[dave-gnfnr2k]

I don't understand where all this is coming from. I am agreeing with you and gnfnr2k. We should accept Axl for who he is. If Axl is the kind of person who doesn't feel the need to explain himself for missing out on a show and leaving his band in the cold than we should accept it and get on with our lives. I really do not connect with these "fans" who are promised an album in 2005 yet complain when it doesn't come out. I mean which country do they think they live in? America? There is a reason why this album is called Chinese Democracy. Because a Chinese democracy would not be a real democracy. It would just appear as so on the surface but underneath it all, those who question or complain about the authority will be DISIPLINED by their peers. OR we can get along with these so-called "fans." Oh yes, I will get along with them. Then, I will hug some snakes...yes! Then, I will hug and kiss some poisonous SNAKES!?

as for agreeing with me and dave you're posts are getting more twisted by the minute

if you're looking for snakes you are in the wrong section of the board.?

what's all this talk about discipline?? lol!
you into S&M or something?? lol!

mikegiuliana.....? ?I doesn't bother me if anyone wants to vent their frustration about the album coming out.? what irks me is when some fans accuse fans like dave or I of being up Axl's ass just because we're not frustrated.

Its slash is gnr under a different name I bet eva. What do you think? 4 of his first 5 posts are aimed at me.
What do you think?

[damien24]

axl rose gets paid to sit around, write poems and hire talented musicians to play them.   
the hardest part of his day is probably dealing with his label-  or avoiding dealing to his label.
in the mean time suntans- and pays someone $700 to braid his hair.
he put "oh my god" on a soundtrack to shut the suits up-  same with the tour and the vma's.  he got paid to go out on tour with these people and when he got bored with it he dropped it.     he'll do it all again sometime... maybe... if he feels like it-


or maybe we just have to wait till' the fellow dies?

[Mikkamakka]

Really surprising... Axl didn't completed the vocals by 1998? Slash didn't hear Axl singin' in the last years of GN'R since Axl was only sitting and saying 'I want this riff, I don't want this riff' - if he even appeared. Finck left because he was tired of working on instrumentals... The vocals weren't done by 2002,2003,2004 and you know, Richard said in 2005 that Axl was finishing the vocals. Again. So for those who believe that after Axl's death we'll hear CD: it won't be more than an instrumental album. 

[ppbebe]

Officer Frank Serpico, as a music fan, don't you feel psyched out with the way he described the shits?
"sounded like GNR but there were elements of Zeppelin, Nine Inch Nails and Pink Floyd mixed in"
Come on, All your favs, aren't they?

If Axl decides he wants to beat up his wife and girlfriend then tough for them. They should just accept Axl for being Axl and stop bitching about getting hit. Hell, if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place. Stupid bitches. I LOVE YOU AXL!

Oh my God.  You're sick, you know that?  I just can't even believe you posted that or that I'm reading it, specifically, "..if they didn't bitch so much Axl probably wouldn't hit them in the first place.  Stupid bitches."    You scare me!

Anyway, why do I post here, if I feel this way?  Because I loved GnR.  Axl's made this into a joke.  For those of us who feel this way, our opinion means something, as well.  (Plus, I love to see people get all freaked out about this.  Can't help it.)         

Oh my darling why did you change?
What are you two doing here then? Stalking? Haunting the board?
Both of you sound pretty sick.

Its slash is gnr under a different name I bet eva. What do you think? 4 of his first 5 posts are aimed at me.
What do you think?

added to that, my bet is SIG is a kind of equivalent for 'club cookie', if you remember.

[WAR41]

he put "oh my god" on a soundtrack to shut the suits up-  same with the tour and the vma's.  he got paid to go out on tour with these people and when he got bored with it he dropped it.     he'll do it all again sometime... maybe... if he feels like it-

Oh really?  Where did you hear that? 


My problem with the 'positive' posters is that they are so 100% extreme on all positions.  What good has ever come out of being extremists in anything?  There is a happy medium to everything.  People are so sure about everything and when I ask for some kind of material to support what they say 99% of the time there is nothing to back up their claims.  It is all based on 'faith' in Axl.  It is all the gut feeling on the part of the people posting.  All I want is something to back up what they are saying. 

[ppbebe]

the same is true of the negative posters. Or rather, it's more true.

IMO would be the magic word.

[mikegiuliana]

the same is true of the negative posters. Or rather, it's more true.

IMO would be the magic word.

I don't agree but that's just my opinion.. I see someone like james lofton who loves the new band and says some cool shit about a few of the new tunes but disagrees with the time it takes and the actions or lack of them by axl.. He can be a perfectionist or take forever but there's nothing wrong with keeping the fans somewhat informed and allowing the band members to at least speak for him..

[makemyday]

Does anyone know who Billy Howerdel is?

He is in a perfect circle. He is a guitarist/tech person.

Yeah, remember I read an interview with him back in 2000, I think.
Axl asked him to help with 'computer programming' thing (sorry if it's unintelligible, I don't know the right english word for it).
He left because the whole thing didn't want to end.
Then he and Josh Freese became the members of perfect circle.

[madagas]

James, did I actually just read your post correctly? Brian May just lied about what he heard? Lied on purpose? Why exactly would he lie? Comments like that are unbelievably ridiculous. He heard what he heard...multiple albums of material with vocals. Finished, mixed vocals...maybe not, but I am sure there were vocals on the songs. May listened to the stuff in spring of 2000. Barber is talking about 1998-1999. David Wild from Rolling Stone heard 12 songs in Dec 1999. 11 had vocals, only Oklahoma was mentioned as an instrumental. The simple fact of the matter is Axl is a crazy fucker and most likely he has an absolute mountain of material. We may hear it one day, we may not. The only consistent thing we know about the material is that everyone who has been involved in the project speaks very highly of the music. Led Zep, NIN, and Pink Floyd is a pretty strong compliment. Wild said the 12 songs he heard sounded like Physical Graffiti remixed by Trent Reznor. Again, STRONG compliment. If Axl has a better record now than then, I will wait for it-not happily, but I'll wait .?

[damien24]

he put "oh my god" on a soundtrack to shut the suits up- same with the tour and the vma's. he got paid to go out on tour with these people and when he got bored with it he dropped it. he'll do it all again sometime... maybe... if he feels like it-

Oh really? Where did you hear that?

maybe axl told me,  ever think of that?

[Evolution]

maybe axl told me,  ever think of that?

Maybe as in.............no?