Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Yeah, his guitar parts I know - he also recorded for Tommy's VGH. I was talking about his songwriting as in the whole song melody and structure - or at least some riffs. : ok:

Everybody needs to watch that Fall On Tears video, I love it, great song.

In regards to the question, I think alot of people in GN'R have got great songwriting capabilities. For instance, Ron, Chris, Dizzy and Tommy, all have great solo music under their name.

And I feel Richard is a silent gem, and will have a big part in the next album hopefully. With DJ, I cannot give my opinion as I'm not a big Crue fan and thus haven't checked out Sixx AM.

But when you've got a songwriter like Axl Rose, you are already there. But GN'R has at least 4 other great songwriters, who have proved they can write great lyrics. So I think people can sit back and look forward to a masterclass of an album, it's Axl Rose, what more do you want.  :)

Great Topic Spirit
I love Fall on Tears

Some songs Richard has co-written:

Fall On Tears
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4Nmvhk1OFA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4Nmvhk1OFA)

Seventeen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJYPdS-NIzI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJYPdS-NIzI)

7 Years
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jlio4Nu_a3A (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jlio4Nu_a3A)

Jigsaw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6yCidF25HY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6yCidF25HY)

Green
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Djc8vfpOyrU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Djc8vfpOyrU)

Long Long Time
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNsZ4btghew (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNsZ4btghew)

Thanks man! I loved this version of Green live! Great solo and really good groove by Frank! :D

About Richard's songs on the follow up, I recall seeing people claiming he said that, but never really saw the original source. Anyways, would be interesting to see if they managed to write between 2002-2004 (with Bucket still on the band) and even after that (which didn't seem to have anything new as far as we know, but we know very little :P).

I think Tommy, Dizzy and Richard could pull off some great stuff - they all seemed to work togheter really well. For some reason, I think DJ and BBF writing material would be more from their own than with others.

Who's a more accomplished piano/keyboard player Axl or Dizzy?

Thanks, thought it would be interesting hearing everyone's opinion. I know I've left out Dizzy, Frank and Chris. Will post on them later.. Anyone remember what song Dizzy wrote for a movie (I think) some years ago?

Frank on drums on Fall On Tears by the way..  :peace:

I know Dizzy has some really amazing music, I hope he releases his album soon. Since he took down his songs from his myspace a few years ago, I can't find them anywhere.

Here are a few songs from Dizzy to watch out for, Mother Teresa, Fracas, Sea Monkeys, and Crunch. They all rock and I can't wait to listen to them again, they were really awesome songs. And it's a shame they have been took off his myspace, but this may be because he wants them to be on his album.

So bring it on Dizzy.  ;)

I really hope it's a song. Bumblefoot's lead is outstanding, and I love the progressive approach they put on this one. This is the most interesting jam I've heard from them...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WZAFtQU0IU

Great thread, by the way. :)
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never  seen that thanks awesome

Spirit, here's something about the writing of If The World, from http://www.nrhz.de/flyer/beitrag.php?id=13269  ;D

I think the great thing about this band is that each of them got so many styles  :)

Street Of Dreams is a song I'm a little curious who wrote the piano parts. We know Dizzy plays them live, but so does he with everything except November Rain. Dizzy is credited for the song, so I assume he wrote parts (or all) of the piano for the song. It's a great piece, so he definitly got skills in the writing department as well.

Spirit, I remember I read something here (can't tell if it was a proper interview or just people from CD.com who went backstage at the Paris 2006 gig) about this. Dizzy would have said that Axl wrote the intro and he wrote the rest of the piano parts, with everyone adding their own stuff later. He even adressed SOD as being one of the first songs wrote "as a band".

I think the Chinese Democracy tab book also credits SOD for Robin, if I'm not mistaken.

Dizzy Reed - Cheers to Oblivion

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o7NdrBl_c4

also listen to the air by Dizzy Reed

So beautifull

It's on his myspace
http://www.myspace.com/dizzyreedmusic

also listen to the air by Dizzy Reed

So beautifull

It's on his myspace
http://www.myspace.com/dizzyreedmusic

Are there any solo songs released by Dizzy (except for the air), Richard, or any other band member?
I'm familiar with Tommy's vgh and Bumblefoot's work.

Great story, thanks for posting it. Id love to know more about the writing on CD songs. :)

Frank is a member of The Compulsions too.

