Ozzy mentions GN'R

[the dirt]

Now, am I saying all of this just because Ozzy attacked Axl?
 

Yes.

No.

 

Sure, you might say "Yeah well, Axl hasn't released ANYTHING in all that time" and you'd be right.

Precisely. GNR broke up, the band. This is the tragedy of this band.

However, does that make Guns N' Roses the "tragedy of the last 20 years"? I don't see how it could. Why are they a tragedy?.

Because a lot of people loved them, or at least had the curiosity to see what would come next with these guys, and wanted more. the expectations and sadness that it all ended for good the way it did warrents a musical tragedy for rock.



Look, Ozzy is dissapointed and he just feels that axl the nutcase, a fairly common perception of him is responsible. And this ended the music, this band, and thus the tragedy.

[ppbebe]

I'd say a tragedy if someone died.

[jgfnsr]

Now, am I saying all of this just because Ozzy attacked Axl?
 

Yes.

No.

 

Sure, you might say "Yeah well, Axl hasn't released ANYTHING in all that time" and you'd be right.

Precisely. GNR broke up, the band. This is the tragedy of this band.

However, does that make Guns N' Roses the "tragedy of the last 20 years"? I don't see how it could. Why are they a tragedy?.

Because a lot of people loved them, or at least had the curiosity to see what would come next with these guys, and wanted more. the expectations and sadness that it all ended for good the way it did warrents a musical tragedy for rock.



Look, Ozzy is dissapointed and he just feels that axl the nutcase, a fairly common perception of him is responsible. And this ended the music, this band, and thus the tragedy.

Think whatever you want about if he was coming to Axl's defense or not but what reynics 22 posted was right on.

The old band burned out.? Period.? Whether Axl is the biggest nut in the history of the world is irrelevent.

Yeah Guns N' Roses fans "wanted more."? But too many just assume that even if the band had stayed together, whatever they might have released would have been worthy of them.  Not necessarily so.

[Neemo]

I'd say a tragedy if someone died.

Well, someone didn't die, but SOMETHING great did, GnR were huge back then and after seeing GnR in 2002 and VR just last month all I could think of was, "wow, it really sucks that I couldn't have seen GnR back in their heyday, back when the original band was together" not "Oh man this is awesome! I saw Axl 2 years ago and I just saw Slash and Duff and Matt!". The chemistry between Slash and Duff and Matt was incredible, like they fed off each other's energy, I really would've liked to witness Axl in that mix (and Izzy too!)

To sum it up. ?I agree with Ozzy's comments on the breakup as being a tragedy, if I didn't feel excited after see my musical idols from when I was a kid, but regret for not seeing them together, then somethings not right. When Slash left gnr, the Arguably greatest Rock band of all time ceased to exist, these musicians are superb as indiviuals, yes, But as a unified group they were unstoppable.

[the dirt]

Think whatever you want about if he was coming to Axl's defense or not but what reynics 22 posted was right on.

right on about what?

The old band burned out.? Period.? Whether Axl is the biggest nut in the history of the world is irrelevent.

Hey, very valid, it is irrelevent, wheather he's nuts or not.

Yeah Guns N' Roses fans "wanted more."? But too many just assume that even if the band had stayed together, whatever they might have released would have been worthy of them.? Not necessarily so.

Whatever they might have released is irrelevent, because they didn't release anything together again to satisfy the hunger people had. People, when they have something they like don't want it to end. people don't want our heroes to change, they want them to remain at a peak they have of them in their minds.

Of course anything they may have released if the break didn't happen may have been shit, but you'll never know.


Some idolize cobain/nirvana, and find it a tragedy for rock music that he died. Some may even be angered at him for ending the music cos he's dead the way he died. Because the music ended.

The potential of a band, the anticipation, the shock, doubt, sadness that many have is natural when it ends.

And, cobain was sick of nirvana anyway, and was gonna nix the band, and it;s kinda common knowledge, but to have a beloved musical entity to stop dead in it;s tracks (GNR release-wise) is tragic to some, and tragic to ozzy.

Ozzy feels it's a musical rock tragedy.
And happens to blame axl for the end of the music that were gnr to us.

