Fall to Pieces

[dave-gnfnr2k]

I am not avoiding anything, the only thing I am avoiding is the child like name calling and bashing that people like booker are doing.  There is no point in name calling back or arguing with people like that.  He and the others that do that can bash and name call all they want but they are looking like the idiot for doing it not me.


Like I have said so many times before I find it funny that I am not being objective yet others like booker, falcon etc are? That makes no sense to me. OH I know its because they like VR songs and I don't.
Well people you really need to look back when VR was looking for a singer since I said they should pick Scott.
Oh but I am sure most of you just happened to forget that point.

The funny thing is, the people that like to bash me do it because they can't argue with my points/opinions.
Instead of attacking me why not discuss the things I am talking about?
I am sorry if the VR songs are mediocre, and I am not the only one that thinks that.
Furthermore, its funny that booker and the rest can talk about how much they don?t like the new gnr or some of their songs and that is fine yet when I do it to VR its not ok and I should shut up. LOL
I just love how VR/slash fans show their true colors when people don?t like their work.  Yes I am a huge  Axl fan but the thing is there are just as big slash fans here too yet its ok for them to be that big of a fan (ie booker) yet its never ok for the huge axl fans.  That is kinda fucked up logic don't ya think?
Keep up the work guys, you are doing great.

So people like booker can bash me all they want but it wont change the fact that I don?t think VR songs are very good.

[slashedguns]

I am not avoiding anything, the only thing I am avoiding is the child like name calling and bashing that people like booker are doing.  There is no point in name calling back or arguing with people like that.  He and the others that do that can bash and name call all they want but they are looking like the idiot for doing it not me.


Like I have said so many times before I find it funny that I am not being objective yet others like booker, falcon etc are? That makes no sense to me. OH I know its because they like VR songs and I don't.
Well people you really need to look back when VR was looking for a singer since I said they should pick Scott.
Oh but I am sure most of you just happened to forget that point.

The funny thing is, the people that like to bash me do it because they can't argue with my points/opinions.
Instead of attacking me why not discuss the things I am talking about?
I am sorry if the VR songs are mediocre, and I am not the only one that thinks that.
Furthermore, its funny that booker and the rest can talk about how much they don?t like the new gnr or some of their songs and that is fine yet when I do it to VR its not ok and I should shut up. LOL
I just love how VR/slash fans show their true colors when people don?t like their work.  Yes I am a huge  Axl fan but the thing is there are just as big slash fans here too yet its ok for them to be that big of a fan (ie booker) yet its never ok for the huge axl fans.  That is kinda fucked up logic don't ya think?
Keep up the work guys, you are doing great.

So people like booker can bash me all they want but it wont change the fact that I don?t think VR songs are very good.

Keep posting dave,your nearly up to 3000

[Acquiesce]

I don't know how many times I've seen Slash, Duff, Izzy etc fans making fun of Axl fans and then they worship the ground their hero walks on. It's all the same....

You are correct that there are similarities in both sides, but like I said Dave is completely different from anyone on either side. I don't mind that he doesn't like the songs, but it's just silly to constantly have the need to compare them to Axl. It would be one thing if he was saying "you know, I really gave VR a chance but they are not my cup of tea." I think everyone could respect something along those lines. Instead, he just sounds like a child saying "haha my hero is better than yours." It's just silly.

Maybe this is my bias speaking, but I do see a clear difference between Dave and the VR fans. The difference is that we don't feel the constant need to compare their songs to Axl's  to make Axl look inferior to them. It would be pointless and silly to do that. Just because someone thinks one is better it doesn't mean the other isn't good. It's also silly because they are two different bands. Not to mention they aren't even on a level playing field because one hasn't finished their album yet.

Dave and others would be completely flipping out if we went over to the GNR board to make Axl look inferior to VR.

I would really love to hear Dave's honest opinions if he would just drop the silly comparisons.

What? Where?  

The little potshot against VR. I'm not sure why it was included in the reply to my post.  

[jarmo]

Dave and others would be completely flipping out if we went over to the GNR board to make Axl look inferior to VR.

I don't know if you read the GN'R section, but it sure gets its fair share of that kind of posts.

You say VR fans don't do what Dave is doing?

