Robin's Guitar Playing

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

Nonetheless, whether you or I or anyone else or a "they" thinks Robin is playing properly or not, is not indicative of whether "he knows what he is doing" or not.

You have no way of knowing the hows and whys of his playing.

You keep repeating the same thing over and over again. Do u think music theory is an obscure black art that only a few understand? Guitarists can have different styles of playing, but that's another discussion. Are u saying that no one can understand the scales that Robin uses? Bullshit. FYI, the "hows and whys" of any type of playing is known. Now, as for why he plays the wrong thing at the wrong time..., Ahhh we reach my original post...

I said you can not possibly know how he came to play it like that - whether it was intentional or accidental, whether it was through his employing an alternative method, whether it was due to his instrument not being tuned properly, whether it was him fucking around, or if he just completely fucked up.  And if it was the way he chose to play it - then you could not know why he chose to play it that way.

You say "The hows and whys of any type of playing is knowm" yet you can not possibly know what type of playing he employed.  Like you said "Guitarists can have different styles of playing".  Not only that but one guitarists can play in a variety of styles - one guitarist can even play the same piece in different styles employing different types of playing. 

You keep insisting that Robin doesn't know how to play guitar properly.  I believe there is much to substantiate that Robin does indeed know how to play guitar properly.  He's been playing guitar in a variety of bands since he was 15 years old; he was good enough to join NIN by the age of 23;  he was hired by Trent Reznor not once but twice;  he earned a Grammy award for a live performance with NIN;  he was both performer and musical director for the internationally renowned performance troupe Cirque Du Soleil; he's been deemed worthy of joining GN'R not once but twice; and he's performed & recorded with a variety of other artists. 

You are, for the most part, focusing on one performance which you can not understand.

[Voodoochild]

August 4th, 1999
Robin Finck Leaves Guns N' Roses, Rejoins Nine Inch Nails

March 15th, 2000
GN'R: Buckethead In, Freese Out

Is that enough?

Not really. When did Robin return?

Go find for yourself, dude. I just proved that Bucket replaced Robin, what else do you want?

Yeah izzy helped him, so, I doubt robin is the sole creator of the new guitar work as well.

Why do you doubt? Do you have any reason for doubt? Unless Robin had Bucket's help, he made the GOM tracks by himself... You're only trying to judge Robin as a bad writer, but has nothing to backup.

KOHD does not use Drop D.

Yes, it does. At least Robin's guitar (I'm talkin' about the new band's version, of course).

I doubt it cuz it was supposed to be closer to Dylan's version than ever.... and I don't think Bob Dylan wrote anything in Drop D tuning but whatever you say

Unless they did it so all Robin had to do was strum the top 3 strings. pretty hard to fuck that up huh? (BURN!!!! )

Uh, pretty stupid comment. It was supposed to be closer, but not exactly the same thing. Or I miss something and they played the song with accoustic guitars?

Go watch (and hear, for God's sake!) the 2002 DVDs. You can see Robin playing the chords in the intro (it's only him, no one else). If you really think the intro is only made with the top 3 strings, you obviously don't know shit about guitar playing (in fact, you're already saying enough to judge).

[Neemo]

oh relax!!!? geez. you are the one who said Robin was replaced by buckethead, but we don't know when robin returned, (And frankly I don't care)

I'm not saying robin is a bad writer. I'm just saying he's not as good of guitarist as Slash. that's all. GnR has always collaborated on song writing. why should this album be any different? in fact if anything, it'll be heavy on tunes Axl wrote.

as for the 2002 DVD's, I've only seen RIR and I toronto live. and to tell you the truth I didn't really pay much attention to Robin unless the spotlight was on him. All I know was that I didn't care for his rendition of patience on any of the bootlegs i've HEARD (aka mp3's) (london, on; detroit; msg; albany; Toronto; rir; vegas; pittsburgh; boston; columbus)

Do you ever play in Drop-D tuning? when you do the top 3 strings are a chord if you strum them open its "D" 1st fret "Eb" 2nd fret "E", 3rd fret "F", yada yada yada? am i wrong, I don't think so.? It really throws the playing of a song for a loop if you try to play a song written in standard tuning on a guitar tuned down to D. You have to be able to stretch your fingers pretty far if you are picking on it. I really doubt they tuned Robin (or anyone for that matter) down to Drop-D for KOHD. but i could be wrong cuz I've never looked for it. Do you know how to play guitar? did you understand all that?