[Bad_Apple]

what if? what if? what if?
u gotta remember, rock n' roll is unpredictable...it was expected that gnr would crash and burn even b4 the release of AFD.  I think a lot of ppl were amazed that they released UYIs (and that they were so artistic/different).  I think we should be happy w/ what we got out of it.  Look at other rock acts, usually they only put out a few albums and then burn out (or OD, or commit suicide, or split up...) (w/ the exception of a rare few)
so remember, Ozzy, "nothing lasts forever..." (as Ax sang)

[D]

Ozzy walkin around pickin up dog shit and totally losing his dark mystique is probably more tragic than GNR.


i never was a huge Ozzy fan but his show and his kids are pathetic.

I appreciate and respect Axl for what he has done.

Ozzy is a legend but was never the frontman Axl was/is.

[Death Cube K]

Without saying ANYTHING about Ozzy and his life, I'd say he's right. It was a tragedy that GNR ended like it did..the old GNR. I dont blame Axl more than anyone else in the band..it's not the point. It was a tragedy that GNR couldnt keep it togheter. Axl's been dealing with it ever since, kind of like setting togheter a house blown to pieces by an atomic bomb.

[Intercourse]

Ozzy has a very valid point.
Regardless of what you think of him today, his opinion must be respected. He has enormous experience as the front man of the band that invented the genre of heavy metal. He has experienced the highs and lows of band success and failure, inter band relationships, fights, egos, fall outs and reunions. He has also been a terrible alcoholic & drug addict...he has gone through and eventually gotten past all of the things that GNR and its old members could not hget over as a group.

To say it is not a tragedy that GNR have not released anything in 14 years is just dumb. Of course it is!! Each member of the original band got nothing of musical merit done in their thirties. This could have been a fantastic time for GNR as adulthood would have finally arrived and God knows what material could have come our way if they could have sorted out their power trips, drug and personality  problems and got back to what they did best..writing music.
How can any GNR fan be happy with virtually NOTHING, no matter what Axl has been promising for 5 years now?

I have seen both incarnations of the band live and I missed the fizz of pure adrenelin between Axl, Duff and Slash out front. THAT magic you do not see in full in VR or in GNR, just a diluted version which is great but just not the real deal..
I think Ozzy saw that magic and that one in a million combination is what he's talking about, to squander that gift is the shameful part of the GNR break up.
peace,
Intercourse.

[Neemo]

I have seen both incarnations of the band live and I missed the fizz of pure adrenelin between Axl, Duff and Slash out front. THAT magic you do not see in full in VR or in GNR, just a diluted version which is great but just not the real deal..

I envy you for seeing the orig band, mostly because it makes my suspicions true. Both VR and NuGnR are Awesome but not as great as they could have been or once were.   

[Chief]

ozzy has a point there but what has he done? reality tv and package tours.. nothing that good/original!!  we'll see ozzy.......

[Intercourse]

Just as a foot note to what I've been babbling on about:

Part of a great bands life is to evolve through playing life and working in studio. Evolution requires making mistakes and all the greats have done it with dud albums etc and stuff fans didn't like.
I would have loved to see how GNR would have evolved in the face of grunge and how they would have moved forward through the last ten years.

Think of all the knowledge they could have gathered over the years of touring, collaborating and writing etc....never to be. All the members walk around in the shadows of their former glories no matter what they do and that is sad for them.

U2 have done several albums far inferior to 'The Joshua Tree' but remain legends because of this epic journey the band have taken through teenage years, twenties, thirties and now forties writing music all the way, which is all a fan wants.
We never got that with GNR and I for one would have loved it; good songs, bad songs, them all. We never got them and that's the tragedy I think Ozzy is talking about.
peace again!
Intercourse.

[Intercourse]

I envy you for seeing the orig band, mostly because it makes my suspicions true. Both VR and NuGnR are Awesome but not as great as they could have been or once were.

They were quite simply stunning, plus they were so fucking young!! I saw them in Germany in 1991 before UYI came out and I don't think I could think straight for about three days afterwards. Amazing.

[Neemo]

I envy you for seeing the orig band, mostly because it makes my suspicions true. Both VR and NuGnR are Awesome but not as great as they could have been or once were.

They were quite simply stunning, plus they were so fucking young!! I saw them in Germany in 1991 before UYI came out and I don't think I could think straight for about three days afterwards. Amazing.

Bastard! 

I know after VR my ears were ringing for 6 days. I have always heard GnR were the loudest live band around but thought whatever until I saw VR. Now I believe it. 

[jgfnsr]

Whatever they might have released is irrelevent, because they didn't release anything together again to satisfy the hunger people had.? ?Of course anything they may have released if the break didn't happen may have been shit, but you'll never know.

