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All Guitars Tech Drums Classifieds Marketplace RSS Guns N' Roses' Chinese Democracy nosedives on the charts
An insider offers his thoughts

Joe Bosso, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 5:43 pm UTC

 
Can anything stop GN'R's downward spiral?

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For Axl Rose, it's bad times. A week ago, his much-anticipated album Chinese Democracy debuted to less-than-steller chart showings - in the UK it was handily beat by The Killers' Day & Age, and in the US it did even worse, coming in at Number 3 behind Kanye West and Taylor Swift.

And now it appears that the raging apathy of once-fervent Guns N' Roses fans continues.

Final sales figures are still coming in, but in the UK, Chinese Democracy dropped off the Top 10 and slid to Number 11. And in the US the story is even grimmer, where the record nosedived to Number 17 -that's a 78 percent drop-off from its first-week sales.

Some see a turnaround
With radio stations turning a deaf ear to the album, it would seem that the goose that is Chinese Democracy is cooked. But some insiders close to the Guns N' Roses camp still view the record as a long-term winner.

Bob Chiappardi, the New York City-based CEO of Concrete Marketing, has worked with Guns N' Roses since the Live Like a Suicide EP. Recently, his company worked on TV ads for Chinese Democracy and serviced the album to gentlemen's clubs in the US. According to Chiappardi, the record has yet to receive its moment in the sun.

"It's going to follow the same kind of life of the Kid Rock record, where songs keep coming" Bob Chiappardi, Concrete Marketing"We all expected a situation with the numbers falling off," says Chiappardi. "First off, it's not in every record store in the country, which doesn't help. But I hope it's going to follow the same kind of life of the Kid Rock record, where songs keep coming - then we'll have really good numbers by summer."

Believe in ballads
Radio's resistance to the title cut is "disappointing," says Chiappardi, but he believes that several of the album's ballads "are going to come through. Maybe not on a November Rain basis, but there's some tracks there."

Above all, Chiappardi claims that Chinese Democracy needs time and nurturing. "The record is like a unicorn - there's a legend around it," he says. "It's hard to explain. I think once the smoke clears, it'll rise to the top."

http://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/guns-n-roses-chinese-democracy-nosedives-on-the-charts-186624

I agree with this stance. I believe if 'TWAT' or 'TIL' or 'SOD' is released as a single, this album will take off. It needs to get on more mainstream radio stations like 'November Rain' was. Though I don't think it's the BEST song off the album, I think 'Street of Dreams' really has the best chance to really win over music lovers. It's the song that sounds closest to the 'old' GN'R in terms of their ballads and I think it could then open the door (and ears) to songs like 'TWAT.'

Yeah, that's what I've been saying all along. If you get a song like that out there, it's going to wonders. It has appeal to most music fans.

It seems like Better is finally getting that push.  It's a great song, I could see it pushing this album back up top.

I hope he's right.

I thought Chinese Democracy did as good on the radio as that song could--it's a great album opener, but compared to Rock N Roll Train it's not a great single. Is Better too complex? Too poppy? Too heavy? Maybe it too just needs time to catch on.

Part of what helped along those old singles--November Rain especially--was the visual association the videos and their narratives. They also had the association with really exciting live performances. If I remember correctly, Welcome to the Jungle didn't catch on until people saw the video.

So, I don't know if Axl is going to tour or do videos, but those visual associations do help people warm to a tune that is maybe a little too this or that to catch on as a classic single.

These were different times though. Back then people were buying whole albums even though they knew a couple of songs, mp3 and download was two words that were not invented yet, rock was popular, music videos were effective, MTV was the biggest influence in music industry.

Now the scene is totally different. Just look at MTV to see the difference. There's everything but music on it.

I think the band needs to tour in order for the album to rebound long term.

A few pressers wouldn't hurt either.

Why are some of you sounding like broken records?

Don't you think one thread is enough for the same shit?


We get it. You want the album, only the album will do.

Oh wait! It's been released.

You got the only thing you ever wanted, but now you want something else. A tour!

