GNR vs VR (Player By Player)

[dave-gnfnr2k]

Linken you are just all in a huff because deep down you know that BH is better than slash and tommy is better than duff. Like I said with out Axl, Duff and slash are not as good. Axl  always brought out the best in them. Now that they are on their own they just do what they always wanted to do and half ass their albums.

[Lineker10]

Linken you are just all in a huff because deep down you know that BH is better than slash and tommy is better than duff. Like I said with out Axl, Duff and slash are not as good. Axl? always brought out the best in them. Now that they are on their own they just do what they always wanted to do and half ass their albums.

Thats just pathetic Dave - i beat your argument so you again resort to doing exactly what i said you do - criticising Slash and Duff. You focus more on them that you do on the positives of the new band. For a man who hates the old band - you seem to spend a massive amount of time talking about them instead of focussing on the new band. Instead of saying - Tommys good becasue of this, this, this and this. You say - Tommys good casue hes better than Duff whos crap, has bad solos albums etc.etc. Very strange.

[Falcon]

Tommy is the epitome of punk.....Lineker, you may need to check up on your rock history a bit.

Yep, although I'd never compare his Minneapolis pop/punk existence to that of the original movement, he's still got loads of credibility albeit without much creative experience.

On the other hand, Duff had a more hardcore punk existence growing up and playing in the pre
grunge Seattle scene and he did do some time with the original punk guitarist Steve Jones in the Neurotic Outsiders..

Anyway, this whole thread is a bit goofy. ?Comparisons of "better" are still extremely subjective, especially when dealing with professional musicians and their methods/styles of creation and judgement of their finished product.

[dave-gnfnr2k]

Linken you are just all in a huff because deep down you know that BH is better than slash and tommy is better than duff. Like I said with out Axl, Duff and slash are not as good. Axl? always brought out the best in them. Now that they are on their own they just do what they always wanted to do and half ass their albums.

Thats just pathetic Dave - i beat your argument so you again resort to doing exactly what i said you do - criticising Slash and Duff. You focus more on them that you do on the positives of the new band. For a man who hates the old band - you seem to spend a massive amount of time talking about them instead of focussing on the new band. Instead of saying - Tommys good becasue of this, this, this and this. You say - Tommys good casue hes better than Duff whos crap, has bad solos albums etc.etc. Very strange.

You didnt beat any argument. If ?you think that, the only person you are fooling is yourself. ?This is the NEW BAND BOARD so why is slash and duff even brought up here hmmm? ?This thread should be in the dead horse section but ?I guess the mods are on vacation or something. ?Tommy is a better player than duff, its that simple. And tommy can write some great songs. Duff wrote some in gnr but has not written any since. The same goes for slash.

You are just in denial that slash and duff are shells of their former selves while axl can still write just as good if not better, plus axl stll has the pipes in the studio. ?

Duff was never a good bass player. Tommy on the other hand is a very good bass player.

[Lineker10]

Linken you are just all in a huff because deep down you know that BH is better than slash and tommy is better than duff. Like I said with out Axl, Duff and slash are not as good. Axl? always brought out the best in them. Now that they are on their own they just do what they always wanted to do and half ass their albums.

Thats just pathetic Dave - i beat your argument so you again resort to doing exactly what i said you do - criticising Slash and Duff. You focus more on them that you do on the positives of the new band. For a man who hates the old band - you seem to spend a massive amount of time talking about them instead of focussing on the new band. Instead of saying - Tommys good becasue of this, this, this and this. You say - Tommys good casue hes better than Duff whos crap, has bad solos albums etc.etc. Very strange.

You didnt beat any argument. If ?you think that, the only person you are fooling is yourself. ?This is the NEW BAND BOARD so why is slash and duff even brought up here hmmm? ?This thread should be in the dead horse section but ?I guess the mods are on vacation or something. ?Tommy is a better player than duff, its that simple. And tommy can write some great songs. Duff wrote some in gnr but has not written any since. The same goes for slash.

You are just in denial that slash and duff are shells of their former selves while axl can still write just as good if not better, plus axl stll has the pipes in the studio. ?

