Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Jarmo, who were you telling to Fuck Off?  I asked in the thread where you made the comment but you removed my comment.

They know who they are.

The same people I've been saying this place isn't meant for. I've been repeating myself about that for ages so I'd assume those people start getting the point by now.




/jarmo

Probably me since I got a -1.

jarmo you'd probably maintain your opinion if it were never released.

You run with that belief that the band does not owe anybody anything.  I'd agree if Axl did not keep the name.  Tired arguement you say?  Some of the founding members disagree.  I'm not saying Axl should have moved on without the name.  I'm cool with him taking Guns N Roses to new places.

From where I sit, and yeah it's a valid place just like yours.......he does owe GNR fans who have supported his new direction.  He owes the fans that have followed him and his annoncements of releasing an album.  Noone knew of Chinese Democracy until he spoke of it.  None of us knew of the new songs until he played them. 

Axl is stating, "I want GNR to continue on and this is my vision.  Will yo BUY into it?"  And we have....for years now.

So to some degree, I feel he does owe those of us who have followed him.

Am I waiting around for the cd, no.  But I certainly have an interest in it.  It's long overdue.  Just because you jarmo choose to support him unconditionally doesn't automatically make anyone who dares speak against Axl a whiner.

It's a human right, in most places, to voice our opinions.  Am I here everyday speaking negatively?  No.  I do understand now that I cannot voice an opinion or complaint regarding Axl Rose, who by the in my opinion is still the greatest musician to ever grace this planet.  That won't change whether or not he releases any new material.

I thought this was the best place for me, a fan moreso of Axl than of GNR, to voice a frustrated opinion to his timely manner of delivering the cd to me/us.

I believe CD will have the same impact on me that AFD had 20 years ago.  So I am supportive.

But as you wish, jarmo, I'm exiting your board.  Yeah you have a GNR board that is tapped directly into the band.  I was within the AFD vibe as it was happening.  I felt the change GNR had on the music scene as it occurred.

Yeah, Axl does owe me and any other fan who had a part in getting him where he is today.  We, the Afderz.

No.....




/jarmo

Afderz?

Yeah, I guess that means the people who bought Appetite back in the day.

I wonder if these "fans" feel they're owed by the whole AFD line-up or just Axl.  ::)


Do they also feel like the founder of huge companies owe them because they helped them get where they are?




/jarmo

Well I'd disagree. 
If you have made random amount of millions because people buy your album,go to your shows, wear your shirt,  you owe something to these people. In my books thats the long and short of it.

The eternal paradox here just might be that people you owe shit don't always deserve shit.
At any rate,the good old "Axl(or any other artist) doesn't owe you shit"-argument  is bullshit.
This post is full of "shit"

I wonder why those people just don't give up. I mean, seriously... If you think Axl/the band owe you so much and you're not happy because it's not getting the album (even tho a lot who whine don't seem to care that much about the new songs), just leave it. No need to keep feeling bad about something, go seek for music elsewhere.

Also, seems like they think it's cool to put down the optimistic people with the whining. The year is over in August to those people and the album is never coming out. No matter what, it HAS to be negative.

I bet once the album is released, people will already start to complain about the time the second album would take to come out.

I guess will never get it how some likes to feel bad about something and wants to make other people to feel the same way.

Since you asked, we'd first have to be able to measure the amount of this "owe" and then put a owe-price  tag for each release, and then you could cross reference your way  to your final owe-number, and then compare it to owe number of others, and thus determine just how hot you are.
Since this is very hard and pointless thing to pull out, I'd recommend you settle with "they owe  me something" :yes:

If we tried to determine what this something exactly is we'd end up in terrotory so damn subjective that the discussion (if it involved more than 1 person having monologue) would turn very pointless very fast. So just settle with "they Owing you something." That's good enough for me atleast.

All half serious bullshit aside, I do sincerely believe that some sort of collective self esteem of a "newGNR supporter" is so damn low (when he is in grn mode) that some sort of therapy sessions with "Axl owes me something" as a mantra wouldn't hurt at all.
You know, "i refuse to be a victim, i refuse to be a victim" etc!
..what? it's a great idea.



Yes, exactly. :yes:

Axl owes nothing to noone. If you have some legal document saying otherwise, then fair enough, but I doubt this is the case

Jarmo runs this board his way. If you do not like it, then there are other boards to choose from

Stop, Click here http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?action=logout then go outside, because Axl doesn't owe you anything.

The idea that anyone who posts here, or has been a fan, is owed anything by Guns n Roses is utterly and totally asinine.   If that's the attitude you want to bring here, then it would be far better for all involved if you just stayed away.

That said, I understand the frustration of wanting to hear new music from Axl and GnR.  I bought appetite when it first came out, and GnR was gave me the defining, life changing music that made me pick up the guitar in high school.  Truly, GnR means more to me than I can put into words.  As someone approaching my mid-thirties, I would love nothing more than to see a new album released, and a triumphant return to the forefront of public consciousness - and to the top of the charts - for Axl, and for Guns 'n Roses.

The leaks - and their inherent brilliance - have made that waiting far more difficult, as has seeing the band live, meshing well and proving that they're more than capable of changing the face of music once again.  In spite of this, however, I haven't once felt that I've been "owed" anything, but that certainly doesn't make the waiting any easier. 

It's been frustrating, and it's been disappointing, but as I keep telling myself, it's all for good reason, and when the time is right, the album will come out.  Until then, there are plenty of other things to get caught up in.

But please.  Stop confusing support and enjoyment of GnR music - no matter how passionate - with some form of entitlement.  If you think you're entitled to anything from the band, then you're in the wrong place, and you've got the wrong band.