I remember when a tour wasn't good enough! It was a year or two ago.

Two weeks after the release you're done with it and are here asking for more.






/jarmo

They're just dissecting the scenario and trying to evaluate the current fiscal performance and public demand of their favourite record.

And in doing so they are offering their thoughts on what our favourite band should do next.
Nothing wrong with that mate.

In my opinion there is something wrong with it, when two weeks after the album they claim to have waited for for about 15 years was released, there's no sign of any kind of excitement or positivity from certain people.


This is supposed to be the time when these people actually got the album they bitched about how Axl should "just release it" for years.

Now what are they doing?

They're just doing the same old in every other thread. Complaining and asking for more.




When will you fucking get that the complaining isn't gonna help anybody? Except maybe yourselves because I guess it makes you feel great knowing you can always log on and put "your favorite band" down from behind a computer....

What a bunch of bullshit.


I hope you're all sending your CVs to Universal Music and other companies since you're all experts on marketing, touring, promotion and so on.  : ok:


When a fan starts using the word "units" when taking about the album he/she "waited" for since the 1990s, something's not right. Suddenly the art has just become a product.




/jarmo

i for one am satisfied....i got the cd and it rocks.  i was expecting a lot of negativity because nothing, and i repeat, nothing, can live up to 15 years of hype.  we had to expect some people would be dissappointed. 

regardless, we got cd and i couldn't be happier

I'm glad you're able to enjoy the music instead of focusing on the other stuff.

 : ok:


That's what it's all about.

The music.

It's out there, enjoy it.




/jarmo

yeah...i remember that's all anybody wanted...now we got it.  the music speaks for itself.  sure, i'd like a tour and all that, but even if we don't get all that we still got an awesome cd!!

Well, I do not demand anything (who am I to do that?), and I dont think at all that the number of copies sold are dissapointing.

But I really feel that GNR and its management should do something more to promote the album, simply because the album is a masterpiece. I consider ''Chinese Democracy'' the best GNR record ever (by far) and its a pity that a lot of people will never listen to the phenomenal songs the disc has inside because the album release news is happening almost unnoticed.

For example, GNR is #2 in my country, and lots of stores have the album sold out. Guess what? ZERO promotion. Just a minimum promotion (one unpretencious / cheap video-clip, for example), one or two cool interviews and I'm sure sales will be a lot better.

If GNR's decision is not going to promote the album, that's cool for me. I have the album in my hands and I cant stop listening it, and I discover new things every time I hear it. I'm absolutely in love with the album. It's all I have ever dreamed and more.

Let the people know GNR is back. I see a lot of you saying that video clips are not longer useful in the USA. But ... there's life outside USA! Teenagers in my country just listen and buy a record if they like ''the song that's on MTV''. This is the first time I see ''singles'' without physical release and without video-clips simultaneously.

All I want is more and more people to feel the same than me when listening to masterpieces like TWAT or Prostitute. It's not a critic, not a demand, not bitching. Just a wish.

Man...

A lot fans want to see your favorite band rockin the world. They waited too long just for listen the chinese songs, thats true. But think about it: They was imagined how cool will be, listen the album, watch the videoclip, watch GNR in a big tour! I think the just want the best for GNR, and sometimes I think that way too...

But I know how smart Axl and the guys are, and they know whats they have to do! If Axl dont want a super marketing, for me, thats great anyway! I have my album and I'm happy with it...

But try to be cool with people, Jarmo, cause I think that they just want the best for GNR!!!


Sorry for my bad english!  ;D

And, I think some people are worried about the sales because it may put the rest of the supposed 'trilogy' of albums in danger of ever being released. If CD were to fail, who would want to back him up with another two albums?

That is the only reason to be concerned about sales.  As long as the record sells enough to ensure the next release, then that is all that has any effect on us as fans.

Beyond that, no one should care.

Ali

I understand that too, but I don't understand why a tour needs to happen within two weeks of the release?

Why does everything have to happen at once?


Isn't there enough to keep people occupied for a while? 14 songs.....

