richard fortus, legit member in your eyes or not?

[norway]

is the vr section gettin boring? they're NOT gnr members for those who think so

i really like richard, but i will not say he is better than any members, they have different styles or disticntion and that equals the members, so some? of the a styles suits you and some don't

plain formally (like contracts) richard is a legit member- but unfortunatly not in yet in the gnr legacy t the big public crowd
- we'll see it ten years after release i guess

So were matt and Gilby members of guns n roses in the early 90s?

i mean slash and duff and etc is not members of gnr

[younggunner]

I'd ask you to prove this, but I know you can't.

the band members have said it so thats good enough for me

[providman]

I'd ask you to prove this, but I know you can't.

the band members have said it so thats good enough for me

Youngunner, I edited my quote before you posted , it sort of answers your reply.

[norway]

i gotta say that attempting to play the solo's like slash is like an atempt to copy bucketheads playin-
-can't be done

so i really like that you often hear their own input and their own version of the solo's
but intro to sweet child and stuff is a tuff one

[younggunner]

They have no credibility. They lost getting the benefit of the doubt years ago.

To an extent you are correct but those are things they cant control. Release dates...What they do control and what they are a major part of is the actual writing and recording. You might not want to believe that but thats the truth.

[Bongo]

The only legit members are Axl, Finck, Brain, Tommy, Richard, Dizzy and Pitman

Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy,Steven and Gilby -  They dont belong to GNR anymore......

[Mikkamakka]

I start to think that you are Axl Rose, cause you're repeating everything he said.

Because in order to support an argument you need quotes,facts

Quotes are not equal to facts. If Axl, Slash or Michael Jackson ?etc. said he created the world it wouldn't mean that he did. And it'd be easier for everybody if you emphasized what was a quote from Axl and what was a fact. You know, it's quite different.

To clear it: the band suggested names. Slash wanted Ryan Roxie to join, they tried out Zakk, Izzy was around and Matt suggested Robin Finck.

What does that clear?
We know the situation and what happened...we are discussing the role of Tobias.

same old trick again, YG... You cut off what you don't like and then try to act like I'd have been misplaced the argument. You said this:

The reality is even though the other members didnt like him, they didnt suggest one name at the time. ?

and I reacted.

[Falcon]

Simply put, he's one of the most influential players of the modern rock era. ?Highly skilled, with a unique style, tone and sound.

Slash blows him away in my mind.
Im not so sure he has a unique sound either. Slash has a unique sound..not sure Dave does...

Slash and Dave come from 2 different sides of the spectrum, totally uncomparible.

Dave's was influenced by the mid eighties British goth scene along with forays into metal and LA punk.
Slash's influences are more of the blues based variety. ?Joe Perry, Eric Clapton and the like.

Both are highly respected, great players. ?Just different stylistically.

Tying this to topic, Fortus only has one thing in common with both. ?GNR. ?Slash played in it, Dave turned down the opportunity..

[dave-gnfnr2k]

Saying Fortus(or Brain, Stinson, Finck, etc....) is a legit member is like saying Billy Preston is a legit member of the Beatles. Like Preston & the Beatles, they recorded ?with GnR(supposedly). Like Preston & the Beatles, they toured with GnR. However, since the Beatles, just like GnR, ?are no longer a current group, you have to say Fortus, like Preston, are NOT legit members since the bands don't currently exist, which is probably besides the point anyway.

Fortus, Brian, Tommy and Robin all have written songs for guns n roses,

I'd ask you to prove this, but we all know you can't, & just because some of them said so doesn't mean shit anymore, either. They have no credibility. They lost getting the benefit of the doubt years ago.

You crack me up. Lets see all the band members said they all contributed to the songs but that is not good enough? Why is that? so you think Axl pulled a Corgan or a Trent and wrote all the lyrics and all the music to all the new songs?

Again Saul you didnt know who BH was before he joined guns n roses just like 90% of other people in the world.
Like I said, unless you were a die hard you didnt know who he was.  Its a simple concept but you just dont understand it. And yeah he was in a few write up articles in some mags but he still was not a legend or widely known. 

[Booker Floyd]

Regarding Dave Kushner being a great guitar player because he plays with Slash. Yeah right. Izzy played with Slash too but you'll never see him listed as one of the greatest guitar players of all times. They both work well complimenting Slash. That's why they play(ed) with him.

Just to be clear, my point was that working with a huge rock star doesnt necessarily mean a guitarist is great or special, and I used some peoples dislike for Dave Kushner to illustrate that. ?Then they decided to change their original point mid-argument...but I never said Kushners great because he works with Slash; thats the logic I was arguing against.