You know, it makes me sad that I rarely feel like posting much of anything here anymore.  For too brief a time, I really enjoyed the intelligent discussion and conversation that went on among fans here.  It seems rather difficult to post something these days without it being deleted for reasons unknown (and I truly do go out of my way to follow the rules) or for most new threads to quickly degenerate into mudslinging, rumor-mongering, and off-topic pettiness, such as "being owed" anything by the band.  Perhaps we need a "Get in the Ring" section for all the personal back-and-forths that seem to dominate most threads around here?

Me, I'm just glad to have an active GnR making a record and playing amazing shows.

No, Axl doesn't owe his fans anything.. But I think his fans deserve a new record after hearing him talk about releasing one since 1997

Axl doesn't "owe" anybody anything, period.

He owes me a new snowblower.

Do you have the paperwork to prove this?

Lets see, I bought Appetite about 13 years ago for about 12-15 bucks. Out of that the record company probably got a chunk, distributers too, then the band divided by 5.....If Axl doesn't release Chinese Democracy I want my $1 that he got from my purchase back. This is bullshit. Thats almost enough to buy a soda at work.

You are forgetting inflation, you should ask for about 5 bucks....

But buy the time we know for sure or not that the album isn't coming it maybe more like 25 bucks.

Well, we must remember that the value of the dollar is falling, then take into account Axl's braids, and finally divide it all by pi. I think we'll have an accurate figure then...maybe.

Edit: Don't forget the subprime mortgage crisis will also come into play, along with the amount of US debt that China carries. Honestly, I think Axl may owe us all much more than we ever imagined.

Edit 2: We're totally screwed! Buy gold now!

But with the falling value of the dollar while we even be using the dollar for much longer? Could be using somethign like broken glass and cigarettes.

Well we must convert the falling dollar to the "amero" which will be the currency once Canada, USA, and Mexico all become one union. I think one Amero will equal half a bag of broken glass and cigarettes, preferably Kools, under the most adverse scenario. (Again, I think we are fucked-but precious metals in the meantime.)

I don't necessarily agree with u guys with all due respect.


I think honestly, we are "OWED" Chinese Democracy.

Especially after Axl's press release this past December and the fact he is out touring.

If Axl chooses to retire and never release an album that is fine and I respect that and will still be a huge fan and support him

BUT, However:

When u countless times promote and talk about an album/project, and u make a couple promises that it will see the light of day, That then qualifies as OWING your fans.

If Axl never mentioned CD or never said anything about it,then SURE he owes us nothing, but after all the years,hype and talk about this album, I would think its fair to feel like we are "OWED" at least Chinese Democracy.

Am I gonna cry,bitch,rant,moan and stop being a fan if we never get it?  NO

But it still won't change my opinion on the subject.

Jarmo told someone to "fuck off"? Maybe that explains the 1 on his karma.

That's an interesting perspective.  ESPECIALLY in light of the "Chinese Democracy" tour etc.   

It was a generic Fuck Off.   He didn't really specify who the recipients were. 

Was it officially called the "CD tour" or were internet MB members referring to it as such?

He owes me a 2001 show.

Yes, I have the paperwork to prove this.

But since I can't have that, how about we strike a deal with CD?

i'd like an turbo-engine on mine, PS i'm an afd'er... :peace:

anyone who feels they are owed anything from Axl or Guns N' Roses should just log out now because they are not a real fucking fan and they dont get the concept of THEM CHOOSING TO BE A FAN OF THE BAND, not the other way around.   Axl never asked anyone to come to htgth.com or any other gnr site and wait for chinese democracy.

seriously, do you have any idea how much snow we have in the winter here? >:(

haha i dunno mang.   i live in the desert so Axl can buy me a new air conditioner.  :peace:

It was officially called that...

who gives a fuck what the name of the fucking tour was called?   that has nothing to do with anyone "oweing" anyone.

I don't think that there is an issue of whether we are owed anything or not.
On the one hand, at times I feel, much like D posted, that after all these mentions of ChiDem, that we are owed at least for it to be released. But on the other hand, it's our desicions as to whether we wait around for ChiDem or not. As Axl said 'live your life'. Axl isn't responsible for satisfying our want for more music, no matter how much we want it.
I paid to see a GnR show, so I was owed a performance, and they deffinatly delivered on that. That should be the only time you are owed anything by the band- when you put your money down in exchange for a product. If it's a show- you are owed the show. If it's a CD, you are owed the music on it (which you'll get on the thing.). When it comes to waiting for an album we aren't really owed a thing. It's our decision to wait.
All of that being said though, I feel that Axl should live up to his word, and release the album. How many press releases have mentioned the 'forth coming album Chinese Democracy'? Whether it's released tomorrow (we can dream can't we?!), in 6 months, or in 6 years, I just hope that Axl lives up to releasing the thing.
But that's my decision, if it doesn't come out I'm not going to hold Axl accountable for the time I wasted on it. I will however be dissapointed, but life goes on.

You're right.  There's no way that anyone would ever have had their decision to go to any of the shows influenced by the tour name.

No, it wasn't.  Stop spreading lies.

The North American leg wasn't, but wasn't one of the overseas jaunts using that moniker?

No, it was The Guns N' Roses World Tour


Any other names were wrongly used by promoters etc.

jesus Jim Bob, must you even post defending gnr, you do it so often, using a so typical, standard response i think we can all assume what youd put rather than you even typing it.

Lies? gimme a break, I could've sworn the tour was officially called the cd tour....

Stop being so defensive...

The promoter for the Australian and New Zealand shows called it that.

The t-shirts sold at all the shows clearly say: World Tour 2007.




/jarmo

This album has alot to do with Axl owing something to himself OK!

Someone posts a defense of Guns N' Roses, on a Guns N' Roses message board?

I, for one, am shocked.

