Do you think religion will eventually become extinct?

[TheOtherMember]

Kinda out there, but I'm a bit bored and wanted to start some sort of debate. Religion is usually the key to peoples heart, so...

Evidence clearly shows that religion is on the decline. A couple of hundred years ago it was a criminal offence not to go to church, and blasphemy was an offence until recently. Now, one of the biggest selling books of our time is a trilogy dedicated solely to ridiculing organised religion and, ultimately, killing god. (His Dark Materials.) We are living in an increasingly secular world.

I was wondering if any of you thought that, eventually - be it 200 years or 2000 from now - organised religion will no longer exist. I'm not going to say that people won't believe in some sort of 'God', but I do believe that people will cease to class themselves under the 'catholic' 'islamic' 'hindu' etc etc terminologies that they do today. I, as one who has seen a human's future as no more than "a handful of dust" for a few years not, consider this to be the logical progression for man. (cf Lyotard - french philosopher of the 70's...)

What do you lot think?

[Dizzy]

There will always be some questions about our own existence and mortality which we cannot answer.  So on that basis, some form of religion will always exist.

However, I'd predict that all of the religions we know of today will eventually wear thin and die, as have all other religions before them.

Thousands of years ago, people believed that gods controlled the moon, the sea, and the winds, among many other things.  But the ever-deepening rationality of Science resoundingly disproved them.

Science will continue to do just that.  Historically speaking, no religion has ever been able to stand up to Science, and Science will continue to obliterate all religions which cross its path.  It won't happen overnight, but eventually people will have to formulate new systems of belief which surround any unknowns that remain.

[Jessica]

I think that christianity is on the decline, yes.

Mainly, catholicism. When catholicism started, it excluded women.

It is important to stress that out, because in those times, in Palestine, in Rome, and in pagan worlds, women had religious power as well as political power. Women could be intellectuals, could posses land in their own names, could ask for divorce without consent, they could even baptize children.

Historians ( i can give you my sources) have now proved all this and the 1st popes did it on purpose.

In a world were women had become weak, and where men only could have power, men didn't hesitate in spreading the Virgin Mary lie ( ENORMOUS LIE) and the world became totally dominated.

You must think that women would never have bought the story, because they have always known what was the ONLY way to have a kid ( before sperm banks and cloning of course).

Women aside, it functionned for almost 2000 years.

Now that women have gained their individual liberties, now they work, now they are in control of their sexualities, now they don't get married as much, religion has not much meaning.

People will always need faith though. They need something to believe in. And i see nothing wrong with that.

What i see as wrong is deciding as to what God is simply on the word of men, what is wrong is making a gender weaker by law, what is wrong is killing millions of people in the name of 1 faith, what is wrong  is preaching about a God most preachers have never heard or seen in their lifetime ( whereas psychics fucking do).

According to the Fatima predictions, Catholicism will soon die out, and astill according to these predictions, it will come from the inside of their church.

Could it be because of pedophilia and the world seeing that a society of men only is wrong, probably.

On top of it, and i can give you all the sources, the whole catholic religion is based on a lie.

Jesus was never crucified, he was married, he had kids and has descendants today.

The saying goes :

When you build a castles on clouds, beware of the fall.

[lennonisgod]

"Do you think religion will eventually become extinct???"

We can only hope so.

[SLCPUNK]

No. Of course not.

[loretian]

I don't really think religion has declined very much at all, in fact, I'd say interest in it has increased in recent years.

Organized religion, at least the long standing traditional ones, may be giving way to other, more individual, spirituality focused religions, but it's still religion.

Besides, I believe in Christianity, and I don't think the truth will ever go away, even if people don't like it.

[Dizzy]

Besides, I believe in Christianity, and I don't think the truth will ever go away, even if people don't like it.

Even if you don't like it, Christianity is not the truth.  The word "truth" is defined as proven fact which cannot be refuted.  Christianity is far from that.

[axls_locomotive]

Besides, I believe in Christianity, and I don't think the truth will ever go away, even if people don't like it.

Even if you don't like it, Christianity is not the truth.  The word "truth" is defined as proven fact which cannot be refuted.  Christianity is far from that.

uhhh just because something cant be proven doesnt mean it cannot be true

im not religious but i do believe we are greater than the sum of our parts...religion has given us so much it would be a shame to see it die out...i dont believe it will as the world tends to go through cycles...we are quite near the top of this negative religious cycle but at some point i believe it will turn back...we always want things we dont have and human curiousity will always be there to bring it back.

Science and religion can coexist, there is no reason it cant, Einstein was very much religious as well as being the greatest scientist of the 20th century...


 

[Dizzy]

uhhh just because something cant be proven doesnt mean it cannot be true
 

Actually, that's exactly what it means.

From Webster's dictionary....