I know he's a member, but I'm not 100% familiar. Does he have any writing credits?

I dont know, i bought their first e.p. from 2004 on itunes and the credits box is left blank. Didnt find anything on their website either. Most likely its Written by The Compulsions officially.

I wanna have as many songs from Chinese Democracy sessions as possible on the next record/records so I have to choose Axl (of course), Dizzy, Chris and Tommy (and from the former members Tobias, Buckethead, Finck and Mantia).

If they bring in any outside writers, who would be the best fit you think?

Previously there have been West, Del and Tobias (outsider at the time).

Anyone know if Brain still writes with the band? We know he focuses on composing music nowadays. Same goes for Paul Tobias, anyone know if he's still affiliated with the band? He did have a lot of credits on Chinese, much more than I had though beforehand.

If they bring in any outside writers, who would be the best fit you think?

Pete Scaturro and Marco Beltrami

On one song I actually wrote a guitar part, but they pretty much had the band tracks down and then I added orchestral stuff on top of it.

A song called "Seven," which is the one that I did the most work on, I actually did some writing on.

Thanks!

(still can't access the site though..)

IGN: When you go to the movies, do you key into other composer's music and subsequently find yourself saying "I would have done this or that"? Or are you able to disassociate yourself from that?
Marco Beltrami: Well, no, I can never disassociate myself from it, but I can enjoy the movie still. If it's a real bad score, then it can ruin a movie for me or at least it will draw a lot of my attention to the score. I sort of enjoy being able to hear what other composers are doing and how they might score something differently than me. I enjoy that part.
IGN: Now what about being labeled as a genre composer, if such a thing exists? I mean you've made a name for yourself via scoring mostly horror films and thrillers with horrific undertones.
Marco Beltrami: I think it's okay for now. I mean I haven't been doing this that long and the fact is that most of the movies that I've done that have been a success have been, I guess sort of genre type movies. But I still feel like I have a lot to say in other areas and will have plenty of opportunities to do that. I'm not really worried with the way my career seems to be going, which is in a forward moving direction. So I think there's time for everything.
IGN: What was it like working with Marilyn Manson on the Resident Evil score?
Marco Beltrami: It was great. He had really great ideas; he approached it a little bit different from me coming from a different background. We'd meet once or twice a week, either at his studio or my studio and play each other what we'd been working on. It really worked out well. I was amazed at how continuous the score felt. It felt like it was one score rather than two different composers working on a score. I think it was a good collaboration and I look forward to doing it again sometime.
IGN: Meaning working with Marilyn again or with other rock musicians in general?
Marco Beltrami: Yeah, I would work with him again. There's Resident Evil 2 but I think they need an English composer for that. So maybe on a different project. I think it would be fun. He's got a lot of great ideas and approaches music [differently]. His sense of sound and creating, mixing the sort of sound and music worlds is really cool. I definitely learned stuff for him and think it would be a good experience again.
IGN: Since we're talking about rock musicians, what was the deal with you arranging some orchestral sections for the impending Guns N Roses album?
Marco Beltrami: That was sort of just work for hire. I guess they'd heard some of my orchestral music of mine. I met with Axl and he played me these songs, asked me my ideas about them, and I told him what I thought they needed. They gave me four songs to orchestrate. A couple of them I did more than orchestrating, I actually wrote some melodies and stuff. It was a fun project. I really enjoyed it. The music was eclectic and at the time that I was doing it there were no lyrics on the songs that I was working on. People ask me about the album and I really have no idea about the release. I thought it was coming out last September. I'm the wrong person to ask about that.
IGN: He came to you with the tracks then, so you weren't ever in the studio with the musicians or anything like that
Marco Beltrami: No, they had finished tracks. On one song I actually wrote a guitar part, but they pretty much had the band tracks down and then I added orchestral stuff on top of it.
IGN: What songs were they, by chance?
Marco Beltrami: A song called "Seven," which is the one that I did the most work on, I actually did some writing on. There was one called "Thyme," one called "The General," one called "Leave Me Alone."
IGN: How was that as an experience? Do you have any future plans to work with more rock musicians or is it more like you'll take it as it comes?
Marco Beltrami: I enjoyed it quite a bit. It was different than doing film music, but it was a lot of fun. I would probably do it again. It would probably be more fun at some point, to do it as a more collaborative affair, starting more from scratch, working and writing stuff [together]. But it was definitely fun.
IGN: Plus it shows that you're not limited to just film work.
Marco Beltrami: Oh, no, not at all. In fact I have plans for other projects as well, some operatic stuff and some concert stuff, and I like writing songs, too. To me music is music and it's not limited by the medium, it just encompasses everything.