Yes Jim Bob, what makes you think supporting Guns N' Roses on a Guns N' Roses message board is normal?


 :hihi:


/jarmo

Obviously I was curious, why don't you pipe down...

yes but this is jim bob doing his usual worshipping of axl and how he can do no wrong to the community.

You have read the title of this thread?

ask yourself the same question

I just now did . "fuck off" Right?

He has every right to do so here just like every VR fan can do the same for VR at the VR fan sites.

It's nothing weird at all.



The weird thing is the negativity. People come here to bitch and moan about GN'R.

I can get that from places like NME or Kerrang! I don't need to read it here too.




/jarmo

whats negative about alot of people on here feeling axl owes the fans this album?

How many times has this subject been discussed? I mean...really.

36666666666666666 time I think .

well i rarely read the gnr section anymore since theres not much news i care to hear unless its a UK tour or information on the albums where abouts.

you are obviously one of those who just doesn't get it.  theres no use even trying to get thru to people like you.   you're an ingrade.   you aren't owed a damn thing.   if chinese democracy never comes out, that will suck, but neither you nor I will have been shortchanged one bit.  The only people Axl may owe this album to, are the people at Universal, or perhaps the other members of the band who have put years of their lives into this project.  So unless you are one of the higher ups working for Universal who might have something at stake here, why don't you take your own advice and not worry about me.

well i think its pathetic if gnr dont release this album. what a big waste of time, a load of false hype and lies and a waste of alot of money and peoples time.

Looks like Mr Lee is trying to be as negative and bitchy and whiny as he can!

there is nothing wrong with defending GNR.

I'm just not a fan of blind loyalty and worshipping.



I am a HUGE fan of many bands,athletes etc and I will call them out when they are doing shit I don't agree with.

Being a fan doesn't mean u have to obey and support every single thing they do.

Being a fan isn't being ?a YES MAN to their every decision.

JIM BOB and others may think that makes me less of a fan but I guarantee Axl or any other person I am a fan of would probably appreciate someone like me more who isnt afraid to have an honest opinion over a Star Trekkie type of fan who would jump off a cliff if they thought it would impress Axl.

So yes, I am and will always be a HUGE Axl Rose fan, but after all these years and after all thats transpired.

He owes us at least one album.

i wasn't directing that at you, moreso at the ones who think they are owed something.   its a valid question, but i was just making the point that regardless if the tour was called "the Chinese Democracy Tour" or "GnR World Tour 2007" or "GnR Greatest Hits Tour" or "Axl owes us a snow blower world tour" has no bearing on us being owed an album.

fair point, but no one is making you wait for anything.   So if you don't like it, stop.   Its that easy.

I'm not waiting for anything.  Obviously there is something that has kept this album from coming out and I stopped worrying about it around 2004 and decided that if it did come out, that would be a nice surprise.  If not, I have AFD, Lies, the illusions, spaghetti incident, and 5 incredible nights of seeing the band.

Many of us are greatful for the fact that its not 2004 or 2005 and we got to see GnR sometime in the last year.   

How 'bout the "GnR Owes Us Summin' 2007 Tour" ?

 ;D

yes well me n my fellow ingrades a.k.a people who differ from your oppinions would like to hear this album sometime.

i dont see anyone worshipping anything, and Axl is a human being who is fallable just as you and I.   If he fucks up, I'll say so.  That shit in Sweden last year isn't something I'm proud of and I said that was fucked up.   

no, he doesn't.   it would be nice of him to release it, but he doesn't owe us.   unless of course you have some money wrapped up in all this?

a.k.a. people who feel because they bought some of GnR's albums and spend time posting on GnR's messageboards that Axl should get on his knees and beg them to stay his fan.   

we all want to hear this album.

I see it the same way . Being a fan doesn't mean you have to agree with everything . Doesn't mean you have to act like the band can do no wrong.

And if Axl would repay me for those concert tickets from 2002 that I never got refunded for that would be great.

That was part of my point.

IF HE SAID "I am retiring, Chinese Demcoracy isn't coming out"

I am fine with that.

Thats his right, Cool, have a great life I hope u find happiness.

But the fact he keeps touring under the GNR name, the fact he keeps playing unreleased songs from the album and after the press release in December giving us the tentative release date and now the fact the album is suppose to be finished and is mixing.

I think all that qualifies as we are OWED that album. ? ?I respect Axl and everything he has done and Deep down I know he cares about his fans and appreciates them. So that alone should make him someday release this album.


He will always be my hero whether he released no albums or 20 more albums but the fact CD has been talked about and built up this much, I think he owes it to not only the fans, and his bandmates, I think he owes it to HIMSELF to release the damn thing.

Well isn't the admin section the hawt spot today?

It's getting hawt in here . So lets take off all are clothes.

well, as i dont wish to be looked upon on the same way as stolat. ill leave this topic with one final question.

how do the insides of axls rectum taste jim bob, your creeped up there pretty often, just wondered.

I think we all will get it eventually, so no reason to wonder if we are owed it. I honestly believe it'll be out sooner than later. The problem is that so many people have had their hopes up during times when it was nowhere near ready, that it is making this part of the leg almost impossible to endure.

Hey, uh, lets not get too carried away, remember D is online right now..

See, with attitudes like that, I'm not so sure this is a worthy generation.


So I guess you wouldn't last 63 days in the Warsaw Uprising then, let alone 5 years of war.

Just dont understand why Jim Bob has to insult people to try and get a point across.......


Being owed has nothing to do with money. ?No band is anything without their fans and if u talk about it, u got to be about it.

It's also such a disservice to the band members who already have an impossible task of filling the old members shoes to constantly be paraded around the world playing AFD.