How about "At least VR has a record coming out"? Which is basically making Contraband good thing just because it's coming out. I'd rather wait until I hear it before I start calling the album good, great or bad.

Oh, and the biggest Slash or Duff fansmight not even post on this board....

The little potshot against VR. I'm not sure why it was included in the reply to my post.  

Nothing to do with your post. Just an observation.


/jarmo

[dave-gnfnr2k]

I don't know how many times I've seen Slash, Duff, Izzy etc fans making fun of Axl fans and then they worship the ground their hero walks on. It's all the same....

You are correct that there are similarities in both sides, but like I said Dave is completely different from anyone on either side. I don't mind that he doesn't like the songs, but it's just silly to constantly have the need to compare them to Axl. It would be one thing if he was saying "you know, I really gave VR a chance but they are not my cup of tea." I think everyone could respect something along those lines. Instead, he just sounds like a child saying "haha my hero is better than yours." It's just silly.

Maybe this is my bias speaking, but I do see a clear difference between Dave and the VR fans. The difference is that we don't feel the constant need to compare their songs to Axl's  to make Axl look inferior to them. It would be pointless and silly to do that. Just because someone thinks one is better it doesn't mean the other isn't good. It's also silly because they are two different bands. Not to mention they aren't even on a level playing field because one hasn't finished their album yet.

Dave and others would be completely flipping out if we went over to the GNR board to make Axl look inferior to VR.

I would really love to hear Dave's honest opinions if he would just drop the silly comparisons.

What? Where?  

The little potshot against VR. I'm not sure why it was included in the reply to my post.  

Girl Gunner,  you do read the gnr boards right?
Axl is always getting bashed over there and so is bh, and robin etc etc.
Also how many times has BH and Finck been compared to slash over there by the VR fans?
So I really dont see what you are getting at.

[Acquiesce]

How about "At least VR has a record coming out"? Which is basically making Contraband good thing just because it's coming out. I'd rather wait until I hear it before I start calling the album good, great or bad.

I don't think they are trying to say that automatically makes Contraband a good record. I think they are trying to say that at the very least they are capable of releasing a record.

Girl Gunner,  you do read the gnr boards right?
Axl is always getting bashed over there and so is bh, and robin etc etc.
Also how many times has BH and Finck been compared to slash over there by the VR fans?
So I really dont see what you are getting at.

I don't pay as much attention to that board anymore, but I am aware of the type of posts would go on there. What I'm saying is that you won't see people running over saying things like "Falling To Pieces is so much better than Madagascar" or "Slither blows Chinese Democracy out of the water," and starting threads to prove GNR is inferior. Maybe, I'm wrong though.

There is a difference in comparing Buckethead and Finck to Slash than comparing the two bands. Slash was one time a member of Guns N Roses. These guys were/are his replacements. It's no different from comparing Steven to Matt or Izzy to Gilby.

Besides, even if VR fans are behaving childish it doesn't make it right for either side to do it.

Seriously Dave, I'd really like to hear your honest opinions without comparing it to Axl/GNR. What do you dislike about each track? Is there anything you like about any of the tracks?

[Falcon]

Like I have said so many times before I find it funny that I am not being objective yet others like booker, falcon etc are? That makes no sense to me. OH I know its because they like VR songs and I
don't.

No, it's not because you don't like VR songs, that's just silly.

It's the way you voice your dislike for them in a combative manor, by saying things that are bound to draw fire (not intellegent discussion) like "The Blues blows away such and such" or "Maddy is so much better than whatnot" or "Axl doesn't have anything to worry about" mumbo jumbo.  By the mere comparisons you're objectivity will be in question due to the fact everyone knows your allegiance to Axl and your disgust for everything old band member related.  Honestly, each and every board member knew exactly what your opinions would be before you ever even posted, history proves that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I'm not bashing you Dave, just an opinion on why your objectivity is constantly questioned.

[Lineker10]

Dave people attack you not becasue your an Axl fan but becasue you follow up criticism of VR (which your entitled to do) with....Not as good as newGn'R/The Blues or Axls better etc. What has that got to do with wether you like VR or not? All you have to say is - i dont like it becasue i dont like the lyrics or the guitar isnt to my liking - then mabye people would take your opinions with respect.