It just seems like some people are constantly asking for more and can't be happy with what they have gotten so far.



/jarmo

I wanted 15 songs.  Not 14.

I agree! I think people have to be patience, cause the tour dont have to start now!

In my country have a lot fight about the chinese: some love it (me!!!  : ok: ) and some hate it just because we love it so much... So, we been years saying "Wait for the chinese and you will see how great it is" and when this album release, this haters just come up to me on the messenger and say:

"See! This album is a crap! Axl has fear to realease a videoclip and show your face to the world! He saw how shit he did!"

And I and a lot fans start a fight! lol

This happened on orkut, messenger...

So thats why a lot fans want to see GNR rockin the world! lol


But in the end, to me, I'M VERY HAPPY WITH THIS ALBUM!! AMAZING!!! THANKS AXL!

I just wanna hear more now :P

Yes, this is a strong album. I believe it will do well in the long-run, however badly the sales numbers may look now.

We're talking about an album that has 12/14 songs that are very strong.

thats funny that the kid rock scenario was mentioned, because when i thought of the current sales of the chinese democracy album, i immediately thought about 10 years ago, when kid rock's devil without a cause came out, and the first single released, I am The Bullgood got mediocre reviews and not a lot of interest.  however, after the album had been out a few months, you got more and more singles being released (Only God Knows Why, Cowboy, Wastin Time, etc, etc), and the album REALLY took off and ended up being pretty successful.  it kicked off a "second coming" of kid rock's career.  its quite possible chinese democracy could do the same.

How long between AFD's release in July 87 and when the album finally went to the top of the charts?  Almost a year right?

The reason that AFD did well is because of the Word of Mouth.  This time around...we (the fans) need to do the same thing.  We need to do our part.  We need to spread the word. 

To be honest I'm not that bothered if it gets toured or not - it'll be cool if it happens, but if not, at least we've got the bootlegs from '06. A concert lasts one night, a great album's something you can enjoy for the rest of your life - but it would still be great to read/hear Axl talking about his masterpiece now that we have it. I guess, if anything, that's what I'm hoping for but to be honest I don't see it happening.

Serious question - does anyone know if the rumor about music videos that someone (I forget who) mentioned being finished and awaiting Axl's approval was true, and if so, what happened to them?

Whatever, a world tour is in the works and a videoclip as well. I don't think we'll wait too long anymore. :peace:

Geffen/Black Frog definitely need somebody in their ear.  Their promotion and marketing for CD sucked, big time.  Send away, people.

But for the record, I am very satisfied with the album.  Anything else that happens (tour, videos, chart-topping) is a bonus from here on.  I'm all good regardless.

A logic move might to release some potentially huge single at the time the Best Buy exclusive ends to boost CD's general release...

When does the Best Buy exclusive end?

I totally agree.  Personally I think THIS I LOVE would be a great choice for the theme song to the next movie of the TWILIGHT series. It's Christmas and all I can think about is vampires and CHINESE DEMOCRACY. It reminds me of going to see the musical LESTAT inbetween GNR concerts at the Hammerstein ballroom and having all the vampires kiss me on the neck.

I think it's a six months deal. Not sure.  ???

If a video was to come out, I want the whole thing, not just a clip :hihi:

I think having the BB exclusive probably held down sales numbers just due to the fact that many people don't live real close to one ( unlike wal-mart) and their promotion was not consistant with all their locations & a bit lackluster.

But the deal that was made guaranteed the label would turn a profit, so I understand that part of it.

But back to the topic point - I agree that this album will have a long life if there is a tour in 2009. Just because it did not go platinum in 2 weeks does not mean it is a failure like some are saying - this album has impossible expectations to meet for many due to the history behind it. And then there are the haters of it as well.

If the next 2 albums are already recorded with some minor touches to add later, I'd say the label will make out pretty good since those 2 albums have little or no cost to them since they have been paid for by Chinese Democracy. In other words I would not expect any problem between the band and the label putting out a couple more albums which is good news for us.