Lord Of the Rings anyone?

[Kujo]

Viggo Mortensen was a good Aragorn.

Though I would have loved for Daniel Day-Lewis to have taken the role.

Wow, thats a great thought. Daniel Day Lewis is awesome in everything he has performed in. He was absolutely robbed in the Oscars for "Gangs of New York". He made a mediocre movie extremely enjoyable, for me at least, as Bill The Butcher.

Still, Viggo seemed to just nail the role to me, but I only read the books once before the movies so I am hardly an authority on the matter.

[Axls Locomotive]

I don't underestimate his standing, but his purpose. He stood for much, yes, but did nothing, so he would have been completely irrelevant in the film. As would have been Glorfindel, though he was functional. When people are going to see the film I don't think they'll be giving a shit that he's the complete opposite of Sauron.

so youre saying that if people went to see this film with tom in it then these people wouldnt have the capacity of intelligence to understand what he stood for?

Nope. I'm just saying they wouldn't want to sit down for an extra 45 minutes watching a character that ultimately plays no part in the movement of the film. The film wasn't made for Tolkien snobs, it was made to reach a wider audience, including non-Tolkien geeks, and it did exactly that.

I happen to think Arwen taking Frodo across the river as opposed to some stupid horse, was a much better idea than including Glorfindel in the movie for five seconds.

even though LOTR is one of the most read books of the 20th century?...the inclusion of tom would have made no difference to the audience...im not expecting people to be saying, "hey im not going to see LOTR cos tom bombadil is in it"

then reason the films reached a wider audience is because 95% of the films were true to the book...

you may think that glorfindel at the ford of bruinen was ummm cool...but it actually lost the fact that frodo's power stood up against the nine...it would have been far better to show this than the obvious attempt at increasing the size of arwens character in the movie...

im not dissing the movies, theya re probably the among the best 3 movies ever made...jackson is a genius...but they could have been better

[Cubb]

wat was every bodys fav line frm each of the movies mine are

ROTK:u will suffer me
an i can never decide frm the other two

[Jim]

Original screenplay? : "I see in your eyes, the same fear, that would take the heart of me..." - Aragorn

Ooh, makes me shiver whenever I watch him give that little speach.

[Timothy]

Original screenplay? : "I see in your eyes, the same fear, that would take the heart of me..." - Aragorn

Ooh, makes me shiver whenever I watch him give that little speach.

That little speech does the same to me.   

Just fuckin great the way Viggo delivered it .

[Walk]

Aragorn should have been a few inches taller and with blonde hair and blue eyes. From the books, Aragorn clearly represents the race of kings, the Nords. Dwarves are Slavic, hobbits I think would be Alpine, Elves Mediterranean, etc. So much of the books are symbolic of Europe's cultures, all united against a common foe. By the way, notice that orcs used curved blades, just like Middle Easterners did during the Crusades. They're harder to defend against.

In today's PC climate, you would never hear about this. These days, the books are just another fairy tale. 

[MCT]

Aragorn should have been a few inches taller and with blonde hair and blue eyes. From the books, Aragorn clearly represents the race of kings, the Nords. Dwarves are Slavic, hobbits I think would be Alpine, Elves Mediterranean, etc. So much of the books are symbolic of Europe's cultures, all united against a common foe. By the way, notice that orcs used curved blades, just like Middle Easterners did during the Crusades. They're harder to defend against.

In today's PC climate, you would never hear about this. These days, the books are just another fairy tale.?

That was the most uneducated attempt at an educated response that I've witnessed in at least a month.

And no, I'm not backing up my claim. The best I can do is refer you to Q (IQ) as he seems to be knowledgeable in this particular area. It remains to be seen though, whether or not he has any more patience for your knockabout diction and its nonsensical roots than I do. My guess would be, no. But you never know...

Anyway, sorry for the ad hominem verbosity. I'm just a hater when it comes to posers...

Nothing personal...ah...intended anyway...