[chas]

Well i downloaded FTP and listened to it a couple of times last night, i just had to know what VR's answer to Madagascar and The Blues sounded like.

The song is very good, i like the melody and i also like Scotts singing. The song will do well in the charts, but does not hold a candle to Blues or Maddy. Fact of the matter is im not surprised even though the song was very hyped up, i never expected VR to be able to come up with ballads or 'mid-tempo' songs that were as good as Axl's.

On the other hand i find Slither to be a very good song, i think its the type of song that GnR will have problems coming up with. Its Slash's simple yet catchy riffs make SMF and Slither so good, they are the kind of songs that make a mediocre album good or a good album great.

I'll obviously buy the album when its released, so i reserve my final judgement till then.

P.S      I have made comparisons between VR and GnR because it is inevitable when posting in the VR section of a GnR site.

[slashedguns]

Like I have said so many times before I find it funny that I am not being objective yet others like booker, falcon etc are? That makes no sense to me. OH I know its because they like VR songs and I
don't.

No, it's not because you don't like VR songs, that's just silly.

It's the way you voice your dislike for them in a combative manor, by saying things that are bound to draw fire (not intellegent discussion) like "The Blues blows away such and such" or "Maddy is so much better than whatnot" or "Axl doesn't have anything to worry about" mumbo jumbo.  By the mere comparisons you're objectivity will be in question due to the fact everyone knows your allegiance to Axl and your disgust for everything old band member related.  Honestly, each and every board member knew exactly what your opinions would be before you ever even posted, history proves that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I'm not bashing you Dave, just an opinion on why your objectivity is constantly questioned.

Well said,,for example Dave,your posts Judging by the VR bootleg,Axl has nothing to worry about and Boycott Contraband. No one is worried about what the other does except you

[madagas]

Falcon, please name the influential acts you are talking about because the Cult sure isn't one of them. And, yes, Gnr overall, are far more critically acclaimed than the Cult. I have never in any poll of greatest albums seen the Cult mentioned-anywhere, alternative press-mainstream press etc. Yes, record sales do matter to a degree. In my opinion, sales plus critical acclaim make you on a higher plain so to say. If cutting edge to you is modern rock and trash like Good Charlotte and Blink and the Foo Fighters and other shit that is played on modern rock radio, then I guess I'm happy with Axl being lumped in with Zep, and the Who and the Stones. If your wondering what I listen to outside of Gnr: is Bob Dylan influential enough for you..or Miles Davis...or Iggy Pop or Radiohead or Hank Williams or U2 or Johnny Cash. Actual   true innovators, not wannabes. If you weren't so damn arrogant and full of shit, I would leave you alone.... ps 1. Close minded is listening to only one type of music or one style of music and constantly putting down other things besides what you like. 2. Axl doesn't have to EVER record another song. His legend is secure just as Rotten's was with his one influential album. Axl is of that stature whereas I would consider Weiland and Astbury as great, but not top shelf so to say. And maybe, just maybe, Axl didn't want to put out four or five albums of inferior product over the last decade, just to make a buck. Maybe he is trying to actually make a truly great record and firmly establish himself as an artist and not just a "rocker". To me, he has never sold out and that is respectable.

[Dizzy]

Btw I thought slash HATED playing ballads, guess that is just another lie eh?

Nope.  It's another example of Dave taking something Slash said out of context in the interest of bashing him.

Slash said he got bored playing EPIC songs, not ballads.  He stated very clearly that he liked playing songs that were fast paced because he got bored playing long, drawn out epic songs.  The fact that the epic songs were ballads was coincidental.  He said he used to hate playing "Sweet Child o Mine" because it was a hard and repetitive riff to play, not because it was a ballad.

He did say that he liked "Patience", and said many times that he was proud of "Estranged".

[Falcon]

Falcon, please name the influential acts you are talking about because the Cult sure isn't one of them.

If you're not familar with their pedigree, it my behoove you to do a little research about the post punk and gothic rock movements, you might learn something.  See who's credited with coining the term "goth", it'll surprise you...

If cutting edge to you is modern rock and trash like Good Charlotte and Blink and the Foo Fighters

I dig the Foos, a hard working band that has great singles, solid albums and tours their ass off.  

