Someone explain this

[mikegiuliana]

I wanted to understand something, I see alot of the if the new albums never happen I'm still happy because I have the old stuff, and we have old albums etc., etc etc.. Yet all that anyone talks about is the new band.. 

So my thing is if you have just a handfull of shows and a few new song that aren't as good as the old then why is there mostly talk about the second version of gnr and not the one we all know and love?

I see sites devoted to new gnr and some are so anti vr, I don't understand why if you are a gnr fan that you have such a dislike towards the other members.. Nobody says you have to like vr's new album, butt o hate the old members sounds so idiotic if you love gnr..

Just help me to understand why there is so much anti old gnr and so much pro new gnr..? If everyone is like whatever with the new album and you're all guns n roses fans then what's the problem?

People say well if you aren't into cd or the new band then why do you go to gnr forums.. ? I just wonder when did gnr forums become a staple for the new guys without an album? How have they payed their dues in regards to gnr?

I see forums that get so angry if you have negative shit to say about new gnr, why does everyone defend them to the death, they have'nt even given us anything yet and the linueup is always subject to change..

The point was if so many people are going to get on people's ass for being annoyed that cd isn't out and tell them it's no big deal and enjoy the old albums, then why does the old guys get so little mentiones and why do you worship the new guys so much more?

This is just a two year observation, it's just some things I would like people to address, I was just curious to see how people felt..

I understand the band has changed, I just don't get the devotion of people from having so little being fans of a group that broke up..

I just need to understand it better, I enjoy vr alot, but it's because of seeing them, having countles interviews, having an album, videos, getting to know a band I pretty much have been listening to for years (matt scott, slash duff)..

I just can't understand the huge love for all players from other bands having such minimal material to go by and so much dislike towards the band that made gnr.. Yet people will cry their eyes out and go nuts over some shady interviews by ex members, but they will defend axl to the end and say it's ok if he releases nothing.. It's doesn't make sence..

[Wooody]

..a few new song that aren't as good as the old then..

that's YOUR perception.

[mikegiuliana]

..a few new song that aren't as good as the old then..

that's YOUR perception.

fine songs as good as the old.. It still doesn't say a thing about what I said..

[Hammy]

..a few new song that aren't as good as the old then..

that's YOUR perception.

Exactly, and don't forget this board has an Ex-Gunners/Velvet Revolver Section, there are plenty of people like myself who like and respect everyone ever involved in the band.  Firstly though the old band is over, many don't want to dwel in the past all the discussions about the new band are people's efforts to move forward.  As for people who have a dislike for old members or who hate the new band the fact is ex-gunners don't really get along with Axl and i am guessing, only guessing though, many people feel they should...take...sides e.g. support their favourite members e.g. Some people think 'Axl is a cock he just sacked everyone'.....otherwise think 'Nah, Axl is just misunderstood'.  Everyone has a different perception and is welcome to like or support or hate who they want.  Like i said before i like them all but my full support goes to the New GN'R well before anything else related to the ex-members.  As for the new guys many people on this board have looked into their previous projects and have great respect for them as musicians, this board seems to be full of people who love Buckethead solo albums, Tommy Stinson's new release seems to be going down a storm although i am yet to listen to it along with his work in The Replacements, Primus from what i have heard are a class act and well.....Richard Fortus w/ N Sync.....jeez that was a dream come true for me

[younggunner]

Yet all that anyone talks about is the new band.. ?

Because most people have accepted the fact that the old band is done. Those same people have decided to either? stick around and see what Axl has in store for us or just leave.

I see sites devoted to new gnr and some are so anti vr, I don't understand why if you are a gnr fan that you have such a dislike towards the other members.. Nobody says you have to like vr's new album, butt o hate the old members sounds so idiotic if you love gnr..

I think its an interesting point you bring up. To me it shows and says that Axl is the main drawing card compared to the old members. There is something about Axl that sticks out and gets peoples attention. Yes we all love the old members but Axl seems to be on another level in terms of popularity amongst the gnr fans. And that goes for the haters as well. Axl draws peopel from all opinions.

Another thing that I think plays into the whole thing is that I think people see that maybe Axl isnt lieing over the yrs. Not to say the old guys are lieing but its more of a handful of guys vs this 1 guy. And when the group has some accusations towards Axl but cant build an overwhelming case towards the guy I think people are tending to lean towards Axl over the past year or two in my opinion.
Its also based on the fact that some people arent overly impressed or enjoy CB that much.

People say well if you aren't into cd or the new band then why do you go to gnr forums.. ? I just wonder when did gnr forums become a staple for the new guys without an album? How have they payed their dues in regards to gnr?