Axl owes it to EVERYBODY to release this album. ?If he wants to quit or walk away afterwards, that is fine.

this I do agree with.   I'd love for him to show the world he's still has the ability to put out kickass music and he does owe himself that.

kinda like chocolate  :-*

yes you should get your money back if the concert never happened.   that might not be in Axl's hands because I'm sure he doesn't handle that part of the biz, but you are certainly owed your money back.

True ,but none of us are a sheep ........Right?

So now waiting for Chi Dem is equivalent to a World War?

Nice one. ? The points of all these posts just keep on sailing past you don't they?

Jim Bob I have got to fuckin ask this:


Who fuckin died and made u GNR's Publicist


Jesus Christ..................


Its like u are tryin to win some kind of backstage invite or free tickets from Beta or something.

i get a little hostile because I come here to a Guns N' Roses fan messageboard to talk about my favorite band and show my support.   the same people whine over and over and over and it gets reallly fucking old.

and fans do not make a band who they are.   you liked the music Axl put out, and you like him as an artist, thats your choice and its beacuse of his amazing talent. 

i'm no publicist and I am not trying to get anything for free.   if GnR comes back to Vegas, I'm gladly gonna be there and gonna show my support.   I'm just tired of the bullshit man.

So how can u not just understand that some fans are tired and upset over waiting for the last 7 years and all the false starts.

I was speaking of those who have grown impatient, not myself.

It's a little more of a two way street . takes a melting of both Me thinks.

i was frustrated in 2005 when we hadn't seen Axl in 3 years.    I still didn't come to boards and bitch about it like he was someone who personally fucked me over and hurt my feel goods.

if i get tired and upset, I take a break.   

I see nothing to be frustrated about at this point.  Yes it sucks the album is still not out and its summer 2007, but theres too many other things in life to get upset about like paying bills and flaky porn girls.

The album will come out when the time is right.

not really.   Its cool to see fan appreciation from the aritst, no doubt.  But I don't believe we are responsible for making them what they are because its their talent that draws us to them and makes us buy their albums and tickets.   They've earned it.

The fan base needs to be united and solid.

When it comes out, we will be greeted as liberators, and flowers will grow up from the street where blood once spilled.

Oh wait....wrong thread sorry.  :confused:

Then we could all hold hands and sing we are the world.......

We are the ones to make a brighter day, just you and me........

Jim bob

U know what Axl would be without his fans?



Bill Bailey still living in Indiana

And probable in a shitty cover band right now or living on the streets ,giving hand jobs for crack.......

No, not at all.

Axl is way too talented and very, very smart.

"I guess as much as I realized that I wanted to be Axl Rose, I'll always just be Bill Bailey."



(did you get that George Steele?!?! A total fucking homerun!!!! Yeeehaw!!!)

Talented smart people can give hand jobs for crack. Don't be so prejudices against the none talented dumb people..

Yea, look MCT....

Bill Bailey ?:rofl: That's a great name isn't it! ?:rofl:

right.  because its our amazing talent that makes us fans of him.  : ok:

his point was, if it wasnt for the fans, he wouldnt be anywhere. there have been alot of talented bands that never made it because they never got a big enough fan base.

Axl was always going to make it.

Beats Stolat, that's for sure.

Make it as what?

A drag queen, paper boy, porn stunt cock???

If he didn't make it in Rock N' Roll he would've made it as a Classical pianist.

dude isn't that good to do that.

but obviously that talent wasn't quite on Axl's level because he managed to attract such a large fanbase, they did not.   if it wasn't for his music we wouldnt' be fans so this is the most retarded argument ever.

Oh yes he is.

Sir, their is no right or wrong way to look at . Don't get your panties in a twist.

spice girls made a load of shit music yet they were huge. its not about talent, its about the luck of attracting enough people to get signed and then things just working right with fate to get you a huge fanbase.

without the fans musicians are nothing.

2006 and 2007 (so far) have been amazing.


You people forgot so fast. Maybe you should think back to the exciting times of 2005 or 1998?



Anybody who thinks Axl owes them an album: Leave right now!

You didn't pay for it, you weren't forced to "wait" and it's all by your own choice.

You really need to find some other band who you can latch onto saying they owe you...... Fucking ridiculous.



/jarmo

I don't and have never cared to wait.

But I can see why people get upset.


I feel we are owed the album.

I didn't say we were OWED it this year or next year or even this decade but at some point we deserve to hear this album.


Jim Bob u just proved my point. U said "Axl's MUSIC attracted us"

Exactly!!!!!  Which is why he needs to release more of it.

Whoever fuckin heard of a musician that didnt release music?

at least those who survive axl will hear the music

no i do not wish axl dead or saying it won't come out before

I still have my 2002 Philly ticket stub for the show Axl was "supposed" to do.

Does that count as paperwork ?

Not in a legal sense, no.

hey were the hell is that damn street team , sir???

Never gets old, my friend.

Quite a filthy orgy going on in the Admin section these last 2 days. ?I'm a little nervous in here, I think I'll go back to minding my own business in the sheep thread.

Good thing I haven't been around for the past two days!  ;D

Spits water out of mouth..........lol

A complete and utter blood bath on Admin Avenue, that's fer damn sher. Looks like we all need some fresh air...

That explains so much "bringbackadler".

Now go post on some Steven Adler forum and please remember to talk about all the shows he has canceled with his band, Adler's Appetite.  : ok:




/jarmo

that doesn't translate into owing us an album release.

you might be attracted to my money, but unless i lend you some of it, you dont owe me anything.  (not implying i have a lot of money, but you get my point)

I think we all need a beer break......

Here you go!

 :beer:

 :hihi: :rofl:

nice siggy jim bob

What type of beer is that? you didn't pee in it did you?

Of course I did. And that's harder for me to do because I am a girl.

