Immigrants Sue Employer for Back Wages

[polluxlm]

I still think the solution has to be a Mexican one.? The reason for illegal immigration, here, is the same for their emigration, there...it's just better to live and work here!? As long as that's the case by such a large margin, this will be a problem.? When the Mexican standard of living and wages start to close on ours, the problem will diminish.? ?

When? I can't recall any immediate plans to improve the very profitable explotation of the third world.

The government loves immigrants. The economy grows, without the extra expenditure of health, pensions etc.

Oh, and yeah, they can be used as another fear tool when somebody needs to be blamed.

[freedom78]

I still think the solution has to be a Mexican one.  The reason for illegal immigration, here, is the same for their emigration, there...it's just better to live and work here!  As long as that's the case by such a large margin, this will be a problem.  When the Mexican standard of living and wages start to close on ours, the problem will diminish.   

When? I can't recall any immediate plans to improve the very profitable explotation of the third world.

The government loves immigrants. The economy grows, without the extra expenditure of health, pensions etc.

Oh, and yeah, they can be used as another fear tool when somebody needs to be blamed.

Oh, I didn't say it would happen soon.  But imposing fines and putting up walls are "solutions" to the problem that don't do anything to actually fix the root causes of the problem, which are the Mexican (primarily) and Central American economies. 

[stolat]

Do you know that in politics the 'third world' is no longer referrd to as the 'third world' - these countries are now called 'developing countries'.

[polluxlm]

Do you know that in politics the 'third world' is no longer referrd to as the 'third world' - these countries are now called 'developing countries'.

I also know that black people are referred to as african americans although most have never set their foot on that continent. I love politicians.

[25]

25 claims that, as all prior methods have failed, the solution is to fine illegals, and make them pay taxes.  Of course, this is a noble idea, assuming that illegals are willing to step forward and pay their fines.  But can you imagine any other system working like this?  If a driver didn't fill his/her parking meter, and the system in place asked that he/she  go to the local police station to pay a parking fine, how many times out of 10 do you think that would happen?  Oh...but there's an incentive!  IF you come in to pay your parking fines, we'll keep better track of you and make SURE you fill your meter every time, from now on, meaning that, basically, nothing in your life will change, except that you'll have less money.  Deal?   

Well actually I claimed that the solution was to make the immigration process more accessible to those coming from poorer countries (way back at the beginning of the discussion)  and to give illegals a means of becoming legal. I'd whip the fines on them to appease the "rule of law" types. And I think it would work a little better than your parking meter example if only because you left out the part about attaining some sort of legal status and no longer living on the scraps handed out by dubious exploitative employers. I'd think that not being a fugitive and not being exploited are fairly decent carrots and paying a fine is a fairly flimsy stick. I'm not claiming it's a great idea but I will go out on a limb and claim it would be more effective than spending the money on detaining and deporting people who will then re-enter illegally, nullifying your efforts.

[C0ma]

Well actually I claimed that the solution was to make the immigration process more accessible to those coming from poorer countries (way back at the beginning of the discussion)? and to give illegals a means of becoming legal. I'd whip the fines on them to appease the "rule of law" types. And I think it would work a little better than your parking meter example if only because you left out the part about attaining some sort of legal status and no longer living on the scraps handed out by dubious exploitative employers. I'd think that not being a fugitive and not being exploited are fairly decent carrots and paying a fine is a fairly flimsy stick. I'm not claiming it's a great idea but I will go out on a limb and claim it would be more effective than spending the money on detaining and deporting people who will then re-enter illegally, nullifying your efforts.

I still can't get past the fact that you are rewarding someone who broke and continues to break the law. Which sends out the message "Please come by any means nessesary because once you are here will fast track you to legal status, so why wait for the proper channels"


Lady Liberty's inscription is a little out dated:

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door."