Because the past is the past. Believe it or not there are many old gnr fans who love Axl and the new guys.
For me I love the old band. They were absolutely great. BUt new gnr is my band. Not only do I love Axl but I also have a connection with the new members as well. Maybe its because I dont look at it as a old vs new type thing.

I see forums that get so angry if you have negative shit to say about new gnr, why does everyone defend them to the death, they have'nt even given us anything yet and the linueup is always subject to change..

And that my friend shows the power of Axl ROse. HE has done jack shit, some would say treated his fans horribly, etc,etc...yet there is a legion of people ready to embrace this new band. That in and of itself speaks volumes imo. The band hasnt done much since they began but I guess peopel see the potential. Some see the potential, some want to see them fail.
Like I said before...thats what Axl brings and has over the old guys.

then why does the old guys get so little mentiones and why do you worship the new guys so much more?

That quote Duff said about Axl and the fans a few yrs back is coming to mind.....

I just can't understand the huge love for all players from other bands having such minimal material to go by and so much dislike towards the band that made gnr..

SOme dont look at it like old vs new. SOme embrace this band and see their talents and potential. Although most of them arent really aminstream guys they are talented muscicans. Combine that with a guy like Axl peopel get excited. Me atleast. It also has to do with the Axl factor. People are curious about what he is up to and know that despite his negatives ...is an amazing songwriter,performer and singer.....and that he has the ability to create something very special. Somehting that might outdue any previous efforts by himself and his former band....

But as I have been saying...the jury is still out and time will tell....


Youy can also ask...if the whole gnr situation was reversed. The old guys were still together, it was still called gnr, and Axl left would thier be message board/internet sites devoted to gnr like it is today? Would the intensity/passion of the gnr fan still be there?

[jarmo]

Some fans weren't around when the old band ruled the world. So for them this new band is the only GN'R they have experienced.

I'm not sure they're "anti old band", they're just not fans of the ex-members post-GN'R work.

Just like there are fans of the ex-members who'll do anything to discredit Axl, there's Axl fans who'll do the same about the ex-members.





/jarmo

[Buddha_Master]

Alright, I give this a shot.

Back when things got real bleak for the classic GNR, and I knew the end was near, the stories I was hearing forever changed my own perceptions. I am a real big Beatles fan. But, I am not a fan of there early work. That is not the part that relates this to GNR. When things became clear the Axl wanted their sound to grow and evolve, I got real excited. I got excited because that is what the Beatles did, and did it collectively. The sound that came from them really moves and touches me in ways I cant really describe. Now, for GNR to risk everything and go into new realms, is the fucking shit. It takes balls. The UYI at the very least, shows that there is somthing so much more they could be doing. There was mass experimenting there, and I feel they might have been really onto something. Maybe they could have ushered in something completely new and innovated.

But it quickly became clear that only Axl was willing to take the next step. I still dig Slash. He is one of the greats. But I don't respect him as much as I would had he decided to evolve into someone greater. Jimi Hendrix for years played backup electric guitar. But Jimi was a genius and a beast and he thrived to go as far as he could with the music. Jimi had drive. That is what makes Hendrix so relevant today and respected. Axl has this drive. The Beatles had this drive. But GNR collectively didn't, and I fucking hate that Slash and Duff couldnt see the bigger picture. We sure as shit would have had some new GNR we could have been enjoying right now had Slash and Duff decided to step outside there box.

I respect Axl more for following this vision. And although VR was kind of fun, it didnt move me at all. It was run of the mill R&R. For that, it is cool. But that is all it is. And that is all Slash and Duff want to be. They are in a safe place, and they deserve a shit load of props for the music they helped create, and for still being in a popular band. But their music isnt changing shit. Its not here to kick you in the face and show you what music could be. Not like what Appetite first did. Its giving you what you already now. They played it safe. Axl never played it safe...never. 

[younggunner]

well said dude

[norway]

in the beginning...

They got atracted to eachother
and knew they had to play together when they saw and heard eachother

Maybe the thought, wow this band is so amazing and intresting and the era\time is something that affect that opinion

but time evolves and nothing lasts 4-ever...

so lookin at the new guys and their special competanse...
i'm just: wow this band is so amazing and intresting and thats why i'm so into this new band+

-i'm a big fan of axl (amazing voice and presence)
-and the new songs rock

don't get all the hatred between the different era's, i'm really into the old albums (though afd startin to sound poor, like when you play young elvis-good songs, but the soundproduction is not up to standars anymore)
-and i love watchin shows by the old band,

but some people seem to think that the old band still exist and that axl has fucked it up
them i don't get, it's a new band 2 me

ps\ hope for a feb release

[mikegiuliana]

Some fans weren't around when the old band ruled the world. So for them this new band is the only GN'R they have experienced.