That what they have funnels for.   ::) : ok:

That's actually a damn good post Jarmo.  Most of it anyway. 

AND you didn't even have to insult people or tell them to Fuck Off.

Axl.

Now he's a touring musician again, which is good. Not a creative output one.

perhaps a Kool-Aid break.

Is it time for the aliens to come get us already?

Just about ......Put your hat on.

One must be patient.

I guess if I had to voice a complaint, it would be where there seems to be no middle ground.

U either worship or you leave.

To me that is not the way it should be.

Certainly people shouldn't be allowed to bash or spread bullshit.

But I don't think there is anything wrong with intelligent, honest opinions.

Dude.

Isn't that you?

ah damn............Homeboy bust you their , sir.


 :hihi: :hihi:

The "big guns" weren't released in 2006 like he basically promised?

You owe us an album!

This message board has supported you long enough.

That thread and all that feedback. Where's the fucking album?


 :rofl:


/jarmo

Yea, D, show us you big guns........hahaha

Fuckin sheep shagger! 

so...did the 'ship' come in yet? and is SLCHUNK coming alone this time?

SLCHUNK is invited, even if he hasn't released the big guns or not, he don't owe me a dayum thing.

Side note to Hunk: There is no ac issues on the spaceship-kewl enough to store milk.

Never let it be said that the evil dictator of this site and his cronies dont have a sense of humor.

 :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:


U fuckers! :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:


Give me a second while I remove the Tree from my ass.

If I could stay off this damn forum arguing with u assholes long enough, maybe I could do something. :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:

Do not feel bad hunk, I have gotten very little flooring done today, and I still have to be at the space ship for our weekly cult meeting in less than 90 minutes!

I'm just stunned that I made a thread titled "Fuck Off" and it stuck around for so long!

Aren't you are star!

^Hell no

back a couple years ago Pharmo and I would easily crack 100 posts a night. :hihi:

Compared to you - the brightest in the sky. 

Crazy ideas like that must be why you have -4 karma.? ?:hihi:



I just realized I'm quoting you twice...? Good posts, though.

I'm not sure how I feel about being "owed" anything.? I mean, we chose to be fans, right?? I really have never felt that "owed" is the right word.? ...On the other hand, Axl's been telling us this thing's been coming since, what, 1999?? I recall an interview with Kurt Loder, it might have been 2000 (I'm not so obsessive that I have *all* the dates memorized, just some of them).? He might not "owe" us an album, but as John Lennon sang, "Gimme Some Truth."

What I mean is, don't even mention a "tentative" date (yes, I know what tentative means, and I didn't take March 6 as gospel) if the album is apparently so far from release that we still haven't seen it 5 months later.? Maybe I was a fool to assume that "tentative" could be translated to "within a month or two."? ...And yes, I realize that unforseen complications could have happened.? That happens a lot in GNR land.? But I also recall a line in that same press release that claimed that there would be an update if the March 6 date was delayed.? Just to be clear, here's the exact quote:
In all seriousness, those unforseen delays must have been fucking serious for a tentative March 6 to turn into... well, you know.

...Sorry, off topic.? I'm not really that burned up about it, that's just the latest example.? ...In regards to what I put in bold in the quote above:? I don't know if Axl would "appreciate" you more, but he'd probably be less worried about you stealing his toilet water and keeping it in a vial around your neck, as a "Trekkie type fan" might do.? ?:hihi:

i sure as fuck ain't jumpin off no cliff for anybody.

Axl wouldn't let me go anywhere near the cliff's edge!

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Be honest Jim Bob

If Axl wanted u to eat pile of dog crap would u? If he said u could come and hang out backstage the entire tour what would u say?

"Where's the fork?"

fuck no dude.   i just respect Axl as an artist and love the music he has given me.   i wouldn't do anything out of the ordinary to gain his favor.    :peace:

^ Ha. Just kiddin man. :)

LIAR!!!!!!


I  would say "where's the fork and do u want me to wash it down with a cup of Goat Piss"

Shit to hang out backstage and tour the world with Axl and GNR I'd probably eat a turd everyday if he wanted me to. and U say Im not a diehard fan.

Well, each to their own!  ::)

Stolat won't make any new posts for five (5) days.

Every time the spamming occurs, I'll keep increasing the ban time.




/jarmo

 :hihi:  This all keeps getting better and better.  First 2 days, now 5.  If she continues to learn nothing from the experience, it could then be 10 days, then 20.....how long do you think it will be before she works herself up to infinity?  (not looking for an answer to that, just making a general observation). 

I think someone needs a new hobby.  :hihi:   I limit myself to these boards by jus checking them a few times a day for like 10 min.

It's funny how I'm a member here since 2002 and yet have less posts than stolat, who registered in April this year. :hihi:

Stolat is special.

You know that, right?

Like a 1-800 type of special?

Okay....

What just happened here?

 :confused:

Ditto, and I have less posts than both of you!

Fuck Off

No fucking Idea.

I think just about everyone, here, has fewer posts than Stolat!   It not total, than certainly average.  Who could possibly post 50 times a day?!? 

Yea, nice fuckin eye patch, matey! ^^^

 :o

You have no idea how hard it was to find even THAT!  But, thanks, oh fearless pirate leader!   :hihi:   

you're one of these "gotta support the team" guys, aren't you?

thats what i said a few pages ago. and got a lecture lol

And you're one of those "I visit sites dedicated to bands that I don't really like because I have no life" guys aren't you?

I mean, maybe you and mrlee support something that was around 17-22 years ago and hold on to the memories (or memories based on bootlegs and old articles)?




/jarmo

you have no idea what i do and dont support jarmo. unless your next step on the forum is mind reading youll never know. : ok:

Dude, you're chip is already in the mail. If you don't agree to surgery putting it in your skull, then... YOU'RE BANNED!