Truth (noun) something in accordance with facts; the state of being exact or correct.

Now ask yourself, does Christianity meet the above definition?

Of course it doesn't.  If Christianity were factual, it wouldn't be religion.  It would be history taught in schools, and nobody would worship it.

The point of religion is that it isn't truth, it's faith.  And those two items don't go hand in hand.  I don't have faith that the world is round.  I know the world is round because that is the proven truth.  Nobody knows that Jesus exists in an ethereal state, so that is not the truth.

Understand the difference?

[Prometheus]

Defination be gone! sayith the LORD....LOL. I have to agree with Axls there Dizz, Just because something cannot be proven doesnt mean its not true. Now before you try and throw a book at me over teh brodband hear me out. Is graviety true? Of course it is, was it true 5000 years ago? Yes  it was. Was it true to man at the time who had no concept of it? Of course it was. Becuase something is not proven cannot make it untrue, Truth is also defined as being what you beleive, "A statement proven to be or accepted as true." As the old adage goes, "as long as you beleive that it is true then it is true."

Personally im agnostic, Born and raised catholic. I see  so many other relgions that are .... more intuned to my understandings however they are still relgion.

Relgion it self will exist for many hundreds of years, perhaps even thousands of years (if we survie that long), However this is based on one of teh meanings of relgion, "A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion" hell by that that would mean science is a relgion.

and for once i have no real zeal for this discussion.....However...... i jsut read the prior posts again, it always amazes me how people like my parents can stan dup and preach at me over and over and over again that my choice is wrong, how my belief is wrong.

BTW Jessica, Oh how i love when you post, you always get my blood pumping Hook me up with your sources on the based on a lie stuff, I know ive heard it all b4 but i need a refresher. ohhhh and the virgin part i agree with you.. its BS, but you know its statsicly possible for a chick to get pregent simply from teh contact with sperm (if the sperm are retaredly great) to the outer vaginal opening

__________________________________________________________________

"Show me a man without sin, and ill show you a million sins that that man has made."
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Relgion, and its cannons are so......outdated. not to mention that alll relgions are sooooo contradictory. In one line they tell you to populate the earth and the next they tell you only with one person. they tell you  not to have too many children, then they tell you you cant use protection, as every sperm is sacred....

or my favorite, help out your fellow man, but get rid of all your belongins first. come one guy needs money, you threw it away....fa fack sakes.

[axls_locomotive]

uhhh just because something cant be proven doesnt mean it cannot be true
 

Actually, that's exactly what it means.

From Webster's dictionary....

Truth (noun) something in accordance with facts; the state of being exact or correct.

Now ask yourself, does Christianity meet the above definition?

Of course it doesn't.  If Christianity were factual, it wouldn't be religion.  It would be history taught in schools, and nobody would worship it.

The point of religion is that it isn't truth, it's faith.  And those two items don't go hand in hand.  I don't have faith that the world is round.  I know the world is round because that is the proven truth.  Nobody knows that Jesus exists in an ethereal state, so that is not the truth.

Understand the difference?

faith wouldnt exist it it wasnt based on at least some truths... if there was no truth then there would have been no reason to believe

If loretian has faith, then say in 30 years time they can prove the existence of say ethereal jesus (because lets face it science is always changing its parameters) then his faith would then be rewarded with a truth...so therefore ethereal jesus would now be a truth

in fact the world is round and it is a truth, therefore before Aristotle discovered it was round you would have been denouncing his faith...his faith was based on truths and facts

If Christianity were factual, it wouldn't be religion.

so if they proved the existence of ethereal jesus then do you think people would stop being christian? i think the opposite would occur

...how do you know that someone you do not know has proven something? do you believe them? do you take their word for it? the only truth that exists is the one you see, everything else is faith on others judgements and actions

but hey i know what you mean with your definition thing

[sandman]

love doesn't meet the definition of truth, but i think you believe in that.

(gayest comment i've ever made.)

[loretian]

Actually, that's exactly what it means.

From Webster's dictionary....

Truth (noun) something in accordance with facts; the state of being exact or correct.

Now ask yourself, does Christianity meet the above definition?

Of course it doesn't.  If Christianity were factual, it wouldn't be religion.  It would be history taught in schools, and nobody would worship it.

The point of religion is that it isn't truth, it's faith.  And those two items don't go hand in hand.  I don't have faith that the world is round.  I know the world is round because that is the proven truth.  Nobody knows that Jesus exists in an ethereal state, so that is not the truth.

Understand the difference?

The Bible states that people will not believe for other reasons than it not being true.  If the Bible is true, the beliefs you hold and many others fit exactly with what it claims.  I know that's not evidence for it's truth, but if the Bible is true, then it would NOT be taught or regarded as truth by all because it states the gospel won't be.  It's that catch 22 thing.

