Axl Rose signs Publishing Deal

[mitchejw]

I would have to agree with you jabba, isn't sanctuary one of those companies that takes Cds and sells them for 1 cent in buy 10 cds for 10 cents deals?

there is only one thing on his mind i guess, MONEY

[killingvector]

Axl has done this purely for the $$$. All future CD tracks will be at the mercy of Santuary to decide if the want FOX to play Chinese Democracy during they're TV commercials, or fat guys in a Wendys commercial eating a hambuger, and smiling while Madagascar plays. Or a commercial with babies in diapers running around while November Rain is playing.

Considering that Merck is still involved with GnR in a management capacity, I find that claim dubious. Sanctuary's best interest is for CD to do well; selling off songs to  diaper or hamburger commericals isn't going to help move copies of the album. Sanctuary is  going to help the new band reach a higher profile, whether that means soundtracks or television shows or whatever.  As Sting can attest, older artists have to resort to such things to make money these days. I doubt that GnR would consider commericals for their new music, but the soundtracks will be an important element to the new publishing life of the band since , clearly, GnR won't sell like the backstreet boys anymore.

[Chuzeville]

Anyway, Axl retains all moral rights to his songs.

[Mikkamakka]

If Axl sold the rights which were only belong to him, then it's alright.

Do you really think Sanctuary woul dhave done this deal if it had the chance of being blocked in court? Its pretty safe to say Axl sold his rights and his entitlements to the company. Otherwise I doubt the company would have take part in this investment.

You can never know. Sanctuary can think that there is 90% chance that Axl will win the battle for controlship, so they signed the deal. But the fact that Sanctuary's lawyers find more likely that Axl has the rights doesn't mean that the court is over, cause an Axl Rose-related company sticks with the Redhead, and Slash and Duff are assholes (I know you didn't say that), because they think otherwise.

[Mikkamakka]

guys, everyone chill out. look at the article carefully. the only "new" information that the article is based on is the following:

"McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement." He added Rose is trying to transfer copyright interests in songs which "are not owned by Mr. Rose."

read between the lines. duff's lawyer wasnt' aware of this deal. his main issue seems to be that axl never sent this contract to duff or slash. in fact, what probably happened was some random reporter called him up and he had no idea about it, so he just had to go based on what the reporter said. so the lawyer may have just assumed that axl was trying to sell the entire copyrights or publishing rights to the songs, which he would not be allowed to do. it's probably a misunderstanding due to the fact that axl didnt tell the other guys anything about it (and since they are part of the same partnership, they would have a right to know who they had to deal with).

in short: people should chill out and not read too much into this. nowhere does it say that slash and duff want to sue axl or sanctuary over this deal. all it says is that duff's lawyer wasn't aware of it.

The most likely scenario IMO

[erose]

Axl has done this purely for the $$$. All future CD tracks will be at the mercy of Santuary to decide if the want FOX to play Chinese Democracy during they're TV commercials, or fat guys in a Wendys commercial eating a hambuger, and smiling while Madagascar plays. Or a commercial with babies in diapers running around while November Rain is playing.

Sanctuary is free to whore the new music out, with potential of making millions more than what Axl recieved. Would you call this brilliant?

if you think it's purely for the money, why wouldn't he go with the publisher who offered him the most money? do you really think axl has been so tight on the gn'r material just so he could, all of a sudden, let it all go and get whored down the drain??? 

[jabba2]

if you think it's purely for the money, why wouldn't he go with the publisher who offered him the most money? do you really think axl has been so tight on the gn'r material just so he could, all of a sudden, let it all go and get whored down the drain?

Its possible. Noone knows how Axl's financial situation is. All we know is he spent wildly during the illusion tours. Axl could realize he needs the $$$ right now, while GNR music can advertise effectively at a high price. Nobody will know how much someone will pay for GNR music 15-20 years from now, or if anyone would care. But he went with the lower bid because it sounds like Sanctuary is a big fan of the older GNR material. But its going to take a shitload of commercials and movies for them to get $20M back and the make a large profit. Im sure they plan on getting it.

[ppbebe]

the fact that Sanctuary's lawyers find more likely that Axl has the rights

Mr. McKagan?s lawyer more likely finds that Axl has the rights.
In Regard to the comment of Mr. McKagan?s lawyer on the article

McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement."

