Instrument Thrashing - A Question

[Mattman]

Okay, so you read all the time about bands like The Who and Nirvana that became famous with a live act that featured them breaking their instruments at the end of a show.  Fine, but here's my question: if you're in an unsigned, unknown band, how can you possibly afford to buy a new guitar for every show?  Kurt Cobain lived under a bridge in Seattle in the late 80s...where did he find the money to afford a new guitar for each concert?

[Chris Misfit]

I doubt he did it when he was poor.


Tre Cool (Greenday) always fucks up him drumset because he has a sponsorship coontract with a Drum making firm, and can get a new set whenever he wants.

Or you could do what the Damned do, borrow a kit and then destroy it. Whoops.

[Walk]

Bands like Nirvana and the Who did that just to get attention, despite their lack of any talent. Real musicians with real, quality instruments would never do that. Punk/Garage kids with cheap guitars do that, and it's stupid.

Great guitars are expensive, and just destroying them like that says a lot about a band's mentality.

[jarmo]

The Who had no talent? 


Anyway, as far as I remember, Kurt used to smash a cheap guitar at the end of the show.... Not his real instrument.





/jarmo

[Walk]

Beatles were decent pop, Clapton and Hendrix were the guitar gods, the Rolling Stones and Deep Purple were good, plain, rock and roll, and the Who were the guys all the despressed kids listened to.  I can't figure out what's so great about them at all. Besides, blowing a pair of speakers at 120 decibals is much more impressive than breaking a cheap fake guitar. 

[kj_jive]

Pete Townshend said that they used to steal the equipment from the local music store before they got big.  They had a friend who worked there and they'd just run in and grab guitars off the wall.  And yes, they did used to smash their instruments up before they were famous.  The first time they ever did it was at a small club gig.  Pete accidently broke the neck of his guitar on a low ceiling and then destroyed it in anger.  Keith soon followed suit

Oh and Walk.....nevermind its not even worth it.

[Walk]

Hendrix's fire rituals were so much more meaningful than bashing the instrument like a caveman's club.

[kj_jive]

okay.....

What did they mean then?

[Eugene Klein]

According to Nirvana's first manager, Cobain never used to destroy his gear until some Halloween party in '88. Kurt got excited and smashed the guitar. The manager got mad at Cobain because they couldn't afford a better gear.
The victim: a Univox Hi- Flyer late sixties model.

[kj_jive]

Again, what is this "statement" that Hendrix made when he set it on fire? And don't act like there's a shortage of guitars or anything.  You can get a guitar anywhere you want.  I like when bands smash up their stuff at the end of a good show.  It's rock and roll.  Who cares if they break their instruments...you're not footing the bill.  Hendrix setting his guitar on fire is no different than smashing it up...they both are broken.  And Cobain smashing his equipment cause he didn't know how to use it...gimme a break. The man could play well enough, you don't need to be able to speed pick and play the national anthem behind your back to be a good guitarist...just writing a good song and playing it well is all it takes.

[Butch Français]

Anyway, Cobain probably smashed guitars and amps because he didn't know how to use them. Best way to create sound out of an instrument when you can not play it is probably smashing it. I don't know. I can play guitar. And I would never smash one, no matter if cheap or expensive.

damn right, I get angry every time I see it!

[SisterMorphine]

Bands like Nirvana and the Who did that just to get attention, despite their lack of any talent. Real musicians with real, quality instruments would never do that. Punk/Garage kids with cheap guitars do that, and it's stupid.

Great guitars are expensive, and just destroying them like that says a lot about a band's mentality.

 
The Who had no talent? Yeah, that Entwistle was a real slacker on bass! etc. etc.
Also, fuck, what, eighteen months of auto-destruction in a forty-year career? Wow. Great albums like Sell Out and Who's Next -how do they rely on auto-destruction? Or do they - gasp - stand up on their own merits?

Also:

Townshend did smash cheap guitars, and they were stuck up back again anyway. Besides, I remember a quote that went something like this: "Some fool in the Bee Gees asked if I'd smash up a Stradivarius. Of course I wouldn't, but something off of a production line? Fuck it, why not?"

It's always arrogant twats who make these stupid statements like the Who "had no talent" - the same kinda guy who'd dismiss the Beatles' thirteen-album, world changing, music-revolutionising, ever-evolving output as "decent pop". Wow, he's said it, so it must be true! The avant-garde Tomorrow Never Knows, the early world music fusion Within You Without You,? the arguably metal-inventing noisefest Helter Skelter - all just "decent pop" a la She Loves You, in one handy-dandy bluffer's party line!
 

The truth is: there was an artistic point, however misguided, in the Who's "rite" of auto-destruction" - look up an artist called Gustav Metzler, whom Townshend studied under. It's just a futile, stupid fucking gesture when Nirvana or the Vines or whomever do it, however. It's been done.

People decrying destroying guitars is the same as the people decrying that rock n' roll itself was the destruction of music, or that electrifying guitar notes was anti-music. People experiment, sometimes it doesn't work. So what. It was fucking exciting and made a point in the beginning of the "built-in obsolesence" culture of the sixties.


You might disagree with it.

But to say the Who had a lack of talent is fucking stupid. End of story. For my part, anyway. See ya.

[Is he struggling?]

Townshend did smash cheap guitars, and they were stuck up back again anyway. Besides, I remember a quote that went something like this: "Some fool in the Bee Gees asked if I'd smash up a Stradivarius. Of course I wouldn't, but something off of a production line? Fuck it, why not?"

