Billboard paints rock/rap divide as racial

[Mattman]

I was perusing the Billboard Modern Rock Singles chart today, and I couldn't help but notice that "Triple Trouble" by The Beastie Boys is on there.? Now, "Triple Trouble" is a pretty lame song.? But besides that, the thing about it is that it's a true rap song in every sense of the term.? There's no loud guitars or drums, no singing.? Just rapping over extremely spare and minimal beats.? There is nothing rock about this song.? So why is it on the Modern Rock chart?? The same thing happened a few months ago, when "Ch-Check It Out" wound up on the Modern Rock chart, and my local rock radio station was playing it too.? Both those songs are total rap.? So why do they often get perceived as rock?'

The answer is simple: because the Beastie Boys are white.? In the 80s, they used to be basically a rock band without melody, which was cool in songs like "Fight For Your Right To Party", where they used electric guitar and could be called rock.? Run-DMC were the same way.? But the Beasties are now more experimental and the beats on the new album are almost entirely just drumbeats, maybe? a quiet bassline ever now and then.? It's pure rap.? But because the Beasties are white, they can get on the Rock chart as well.

Think of other rap songs in the last few years that have had more of a rock influence.? Nelly's "#1", P. Diddy's "Bad Boy For Life".? These songs had more of a rock influence than any of the Beastie Boys' latest songs: Joe Perry's guitar on "#1", Dave Navarro's guitar and Travis Barker's drums on P. Diddy's track.? But I didn't see either of those on the Modern Rock chart.? It makes me think that racial divides are more prevalent than we think in the categorization of music.? A great band like The Roots play their own instruments, but you won't see them on the Modern Rock charts, just the Rap charts.? Because they're black?? And I think I once saw Eminem on the Modern Rock charts with "Lose Yourself" or something like that.? WTF?? How is he more rock than certain other rappers out there?? He isn't - he's more white, and thus more Modern Rock, according to Billboard.

[Booker Floyd]

The radio stations are mostly responsible for this...Ive heard the likes of House Of Pain, Eminem, and the Beastie Boys on rock radio for years.  Its obviously about race...rock radio has a white audience that usually likes rap when its done by white people - Eminem and Beastie Boys in particular. 

However, black people generally dont like the Beastie Boys.  So Im highly doubtful youll hear their singles on rap radio, or see rap fans (black or white) buying their albums, beause they appeal largely to white "alternative" rock fans.  Eminem has much more of a crossover appeal, so his single will get play on both rap and rock radio.

But thats radio, and as we all know, radio is incredibly lame.

[MadmanDan]

This is totally wrong,but I bet that albums sell better this way. White rockers are more likely to buy Beastie Boys' albums than black rappers. I think that black people have a much worse opinion about white people than whites about blacks

[Booker Floyd]

I think that black people have a much worse opinion about white people than whites about blacks

 

Id keep that thought to myself if I were you...

[MadmanDan]

I think that black people have a much worse opinion about white people than whites about blacks

 

Id keep that thought to myself if I were you...

Why? That wasn't a racist remark.

[2NaFish]

I think that black people have a much worse opinion about white people than whites about blacks

 

Id keep that thought to myself if I were you...

Why? That wasn't a racist remark.

I agree with you on this point, although alot of people are gonna have a naturally over-PC attitude to this in typical reactionary style.

The simple fact is that alot of white teens buy black made music (50 cent, usher, snoop) - how many black kids do you see rocking out to Velvet Revolver?

[Acquiesce]

I think that black people have a much worse opinion about white people than whites about blacks

 

Id keep that thought to myself if I were you...

I think he brings up an interesting point, at least where music is concerned. I live in an area where rap is fairly huge. Plenty of white people listen to rap with no problem. However, I've seen a small handful of black people who listened to rock and they are generally shunned by the other black people around here. I've seen then make fun of them, call them white, and even refuse to associate with them. It is as if? black person who likes "white" music is a freak of nature and there is something wrong listening to rock music.

[Booker Floyd]

I think he brings up an interesting point, at least where music is concerned. I live in an area where rap is fairly huge. Plenty of white people listen to rap with no problem. However, I've seen a small handful of black people who listened to rock and they are generally shunned by the other black people around here. I've seen then make fun of them, call them white, and even refuse to associate with them. It is as if? black person who likes "white" music is a freak of nature and there is something wrong listening to rock music.

