Civil War and Cool Hand Luke

[Neemo]

I Just saw the movie last night for the first time. Anyone else seen it?

I didn't really think it had anything to do with civil war. Can someone give me a comparison why the clip at the start of the song is relevant? Or did they just think it was cool and put it in there.

When the "What we have here is Failure to Communicate" speech happened I expected to hear slash start playing guitar and I started humming it to myself. I thought it was pretty funny.

All in all it was a decent movie, Paul Newman is cool, and if you haven't seen it I recommend it. but I saw no tie in to the civil war song, myself

[ClintroN]

the saints go marching on harra, harra

whistle that n' tell me what you hear

[mikegiuliana]

I love when people just realise the movie.. Faulire to communicate-civil war some men you just can't reach.. Just a little clip that was good to start the song and express what he was thinking. Great movie, ol' luke eating them eggs, and digging those holes

[Cornell]

Great movie!    I've seen it several times now.

That movie doesn't have anything to do with civil war, but it was a great line!

[Neemo]

I love when people just realise the movie.. Faulire to communicate-civil war some men you just can't reach.. Just a little clip that was good to start the song and express what he was thinking. Great movie, ol' luke eating them eggs, and digging those holes

The eggs were awesome!!!  and when he shakes the bush classic

[mikegiuliana]

I love when people just realise the movie.. Faulire to communicate-civil war some men you just can't reach.. Just a little clip that was good to start the song and express what he was thinking. Great movie, ol' luke eating them eggs, and digging those holes

The eggs were awesome!!!? and when he shakes the bush classic

yeah I'm shaking it boss and he has that long ass string while escaping..

The big dude that fights with luke was in all those leslie nielson naked gun movies as his partner.. Goerge kennedy I think?

great movie, great song..

[lennonisgod]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.  It's a pretty good movie too. 

[Cornell]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

   I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.  When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

[mikegiuliana]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

 ? I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.? When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

yes old timer we got it second hand.. Most shit is stolen from somewhere anyways

[Cornell]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

 ? I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.? When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

yes old timer we got it second hand.. Most shit is stolen from somewhere anyways

   Watch it, Mikey! 

There are some advantages from being my age - the main one being that I saw the original GNR while front row center and many other versions of GNR. 

[mikegiuliana]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

 ? I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.? When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

yes old timer we got it second hand.. Most shit is stolen from somewhere anyways

 ? Watch it, Mikey!?

There are some advantages from being my age - the main one being that I saw the original GNR while front row center and many other versions of GNR.?

not only that but a woman with experience

[willow]

Its one of my favorite movies!! I'm guessing its one of Axls too!

[NorthwindNS]

Just a quick question. Does anybody know the origin of the intro the "Civil War," where it says "What we've got here is failure to communicate." It sounds like a clip from a movie or something. Sounds like a Robert E. Lee type person - does anyone know who/what it is suppose to be?

[Mutherfunker]

It's from the movie 'Cool Hand Luke' (It does say this in the UYI booklet)

I watched it once, and I thought it was pretty good. This link tells you about the film: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0061512/.

The quote is the prison Captain (Strother Martin) talking about the main character (Paul Newman) who refuses to conform to prison rules however much he gets punished, and however hard they try to make things for him.

@#$%Funker

[justynius]

That movie doesn't have anything to do with civil war, but it was a great line!

Wrong.....

People needs to understand the themes behind "Civil War" (and the entire Illusions albums for that matter). GN'R didn't just throw in a war protest song that has nothing to do with the rest of the album for no particular reason. The song is literally about war, but serves a metaphor function to an entirely different theme.

Look carefully at the lyrics and what they're saying about war. It's not just that "war is bad."

Perhaps the most relevant image is "we got the wall of DC to remind us all / that you can't trust freedom / when its not in your hands / when everybody's fighting / for their promised land." People think they're free, but they're really slaves for the slaughter who are brainwashed and hypnotized by authorities who tell them they're dying for "the love of God and our human rights."