Also SLASH's management said, according to  the webmaster of the Official Slash Fan Site

There are three signatures required on every deal: SLASH, Duff and Axl. Since Sanctuary bought Axl's share for 20 years from now on every deal, there has to be approval by Sanctuary, SLASH and Duff

Here they are clearly stating Axl is a partner and has the rights.
I must take back my words on my earlier post. (Damn it, I should have completely erased that rumourboard version from my head!) Now Duff and Slash's side is asserting that the assets Axl handed over to Sanctuary dose exist.
Was it like this before this deal emerges?

I?m not certain about what the pending suit against Axl is exactly for.

Slash and Duff are only trying to protect they're past music. Theres no cold hearted intention to sabatoge Axl. They are still suing for full control of the past catalog,(which is a little more cold hearted)

Are you?

[D]

if you think it's purely for the money, why wouldn't he go with the publisher who offered him the most money? do you really think axl has been so tight on the gn'r material just so he could, all of a sudden, let it all go and get whored down the drain?

Its possible. Noone knows how Axl's financial situation is. All we know is he spent wildly during the illusion tours. Axl could realize he needs the $$$ right now, while GNR music can advertise effectively at a high price. Nobody will know how much someone will pay for GNR music 15-20 years from now, or if anyone would care. But he went with the lower bid because it sounds like Sanctuary is a big fan of the older GNR material. But its going to take a shitload of commercials and movies for them to get $20M back and the make a large profit. Im sure they plan on getting it.

great post that seems very very reasonable

people have to remember that Axl may not be as rich as we think

when u are in a band with that many people, millions of dollars split a whole bunch of different ways doesnt go as far

after taxes,fines,lawsuits etc

plus i like that, make the deal now while there is still an interest

the lowest bidder im sure was to sanctuary cause he feels they will whore it out the least and still keep his interest in mind to a degree.

[Mikkamakka]

the fact that Sanctuary's lawyers find more likely that Axl has the rights

Mr. McKagan?s lawyer more likely finds that Axl has the rights.
In Regard to the comment of Mr. McKagan?s lawyer on the article

McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement."

Also SLASH's management said, according to? the webmaster of the Official Slash Fan Site

There are three signatures required on every deal: SLASH, Duff and Axl. Since Sanctuary bought Axl's share for 20 years from now on every deal, there has to be approval by Sanctuary, SLASH and Duff

Here they are clearly stating Axl is a partner and has the rights.
I must take back my words on my earlier post. (Damn it, I should have completely erased that rumourboard version from my head!) Now Duff and Slash's side is asserting that the assets Axl handed over to Sanctuary dose exist.
Was it like this before this deal emerges?

Now we think the same. I think that there are two possibilities: Axl sold his parts - then it has nothing to do with Slash N' Duff. But if Axl sold all the rights (I'm a bit sceptical that 1/3 of the GN'R rights would worth 20 million), then further lawsuites will take place.

[Booker Floyd]

I wonder, if Slash and Duff wanted to, could they block all possible deals?  One would imagine that in order for Axl to receive his full pay, Sanctuary would have to make money off of the rights.  If Slash and Duff chose to be really spiteful and block refuse every deal offered (highly unlikely), what would Sanctuary do then?

[erose]

I wonder, if Slash and Duff wanted to, could they block all possible deals?? One would imagine that in order for Axl to receive his full pay, Sanctuary would have to make money off of the rights.? If Slash and Duff chose to be really spiteful and block refuse every deal offered (highly unlikely), what would Sanctuary do then?

but the 19 mill was up fron right?

lets say sanctuary wants to put a gn'r song on a movie soundtrack and duff and slash didn't want it to happen, i guess duff slash and santuary won't get shit done and Axl would still have his 19 mill.

[SADIS]

By the time all these deals, cases, etc will be done they'll all be dead.

It's so far away from where they came from; just making music. And now GNR almost stands for a corporate machine. It's such a shame.....

[Lesty]

Interesting thing I heard on the radio this morning.
I listen to radio station KFAN in Minneapolis, and the morning show are big fans of rock music, even though it's mainly a sports-based show/station. Every Wednesday, they have Rob Chapman on, a local rep for Sanctuary records. They usually just talk about the top 10 for sales that week, upcoming releases, etc...
Anyway, one of the co-hosts asked him about the GnR deal that was made this week.
Now obviously he's a rep for sanctuary records, and not involved in the publishing end of things, but he knew what it was about.
He stated that they bought AXL'S publishing, which was "most of appetite for destruction." and of course, other songs as well,
but said they didn't have the rights to songs that were credited to slash and duff. And, he said that whenever Axl drops Chinese Democracy, that album will sell HUGE.
Nice to know that the music industry still feels his new music is still very viable.
But I'm not sure how Slash and Duff can stop Axl from selling his publishing rights,
especially since they don't have the rights to the GnR name.