Ultimately that's true.? However I think one can make a pretty "educated guess."

You managed to avoid my main point.? The old band BURNED OUT.

When a band burns out there is nothing left to work with.? They still might plop something out but, inevitably, it will be sub-par.

The Spaghetti Incident was the "last gasp" of the old GN'R.? And yet to this day so many fans are still under the illusion that, if they had not broken up, we all would have eventually been rewarded with Appetite II.

[azazello]

I think there's no reason to state they had burned out. It only makes you easier to cope with the break-up. How do you know for so damn sure that if they had been able to straighten out, they wouldn't have written any good new material?


Readin all the above, Ozzy's ultimately right: Of course, you can make his words more exact, but after all he's right.

And I see no reason why the things Ozzy did or didn't do lately has any relevance with this two phrases. If it was a quote form our local butcher, I'd agree with it too.

[Intercourse]

You managed to avoid my main point.  The old band BURNED OUT.

I don't think so man, even Axl said Slash was writing some of the most bad ass blues based guitar riffs ever before he left GNR. The band BURNED UP rather than BURNED OUT. Slash gave up on trying to temper Axls desire to follow trends of the time plus he couldn't live with the inclusion of Huge. The others eventually ran out of patience with the way things were being run (Axl not coming into studio until 2am, having full veto on music being written, Huge in his ear etc).

These guys needed someone to come in an kick their arses after the UYI tour.  A good manager has the power and personality to do that (just read about Zepplins manager.....YIKES!!!). I think if they were sat down,  made to take a hard look at themselves, their behavior toward each other and their drug and alcohol abuse, we may still have them together today. Instead  they had bags of 'yes men' and hangers-on with personal agendas filling their heads with shit.

Every great band in history has kicked the crap out of each other and you will find that the ones that survived (The Who, U2, Aerosmith, Queen, Stones etc) all took it in the chops from a manager or trusted friend who had the balls and where-with-all to sort the shit out and make people realise what they had as a team.

I think  the whole situation was summed up brilliantly by Duff when he said that he looks back at pictures of himself vacant and bloated stumbling around the stage on the UYI tour and wonders "why did nobody say anything?'  or try to help him.
The fact of the matter was too many hands were too busy in the GNR till to care about the band themselves and this is where we are today.
peace and an IRS weekend gunners,
Intercourse.

[jgfnsr]

You managed to avoid my main point.? The old band BURNED OUT.

I don't think so man, even Axl said Slash was writing some of the most bad ass blues based guitar riffs ever before he left GNR. The band BURNED UP rather than BURNED OUT. Slash gave up on trying to temper Axls desire to follow trends of the time plus he couldn't live with the inclusion of Huge. The others eventually ran out of patience with the way things were being run (Axl not coming into studio until 2am, having full veto on music being written, Huge in his ear etc).

I think we might be splittin' hairs here with the "burned out" vs. "burned up" talk.

Yes Axl had some great things to say about Slash's guitar work before he left GN'R.  Hell, Slash's is a riff-master who's playing is almost always great.

But even with Axl's involvement, I still see little if any reason to believe those two would have come up with anything worthy of the old band by that point.

Not only were Axl and Slash going in different directions, the crucial third song-writing component they had in Izzy was no longer available.   

[jgfnsr]

I think there's no reason to state they had burned out. It only makes you easier to cope with the break-up. How do you know for so damn sure that if they had been able to straighten out, they wouldn't have written any good new material?

Read what I wrote above.

And for the record, if anyone uses anything to "cope" with the break-up of GN'R, it's the fans who will go to their grave cursing Axl as the sole one to "blame" for the demise of their beloved band.

[the dirt]

And for the record, if anyone uses anything to "cope" with the break-up of GN'R, it's the fans who will go to their grave cursing Axl as the sole one to "blame" for the demise of their beloved band.

For the record, i just want to clarify that I do not soley blame anyone for the demise of the band.

I was just trying to open up what ozzy said to show what he really meant.

RANT, so you don't beleive that GNR's death (in 94, in all intents and purposes) was a trajedy for rock music?

I agree with ozzy on this one and it ends there. Screw who's to blame, and the fact that they may or may not have burnt out as a creative unit, which is irrelevent as you deemed ultimately correct.

I didn't avoid your point, you may have misinterpreted mine..