Jarmo, did you ever get to meet Paul? Was he ever attending any concerts from 2006 and onwards?

He did stuff on SOD, TWAT, Madagascar and Prostitute as well, so seems like he's worked on at least 8 songs in total.

I gotta say, when listening to the orchestral tracks of those songs, they're really good.

And he has only named songs that weren't included on CD. What do you think about that?

Not that I remember....



/jarmo

Either he hadn't worked on the Chinese songs yet at the time, or maybe he considered Seven, The General, Leave Me Alone and Thyme as the best songs. Hopefully the latter.  :hihi:

Yes, most likely the latter. Or maybe he just thought that the songs would be on the album too.

What's also interesting is that he says they were complete instrumental tracks when he started working on them. It backs up the notion that "CD 2" has probably been done for a while, maybe even at the time Chinese came out in 2008.

Maybe without vocal tracks though.

Didn't Axl say that in the future he would want to go back to a melody and music approach to writing songs ? not starting on the lyrics and vocal melody when all the music was finished. But rather doing them at the same time, a more organic way of creating the songs.

I'm no expert, but maybe it has proven to be hard to come up with the lyrics and melody at the end, like they did the songs on Chinese.

Robin Finck and Patti Hood have both said the same thing. So it's not really a proof that the lyrics weren't done at all.

It isn't that unusual to lay down vocals last, after the majority of other required tracks are done-or near done.

That's true. You need the music to sing.

But you could still come up with the lyrics and vocal melody at the same time as the music, before even. That wasn't the case with Chinese per Axl. He wrote the lyrics and vocal melody after the music was done.

I'm no musician, so I don't know for sure what's the hardest way to do it.

Despite what the E-experts say,there is no "correct" method, people compose using different formulas, at different times and even on different songs within the same album.

Look, I'm not saying that this is the wrong way to go about it. It's not a discussion on what's more correct ? it's not a criticism of Axl's way of doing things.

What I am saying is that maybe Axl wanted to do the songs this way, sort of like a challenge for himself to push his creativity to new levels. I don't know if he had done songs this way before. The result might be that the songs on Chinese became better than they otherwise would have been if he had written the vocal parts in a more traditional way.

What I am speculating in is that the challenge he set himself maybe proved to be a bit harder than he envisioned. That's why I posed the question if doing songs this way is harder than any other way, I don't know.

He himself said in interviews that he wanted to go back to writing songs with melody and music in mind from the get go, that made me think that he sees this as an easier approach to song writing. Maybe not as time consuming as the other method.

We do know that there were vocal tracks to the songs that wound up on the Chinese record at the time Mr. Beltrami worked with Guns. But Axl might not have gotten around to create/finish up lyrics and vocals to tracks like Seven, Leave Me Alone, Thyme and The General at that time, just because it can be a daunting task to make melodies to already existing music (that's the question I'm posing).

Maybe this is part of the reason the track list on Chinese became what it did ? those were the songs that got 100% finished first simply. Actually, if that is the reason we can throw out any idea of an A- and B-list of songs, they're all A-list. :)

Tool is finally making progress on their next LP with one finished track and 10 songs that are almost ready for singer Maynard James Keenan, who adds his vocal parts after the instrumentals have been constructed. "Some of it's really heavy, some of it's complex and some is more atmospheric, but it's definitely Tool. I think having this lawsuit out of the way should really speed of the progress of getting the album done," Jones said, noting that while they'd like to finish the album by the end of 2015, Tool won't be governed by "an arbitrary deadline."In February, Keenan told fans after a studio visit, "Things are progressing nicely. Slowly, but definitely progressing. Nothing is recorded yet, but the guys are confident that the pieces are coming together swimmingly and will be ready for me to begin writing melodies and content 'soon.'"

 

ps....note, "Tool won't be governed by an arbitrary deadline". Sound familiar?  :hihi:

It's the same (or almost the same) with Dr. Dre's never released Album 'Detox'

Dr. Dre producing a GN'R single would have been interesting to hear.

Or maybe a remix - from If the World or There Was A Time for example.

That too.

A new song would have been nice though. Having Axl and Dre working on some music from scratch.