[Gunner80]

Aragorn should have been a few inches taller and with blonde hair and blue eyes. From the books, Aragorn clearly represents the race of kings, the Nords. Dwarves are Slavic, hobbits I think would be Alpine, Elves Mediterranean, etc. So much of the books are symbolic of Europe's cultures, all united against a common foe. By the way, notice that orcs used curved blades, just like Middle Easterners did during the Crusades. They're harder to defend against.

In today's PC climate, you would never hear about this. These days, the books are just another fairy tale.

A no..... Even Tolkien himself shot down stupid theories like that.

[Axls Locomotive]

Aragorn should have been a few inches taller and with blonde hair and blue eyes. From the books, Aragorn clearly represents the race of kings, the Nords. Dwarves are Slavic, hobbits I think would be Alpine, Elves Mediterranean, etc. So much of the books are symbolic of Europe's cultures, all united against a common foe. By the way, notice that orcs used curved blades, just like Middle Easterners did during the Crusades. They're harder to defend against.

In today's PC climate, you would never hear about this. These days, the books are just another fairy tale. 

sounds like a mish mash of guesses...elves are blonde, tall and fair skinned, from that description people would think swedish not mediterranean...

Do Slavs have long beards and are they 3-4 feet tall, live in massively architectured caves, use axes etc...not much correlation is there?

Do Alpines smoke weed, work little, are 3 feet tall, have large and hairy feet and never leave their home because they are forever happy?

so they used curved blades...they didnt have much choice, curved or straight?  if they used straight blades then you would have said romans or whatever...

European cultures united together against a common foe? wow thats a tremendous lack of history about Europe you possess, before the 20th century you would be hard pushed to find 2 or 3 countries acting together and most often it would be for selfish reasons rather than for the common good...

your logic, like boromir, is filled with holes...feel free to elaborate on your reasons why you think they match

personally i think Tolkien just took what he thought were the right elements for each race and looked for complementing features...

im not an expert, ive only read the books twice!!!

[Walk]

I don't want this becoming a 4 page flame war like the gun control one. I'm just saying that there is much, much more to Lord of the Rings that meets the eye. You guys ought to hear what I have to say about Conan the Barbarian, but that's another story.

As for history, the very act of giving rings to gain allegiance dates back to pre-Christian Northern Europe. When the books were written, the background clearly has Europe in mind. And yes, there has to be a lot of guesswork in interpreting this story, it's just how it is.

It's worth noting that Tony Iommi doesn't like the term "heavy metal", and he denies that any Black Sabbath songs were truly Satanic, that they just used them to scare people. Of course, Iommi doesn't want to offend anyone because he has records to sell. Tolkien had books to sell. Sometimes, even the author of a work can refuse to be objective, as ridiculous as it sounds.

The main point of the book is how good unites against evil and wins. It's an idealistic portrayal of how history should be for mankind. Yes, the Crusaders were probably more interested in loot than a united defence of the Holy Land, but that wasn't how it had to be. Of course, the Scourge of the Shire chapter shows that even in the fantasy background, not everyone was united. The ideal, however, is still there.

EDIT: Here is a source for some of my theory. http://www.churchoftrueisrael.com/pgr/pgr-2.-11.html

The Nordics are, all over the world, a race of soldiers, sailors, adventurers, and explorers, but above all, of rulers, organizers, and aristocrats in sharp contrast to the essentially peasant character of the Alpines. Chivalry and knighthood, and their still surviving but greatly impaired counterparts, are peculiarly Nordic traits, and feudalism, class distinctions, and race pride among Europeans are traceable for the most part to the north.

The mental characteristics of the Mediterranean race are well known, and this race, while inferior in bodily stamina to both the Nordic and the Alpine, is probably the superior of both, certainly of the Alpines, in intellectual attainments. In the field of art its superiority to both the other European races is unquestioned.

