Slash, Duff Sue Axl Over Guns N' Roses Publishing Royalties

[Timmy]

Sanctuary didn't return calls for comment.

am I the only one that finds that horribly funny?

[dave-gnfnr2k]

The major question is did Axl cash that 92,000 check. If he did then maybe he did know. But if its not cashed yet then it could have been a simple error.

[GypsySoul]

Miskel said that only last week did they discover that Rose had notified ASCAP on or around May 26 that he was switching over the publishing from Guns N' Roses to Black Frog Music Publishing (which he owns) and Kobalt Songs Music Publishing (which is a joint venture with and handles the administration of Sanctuary's publishing). Consequently, the ASCAP check for the first quarter of 2005 ? some $92,000 ? went to Rose and "his accomplices" instead, the lawsuit contends.

"only last week did they discover" .... ONLY LAST WEEK?? ? ? FUCK!!!! Even I've known about that publishing deal for months now!!!


Besides Miskel's insinuations, how would we (or they) know if Axl even got his check? ??

[sic.]

February 1st, 2005 - Axl Rose Publishing Deal Fuels Feud

[...] McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement." He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

--

Like they really sat on it for nearly six months.

[killingvector]

February 1st, 2005 - Axl Rose Publishing Deal Fuels Feud

[...] McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement." He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

--

Like they really sat on it for nearly six months.

So Duff's lawyer agrees that slash, duff, and axl were part of a partnership. Doesn't this counter their claim that Axl left the partnership?

[Timothy]

February 1st, 2005 - Axl Rose Publishing Deal Fuels Feud

[...] McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement." He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

--

Like they really sat on it for nearly six months.

So Duff's lawyer agrees that slash, duff, and axl were part of a partnership. Doesn't this counter their claim that Axl left the partnership?

Thats what I was thinking.

 

[jarmo]

He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

He suspected this was going on in February, but they noticed it had happened last week.

That's six months.

Interesting....


Would be interesting to hear the other side of the story, but since Sanctuay didn't comment the story, I guess we won't.



/jarmo

[Booker Floyd]

February 1st, 2005 - Axl Rose Publishing Deal Fuels Feud

[...] McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement." He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

--

Like they really sat on it for nearly six months.

So Duff's lawyer agrees that slash, duff, and axl were part of a partnership. Doesn't this counter their claim that Axl left the partnership?

Thats what I was thinking.

 

I think Duffs lawyer is ackowledging that until that lawsuit is settled, Axl is still viewed as part of the partnership.

He suspected this was going on in February, but they noticed it had happened last week.

The timeline is a little confusing, but even if he suspected it in February, it apparently didnt hapen until the end of May, so its more like 3 months.

[jabba2]

Miskel said that only last week did they discover that Rose had notified ASCAP on or around May 26 that he was switching over the publishing from Guns N' Roses to Black Frog Music Publishing (which he owns) and Kobalt Songs Music Publishing (which is a joint venture with and handles the administration of Sanctuary's publishing). Consequently, the ASCAP check for the first quarter of 2005 ? some $92,000 ? went to Rose and "his accomplices" instead, the lawsuit contends.

"only last week did they discover" .... ONLY LAST WEEK?? ? ? FUCK!!!! Even I've known about that publishing deal for months now!!!


Besides Miskel's insinuations, how would we (or they) know if Axl even got his check? ??

"They're seeking damages for fraud, copyright infringement and breach of fiduciary duty, among other things."


Slash and Duffs paycheck is in Axl's Black Frog bank account. Noone but Axl has access to that company because Axl owns it. Black Frog is probably just a computer at his house, because we know Axl doesnt release music with that label.

[KillYourIdols]

My guess is that they didn't realize that they weren't gonna get checks until fairly recently...and it took a while for their investigation/paperwork to come through.

I wonder if Axl somehow set himself up to be shielded from breaking the law, etc. Like, when people set up a Limited Liablity Company (LLC) so that IT (the LLC) becomes that which people would sue, not the individual person. In a real world example, if a guy owns a restaurant, and people leaving that restaurant drunk get into an accident and kill people, then the families of the victim have to sue the restaurant (LLC), not the owner. Make sense?

So is it possible that Black Frog Ent and Sanctuary are "responsible," and not Axl?

I'm not a lawyer but I think its an interesting point.

~KYI

[jarmo]

I wonder if they asked for an explanation or for it to be fixed before going to court.

Also, it would be interesting to know if/how this is connected to the other lawsuit.




/jarmo

[killingvector]

I wonder if they asked for an explanation or for it to be fixed before going to court.

Also, it would be interesting to know if/how this is connected to the other lawsuit.




/jarmo

I would bet that Slash & Duff's lawyers would want it brought up in the November trial.  If 1108 can subject MJ to suffer the humiliation of past alleged molestation acts perhaps the civil code allows the admission of past alleged fraud allegations.

The mountain of shit is building over axl right now. He may have to hire Harvey Birdman to pull off some miracle defense.

[Saul]

another sad day for gnr.

anyways , part of me doesnt believe for a second that axl's team of lawyers and sanctuarys team of lawyers would do something this stupid if they werent 100% sure they had some concrete evidence that proves they are "in the right" .... either way , somebody from "the old band" , be axl or S&D is gunna get fucked bad from this one when all is said and done.