*in best american cop accent possible*...."jesus...."

i think we need to call team america ,communist china. :hihi:

damn I put the chip in my right ass cheek. Just below my Hello kitty tattoo.

lmao. i dunno where im gonna put the chip...if i can even bring myself to put it in...what am i gonna do...jesus....i say we start a revolution!!! HTGTH democracy starts now!  : ok: :rofl:

just kidding of course on the revolution bit..incase any mods dont get it...ahem.

I think we'll let the chip decide that.

viva la revolution  !!!!!!

no, i'd rather come to a board about a band i no longer like and complain on a daily basis and hold onto memories from 20 years ago and refuse to believe its no longer that way and seriously believe there are things I can do to change it.

mrlee you spam my private message box one more time i will forward each one of them to jarmo.  fuck off and leave me alone.

JB I would appreciate it if you stop spamming this thread. Might I suggest you PM mrlee if you have a message specifically for him and no one else?

I'd suggest you stop spamming this board. Period.  : ok:

Judging by your signature, you don't really feel at home here.


It must fucking hurt to know Guns N' Roses just finished a tour a few weeks ago.




/jarmo

Oh no Jarmo, I'm glad GN'R is having success and giving shows to places that haven't seen them in over a decade. I just respect who came before this line-up as well, and keep an objective view of it all. I believe that the current member isn't always the best member. Such optimism is lost on me I guess. Oh well, I survive.

Oh yeah, another "objective" fan.

You seem to have problems understand the concept of respect. We don't disrespect the accomplishments of the old band.

It's possible to have respect for both without living in the past and hold a grudge against the current band like you seem to do.



Judging by your signature and your attitude, you're a person who loves attention and thinks your posts are funny.


Just a friendly suggestion, change your signature to something that's not attacking the visitors of this board or the band in the general ASAP.

Otherwise your "objective" views will have to be posted somewhere else.

How's that for freedom? You can either adjust or leave.


For the 49276438494th time: I don't understand why I should have to come to a Guns N' Roses fan site and be met by posts by a group of people who obviously don't like the band! It just makes no fucking sense to me. I never started the site so you could have a platform to try to bring others down with your hate, whining and general misery.

It's got nothing to do with your precious freedom of speech. It's a fucking attitude.

Either you're here because you support the band (Guns N' Roses in 2007) or you don't post. If you can't support the band, just leave this board.

It's really that fucking simple.


If the name or the fact that certain people aren't in the band bothers you, go somewhere else.


It's up to you, but don't tell me what kind of board I should have.



I see many of you saying shit like "you want us to leave because we don't support the new band?".

Well duh!

Nowhere on the board does it say "Dedicated to the old line ups of the band".

Where did that misconception come from? Is it because you have an idea in your head that Guns N' Roses existed between 1985 and 1990, 1996 or whatever year suits your personal preferences (depending on your favorite band member)?


You could say "but it doesn't say this is a NEW GN'R site!". Yeah well, I never made difference between the different line ups like that.

Just like The Rolling Stones were The Rolling Stones in 1962, they're still The Rolling Stones in 2007.


It's Guns N' Roses whether you like it or not.

And we're here because the band obviously mean something to us. Yes, in 2007.





/jarmo

My signature does not apply to the current band at all. I made no comment about the talent of Frank. It apllies to a few, specific posters who troll threads about Slash and Duff and Steven and 'voice' their 'opinon' early and often to make it seem like their's is common opinion, when in fact it is not.

dude you weren't even a fucking sperm with the old band was around in their prime.   :rofl:   i agree with jarmo, lose the sig and lose the attitude.

So? What does my age have to do with anything?

Sometimes you can tell that a teenager is really acting like a kid.

Then sometimes it's the opposite.


The beauty of the Internet.






/jarmo

"I don't understand why I should have to come to a Guns N' Roses fan site and be met by posts by a group of people who obviously don't like the band! It just makes no fucking sense to me. I never started the site so you could have a platform to try to bring others down with your hate, whining and general misery."

I like the new band , but I prefer the old line up. If more people could just enjoy both bands everything would be fine. I don't know how many topics in the VR forum are ruined because the old GNR in brought up and random insults at scott are made.

dude for the last fucking time, its not about which version on the band you prefer.  this isn't a contest or a competition.  you are sitting there holding on to something that is no longer there and as a result you disrespect what we have now.

take your own advice.  and again, this isn't some contest.   Its all GnR.   But if you let your love of the previous lineups hinder your liking for this lineup, you are wasting your time.

I'm not disrespecting anyone by saying I prefer an older line up of the band to the new one? Its a matter of opinion now if i was like

" Teh  slash rule on bomblefeet YEEHHHH " thats different , I hold the regard of the new members high , they are talented. Insanely, Is BBF technically better than Slash on guitar of course,  but I prefer slash. I am not disrespecting anyone , what we have now is a great thing but I still rather throw AFD or UYI in than listen to Better. Of course I don't know what CD will sound like so I can't say much. Your last statement can be used both ways bro'

But if you let the love of the current lineup hinder you from liking the old lineups , you are wasting your time as well.

the old lineup doesn't fucking exist.  ::)    you are the one holding on to shit that is no longer there.

anytime you feel like joining us in 2007 now...  :yes:

You are being close minded not me. I never said the old lineup exists , i simply said I prefer the old one. I gave the new gnr props , i gave them credit and still you are on my case for preferring an older version. Some people like a certain era of stones , some people prefer the old skynyrd to the new , some people like a certain era of metallica , damn dude really what is your problem?

i'm not closed minded, i'm just sick of posters like you who come here daily to remind us that you aren't happy with this lineup.   You act like its some kind of competition and you are putting something that exists now up against something that was, and its retarded.  I am excited about GnR and the what the future holds for this band, and looking back and dwelling on the past, wishing it was 1987, is useless.