Duff was never a good bass player. Tommy on the other hand is a very good bass player.

Your repeating the argument Dave - which is purley based on the fact that Duff and Slash are crap - its not based on the positives of the new band. Can i ask why you hate the old band so much - im willing to bet that you hate the band even more than Axl does.

[nesquick]

Dave, you should, no, YOU MUST move your ass and go to see a VR show before bashing Duff and Slash. Who are you to judge them?

[ppbebe]

Where did I slag any of them? 

when the nu-GN'R will sell 85 million records worldwide, then, some of you will be able to open their mouth. Until then, just shut up, because there is nothing to discuss and/or to compare with the original band...exept riots and cancelled shows.

When this board became the old band's worshipper's club.
Also I thought this was VR mens vs GN'R mens.

This is not the board only for those who jump on the bandwagon.

[Lineker10]

Where did I slag any of them??

when the nu-GN'R will sell 85 million records worldwide, then, some of you will be able to open their mouth. Until then, just shut up, because there is nothing to discuss and/or to compare with the original band...exept riots and cancelled shows.

When this board became the old band's worshipper's club.
Also I thought this was VR mens vs GN'R mens.

This is not the board only for those who jump on the bandwagon.

If you read my post then i never accused you of slaggin the old members. I actually said your post was good becasue you didnt simply just bash the old members. And this isnt the VR worshippers club - but since when has this board been based around bashing either band. My point is why cant people simply back up there arguements in a way that looks at the postivies of the people either in the old and new bands - not by simply slagging one or the other off.

[Falcon]

You are just in denial that slash and duff are shells of their former selves ...

No offense, but that's insane.? Both are more polished players than their drunken,drug addicted days in GNR.? Tighter and more focused by a long shot.

...while axl can still write just as good if not better, plus axl stll has the pipes in the studio.?

Better wait and see on that one, one studio song less the old guys is by no means a benchmark for objective judgement.

Duff was never a good bass player. Tommy on the other hand is a very good bass player.

I was never a fan of Duff's playing, too clanky.? Tommy's no virtuoso by any means either.? Isn't there some article where Tommy praises Duff's playing?? In either case, Flea
has nothing to worry about...

[madagas]

Falcon, you're right....Tommy has more of a punk "spirit", but isn't like the original movement. The Mats were too melodic for that. After meeting the guy up close and seeing him perform by himself, he just has a coolness and presence of authenticity. He is not a sell out.

[ppbebe]

Tommy praises Duff's playing?

 

That's why I said Tommy was humble. while arrogant people don't improve themselves.

Ok, Lineker10. I misread your post as I read it after Nesquick's one.   

By the way, hate is often the recoil of love.
When I see anyone slagging off any guy of the old band I think of this saying.
Perhaps it's because of their deep affection for the old band.

[jimmythegent]

By the way, hate is often the recoil of love.
When I see anyone slagging off any guy of the old band I think of this saying.
Perhaps it's because of their deep affection for the old band.

Thats a nice way of looking at it. 

[Falcon]

... He is not a sell out.

Unfortunately, the diehard Mat's fans and Mr. Westerberg think otherwise.  The mere thought of him having anything to do with GNR/Axl Rose screams "sell out " to them.

For me personally, it was a good move on Tommy's part.  It's allowed the funds to seek his artistic freedom away from the confines of his prior band.

[ppbebe]

It's narrowness of them, Falcon.

Since there's a bit of punk talk going, I'm gonna quote from John Lydon's interview of April 22, 1989

"When Guns 'n' Roses go on about it...what was that quote? Rock N Roll has sucked a big dick since the sex pistols- that band really have misunderstood us.  It was all about opening things up not closing things down, which is what they?re doing.  Its narrowness all this living rock n roll."

I don't know about 1989, But I think Now GN'R is all about opening things up.

Ta, jimmy.

[Falcon]

It's narrowness of them, Falcon.

Since there's a bit of punk talk going, I'm gonna quote from John Lydon's interview of April 22, 1989

"When Guns 'n' Roses go on about it...what was that quote? Rock N Roll has sucked a big dick since the sex pistols- that band really have misunderstood us.? It was all about opening things up not closing things down, which is what they?re doing.? Its narrowness all this living rock n roll."