If the context was musical, then hes right.  White people are notoriously more infatuated with black music than blacks are with white music.

However, I didnt see that context.  I saw an oversimplified, general statement...If it was meant musically, then okay.

[MadmanDan]

Yeah,I meant musically,but the more I think about it,I think it's even more than that.Some white people also dress and act like black people. Black people have more pride and personality when it comes to these things.

[N.I.B]

there was this black kid who madeled all "white" music as antichrist. and about that remark Acquiesce made, Jimi is a ledgend. What colour is he? What about Phil Lynott from Thin Lizzy? Lenny Kravitz. All these rockers have one thing in common. Can anyone connect the dots?

[liquidvirus]

wow! since when has the skin of a musician come to decide who can listen to their music ?

[Mattman]

wow! since when has the skin of a musician come to decide who can listen to their music ?

Probably back in the 30s and 40s when blues songs and stuff were put out under the genre "race records".

Sometimes I think that music is more segregated now than it was in the 50s.  Then both black and white teenagers danced to music by both black and white artists.  That was the initial thing that was great about rock 'n' roll...everyone listened to it, regardless of colour.  But now today, most rock artists are white, and most rap artists are black (why else would people still be making a big deal out of the fact that Eminem is a white rapper?).  Even though the big market for rap is white suburban teenagers, there's still a certain mockery of white people who "act black".  Or the other way around...as Barak Obama said, there's something wrong about "a society where a black kid with a book is said to be acting white".

[youngerformofaxl]

So, does eminem's singles could put into the rock Category?

It has to do with that the Beastie Boys have had songs that have had rocks beat to them. So, they've been put into that category based on their past mucic not on their race.

[Chris Misfit]

It has to do with that the Beastie Boys have had songs that have had rocks beat to them. So, they've been put into that category based on their past mucic not on their race.

Beastie Boys were a hardcore band before hip hop. See track 2 of Ill Cumminication.

[Booker Floyd]

It has to do with that the Beastie Boys have had songs that have had rocks beat to them. So, they've been put into that category based on their past mucic not on their race.

Read the first post - their new single, "Triple Trouble," is distinctly "un-rock".  In fact, it has the same beat as rap tracks such as Sugarhill Gnags "Rappers Delight" and Def Squads remake...yet youll never see those songs on the rock charts.

[axls_locomotive]

Probably back in the 30s and 40s when blues songs and stuff were put out under the genre "race records".

Sometimes I think that music is more segregated now than it was in the 50s.  Then both black and white teenagers danced to music by both black and white artists.  That was the initial thing that was great about rock 'n' roll...everyone listened to it, regardless of colour. 

im not so sure that is true...sure rock and roll got the attention of blacks as well as whites but there was still a divide...and there were many people who opposed rock and roll...the record companies of the 40/50s, just like today, were happy to pump society full of the same music year in year out...when rock and roll appeared, corporations tried hard to get rid of it and played the race card...but they couldnt stop it

i dont think blacks know how to rock and roll anymore...i hope thats not the case

[Acquiesce]

there was this black kid who madeled all "white" music as antichrist. and about that remark Acquiesce made, Jimi is a ledgend. What colour is he? What about Phil Lynott from Thin Lizzy? Lenny Kravitz. All these rockers have one thing in common. Can anyone connect the dots?

Did you totally miss the point of my post? I'm saying in my general experience black people don't seem to be as accepting to rock music because they consider it to be "white" music.

In fact, I think it's interesting you mention these black rock musicians because I'm sure the majority of their fans are white which further illustrates my point.

[KeVoRkIaN]

I never understood the divide - many white people like black artists and black people won't accept white artists at all for the most part...... I have thought about this often - it is puzzling....;

[Walk]

Big deal. Billboard has had a pop/rock chart going on for years, even though the genres are nothing alike. Let them say rap and rock are the same, it isn't any worse than what they have been doing for ages now anyway. Most "rock" music is just pop music with a little rock influence anyway.

All the great talent doesn't need a chart to measure greatness.

[N.I.B]

there was this black kid who madeled all "white" music as antichrist. and about that remark Acquiesce made, Jimi is a ledgend. What colour is he? What about Phil Lynott from Thin Lizzy? Lenny Kravitz. All these rockers have one thing in common. Can anyone connect the dots?

In fact, I think it's interesting you mention these black rock musicians because I'm sure the majority of their fans are white which further illustrates my point.

Exactly my point.