Granted, Jarmo, you misunderstood my point, but its odd that you shot it down as it pertained to Kushner, and failed to address the original (and, unlike mine, straightfaced) claim that Robin is great because he plays with Axl. 

[Pandora]

For one have you heard any of his solo stuff. The guy is amazing.

have you heard any of his solo stuff??? does Richard Fortus have a solo album?? 

No, but you can download 2 mp3s of stuff he wrote for a video game soundtrack here :
http://www.jellifish.com/techniques/mp3artists/RichardFortus.html

Too bad it's a bit short.

[younggunner]

Quotes are not equal to facts.

never said they are. Quotes show 1 side of a story.

same old trick again, YG... You cut off what you don't like and then try to act like I'd have been misplaced the argument. You said this:

Um, me and Booker were discussing the role of Tobias, then out of nowhere you bring up Zak and Robin Finck. The argument was about how much of a role Tobias was actually going to play in GNR.

Tobias was by all accounts the first guy mentioned to Slash and the rest of the band. They all disagreed. so, AT THAT TIME, in the initial stages Axl was the only guy to bring in a new face.

[dave-gnfnr2k]

robin is lead guitar while kushner and paul were rhythm there is a big difference.

[norway]

buckethead is a well respected musician amongst other musicians,

but he was b4 gnr recognised more in the direction that marco beltramo is and similar than britney spears, slash and the mainstream

[Booker Floyd]

robin is lead guitar while kushner and paul were rhythm there is a big difference.

But not different enough for you to directly compare them anyway, right? 

BTW Robin is BETTER than Kushner.

I see you didnt even bother to address the last point I made to you (about taking "a lot of peoples" advive on VR)...Ive said it before, the blatant hypocrisy is stunning.

[jarmo]

Granted, Jarmo, you misunderstood my point, but its odd that you shot it down as it pertained to Kushner, and failed to address the original (and, unlike mine, straightfaced) claim that Robin is great because he plays with Axl.?

He replaced Slash. Do you think Axl would get a guy who can't play to replace Slash? Robin was good enough to play with a perfectionist like Trent Reznor. Maybe he doesn't suck as much as some people claim?

Kushner is great for what he's doing in VR. I don't think he's the greatest lead guitarist ever, but he does his thing well enough to be in VR.



/jarmo

[D]

I think the new band, axl included are bored with the old songs

notice how the old songs are ok but when they play something new, the energy,intensity etc etc are just turned way up.

I wanted to point out the NSYNC thing cause of the ever important street cred


thats a big reason Axl is the best frontman ever, he is respected by the rich,poor,black,white whatever race,color,class etc etc etc

a lot of people are already turned off cause there is a new GNR, u let it come out that a new member played with NSYNC and i think that will hurt GNR's street cred.

i understand he had to pay the bills etc but whatever happened to artistic integrity?

I lost some respect for SLash when he played with Jacko and those others but i agree with what someone previously stated

its different a legend being asked to collaborate with another legend than it is what Richard did.

I just dont like the old material that much as translated by the new band.

its hard for me to imagine richard or some of those guys dancin with mr brownstone or ridin the nightrain.

the old guys are older but still lived those songs which makes it authentic, the new guys didnt so it is in ways like watching an all star cover band.

So hopefully when CD is released axl will play the tracks off CD and maybe just the big GNR hits and that be it.

[norway]

a lot of people are already turned off cause there is a new GNR, u let it come out that a new member played with NSYNC and i think that will hurt GNR's street cred.

same people prolly thinks showering is gay

[dave-gnfnr2k]

Granted, Jarmo, you misunderstood my point, but its odd that you shot it down as it pertained to Kushner, and failed to address the original (and, unlike mine, straightfaced) claim that Robin is great because he plays with Axl.?

He replaced Slash. Do you think Axl would get a guy who can't play to replace Slash? Robin was good enough to play with a perfectionist like Trent Reznor. Maybe he doesn't suck as much as some people claim?



/jarmo

Exactally, Trent is a perfectionist just like Axl is, and both have/had robin at their lead gutiarist. ?That speaks volumes. ?If he was not a great guitar player neither would have had them playing in their bands.

And D you claim Fortus doing session work with N synch will hurt Gnrs street cred well did Josh Freeze doing studio work for Avil Levine hurt APCs street cred?

[Naupis]

Exactally, Trent is a perfectionist just like Axl is, and both have/had robin at their lead gutiarist.  That speaks volumes.  If he was not a great guitar player neither would have had them playing in their bands.

Or it could mean he is a pushover/yes man (that the only guys he plays for are totally in charge of the creative direction of their projects) who basically plays what he is told by those perfectionist control freak front men. It's all in how you want to manipulate it to best fit your argument. There is no set in stone answer that proves it one way or another.