The truth is: there was an artistic point, however misguided, in the Who's "rite" of auto-destruction" - look up an artist called Gustav Metzler, whom Townshend studied under. It's just a futile, stupid fucking gesture when Nirvana or the Vines or whomever do it, however. It's been done.

I'm sure I've seen Townshend trashing a  Les Paul on more than one occasion (something which should be punishible under law, IMO). Also, according to Roger Daltery, The Who's instrument Trashing had more to do with thier speed intake than anything else.

  Fine, but here's my question: if you're in an unsigned, unknown band, how can you possibly afford to buy a new guitar for every show?  Kurt Cobain lived under a bridge in Seattle in the late 80s...where did he find the money to afford a new guitar for each concert?

On one early tour of Europe, Cobain used to piece together his smashed guitar from the night before in preparation for the next show.

Hendrix : once, back in 1967 (mind the date and occasion)
 After that, no one should have ever smashed a guitar again, cause it's all been said and done when it comes to that. So when Cobain did that, twenty years later, it was just silly and pointless.? ?

Point is: I think trashing music instruments makes no sense (anymore). If it's fun for you, go ahead, trash all your guitars. But don't expect people like me to think that it's cool or rock and roll - cause it's all been done before by better musicians. Last thing I wanna see in a concert in 2004 is someone smashing his guitar.

Amen, Brother! When it is done now by the likes of Craig Nicholls or Matt Bellamy, it comes accross as a desperate attempt to come accross as anti-establishment or anti-materialistic.  Or  in broad terms, just, like soooooo nihilistic and anarchic, man. Yawn.


Regarding Hendrix at MOnterrey, I'm not sure he actually intended to smash his Strat in the normal way. Look closely at his swinging motion as he starts beating the guitar against the floor after letting it burn for a few seconds (which was of course, wholly intentional and pre-meditated, hence the lighter fluid and matches in is pocket). It looks like he is trying to put the flames out. Its only after about twenty seconds or so that he swinging the guitar with the intention of breaking it. (Although it doesn't take a lot of common sense to realise that a guitar that has been engulfed in flames isn't going to be much use to anyone).

[Acquiesce]

Bands like Nirvana and the Who did that just to get attention, despite their lack of any talent. Real musicians with real, quality instruments would never do that. Punk/Garage kids with cheap guitars do that, and it's stupid.

Great guitars are expensive, and just destroying them like that says a lot about a band's mentality.

I know many have corrected you already, but I still can't understand what you mean by the Who had no talent? John Entwistle was the greatest bass player. Keith Moon was one of the top two drummers (along with Bonham). Pete is undoubtedly one of the great guitar players. Roger Daltrey is one of the best rock singers.

As far as pure musicianship goes, the Who are tops. They are also widely considered the best live band of all the time. The pure raw energy and superior musicianship of their shows is unmatched. Even today, while missing 2 members they are still putting on one hell of a show!

Back to the original topic, the Who were broke until they released Tommy. I've heard part of the reason they didn't have any money was because of the constant destruction of their equipment.

Pete has admitted he did it for the attention. He felt a rock n roll show was more than just music. He put on one hell of a show.

[kj_jive]

Back to the original topic, the Who were broke until they released Tommy.

yeah right...

[Acquiesce]

They were. They had big financial problems before they released Tommy. The Who never sold nearly as many albums as  their contemporaries (Stones, Beatles, etc) so money was a bigger issue for them than it was for most. Heck, even The Beatles had money troubles at one point due to the insane taxes on the rich in Britain at the time.

[kj_jive]

I'll agree that they didn't sell as many as the stones/beatles, however....

"Once the Who appeared on the television program Ready, Steeady, Go, the single [I Can't Explain] shot up the charts and became a sensation.  I Can't Explain reached the British Top Ten followed that summer by Anyway, Anyhow, Anywhere.  That fall, My Gerneration claimbed all the way to number two on the charts, confirming the band's status as British pop phenomenons.  An album of the same name followed at the end of the year, and early in 1966, Substitute became their fouth British Top Ten Hit.

Upon its 1966 release, A Quick One became another British hit.  In America, the group was ignored until A quick One was retitled Happy Jack and its title track reached the Top 40 in 1967.  The album freatured I Can See for Miles which became the group's first Top Ten Hit in America.  That year, the group also appeared a t the Monterey Pop Festival.-Music.msn.com

[N.I.B]

Anyway, Cobain probably smashed guitars and amps because he didn't know how to use them. Best way to create sound out of an instrument when you can not play it is probably smashing it. I don't know. I can play guitar. And I would never smash one, no matter if cheap or expensive.

damn right, I get angry every time I see it!

i admit it makes a good show, but if u bought a cheap, 200 dollar fender if u had millions and mllions, wouldnt u break it once in a while, just to have some fun?

[Butch Français]

Anyway, Cobain probably smashed guitars and amps because he didn't know how to use them. Best way to create sound out of an instrument when you can not play it is probably smashing it. I don't know. I can play guitar. And I would never smash one, no matter if cheap or expensive.

damn right, I get angry every time I see it!

i admit it makes a good show, but if u bought a cheap, 200 dollar fender if u had millions and mllions, wouldnt u break it once in a while, just to have some fun?

maybe if I was drunk, but otherwise, I would give it away to a kid in the street and tell him to learn to play!