Anyway, it's a common misunderstanding of what faith is about when it comes to Christiantiy.  The faith is about trusting that Jesus will get you through life, regardless of how bad things are, or how hopeless things seem, not faith that God exists.

[Chris Misfit]

Religon will never die, it's a good way of looking down at people.

The church is in decline my friends, has been for a long time.
The reason for most of this, in a way responding to what someone else said (A couple of hundred years ago it was a criminal offence not to go to church, and blasphemy was an offence until recently.)
Years ago priests were the intellligent, they taught the kids how to read and write. Very few people apart from priests and men of the church had any real education. And you don't question your teacher.
Basically, I believe people are educated better to question the bible, and the priests don't find the "he works in mysterious ways" as effective anymore.

I doubt the bible myself. I don't believe the god that it worships. That doesn't mean, I don't believe in a higher power. If that god was real, I believe him to be dead, because this world is full of hate.
It's just like people believe in aliens now, why, without TV, internet ect to occupy their minds, could the story of the bible have not just been one hell of a exageration? Remember people killing each other because they believed that witches lived amongst them?

Will religon disappear? No. We should start a cult.

[MCT]

We're a buncha dogs chasing our own tails.....and we're never gonna catch it............

[Jessica]

Thse books should asolutely be read and read SLOWLY. On each page, at the bottom, you can find references, serious ones, that exist physically and that can help you ( or anyone) do even more research.

Someone asked me about sources, these books are better, because it's too long to explain all of why Jesus wasn"t crucified, the catholic scam and these authors have done it better than i ever could:



The Grail and the Royal lineage of Christ, by Laurence Gardner
( check the title, it's my own translation) first published In great Britain in 1996 at "Elements Books Limited".


The Holy blood and the Holy Grail, by Michael Baigent, and Richard Leigh and Henry Lincoln. ( and all their other books)
"Jonathan Cape Limited" ( London)


The Hiram Key, by Christopher Knight and Robert Lomas
at "Century".


Secret of the Exodus (Did the Pharaohs Write the Bible? ) by Messod & Roger Sabbah
( Can be found at Harpercollins and Amazon.com)

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

the Bible

that is what gonna ruin religion. how people ALWAYS get everything back to their own religion. u take a christian , he'll talk about jesus for ours.
you take a muslim, allah is the man.
i mean. we, atheist, didnt kill religion, people in churches did. you killed your own god....

orgranized religion will disapear , but it wont solve the problem.
what was the biggest problem in religions ? not god ? no, never. u can believe in watever u want.
the problem was the "group" feeling. that Organization.
it will disapear, but its too late, the problem has switched to other area of society.
you have tv and consumerism
you have sororities / fraternities and all the " i wanna be part of something " feelin in the us and other 'developed " countries.
you have pop music.

the pope said in 1999 that god was dead in europe. he is kinda right i guess.
and there is this really good book, by Andre Glucksman, called " la 3eme mort de dieu " (the third death of god), and it analyse some of the aspect of the decline of religion. really good.

anyway. i have kinda like a theory about god and all.
i feel that god is what we DONT know.
as long as years go by, and we get smarter and smarter, god is slowly "dying".

a lot of people, may be happy, you know, finnaly we get rid of the religion problem.
but if we get to a complete materialistic world .... we're fucked  

[Smoke]

Religion will never die.  There have been two things that have been in every culture in some form since the beginning of time.  And those two things are religion and law.  That is still true to today.  

[Dizzy]

Is graviety true? Of course it is, was it true 5000 years ago? Yes  it was. Was it true to man at the time who had no concept of it? Of course it was.

Before gravity was a proven fact, it was a theory.  Not a truth.  Some theories are proven true, and others aren't.

Truth is also defined as being what you beleive

The definition you provided contradicts what you just said..

"A statement proven to be or accepted as true."

The operative word being proven.  Not believed.

And as far as "accepted" as true, religion is not pervasively accepted as truth.  Even some people who believe it will admit that it isn't truth.  There is always the conflict between those who believe and those who don't.  Henceforth, the debate is created over whether or not it is true, in which case, if neither side can prove that it's true or not, then neither the belief or lack of belief is the truth.

As the old adage goes, "as long as you beleive that it is true then it is true."

And that adage isn't true (pardon the pun).

Using that logic, I could say "Jesus doesn't exist" and it would be the truth.  But then someone else could say "Jesus does exist" and it would also be the truth.  And that of course creates a paradox which immediately disproves that trusty old adage of yours.

Personally, I don't believe that Jesus exists.  But I will never say that "Jesus doesn't exist" is a true statement, because it isn't, even if I believe it.

love doesn't meet the definition of truth, but i think you believe in that.

Actually I don't.  I'm the bitter old man, remember?    

[D]

no way religion will be everlasting in one form or another people are to afraid to stop believing