That was all well and good in the late 19th and early 20th centuries when we were building a country (with people who entered legally (for the most part)), Now we do all of our nation building in Middle Eastern and African sandboxes... we have no time for it here

[freedom78]

Do you know that in politics the 'third world' is no longer referrd to as the 'third world' - these countries are now called 'developing countries'.

I also know that black people are referred to as african americans although most have never set their foot on that continent. I love politicians.

If you want to be less PC about it and more illustrative of the idea of exploitation, you can refer to the industrialized world as the core, and the non-industrialized world as the periphery.  That would make Mexico part of the semi-periphery, consisting of somewhat industrial states. 

[Bodhi]

illegals shouldnt be making money here in the first place...nevermind have the opportunity to sue people....

[Prometheus]

1) Why would tax payers have to spend tax dollars on illegals that were made citizens?

they would be paying for it too wouldn't they..... they would be paying taxes under the Idea presented by 25, along with their fines.

2) As I stated B4 the only way to solve this issue is to curtail the influx of illegals that you currently have. How do you do it..... Fine and jail the shit out of companies and corporations that are hiring illegals, and importing them. Build 1 wall and 2 fences along the border. design it so that areas that are affected by migration routes have large "controled" gaps. embed ground force sensors in all non regular patrol areas. Add fixed CCTV camera points every 200 yards complete with IR NV and daylight features. incorporate "spewer" UAV for low level and mid level flyovers of the entire border. Create border stations every 20 miles that can house 10 patrol officers each..... so you will need 70ish so that 700 officers...... with the use of all the electronic survaliance you could drop this down to 1 station for ever 100miles and include helio support for longer hops and give it 10-25 each of officers and ground crew.piolits..... down to about 350. if you are worried about tunnels..... spewers can look for exits and entrances.... have 7 teams haul a ground penetrating radar over the boreder area every other day to check for em.

so i just spent...... about 1.2 billion in in construction of this..... another 200-400 million in equipment costs and 15yr maintance agreements. another 33 million on officer salary and about 20 - 30 million in fuel costs per year and about 5 million in power bill...... say 2 billion and you just secured your border. if you want a reall good high grade gravel road...... as well... tack on another 400-600 million

3) Then you can start to do the internal clean up. Though i do agree with the arguements of giving a gift to law breakers..... if you an manage to toss 10 million est illegals out without a riot or war, i say good fucking job. realisticly the Idea brought forward by 25 is more do able..... is it exactly what needs to be done... maybe maybe not... but something looking in this direction where the illlegls pay ?even a token fine of say 2k over 3 years would net you about 20 billion and it just payed for the border wall and its operation and up keep costs for the next long while. They would also be paying taxes so there would eb another big injection into the coffers of the US....

[freedom78]

illegals shouldnt be making money here in the first place...nevermind have the opportunity to sue people....

It seems an easier distinction to make, when it's about a paycheck, but the right to use the court system is one that should be open to everyone.  Suppose something like a wrongful death suit needed to be filed.  The idea that someone should NOT benefit from the system of law and order is a bad one, even if they, themselves, are law breakers.  If an illegal immigrant is murdered, it's not as if we just don't investigate and prosecute.  Whether someone is an illegal immigrant has little to do with the jurisdiction of a particular court and, if something lawsuit-worthy occurs when someone is in another country, illegally or not, then that's where a lawsuit must take place.

It seems, to me, that there are two separate issues, those being immigration and its problems, and questions of rights.  Solving immigration problems has little to do with taking away people's rights.  Just because someone is an illegal immigrant does NOT mean that they don't have the basic freedoms that come from being in this country.  To do so is to treat them as less than human, a la Dred Scott.         

so i just spent...... about 1.2 billion in in construction of this..... another 200-400 million in equipment costs and 15yr maintance agreements. another 33 million on officer salary and about 20 - 30 million in fuel costs per year and about 5 million in power bill...... say 2 billion and you just secured your border. if you want a reall good high grade gravel road...... as well... tack on another 400-600 million

Are you kidding?  Congress couldn't commission a report on how to wipe its own ass with 2 billion.