I'm not sure they're "anti old band", they're just not fans of the ex-members post-GN'R work.

Just like there are fans of the ex-members who'll do anything to discredit Axl, there's Axl fans who'll do the same about the ex-members.




/jarmo

I agree about the newer fans that frequent the board have basically mostly seen new gnr and came to appreciate them as the band that I liked when gnr was king..

And yes axl has the mystery and the draw, most people do like the lead singer most..
I enjoy axl more then anything, he was my favorite lead singer growing up..


I guess I had this feeling where when I first joined or checked gnr websites there was this huge love for buckethead, and he was the next big thing and everyone seemed to look at him as the best of the three players, and now I see such a dislike towards him (not by all, just some) like he was never part of the band, yet he has basically contributed as much as many others (being we've only seen the live gigs).
Maybe for me it's otugher because I don't like the newer stuff as much as the old so FOR ME the new album is vital because I don't sit here listening to the boots n oh my god even though I own them..

Well nice explanations everyone, I'm off to the gym then work, see you people sometime tomorrow..

[Hammy]

though afd startin to sound poor

Crazy Bastard! Give it long enough and all the old GN'R albums will start sounding poor

[norway]

though afd startin to sound poor

Crazy Bastard! Give it long enough and all the old GN'R albums will start sounding poor

NOT, it's he same as the techincal old black-white vhs-quality it's annoyingly not up to the standards

But the songs are good

[AxlsMainMan]

I guess Ill try and throw my opinion into this. First of all I absolutely loved the original GnR line-up and always will love and praise the albums that they gave us but as a band unit they no longer exist and as chances see it, probably never will again. I support VR and always will, but Contraband inarguably is a massive dissapointment. I love R&R and Contraband is R&R, very good rock at that, but the album lacks direction and inspriration. Slash, Duff, and Matt had so much potential to move on and evolve from the sheer greatness they exhibited on AFD or the UYI's, but unfortunately they have not and as a result I am very optomistic that with the experimentation and brilliance the new tracks possess, VR will pale in comparirson to the new GnR. I dont however see things as black and white like alot of people do on here where if you like Slash and the old guys then your opposed to Axl and his new project, or if you support Axl, then you are for lack of better words pissing all over GnR's legacy. To me theres no harm in loving the new band and whatever direction the old guys may take in the future. In answer to your other question though, I support Axl even with no album  released because I feel that Axl is without a doubt one of the best rock and roll singers of all time and he is an absolute genioud when it comes to music and with the correctly assembled group of musicians that he has, there is no stopping him. He is a man with a true aurora(sp) constantly lingering around him in which no matter what he does or what he doesnt do, he will always be remembered and followed into the years that his career will center around, and if they are used to reclaim greatness then so be it, if not then we truly do have brilliant matterial to look back on.

[AxemanOnFire]

but Contraband inarguably is a massive dissapointment.

Woah, stop a second. Inarguably? Don't put your opinion on such a high pedestal mate, a lot of people would disagree with that statement.

As to the topic, I'm no new Guns fan. I don't like the new songs (although the guitar on The Blues is pretty good, though the solos lack the finesse of Slash's), and I'm none too happy about Axl effectively stealing the Guns n' Roses name off the old guys (I read about how he came to own the rights and man, that was just a rotten way to treat your bandmates). But don't particularly dislike them, I just don't care for the band. If Chinese Democracy does find its way out, and people buy it, good for them. If you like a band, you should support it. If Axl releases it and tours to stadiums full of fans, that's fine with me, I just won't be one of them. I don't really understand the negativity on both sides either. Me, I'm loving VR, but I'm not going to start shit with Axl fans. Each to their own, if you like.

[33]

Alright, I give this a shot.

Back when things got real bleak for the classic GNR, and I knew the end was near, the stories I was hearing forever changed my own perceptions. I am a real big Beatles fan. But, I am not a fan of there early work. That is not the part that relates this to GNR. When things became clear the Axl wanted their sound to grow and evolve, I got real excited. I got excited because that is what the Beatles did, and did it collectively. The sound that came from them really moves and touches me in ways I cant really describe. Now, for GNR to risk everything and go into new realms, is the fucking shit. It takes balls. The UYI at the very least, shows that there is somthing so much more they could be doing. There was mass experimenting there, and I feel they might have been really onto something. Maybe they could have ushered in something completely new and innovated.