Creed was notorious for playing Drop-D but there is no way to play the majority of their songs in standard tuning. And Nickleback does it all the time too, and you cant play most of their songs in standard as well. a few RATM songs are down to D. A couple Pantera tunes. I can play quite afew Drop-D songs and when i do it I play a few at once cuz sometimes I can't be bothered to tune back up right away .

[Voodoochild]

I'm not saying robin is a bad writer. I'm just saying he's not as good of guitarist as Slash. that's all. GnR has always collaborated on song writing. why should this album be any different? in fact if anything, it'll be heavy on tunes Axl wrote.

I remember that Robin's webmaster said that Robin is the writer of The Blues solo (by that time, people were claiming it was Zakk Wylde's. This is not a proof, but at least is something to look at.

Do you ever play in Drop-D tuning? when you do the top 3 strings are a chord if you strum them open its "D" 1st fret "Eb" 2nd fret "E", 3rd fret "F", yada yada yada am i wrong, I don't think so. It really throws the playing of a song for a loop if you try to play a song written in standard tuning on a guitar tuned down to D. You have to be able to stretch your fingers pretty far if you are picking on it. I really doubt they tuned Robin (or anyone for that matter) down to Drop-D for KOHD. but i could be wrong cuz I've never looked for it. Do you know how to play guitar? did you understand all that?

Of course I know. The question is: did you?

The Drop-D isn't only for fast power-chords or whatever you want to do with only the top 3 strings. It gaves a heavier sound with the first string in D (wich is the second chord of the song, after the G one). You can notice Robin using only one finger to reach the top-3 strings, while he play some licks with the free fingers.

[Neemo]

Go watch (and hear, for God's sake!) the 2002 DVDs. You can see Robin playing the chords in the intro (it's only him, no one else). If you really think the intro is only made with the top 3 strings, you obviously don't know shit about guitar playing (in fact, you're already saying enough to judge).

I did just watch it and he plays an "G" power chord like an "G" power chord. not a Drop D "G" power chord. He bars the top 3 strings with his index finger and the A&D strings with his ring finger 2 frets up. get a clue man they didn't rearrange the song for Drop-D tuning.

Here's the exact quote from Axl,
"his next song... I thought that since this a new band.... and this next song is a timeless song.. we would move a little closer to the original.... and do our own version.... of a song by Bob Dylan"

or in other words they don't use cheesy "Tracy and Roberta" and "I'll sing One, then You sing one, and I think you KNow the words" and "Giveme some REGGAE!!!!!"

not rewrite the song in a different tuning ?

[chineseblues]

But I guess music is all about how great you play.... 

No, but some of us have higher standards of music.

Higher standards? you quoted a poison song for gods sake. And anyone who compares CC deville to Robin Finck has zero credibility. CC is a laughing stock, he can't play for shit and everyone knows it. CC deville, god what is wrong you man? 

[Neemo]

But I guess music is all about how great you play....?

No, but some of us have higher standards of music.

Higher standards? you quoted a poison song for gods sake. And anyone who compares CC deville to Robin Finck has zero credibility. CC is a laughing stock, he can't play for shit and everyone knows it. CC deville, god what is wrong you man??

Dude CC can play guitar. but he goes fucking overboard. Like 20 minutes of solo on the song. he won't stop. When i saw poison in 2002 he was constantly acting like a nut to try and get attention from bret michaels onto himself. seriously he just breaks out into solos out of nowhere and goes on forever. If Axl was singing and CC was guitar like that, Axl'd prolly walk over to him and smack him upside the head with his mike

GnR is the Axl show when Axl's on stage.

Besides Genesis already said he was fucking around about that.

[Voodoochild]

I did just watch it and he plays an "G" power chord like an "G" power chord. not a Drop D "G" power chord. He bars the top 3 strings with his index finger and the A&D strings with his ring finger 2 frets up. get a clue man they didn't rearrange the song for Drop-D tuning.

Oh boy, you're the one who needs to get a clue. Take a look at him playing the G chord:



If you can't see the pic, you can download the video:

http://s55.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=39ISLV1ASUJ3305AA53KOOENLO

He don't use the top string, as you can see. I used the Boston screen-shot version... Try again.