[Ali]

Interesting thing I heard on the radio this morning.
I listen to radio station KFAN in Minneapolis, and the morning show are big fans of rock music, even though it's mainly a sports-based show/station. Every Wednesday, they have Rob Chapman on, a local rep for Sanctuary records. They usually just talk about the top 10 for sales that week, upcoming releases, etc...
Anyway, one of the co-hosts asked him about the GnR deal that was made this week.
Now obviously he's a rep for sanctuary records, and not involved in the publishing end of things, but he knew what it was about.
He stated that they bought AXL'S publishing, which was "most of appetite for destruction." and of course, other songs as well,
but said they didn't have the rights to songs that were credited to slash and duff. And, he said that whenever Axl drops Chinese Democracy, that album will sell HUGE.
Nice to know that the music industry still feels his new music is still very viable.
But I'm not sure how Slash and Duff can stop Axl from selling his publishing rights,
especially since they don't have the rights to the GnR name.

Thanks for posting that, Lesty.  I can understand Duff and Slash being upset that they were not told about this deal as a matter of courtesy.  But, if Sanctuary bought the publishing rights to Axl's contributions to the old material, I don't see how Duff and Slash can legally do anything about that.  But, then again, I'm not a lawyer

Ali

[GNROSAS]

Interesting thing I heard on the radio this morning.
I listen to radio station KFAN in Minneapolis, and the morning show are big fans of rock music, even though it's mainly a sports-based show/station. Every Wednesday, they have Rob Chapman on, a local rep for Sanctuary records. They usually just talk about the top 10 for sales that week, upcoming releases, etc...
Anyway, one of the co-hosts asked him about the GnR deal that was made this week.
Now obviously he's a rep for sanctuary records, and not involved in the publishing end of things, but he knew what it was about.
He stated that they bought AXL'S publishing, which was "most of appetite for destruction." and of course, other songs as well,
but said they didn't have the rights to songs that were credited to slash and duff. And, he said that whenever Axl drops Chinese Democracy, that album will sell HUGE.
Nice to know that the music industry still feels his new music is still very viable.
But I'm not sure how Slash and Duff can stop Axl from selling his publishing rights,
especially since they don't have the rights to the GnR name.

Thanks for posting that, Lesty.? I can understand Duff and Slash being upset that they were not told about this deal as a matter of courtesy.? But, if Sanctuary bought the publishing rights to Axl's contributions to the old material, I don't see how Duff and Slash can legally do anything about that.? But, then again, I'm not a lawyer

Ali

But from what i have understood about the lawshit is that they claim that Axl has no publishing rights.

[Ali]

That's certainly true.  That's why I find the comments by Duff's lawyer interesting, about not contacting the "remaining partners." 

Ali

[madagas]

Yes, Duff's attorney is essentially admitting that their claim that Axl left the partnership is bullshit. That claim could have already been dismissed by the judge. However, there were more issues involved in the suit than that. In all lawsuits, when writing a complaint, you ask for anything and everything...some things can get dismissed while certain "counts" can remain.

[damnthehaters]

Interesting thing I heard on the radio this morning.
I listen to radio station KFAN in Minneapolis, and the morning show are big fans of rock music, even though it's mainly a sports-based show/station. Every Wednesday, they have Rob Chapman on, a local rep for Sanctuary records. They usually just talk about the top 10 for sales that week, upcoming releases, etc...
Anyway, one of the co-hosts asked him about the GnR deal that was made this week.
Now obviously he's a rep for sanctuary records, and not involved in the publishing end of things, but he knew what it was about.
He stated that they bought AXL'S publishing, which was "most of appetite for destruction." and of course, other songs as well,
but said they didn't have the rights to songs that were credited to slash and duff. And, he said that whenever Axl drops Chinese Democracy, that album will sell HUGE.
Nice to know that the music industry still feels his new music is still very viable.
But I'm not sure how Slash and Duff can stop Axl from selling his publishing rights,
especially since they don't have the rights to the GnR name.

Now tell me if I'm wrong, but if this is true, it means that GNR will be hugely promoted.  They will be all over the place when CD hits.  That's my take.

