Study: False statements preceded war

[freedom78]

I think conservatives feel that way because this country was built on christian ideas and principals.....so they stick to that hardcore...a perfect example is how poorly Mitt Romney did, when he was by FAR the most conservative candidate running....he lined up with most of the conservatives ideas except for one thing....he was a mormon...and that killed him....if he were a christian he would have wiped the floor with Mccain because Huckabee woudlnt have been taking a good chunk of his votes....

I can accept the role of some Christian ideas in creating this country, but it's also got roots in the Enlightenment, which was largely anti-religion. 

http://www.stephenjaygould.org/ctrl/treaty_tripoli.html

Authored by American diplomat Joel Barlow in 1796, the following treaty was sent to the floor of the Senate, June 7, 1797, where it was read aloud in its entirety and unanimously approved. John Adams, having seen the treaty, signed it and proudly proclaimed it to the Nation.

Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

I don't think this is a nation based solely on Christian principles.  I think it's a national of legal principles, many of which are connected with Christianity at some point.  Of course, you could just as easily argue that this country is founded on the principles of Hammurabi, or of Britain, or of the Enlightenment (as I said). 

[Perfect Criminal]

Simply put, if the founders of the USA and the authors of it's constitution and declaration of independance were christian, then it is of 100% certainty that the USA was founded on christian beliefs.  100%.  Personal opinions are what drive politics.  Politicians can't keep religion out of politics in 2008, why would that have been any different in the late 1700's?  Now I have no idea what the founders' religions were (if you do, please post), so maybe it doesn't matter.

Article 11 is stating that the USA was not founded on christian beliefs.  Does that make it so?  Absolutely not.  That's just the USA's official position, for very obvious reasons.  How horrible would it be if the USA's official position was that our country's priniples are based on religion?  Man, this Iraq war would be 1 million times worse.

[freedom78]

Simply put, if the founders of the USA and the authors of it's constitution and declaration of independance were christian, then it is of 100% certainty that the USA was founded on christian beliefs.  100%.  Personal opinions are what drive politics.  Politicians can't keep religion out of politics in 2008, why would that have been any different in the late 1700's?  Now I have no idea what the founders' religions were (if you do, please post), so maybe it doesn't matter.

Article 11 is stating that the USA was not founded on christian beliefs.  Does that make it so?  Absolutely not.  That's just the USA's official position, for very obvious reasons.  How horrible would it be if the USA's official position was that our country's priniples are based on religion?  Man, this Iraq war would be 1 million times worse.

A principle can be found in Christianity without it necessarily being a religious principle, though.  For example, "thou shalt not kill" is found in Judeo-Christian teachings, but I don't know that that makes it a Christian principle. 

Anyway, some founders were Christian, others were famously atheist.   

[SLCPUNK]

Simply put, if the founders of the USA and the authors of it's constitution and declaration of independance were christian,

They weren't.

[fuckin crazy]

This country was founded on secular beliefs and the rule of law. That is why there are protections in the Constitution ... to prevent religion from interfering in gov.

[fuckin crazy]

For example, "thou shalt not kill" is found in Judeo-Christian teachings,

That priniciple has nothing to do with religion ... it was around long before all religions. It is an evolutionary trait.

[freedom78]

For example, "thou shalt not kill" is found in Judeo-Christian teachings,

That priniciple has nothing to do with religion ... it was around long before all religions. It is an evolutionary trait.

That's kind of my point.  It's found in religious teachings, but it's primary source is not Christianity. 

So...a principle can be found in religion, without being a religious principle. 

[TAP]

Simply put, if the founders of the USA and the authors of it's constitution and declaration of independance were christian, then it is of 100% certainty that the USA was founded on christian beliefs.  100%. 

No offence but that's a totally ridiculous position even if the founders were all Christian which they weren't. Many of them were deists, several of them spoke and wrote very strongly against Christianity, and even those who were Christian thought it should be separate from law and government.

I won't deny that the majority of Americans were and are Christian, but that's very different from the US being founded/built on Christian principles, beliefs and values or whatever those things even mean. The USA bears virtually no resemblance to any nation described in he bible, or any law/value system from it, nor does it bear much resemblance to any nation which came before with an established Christian religion. The majority of the ten commandments would be totally unconstitutional other than stealing and killing which are quite absurd to claim as Christian principles.

[Perfect Criminal]

Very convincing statements by crazy and TAP.  Your points are so well taken by me, that I simply offer no reply.

[Booker Floyd]

ahhh I see....so pretty much the strawman technique describes everything that Booker Floyd has ever posted on this site.

Ironically, its actually what you use - quite often.

[Bodhi]

ahhh I see....so pretty much the strawman technique describes everything that Booker Floyd has ever posted on this site.

Ironically, its actually what you use - quite often.

haha..looks like I hit a sore spot....I have to disagree with you...if anything I am the most blunt person on this board...i tell you exactly what I think and I don't play semantics or word games so I can cover my ass later if I am wrong..because I believe in my opinion...im not scared to share it......i don't know why you are so scared to actually share your opinion....you will never actually say something without leaving a little bit of wiggle room so you can back out of it at a later date...I also know im not the first person to tell you that...