Here's the exact quote from Axl,
"his next song... I thought that since this a new band.... and this next song is a timeless song.. we would move a little closer to the original.... and do our own version.... of a song by Bob Dylan"

or in other words they don't use cheesy "Tracy and Roberta" and "I'll sing One, then You sing one, and I think you KNow the words" and "Giveme some REGGAE!!!!!"

not rewrite the song in a different tuning 

WTF? Do you really think he is rewriting the song with just a drop-D tunning? LOL!!!

[Neemo]

He don't use the top string, as you can see. I used the Boston screen-shot version... Try again.

kudos man!!!!  that's an awesome shot! all i had was RIR 3 and its a side shot. When he goes to the 5th fret he hammers down there with his pinky and it looked like he was playing a "G" powerchord at the 3rd fret from that angle. but your's shows it clear as a fucking bell. fifth fret "G" drop-D tuned power chord. that's messed.

Is he using that tuning for patience as well? Cuz that would explain why it sounds all fucked up.

You are right and i humbly bow down to you

My respect for Robin has now gone up a notch

[michaelvincent]

What statement is laugable?

Saying guitarist A is 'more emotional' than guitarist B. It's subjective reasoning. Robin's playing moves you, which is cool. It doesn't move others. Same with Slash. There is no concrete way to quanitify who is more emotional. It's all down to each individual person.

There are people who say that Neil Peart is the greatest drummer that ever lived. I personally hate his playing and think he is stiff as a board. To my ears Bill Bruford is a much better drummer because I can get into his feel. Personal opinions abound.

[Voodoochild]

Is he using that tuning for patience as well? Cuz that would explain why it sounds all fucked up.

No, it's the regular tuning. I don't think it sounds all fucked up.. In fact, I think the rhythm guitar he made to the song is awesome, tough in RIR3 he indeed fucked up.

You are right and i humbly bow down to you

My respect for Robin has now gone up a notch

[Genesis]

But I guess music is all about how great you play.... 

No, but some of us have higher standards of music.

Higher standards? you quoted a poison song for gods sake. And anyone who compares CC deville to Robin Finck has zero credibility. CC is a laughing stock, he can't play for shit and everyone knows it. CC deville, god what is wrong you man? 

I never compared CC to Finck. And I don't listen to Poison. The only reason Poison was quoted was because they used dissonance in a solo.

[chineseblues]

But I guess music is all about how great you play.... 

No, but some of us have higher standards of music.

Higher standards? you quoted a poison song for gods sake. And anyone who compares CC deville to Robin Finck has zero credibility. CC is a laughing stock, he can't play for shit and everyone knows it. CC deville, god what is wrong you man? 

I never compared CC to Finck. And I don't listen to Poison. The only reason Poison was quoted was because they used dissonance in a solo.

You stated Axl should get CC as lead guitarist therefore inadvertenly comparing him to Robin. 

[jazjme]

Is he using that tuning for patience as well? Cuz that would explain why it sounds all fucked up.

No, it's the regular tuning. I don't think it sounds all fucked up.. In fact, I think the rhythm guitar he made to the song is awesome, tough in RIR3 he indeed fucked up.

You are right and i humbly bow down to you

My respect for Robin has now gone up a notch

its good to see people realise^

But the whole,comparing Robin and Slash thing is really kinda obsolete TODAY, .......because like some one posted it all subjective to what stirs emotions in people , and some will gravitate to theirs on these matters. BUT , If you are lookin at it with fresh ears, and eyes, and seeing what is the now, alot more would apreciate it . I somehow tend to thnk alot has to do with the fact that soooooo many didnt see the 2002 shows live. DVD, audio, whatever, really dont do justice to the real deal.


Slash played a vital role in GNR , in his time there, I am absolutley sure Robin, will play a huge part for GNR in its future.

[Genesis]

You stated Axl should get CC as lead guitarist therefore inadvertenly comparing him to Robin. 

When the fuck did I say Axl should get CC? That was madagas.  Stop misquoting people.

[ppbebe]

Thanks voodoochild. Your hard data is a telling blew. 
And the sensible ones comprehend that and improve themselves. 

This one, on the other hand?

Yea but I should have thought that it should be beyond your comprehension like other things. 

Sorry, Yoda. Everything is in ur comprehension I hope.

Don't misquote. Quote whom you are talking to. 

Stop stating your bloody imagination as fact.

The same for you with ur 'he was brought in bcoz of his 'musical difference'' and 'Robin and Buckethead compliment each other' crap.