[D]

This will bring music back to prominence though


Imagine when Axl does release GNR

its a 2pac vs Notorious BIG feud times 100


think of the interviews once axl gets going, its gonna be amazing to read that stuff.

I think SLash and Duff werent gonna say anything as long as they got their checks, but remember u dont get checks every month.

they receive them for each quarter which is every 3 months

so their first check was probably due to arrive in April. So they were on tour and out of respect for Scott and Dave they decided to wait till after the tour and everything to get involved in this so as to not take away attention from the tour.



I just wonder if they got their 2nd quarter check which wouldve been due in July?

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

I wish there was something in the article and lawyer's statements that answered the following:

1) Was ASCAP sending out ONE royalty check to the Member Publisher (Company) "Guns N' Roses"/"Guns N' Roses Music" (aka "Guns N' Roses ASCAP)?
2) If so, how was that check being distributed? ?Who was administering it?

I was reading through their site and Member Writers apply individually, whereas Member Publishers apply as a company. ?
If you look at the ASCAP Publisher Member applicaiton ?http://www.ascap.com/reference/publisherapp.pdf a company must be named, and if that company is a partnership the partner's names must be listed. ?

In the case of Member Writers, upon registering a song/title/work which is the product of collaboration, the apportionment of shares must be indicated at time of registration. ?ASCAP then distributes the royalties accordingly. ?Since it only specifies Member Writers in this rule, that would lead me to believe that it does not apply to Member Publishers ?Now back to the articles - The article only references publishing royalties. ?Also there is only one amount noted... seemingly a single check for $92,000.

I return to my question: ?Is this a one lump sum check per quarter payable to the Member Publisher? ?Who was it going to? ?Who was distributing it?

If you look again at the ASCAP Publisher Member applicaiton ?http://www.ascap.com/reference/publisherapp.pdf (and read the referenced 'rules'), ASCAP sends the royalties to the party/ address indicated on the Publisher Member's Application. ?The company/party &/ address originally indicated for ASCAP to send royalties to was likely "Guns N' Roses"/"Guns N' Roses Music" - the same comapny/partnership that Slash and Duff are claiming that Axl has no rights in. ?
Further down on the application form and you'll notice that at time of application a person, ONE PERSON, is to be designated as the publisher's representative FOR ALL PURPOSES. Ths person would be able to change to who/where the royalties were paid/sent. ?. ?In order for Axl to do this, he would have to be the person named as the designated representative.

Of course this is all speculation. ?We don't have any real or specific information.

The article doesn't relate any indication or comment from the lawyer that it could be a simple 'delay'.
They are saying outright that Axl committed fraud to divert money that they should have recievied into his own pockets.

Whether somehow something Axl did is delaying, hindering, or preventing the distribution of publishing royalties to them, or not - it has put them(S&D) on the defense. ?They are being forced to bring a case in which they have to prove their rights. ?In the prior lawsuit their case is built soley on attempting to disprove Axl's rights. Pehaps it can be expected that in thier presenting evidence that they have rights, they will present evidence that shows they ALL THREE have rights - and in doing so will negate thier previous case against Axl. ?

Who knows, this could be just the sort of situaion that will leverage a settlement in which they drop their suits with the assurance that the smooth flow of royalty checks will follow. ?

[DunkinDave]

Who knows, this could be just the sort of situaion that will leverage a settlement in which they drop their suits with the assurance that the smooth flow of royalty checks will follow. ?

That's a best-case scenerio.

Worst-case scenerio is Axl going to jail for committing fraud.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

i think axl needs to call the President or Get the FBI
or at least the Private Eye

[Christos AG]

I wonder if they asked for an explanation or for it to be fixed before going to court.

Also, it would be interesting to know if/how this is connected to the other lawsuit.




/jarmo

According to this they only found out about it last week:

Though the Sanctuary deal was reported on by the press, Slash and Duff claim they weren't aware of the scope of Rose's dealings ? which they say he "omitted and concealed" ? until their expected royalty payments for the first quarter of 2005 didn't arrive in the mail. "When the ASCAP check didn't come, we called and they looked into it," McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, said. "We didn't know all the facts at first."

I believe that they contacted some people in ASCAP and they found out what happened.

Miskel said that only last week did they discover that Rose had notified ASCAP on or around May 26 that he was switching over the publishing from Guns N' Roses to Black Frog Music Publishing (which he owns) and Kobalt Songs Music Publishing (which is a joint venture with and handles the administration of Sanctuary's publishing). Consequently, the ASCAP check for the first quarter of 2005 ? some $92,000 ? went to Rose and "his accomplices" instead, the lawsuit contends.

However this sounds like bullshit to me. That transaction made a huge buzz over the music industry, and the only ones who never heard about it are the ones who should know everything about it?

And think about it this way. The way they are presenting it, it smells lots of money to be made out of a lawsuit.

We know how lawyers work, especially in these cases. They might have told lots of shit to Slash and Duff just to make them go to court...

I honestly don't know who to believe.

[Axl4Prez2004]

   Some people have said the only way we'd see CD or Axl touring again is if he lost his money...is this a possibility now?  Legal costs add up.  This whole mess may be a blessing in disguise.  However, it's official, we won't see Chinese Denocracy this year...if ever.

Axl4Prez2004   

[Wooody]

this album will never come out