I don't come here to remind anyone of anything , I support new GNR 100%. I dont wish it was 1987 , I don't wish for a reunion , but i still prefer AFD era to this era.

But he didn't say that.? ???

Jarmo I am just curious as I am one that supports new gnr but has no problem with talking about the old band.   Why not get rid of any sections that deal with past members that way members here see that this board is 100% dedicated to the new gnr.  It might make less "confusion" for members here that want to talk about old GNR and make less stress for you.

if that happend people would start talk about slash and duff in the main gnr section instead of the dead horse section and vr section, wouldn't have been vey smart to do that  : ok:

There are plenty of Boards that are just dedicated to this incarnation of GNR.   They talk less about the old band than this board does.

Yes but this board has been around so much longer, and are so much more known..

Agreed but it just seems that Jarmo is fighting the same fight over and over, I was just curious if maybe that would ease up on the problem.

I don't  know if the removal of the old GN'R section would help. One could simply treat V.R. and other ex members ' bands as if they were non GN'R bands and the place of those bands would be in  Bad Obsession.... But one thing is great about keeping the forum the way it is : people post news about Izzy, Slash a.s.o. Information and discussion are therefore more developped than on  boards devoted to this "incarnation of GNR". This board is a great source of infos for members and for guests and I think that people just have to respect the forum rules and other people. Some use f-words too easily.  :-\

Because the majority understands.

It's just a little group of confused people living in the past that don't get it.

They also claim we disrespect the old band, whatever that means.





/jarmo

I guess that means that people feel that the old band shouldn't be shunned if you will, as they are the original GNR and there wouldn't be a GNR of today without them.? ?It may be a bit confusing that there is a section called, Wasn't Yesterday Great and yet, if that is mentioned it seems it's frowned upon, that may confuse people.? ?I guess if posts are in the appropriate sections then there shouldn't be a problem.? ?

I may not post here alot anymore but I do visit everyday and see that you are constantly posting the same thing over and over and just wanted to ask the question.? ?Thanks.

Wasn't Yesterday Great is a song by Gilby and it's sort of sarcastic since most of those guys who are discussed in the ex-member sections never had the same kind of success since leaving the band.


I don't know why that would confuse anybody into thinking the Guns N' Roses section is meant to be used as a way to bash the fans and current band.


/jarmo

Yes, everything is so unfair here. Like the way Jarmo will only let people promote similar websites 4 times with every post.

One question how come when you tell ME I disrespect the band thats ok , but if someone says they are disrespecting the old band , you say "whatever that means" it works both ways.

Do I have to spell it out for you again?

Seems like I have to explain everything to you.


If you come to a Guns N' Roses site to talk shit about the current band, you're disrespecting them. Easy.

If you come here with the attitude "the old band is better, I don't support the new band", you're on the wrong site.




Now tell me where I've disrespected the old band's accomplishments.

Please don't tell me it's because I refuse promote Velvet Revolver or Adler's Appetite bogus GN'R reunion show.




/jarmo

You see, a lot of people here will agree with and say the first part- but there are extremely few people who ever mention the second part. And those type of trolls are gone. Those two statements are very different, and I feel like you assume the second when you see the first.

Yeah but does the new girlfriend do and say things that the old girlfriend invented? Does she have the same name? Did she use pictures of the old girlfriend in her online dating profile?

I just don't see how saying I like UYI-era GN'R the most means I don't like CD era Guns or that I don't want CD era Guns to be successful. It's the same band, not any different than having a favorite album.

To give another analogy, I think that saying I prefer the UYI-era of GN'R is like saying on an NIN forum that I think The Fragile touring band was their best. Doesn't mean I don't want to see the YZ tour, and it doesn't mean I want NIN to go bankrupt because Robin and Danny aren't in the band anymore. And that comment is a common one on NIN forums. They don't force their members to prefer Jeordie White to Danny Lohner, and they don't censor people who think that the past was more fit to their personal preference than the present.

That's their choice.

Just because one site has their policy, doesn't make it the only right one.


Everybody has their personal preferences on what kind of site they want and reasons why they keep working on a site.

Some do it because they love the band, some do it to be popular, some do it to make money....




/jarmo

i dont care what your personal preferences are, but when people come here and remind us they like the old gnr more day after day, post after post, it gets really old.  its like, its not really about them anymore, because GnR is active and it is a slap in the face to guys like Tommy and Robin and Ron.

This is not the best analogy you could choose, C.C. Actually plenty of people have trouble to give a chance to N.I.N. 's new line up and those people are long time fans of the band. If you want a G.N.R. analogy, then here is a good one : let's say that Robin was to N.I.N the equivalent of what Slash used to be for G.N.'R. ?! ;D Oh and by the way, there was never any Tommy in N.I.N. ?;)

And when people say they think VR sucks in every single VR thread, how is that different? And don't give the 'it's a GNR site' excuse, because you don't go into the Bad Obsession area and post in every thread dedicated to a band you don't like.

And I don't see myself as a person who posts in every GNR thread saying the same pro-old band stuff over and over. In fact, I avoid most GN'R threads. But when new music happens, you will not find me talking about Slash and Duff. I am more than eager to hear the new band playing its music.

Besides, the most commonly attacked member of GN'R is Axl, and he's a part of all line-ups of GN'R. Most of us on here with frustartions, complain about what the new band does, not how they do it. I don't like that they play 8 AFD songs every night. But I don't have a problem with how they play them. So it's really not a diss that has anything to do with 'line-ups', it's just a complaint. One that the band ignores rightfully, because of course, they don't owe me anything except what I paid for, and that's what I got.