[Eva GnRAxlRosette]

Axl has done this purely for the $$$. All future CD tracks will be at the mercy of Santuary to decide if the want FOX to play Chinese Democracy during they're TV commercials, or fat guys in a Wendys commercial eating a hambuger, and smiling while Madagascar plays. Or a commercial with babies in diapers running around while November Rain is playing.

Sanctuary is free to whore the new music out, with potential of making millions more than what Axl recieved. Would you call this brilliant?

if you think it's purely for the money, why wouldn't he go with the publisher who offered him the most money? do you really think axl has been so tight on the gn'r material just so he could, all of a sudden, let it all go and get whored down the drain??? 

very good point - 
this has been pointed out several times in this very thread...
aparently some board members keep forgetting this detail...
i believe the fact that Axl did not simply go with the highest bidder speaks volumes...
coupled with the fact that money has not been a motivating factor for Axl ALL these years...
elsewise he would have allowed the numerous deals Slash and Duff say he blocked AND he would not have protested the GH...
AND he could have put out X numbers of albums or material that were not up to his standard JUST FOR THE MONEY
he has NOT done so
these may seem to be small details but they are KEY...
on top of all this - AS HAS BEEN POINTED OUT - Sanctuary Group's other relationship with Axl/GN'R as Sanctuary Managmenet is a strong indicator that Axl and Merck have a good relationship and one which Axl apparently has confidence in as he has now joined the Publishing company as well.

Slash and Duff are only trying to protect they're past music. Theres no cold hearted intention to sabatoge Axl. They are still suing for full control of the past catalog,(which is a little more cold hearted)

I'm a bit confused on the quote... but to be clear
SLASH AND DUFF ARE SUING FOR FULL CONTROL OF THE ENTIRE GNR' CATALOGUE - the want to CUT AXL OUT
WHICH AMONG US COULD SAY THIS IS UM... RIGHT?  MORAL?  NICE?  FAIR?  or um... UN-ASSHOLELIKE?   

the fact that Sanctuary's lawyers find more likely that Axl has the rights

Mr. McKagan?s lawyer more likely finds that Axl has the rights.
In Regard to the comment of Mr. McKagan?s lawyer on the article

McKagan's lawyer, Glen Miskel, expressed surprise when told of the Sanctuary deal. He said Rose, Slash and Duff were part of a partnership and "neither Sanctuary nor Axl Rose have provided the remaining partners with a copy of that agreement."

Also SLASH's management said, according to? the webmaster of the Official Slash Fan Site

There are three signatures required on every deal: SLASH, Duff and Axl. Since Sanctuary bought Axl's share for 20 years from now on every deal, there has to be approval by Sanctuary, SLASH and Duff

Here they are clearly stating Axl is a partner and has the rights.
I must take back my words on my earlier post. (Damn it, I should have completely erased that rumourboard version from my head!) Now Duff and Slash's side is asserting that the assets Axl handed over to Sanctuary dose exist.
Was it like this before this deal emerges?

Now we think the same. I think that there are two possibilities: Axl sold his parts - then it has nothing to do with Slash N' Duff. But if Axl sold all the rights (I'm a bit sceptical that 1/3 of the GN'R rights would worth 20 million), then further lawsuites will take place.

that is right - Axl sold his parts - as the press release stated:  his "contributions"
as the statement from SLASH managment confirmed - Befor this deal deals required Axl/Slash/Duff signatures...
now instead of Axl's signature, deals will require Sanctuary's signature - along with Slash and Duff's
Slash and Duff still have their rights!

as far as the deal being for 1/3rd - that is not necessarily the case - there is nothing to indicate that licensing fees / royalties were split evenly among the members.  The only percentage I recall regarding crediting was the formula Slash came up with where Axl 'owned' 42% (of AFD I believe it was).  Though this likely does not apply to the entire catalog (as recall TSI was covers) it shows that there was not necessarily equal splits of credit/renumeration qpplied.  Whatever Axl's share of the rights is, Sanctuary certainly is in the right business to know what its worth - for the old material AND future material.  We can not discount the value of the furture material as I'm sure this represents a major portion of what they consider marketable.  And listen - as i posted earlier in this thread - publishing/licensing income INCLUDES THE MONEYS THE RECORDING COMPANY PAYS PER UNIT -  this means that furture shares of sales/distribution of cd's of the past catalogs AND of the new material goes to Sanctuary.

This is not all about movie soundtracks and commercials.  The publishing deal covers the mechanical licensing - t-shirts, lyrics printing, AND THE ACTUAL CD'S.  That is my understanding from reading though several music industry articles and resource websites.