 If your wondering what I listen to outside of Gnr...

I wasn't.

If you weren't so damn arrogant and full of shit, I would leave you alone....

 

ps 1. Close minded is listening to only one type of music or one style of music and constantly putting down other things besides what you like. 2. Axl doesn't have to EVER record another song. His legend is secure just as Rotten's was with his one influential album. Axl is of that stature whereas I would consider Weiland and Astbury as great, but not top shelf so to say. And maybe, just maybe, Axl didn't want to put out four or five albums of inferior product over the last decade, just to make a buck. Maybe he is trying to actually make a truly great record and firmly establish himself as an artist and not just a "rocker". To me, he has never sold out and that is respectable.

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it.



 

[madagas]

I am very familiar with the Cult's "pedigree"-believe me. I actually grew up-late teens early twenties-during that period. Heard it, seen it, done it. How about you? Your what-25 or 26 maybe? I can tell by some of the concerts you claim to have went to. Listen, you are obviously a bright guy-level headed and consistent in your arguments and beliefs. Just lose the attitude and arrogance. The alternative rock/modern rock cool was played way out in the 80's. Now, it is simply shit-of course unless you can find me better bands than REM, the Replacements, the Pixies, Sonic Youth, U2 etc on the radio today.

[Falcon]

I am very familiar with the Cult's "pedigree"-believe me.

Then why were you so quick to dismiss their relevence within the genres I mentioned?

How about you? Your what-25 or 26 maybe? I can tell by some of the concerts you claim to have went to.

A little bit older than that, but thanks though. I'm old enough to remember the Pistols playing the Cains Ballroom in Tulsa, OK (not old enough to get in though)...

The alternative rock/modern rock cool was played way out in the 80's.

I agree, when Nirvana broke in the fall of '91 the alternative became the mainstream.  However, the stereotypes still exist and radio formats and playlists are literally governed by them.

Did this whole thing get started by me saying I like SCOM and Edie?

Damn power ballads...

And for the record, I still don't like Fall To Pieces...

[madagas]

Nah, I just have always had a bug up my ass about alleged alternative rock. Go to college in Athens in 1986 and you will feel my pain. The thing is, I love the alternative scene, always have. I just like the dinosaurs as well and never understood what the difference was between REM and the Byrds or Gnr and Nirvana or The Stones and the Beatles. Always the same means to an end-guitar bass drums keys. Just wrapped in a different package and delivered by different personalties-some more likeable and cool, some more "difficult". In the end they were all saying the same thing. I'm on a crusade ..or I'm just bored because my wife is out of town.

[D]

no one does ballads better than axl

but no one comes up with heavy catchy riffs like slash

which is what made GNR the greatest band of all time

now we will have great axl ballads with mediocre guitar a la maddy and the blues  when i hear the blues its missing one element to make it a classic, thats a great guitar solo melody, thats where axl misses slash

same with VR only thing slither and set me free are missing is great lyrics and captivating vocals that only axl is capable of

so both sides will be weakened without the strengths every one brought to the gnr table

scott compares to axl like any gnr guitarist compares to slash

they are good, they are serviceable but not slash and no one can do what slash does, just like no one can do what axl does

[Doc Emmett Brown]

no one does ballads better than axl
but no one comes up with heavy catchy riffs like slash
which is what made GNR the greatest band of all time

ahhh!  Now you've gone and done it!  I'm back to missing the old band again!  

[jarmo]

no one does ballads better than axl

but no one comes up with heavy catchy riffs like slash

Where's Izzy? That guy wrote some really interesting songs.....  

Maybe you've even heard some of them?


/jarmo

[Mikkamakka]

no one does ballads better than axl

but no one comes up with heavy catchy riffs like slash

which is what made GNR the greatest band of all time

now we will have great axl ballads with mediocre guitar a la maddy and the blues  when i hear the blues its missing one element to make it a classic, thats a great guitar solo melody, thats where axl misses slash

same with VR only thing slither and set me free are missing is great lyrics and captivating vocals that only axl is capable of

so both sides will be weakened without the strengths every one brought to the gnr table

scott compares to axl like any gnr guitarist compares to slash

they are good, they are serviceable but not slash and no one can do what slash does, just like no one can do what axl does

You have expressed my feelings.