Huh? Unlike you I can distinguish FACT from FICTION.

This is my view on the pair for their joint works, as is stated clearly.

Neemo
as I see it from the new tunes they are both needed to express many aspects of delicate human emotions. BH is not Robin and Robin is not BH.
Each is a musician with a difference.
The difference between them makes all the difference.
To my eyes They are(were ) the perfect pair ever.
Check out the Ghosts of Mars. 

This is pure speculation stated as FACT.

No. Buckethead was brought into GN'R bcoz of what Neemo said - THE NEED FOR A DEPENDABLE, TECHNICALLY SOUND LEAD GUITARIST.

Neemo put 'IMO' in his post cos he's cool.

Besides it's unlikly. They need Robin's talent as well as BH's.
like voodoo said, officially Bh's 'in' was reported on March 15th, 2000.
http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=234

while Robin was still out in this article of April 13th, 2000
http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=243

Apparently Robin came back after BH joined. Case closed.

Like I said, you have no way of knowing the hows and whys of Robins playing.

Answer the question.

Who are you to crap on others honest opinions that way, to start with?
Now you explain why you call my humble opinion crap adequately or cut the crap already.

[Genesis]

Thanks voodoochild. Your hard data is a telling blew. 
And the sensible ones comprehend that and improve themselves. 

This one, on the other hand?

Yea but I should have thought that it should be beyond your comprehension like other things. 

Sorry, Yoda. Everything is in ur comprehension I hope.

Don't misquote. Quote whom you are talking to. 

Obviously, you have no idea what i meant and obviously you don't understand sarcasm when u see it.

Yoda: The Jedi Master known as Yoda (896 BBY?4 ABY), voiced by Frank Oz, is a fictional character in the Star Wars universe. He appears in all of the franchise's installments except for ''. Like many names in Star Wars, the name "Yoda" may be etymologically derived from the Sanskrit yoddha ("warrior") and/or the Hebrew yodea'' ("one who knows").

Must I explain everything to u?

Apparently Robin came back after BH joined. Case closed.

Ok. Robin did rejoin after BH joined. I take back the 'Techincally sound...' rant. Happy?

[Neemo]

Neemo put 'IMO' in his post cos he's cool.

Besides it's unlikly. They need Robin's talent as well as BH's.
like voodoo said, officially Bh's 'in' was reported on March 15th, 2000.
http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=234

while Robin was still out in this article of April 13th, 2000
http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=243

Apparently Robin came back after BH joined. Case closed.

thanks ppbebe

good find. Man I'm getting proved wrong everywhere that's it I'm not posting anything more about Robin cuz obviously I don't know shit about him

[ppbebe]

Pleasure, Neemo.
You stand corrected. Isn't it great to know more about him?
As I said I believe the difference between cool individuals makes all the difference. 
I like hearing different opinions, civil discussions and getting something new.
Gosh I sound bloody goodygoody.

Thanks voodoochild. Your hard data is a telling blew. 
And the sensible ones comprehend that and improve themselves. 

This one, on the other hand?

Yea but I should have thought that it should be beyond your comprehension like other things. 

Sorry, Yoda. Everything is in ur comprehension I hope.

Don't misquote. Quote whom you are talking to. 

Obviously, you have no idea what i meant and obviously you don't understand sarcasm when u see it.

Yoda: The Jedi Master known as Yoda (896 BBY?4 ABY), voiced by Frank Oz, is a fictional character in the Star Wars universe. He appears in all of the franchise's installments except for ''. Like many names in Star Wars, the name "Yoda" may be etymologically derived from the Sanskrit yoddha ("warrior") and/or the Hebrew yodea'' ("one who knows").

Must I explain everything to u?

Why not. You haven't explained anything. I already told you to go find Yoda's post not mine.
Go on. Show your true colors.

Apparently Robin came back after BH joined. Case closed.

Ok. Robin did rejoin after BH joined. I take back the 'Techincally sound...' rant. Happy?

Good for you.
And? What about my other question?

[PhillyRiot]

We won't know the real deal about Robin, and how he really compliements Axl, until we hear some new music from GNR.  He has HUGE shoes to fill, but I have yet to hear him "tear it up" on a new GNR song.  I don't count when he plays old GNR songs, because that doesn't show us how well he can create his own music.  The only way I can judge him for sure is to hear CD.  Unless I am invited to Axl's recording studio, I won't be hearing it anytime soon.