Here Today... Gone To Hell!

I figured I'd just post this here to save Jarmo the time.  But I would like any feedback that anyone can offer. 

There has long been talk that Axl turned in an album in 2010 and the label rejected it.  I believe the source was bicycle grenade MSL, but was anything else ever really confirmed on that?

All I know is that back then in 2010, one day Axl used twitter to sort of rant. But he didn?t mention the album as far as I know. I didn?t see the actual tweet because it was deleted either by Axl or someone from his entourage. Few people saw it. Apparently Axl said something about cancelling that tour at the time. For some reason that rant was associated with an album rejection in fans forums. I wouldn?t be surprised if that was the case. One of the reasons CD took so long was because the record company rejected the album presented by Axl several times over the years. I never heard any confirmation, only fans speculation over that deleted comments on twitter.

Hmmm.  I do recall that now that you mention it.

I see 2 possibilities, neither are good.

1) Gun to my head, I don't think he ever turned anything in.  Where would this sudden burst of inspiration and work ethic come from?  And wouldn't one of the other fellas have mentioned something like this in an unguarded moment in 3 plus years time?  Especially considering how often they get asked by fans about anything new.

2) Although its hard to put a good spin on that first scenario, I think I can.  Imagine if he really did turn it in and they rejected it.  That had to pretty much break him, mentally.  And its hard to see him ever getting back on the horse.  And although admittedly circumstantial, a few things would also make more sense.  Most people can concede a drop off in his live performances starting in 2011.  The setlist pretty much never changes.  And more of the focus on the marketing aspect of the touring is based on an album from 25 years ago, and not anything new.

And just on a personal note, I know a lot of people are very invested in the label being the bad guy.  So they would be all about this story, because it makes them the villain and Axl the aggrieved party.  But does anyone ever ask themselves why the label would do such a thing?  They have already paid for this material to be recorded.  Does it make business sense to refuse any further releases out of spite?  I'm sure they were annoyed with Axl's disappearing act in 2008 (because who wouldn't be) but to this extent?

 This may help. Axl explained in that 2001 interview. Now it?s up to you to buy what Axl said. That was a happy Axl. I don?t think he would lie nor exagerate. My take is despite Axl being a pain in the ass. The record company didn?t give a shit then nor now. Neither part seems to be willing to reach some kind of compromise

http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=65710.0

Maybe I have blinders on, because I'm pretty sure it's the label, but I actually tend to see more people blame Axl's bizarreness for anything's delay.  In the media, on the forums (esp. MYGNRFORUM), a lot of people toss the blame square at him, mostly because he's a public figure and the label is pretty faceless.  It's a lot like what happened with Conan & Leno.  Jay got portrayed as a this villian, but realistically, it was the faceless, corporate politics behind the scenes that caused a ton of grief.

There've been a lot of stories about the label really wanting Axl to reunite with the old band, or at least Slash.  I have to imagine they weren't nuts about a new album from Axl's new lineup, especially considering the album was (allegedly) self-titled.

PS - I'm starting to see that Dead Horse is where the goods are.

I put the blame on Axl.

At the end of the day, its his career.  And I have certainly never been able to reconcile that I'm supposed to believe all this "last man standing", never take anything lying down routine...while, at the same, he is pouting in the corner because he just can't get a break from this cruel world.

There is an inconsistency there.

True, I have no doubt he can be a pain in the ass and difficult, but I also can't see him grinding away at this, recording a ton of music, always replacing band mates, going on tours, etc. and just not releasing things "because he's crazy."

I'm sure there are many layers to it, but, ultimately, it may just be about business.

I reject the oft insinuated talking point that the label fucks with him just for shits and giggles.  What sense does that make?  But people say it all the time.

I also reject that he is just moving heaven and earth to get new material out, but keeps being thwarted at every turn.  What evidence supports this?  It took him over 10 years to get us the one album we did get.  I'm to believe that he was right back less than 2 years later with the next installment?  Does that add up?

I find it far more plausible that they haven't heard much from him in the past few years, and he's totally out of sight and out of mind.

They haven't heard from him and he's under contract?  It seems more likely that he handed them "Blood In The Water," "Better Gone" & "Better [Dj Ashba Remix]" and they thought "Money Loss." 

To quote Marc Canter:

"I don't know all the reasons but I do know that there was more than enough songs recored between 1998 to 2002 to put out the record. Here are some of the things that could have had a lot to do with the delays. How the record would be promoted, how much would be spent to promote it (That could have been the main reason because when Dr Pepper made that offer is when things started to come together) Dr pepper has big money and could have done something good for the promotion , Management issues, record co hoping to get Slash on some of the songs, or some type of reunion, I'm sure there are more reasons but thats all I can think of right now."

My problem with all quotes like this one are the fact they can be summed up with "Tell you who's fault it wasn't : Axl's."

Touche.  But Marc isn't carrying much water for Axl, so I trust what he has to say.

Also, I won't make the claim Axl's free of guilt, but I will say it's his idiosyncrasies (or whatever you want to call it) plus record label politics.

I see this as a one way "war".

I think Axl and his handlers have convinced themselves there is this great jihad at work here.  All sorts of tactics and countermeasures constantly being employed by the nefarious label to hold their man back.

But if you asked the label about it, they'd probably laugh at the concept as they reminded themselves, oh yeah, we still have him under contract.  We forgot.

I have a feeling as soon as vegas wraps up... you are going to see a real quiet time for GNR...

players in the band are gunna do their own things...a couple them possibly permanently and nothing is gunna get done or be said about it for a long long time

i wish somebody could get a more concrete answer on what some of the major hold ups are as fas as a new record, who is really to blame etc. because the speculation and never ending mystery is really getting tiring

I wonder this myself.


Depends how you speculate.

If you want to speculate the big bad label is out to get him, fine.  Or make some comparison to that other band that did that thing that time, so...yeah, its not so simple, smartass. 

That's all fine.

Speculation Axl has lost his drive and its just never going happen?  No good.  Where do you get that?  And didn't you hear about that other band that did that that that time?  We just covered this.  Must be "nice" to have a "fan" like "you".

Bullshit!  Dr Pepper made a SARCASTIC offer because they thought Chinese Democracy would NOT see the light of day in 2008 (offer was good only if the album was released within that year).  Axl obviously knew CD was going to be released, immediately grasped the opportunity for this major FREE PROMOTION and publicly called out Dr Pepper on their offer with that 'share his with Buckethead' press release.  CD was released and Dr Pepper tried to do everything in their power to back out of the deal.  They made us fans jump through hoops and put tight time constraints to get a coupon for a 20 ounce bottle of soda. Very few of us were able to obtain one of these elusive coupons. 

The Obamacare website worked better than the Dr Pepper soda for CD offer website!!!  :hihi:

I still have my coupon!!!  ;D

Yeah, I agree with all of that.  They welched on that one, big time.

Didn't Dr. Pepper go as far as to take their site offline for a bit?

Yeah, they did take their site offline for a while and when it finally came back online, there was a VERY short window to sign up for the coupon that took weeks n' weeks to actually arrive.

I guess technically I let Dr Pepper off the hook by not cashing in my coupon but the souvenir meant more to me.