I don't know about 1989, But I think Now GN'R is all about opening things up.

Ta, jimmy.

That quote by Lydon had to sting, nothing like having a heavy influence call your band narrow.

OUCH.

Not sure about Axl's band opening things up these days.  Although the name itself carries great rewards,  the stigma of the name could prove stiflling as well. 

Guess we won't know until something gets released...

[deliverthecow]

Linken you are just all in a huff because deep down you know that BH is better than slash and tommy is better than duff. Like I said with out Axl, Duff and slash are not as good. Axl? always brought out the best in them. Now that they are on their own they just do what they always wanted to do and half ass their albums.
[/quote


I dont get where you are coming from ok we know you do not like Slash or Duff. Calling there projects since GnR half assed is crazy. The Snakepit records were bad, i will give you that without a doubt. On the otherhand Duff has been apart of some pretty good projects, Neurotic Outsiders, Ten Minute Warning, Mark Lanegan, and his solo work was anything but half assed, Loaded was a good band.

I can safely say you have never seen VR live, if so you would see Duff and Slash can play.

Calling Contraband half assed is outrageous, people may or may not like it but it is anything but half assed. I guess the only way to make an album that isn't half assed is too go into the project with the idea of taking ten plus years to complete it.

Dave i am willing to bet you weren't one of the fans at Vancouver or Philadelphia, that is half assed. Your loyalty to Axl has taken the word loyal to new meaning, If i were you and i didn't get a special thank you in the liner notes of the nu GnR album if ever released i would be extremly upset. 

[dave-gnfnr2k]

All  you have to go back and read the reviews for the 2002 tour shows, and most of they said pretty much the same thing, if you closed  your eyes you could not even tell it wasnt the orginal band playing  the songs.  And that was from unbiased reviewers.  The only bad reviews the band got were from the ones that didnt even see the whole shows, like the guy who based it on two songs and the other guy who claimed they played PC when they didnt.

[deliverthecow]

All? you have to go back and read the reviews for the 2002 tour shows, and most of they said pretty much the same thing, if you closed? your eyes you could not even tell it wasnt the orginal band playing? the songs.? And that was from unbiased reviewers.? The only bad reviews the band got were from the ones that didnt even see the whole shows, like the guy who based it on two songs and the other guy who claimed they played PC when they didnt.

I never seen them. I just saw them on MTV and you cant judge by three songs(parts of songs). I always have said Axl's performance wasn't great but the band did sound good. I dont think anyone has ever said the new guys aren't good musicians, they havent gotten where they are by being bad players by any means. I personally just like Duff, Slash etc's playing better . Tommy was great in the Mat's they were a great band.

[madagas]

The Replacements were every bit as good a band as Gnr was, maybe better (can't wait for these responses!). Falcon, sure the Mats fans and Paul think Tommy sold out, but the Gnr fans think Tommy is some session musician who was selling toner over the phone after failing to make a living with some no name band. What fans and the media think and feel has nothing to do with an artist's integrity. It is simply fanboy, biased opinion. Tommy has integrity, and I believe he really enjoyed recording with this band. His heart seems to be in the right place. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm a pretty good judge of character.

[Falcon]

The Replacements were every bit as good a band as Gnr was, maybe better (can't wait for these responses!). Falcon, sure the Mats fans and Paul think Tommy sold out, but the Gnr fans think Tommy is some session musician who was selling toner over the phone after failing to make a living with some no name band. What fans and the media think and feel has nothing to do with an artist's integrity. It is simply fanboy, biased opinion. Tommy has integrity, and I believe he really enjoyed recording with this band. His heart seems to be in the right place. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm a pretty good judge of character.

Tommy seems like a genuine guy, his participation in Axl's project definately lends some much needed credibility.  That said, though I don't agree with them I understand 'Mats fans and Paul's point of view.  The thought of Tommy movng into the corporate rock world with whomever has to be tough to swallow.  Speaking from experience, I know there's still a faction of Cult fans who will never forgive Matt for joining GNR back in 1990 even though it was a great career move that had the blessings of Ian and Billy.