Aragorn is a brave, chivalrous king and soldier, and definitely an adventurer. Alpines, the "peasant race", don't like adventure, and could be called hobbits or dwarves. I put dwarves as Slavic because, like Slavs, dwarves need lots of body fat in the cold North. Alpines don't necessarily live in cold climates, so hobbits would fit in there. They both have a stouter built than Nords or Meds. The Mediterraneans are less physical (but make up for it with longbows in the book!), but they're good at art and culture, like the elves.

[Axls Locomotive]

As for history, the very act of giving rings to gain allegiance dates back to pre-Christian Northern Europe. When the books were written, the background clearly has Europe in mind. And yes, there has to be a lot of guesswork in interpreting this story, it's just how it is.

im interested about what you say about the rings...any sources for that?

I am aware that much of what he wrote was probably based on medieval europe especially weaponry and fighting close combat but much of it was not...the story of Frodo can be directly related to Tolkien's first hand experience as a soldier in World War 1...he wanted a small person to become the hero and receive the credit and not the general...he was certainly knowledgable in myths and fables all across Europe

It's worth noting that Tony Iommi doesn't like the term "heavy metal", and he denies that any Black Sabbath songs were truly Satanic, that they just used them to scare people. Of course, Iommi doesn't want to offend anyone because he has records to sell. Tolkien had books to sell. Sometimes, even the author of a work can refuse to be objective, as ridiculous as it sounds.

Not sure what you mean...you are saying that tolkien wasnt objective? in what way?...

I doubt that Tolkien was truly interested in the amount of sales in his book...the book took 11 years to complete and from his words he says it was meant as a study of language as you see numerous mentions of it within the novel and far more in the appendices, alphabets, words, structures...he was a humble englishman who lived in the countryside and started it during world war 2 i believe...so i doubt that sales was on his mind especially in the early stages of his book...

"good against evil"  im not sure that directly relates to medieval times...again its probably more related to WW1 than anything else since it relates more to his personal experiences...the allies all joined up against the germans, the dark cloud crossing the land could also relate to the wars in the trenches with sauron being the German High Command

btw i thought the dwarves lived in the caves not far from Rivendell, quite a long way south of hobbiton and there were very few cold winters in hobbiton

[Narcissa]

even though LOTR is one of the most read books of the 20th century?...the inclusion of tom would have made no difference to the audience...im not expecting people to be saying, "hey im not going to see LOTR cos tom bombadil is in it"

then reason the films reached a wider audience is because 95% of the films were true to the book...

you may think that glorfindel at the ford of bruinen was ummm cool...but it actually lost the fact that frodo's power stood up against the nine...it would have been far better to show this than the obvious attempt at increasing the size of arwens character in the movie...

im not dissing the movies, theya re probably the among the best 3 movies ever made...jackson is a genius...but they could have been better

It may be but, even in spite of the movies, still not everyone has read it. In fact, people who've seen the movies and then attempted the book will give up because it's so much easier to just go with the films.
It is a very difficult book to read, don't forget that. These days if people want to read about wizards they read Harry Potter.

Arwen's character had to be increased because she couldn't not be in the film, nor could she be in the film for five minutes in all, given how important she was in motivating Aragorn, who, regardless of Frodo, is the main character of the book.

The fact that Frodo withstood the pull of the ring and the poison from the witch king's blade is stated a lot throughout the film. Gandalf said several times that "You have some strength in you" and there were several other references.

Also, the fact that the journey to Rivendell while Frodo was injured took two weeks or so, was merely shortened, and technically it wasn't removed altogether.

[Narcissa]

wat was every bodys fav line frm each of the movies mine are

ROTK:u will suffer me
an i can never decide frm the other two

I really can't do this question justice because I love every word in all three movies.

Fellowship; probably "Do you know how the Orcs first came into being? They were Elves once, taken by the dark powers, tortured and mutilated... etc. Whom do you serve?" "Saruman!"

and; "There is only one Lord of the Rings and he does not share power." also when Strider tells the Hobbits about the ringwraiths in the room at the Inn.

Two towers; "If the wall is breached Helm's deep will fall..." and the following conversation including the speech to the Orc army.
Also; "The world is changing, who now has the power to stand against the armies of Isengard..."