But it quickly became clear that only Axl was willing to take the next step. I still dig Slash. He is one of the greats. But I don't respect him as much as I would had he decided to evolve into someone greater. Jimi Hendrix for years played backup electric guitar. But Jimi was a genius and a beast and he thrived to go as far as he could with the music. Jimi had drive. That is what makes Hendrix so relevant today and respected. Axl has this drive. The Beatles had this drive. But GNR collectively didn't, and I fucking hate that Slash and Duff couldnt see the bigger picture. We sure as shit would have had some new GNR we could have been enjoying right now had Slash and Duff decided to step outside there box.

I respect Axl more for following this vision. And although VR was kind of fun, it didnt move me at all. It was run of the mill R&R. For that, it is cool. But that is all it is. And that is all Slash and Duff want to be. They are in a safe place, and they deserve a shit load of props for the music they helped create, and for still being in a popular band. But their music isnt changing shit. Its not here to kick you in the face and show you what music could be. Not like what Appetite first did. Its giving you what you already now. They played it safe. Axl never played it safe...never.

I'm not trying to jump on your band wagon Buddha Master, but your post to me is exactly the way I see it too. I couldnt have put that any differently. I opened this thread to have my say and then I got to your post and once I had read I thought there is no point in duplicating it! Well said and yes the Beatles later stuff was fantastic!

[Farmer]

Man, I know some people will say "Fuck him!" for what I'll say, but I'll try anyways

For me there are several controversial points

1. Does the band exist? How can you say - this is Guns N' Roses - when all they did was release one song. BUT....They toured and though played mostly old songs and proved that they can "play the shit out of the old songs". (I don't believe in this concept of "farewell-to-old-songs-tour", let's face it they had these 5-6 songs, some of em pretty raw - SW, Rhiad, some almost ready, and that was all....no album, no 70 songs, nothing). I do not doubt the high potential of the band, but there's no band. It's not a band in normal meaning of this word, this is more like a virtual band. Finally, does a normal band act like this band does to its fans? We don't know shit about what's goin' on. Its fine with Axl, but other"band"members could say something different from "it's almost done. coming soon. worth the wait.blablabla"
2. People who bash Slash and other ex-bandmembers are just immature. How can you say "Slash is shit, Duff is shit, everybody except Axl is shit"? How? These people have written the music that we love, that unites us, that makes us happy. How can you deny something that brings joy to you?Would you? And when somebody says the thing that I said before (that each bandmember played its part in the overall success of the band), these people make a perfect theory to justify themselves - "Axl did all the work, hes the only genius in this band". You know whats this called like?. Double talkin' jive motherfucker!

Thank you.

Peace

[Farmer]

guess I had this feeling where when I first joined or checked gnr websites there was this huge love for buckethead, and he was the next big thing and everyone seemed to look at him as the best of the three players, and now I see such a dislike towards him (not by all, just some) like he was never part of the band, yet he has basically contributed as much as many others (being we've only seen the live gigs).

This is fucking human nature, Mike


P.S. Sorry for the 2nd straight post

[Hammy]

though afd startin to sound poor

Crazy Bastard! Give it long enough and all the old GN'R albums will start sounding poor

NOT, it's he same as the techincal old black-white vhs-quality it's annoyingly not up to the standards

But the songs are good

What makes them so good is the raw 'unpolished' sound, i would not want it polished and tampered with so it sounded as good as today's standards, as for black/white some of the greatest films are and they are great because of the quality of the script the depth within' it there is such a thing as being too good, films these days have great special effects but suck from the story point of view.............go watch Gone With The Wind or It's A Wonderful Life........[seems i went a little off topic]

[norway]

as for black/white some of the greatest films are and they are great because of the quality of the script the depth within' it there is such a thing as being too good, films these days have great special effects but suck from the story point of view.............

Never said the films wasn't good, had good stories and stuff-
-but looking at the pic is annoying, the blurred image, unwanted colors, spots etc

same with afd, it's very good and the songs are amazing, but the sound is starting to degenerate, it's a bit poor
when you listen to the standards in soundproduction 2day,

they should remaster it i like listening 2 it on lp though

[ppbebe]

Nevertheless, I like this band the best. I feel their potential through their sounds and I love it.
What can I do?

I?m not always a singer-fan. For example I prefer the Edge to Bono.

I'm not sure they're "anti old band", they're just not fans of the ex-members post-GN'R work.
Just like there are fans of the ex-members who'll do anything to discredit Axl...........

Yep. 
I don't think new fans bash the ex-members.
Then again, of course, honour bright I defend my fav band against those who do everything to discredit them.

By the way and the other way round, is there anyone in support of just VR who hasn?t been a diehard fan of old school GNR or STP around? It would be quite interesting if any.