One of GN'R's founding principles (and arguably the entire basis for the Illusions albums) is freedom of expression. Just as freedoms are stolen from soldiers who are forced to give up their lives during times of war, artists (specifically musicians) must overcome extreme obstacles to freely express their ideas due to institutions like the record companies and the media. "One in a Million" anyone?

Furthermore, the rich capitialize during war through the industries necessary to support it, while the poor go hungry and unsupported. "I don't need your civil war / it feeds the rich / while it buries the poor." In a similar way, the record companies attempt to pimp out musicians' talents to songs that will bring them the most commercial success. In most cases, the musicians are entirely dependent upon the record companies and are forced to give in. The commercialization process is another way in which the freedom of expression is stolen from artists.

So to return to the point of this thread - why is the Cool Hand Luke quote relevant to the song?

As someone else pointed out, the quote is by a prison warden after he reprimands a prisoner who tries to rebel (as opposed to conform). To return to my earlier points about the song involving the record companies trying to get musicians to sacrifice their freedoms in conformity with what will sell the most records, think of the prison warden as the record company executive and the prisoner as GN'R.

So you have the record company executive saying.....
"What we've got here / is a failure to communicate" (the record company and GN'R disagreed about the material you are about to hear)
"Some men you just can't reach" (GN'R wouldn't go along with what the record company wanted them to)
"So you get what we had here last week, which is the way he wants it - well, he gets it / I don't like it anymore than you may" (the record company thinks they will 'punish' GN'R by allowing them to release the music they want, which the record company thinks will be a failure and not received well by listeners)

The quote is pretty much an ironic statement of victory for GN'R, sending out the message that you DON'T have to conform.

[Neemo]

The quote is pretty much an ironic statement of victory for GN'R, sending out the message that you DON'T have to conform.

Awesome analysis!!! I don't know if that was their original intent, but, bravo. I didn't see a resemblance at all from that movie to the song and thats why I started the thread, but in that point of view i kinda works.  Thanks justynius

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

I agree that freedom is a recurring/prevalent theme in the Use Your Illusions albums....

Freedom is a prevalent theme in art & music - period.

Creative expressions seek to share the expanded vision of what can be...
"If my poetry aims to achieve anything, it's to deliver people from the limited ways in which they see and feel. - Jim Morrison

And like Justynius was talking about - non-conforminty/rebellion....  Jim Morrison also said:
"'I'm interested in anything about revolt, disorder, chaos, especially activity that appears to have no meaning. It seems to me to be the road toward freedom. "

Rock n' Roll baby... Rock n' Roll! 



PS:  excuse me for my current Morrison 'fixation' of sorts... just read "Break On Through" 

[Carlos_f_Rose]

Great movie!? ? I've seen it several times now.

That movie doesn't have anything to do with civil war, but it was a great line!

I cant see a movie more than one time... it must be a real good movie...

[Cornell]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

 ? I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.? When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

yes old timer we got it second hand.. Most shit is stolen from somewhere anyways

 ? Watch it, Mikey!?

There are some advantages from being my age - the main one being that I saw the original GNR while front row center and many other versions of GNR.?

not only that but a woman with experience

 

Carlos - I'm somone who hates watching a movie more than once too, but I have seen this one 3 or 4 times, so it goes to show! 

[Carlos_f_Rose]

I just saw that my dad has this movie on DVD. But anyway the first time you see it and the guy says "What we've got here is failure to communicate...", it's crazy actually seeing the man say the lines that you have been hearing in a GNR song for years, unless of course you had seen the movie long ago.? It's a pretty good movie too.?

 ? I bet it is!

For me it was the other way around.? When Civil War first came out, I said "Hey, Axl used that line from Cool Hand Luke!"

yes old timer we got it second hand.. Most shit is stolen from somewhere anyways

 ? Watch it, Mikey!?

There are some advantages from being my age - the main one being that I saw the original GNR while front row center and many other versions of GNR.?

not only that but a woman with experience

 

Carlos - I'm somone who hates watching a movie more than once too, but I have seen this one 3 or 4 times, so it goes to show!?

Well that is soft! 

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