Return; "What about the wizard?" "I will break him." and the conversation between Theoden and Eowyn after she slays the nazgul.

[Axls Locomotive]

It may be but, even in spite of the movies, still not everyone has read it. In fact, people who've seen the movies and then attempted the book will give up because it's so much easier to just go with the films.
It is a very difficult book to read, don't forget that. These days if people want to read about wizards they read Harry Potter.

Arwen's character had to be increased because she couldn't not be in the film, nor could she be in the film for five minutes in all, given how important she was in motivating Aragorn, who, regardless of Frodo, is the main character of the book.

The fact that Frodo withstood the pull of the ring and the poison from the witch king's blade is stated a lot throughout the film. Gandalf said several times that "You have some strength in you" and there were several other references.

Also, the fact that the journey to Rivendell while Frodo was injured took two weeks or so, was merely shortened, and technically it wasn't removed altogether.

i agree its not the easiest book to read but neither is it difficult...ive read harry potter, even 6-7 year olds could read those, all credit to rowling though, she has managed to get many kids reading again...quite a feat with so many other interests are available...LOTR is in a different class though

you mention how arwen was important enough for her character to be increased but then you think that a few references and the blade is enough to satisfy that Frodo wasnt drawn to the ring...this was a far more important part of the book than the romance and i think that should have had more time in the movie...and you must remember the romance between aragorn and arwen is greatly increased from what was said in the book...a clear attempt to make the film more appealing to women

im sure some people were confused about the horses coming down with the river...arwen didnt have that power so it didnt make sense...it was gandalf and elrond that summoned the horses...

[Axls Locomotive]

so many quotes to choose from, here are a few that i like

"I bring word from Lord Elrond of Rivendell. An Alliance once existed between Elves and Men. Long ago we fought and died together. We come to honor that allegiance."

"The stars are veiled. Something stirs in the East. A sleepless malice. The eye of the enemy is moving. He is here."

"For sixty years, the Ring lay quiet in Bilbo's keeping, prolonging his life, delaying old age. But no longer, Frodo. Evil is stirring in Mordor. The Ring has awoken. It's heard its Master's call."

[Walk]

http://www.octavia.net/anglosaxon/TheWarBand.htm

Here's a little bit about ring giving and other stuff about Anglo-Saxon warriors. When Tolkien had the rings in mind, he was thinking of them in the Northern European warrior's context. Rings, being valuable, are powerful, but they are also a binding of submission and loyalty to one's master.

This raises an interesting question. Why do men have to wear wedding bands at all?

[slash4ever]

Original screenplay? : "I see in your eyes, the same fear, that would take the heart of me..." - Aragorn

Ooh, makes me shiver whenever I watch him give that little speach.

Yeah that rlues.
LOTR is by far my faveourite movie- number 3.
The cast are amazing. I love Viggo Mortensen. He's so sexy as Aragorn. that speech kicks-ass.

Especially the " a day may come when the courage of men fails....."
and "but it is not this day, this day we fight. To all u hold dear, on this good earth, i bid u stand, Men of the West."
parts.I am probably a BIG LOTR freak. I'll be watching it tonight!
                       

[Cubb]

Yeah that rlues.
LOTR is by far my faveourite movie- number 3.
The cast are amazing. I love Viggo Mortensen. He's so sexy as Aragorn. that speech kicks-ass.I am probably a BIG LOTR freak. I'll be watching it tonight!

i Know wat u mean he is beautiful!but not in real life!an orlando bloom is lovely as well!do u have the extended dvds,ther funny as hell!

i like the signatures at the bottom of ur posts cus lets face facts slash is god! wer abouts in ireland are u from?

[Jim]

I sorted out your quote (you need [quote*] at the beggining and [/quote*] at the end of what you want to quote, without the *). Now keep personal conversations out of this thread or I'll slap you about.

Only a little bit, mind.

Okay, so I won't slap you, but I'll certainly have stern words........