I just think that the very positive pro-new line-up look for old v. new fights where there aren't any. There have been trolls, but not as many as you may think, and I am not one of them.

But that doesn't work because Robin didn't right or record March of the Pigs or Closer or anything. He wasn't even in the band until its third album came out. He has zero writing credits with NIN where Slash has writing credits in just about every song GN'R is currently playing live.

this is not a vr board

yep, sure. Aaron North doesn't have any credit as well. Nevertheless it doesn't refrain people from saying that Robin is a better guitarist than him.  And the debate over musical  abilities is the same when it comes to NIN than when it comes to GNR : some people refuse to support the new direction of the band while some others simply accept it and support the band unconditionally.

who are you to talk shit about my life and me going to sites of bands I don't like!?...where do you get the nerve?....! :hihi:
anyhoo, that's not what Im doing here. seeing as Im a fan of what happened 17-22 years ago, and what has happened since then.

Yeah but why do you have to support unconditionally? Isn't that insane? You have to think and judge for yourself, it's not right to just say 'This is GN'R, so I like and agree with it.' And that's what unconditional support is. Blind acts with no thought.

If a band goes in a direction I disagree with, or lies to me, can't I say I don't like it without losing credability as a fan? Love it or leave it is a stupid principle. And only a sith deals in absolutes... accept of course in the matter of if there is try :hihi:

Sorry, got off topic... you guys argue like the pro-war US. I don't have to accept their lies.

You guys always say that the band doesn't owe you anything except the concert, merchandise, and albums you pay for. Well, I don't owe the band anything except the money it costs to buy those things either.

It is said that love is blind,? ;D

Pardon my lame answer,? but i 'd rather not say something which has been said over and over?: ok:

If you give what you are paid for, you don't owe anyone anything.

Well if you don't like it here, you can get the fuck out and go to a site that loves living in the past.

Or you can make a Velvet Revolver site and talk about how they are so amazing, and that how Contraband and Libertad are such amazing albums. By, releasing two mediocre albums.

The fact remains, the album (C.D.) will be released when it is released. Just because you release two trashy albums (like in Velvet Revolvers case) does not make you a better band.

So, if you don't like that people here support the new band and want them to succeed, HereTodayGoneToHell.com is not your site.

I am glad Jarmo goes hard on the reunion retards or the constant bitchers that plague this board sometimes like influenza!

It's their choice and also some of it has to do with the VR members themselves.

If you can't handle that fact that VR isn't considered a holy band on this site, too bad.



/jarmo

Funny two people now have accused me of worshipping VR. You don't know my opinon on VR. You could go search my posts for it, but you won't, so I'll just say it: I don't like VR. Contraband was ok imo and had a few good songs. Libertad is an awful album imo. Just because I don't like it, doesn't mean I want the section spammed with hate messages.

It's like when ChineseBlues called me a Scott nutswinger (and didn't get a karma point for it) because I advised him to not listen to VR or read about them if he didn't like them... you people assume too much.

you had a sig yesterday that was attacking a good portion of this board calling us all nutswingers and you expect people who tell you the same to get karma?  ::)

I got a karma point for that.

You have attacked pretty much anyone who has ever said even the slightest negative thing about scott, whether you like him or not that makes you a nut swinger. Deal with it.  : ok:

I defend him when people attack him merely by saying 'he's a fag queer and he sucks looks so gay on stage'. Which is more or less what you said. If you had a real criticism, like saying his lyrics were weak or that his vocal range wasn't very wide, I would not only have let it go, I would've agreed with you.

I'm gonna make an honest heartfelt post

If it pisses off people I respect like Jarmo and some of the other mods, I feel bad cause I owe a lot to all of u but I am gonna explain a thing or two.




I have supported Axl and his vision since day one and I have always given him the benefit of the doubt. ?My beef has never been with Axl or any member of the new band. I even started threads a couple of years ago stating WHY THIS BAND IS GUNS N ROSES.

I remember making posts supporting this band by stating "If u put in a 2002 boot compared with a 90 boot" u wouldn't be able to tell me who is playing what.

I totally supported this band and I still do but I am gonna admit something here for the first time:

People like Jim Bob and what has happened to this forum has almost made me come to hate this fuckin band and it has nothing to do with the actual BAND, its just the way some people on here act.

It started for me when people started blatantly disrespecting the old members to try and make this band seem more relevant and better than they are. ?They are a great band but Jesus Christ they have done absolutely NOTHING on their own yet.

Everytime I read these Zealot like posts it makes me wanna sling my computer through the fuckin window.

I love this forum, I will never leave it or badmouth it or badmouth Axl or Guns N Roses, but there has to be a balance cause GNR IS NOT only Axl Rose and u can't talk about the present without giving credit to the past.

I've accepted the fact and have embraced the new band, but people on here who desecrate the old band make me fuckin sick to my stomach.


Plus the Out of Hand Ass Kissing by members to Jarmo like they are his bodyguard or personal slave truly drives me up the wall. U can almost feel it in some of these people's post as if Jarmo or Beta or someone is gonna hook em up with a backstage pass when GNR comes to their town as long as they stay loyal and worship at the altar of Jarmo and Axl.

Backstage with Axl would be amazing, Id eat shit for it but I wouldn't sell my soul and I kind of feel like thats what is happening around here to a degree.

The mentality of "U support GNR 100 percent regardless or FUCK OFF" attitude is a HUGE Turn off.


This forum probably means more to me than anybody else on here outside of Jarmo. It was a place that literally saved and changed my entire existance.

If I had never found this website, I'd probably be dead right now or a 300 pound mental patient. People have no idea what finding this forum and the people I've met on here have done to change my entire life.

So I say all I've said above with love and respect to Jarmo and everyone but I can't keep these feelings inside any longer.

Hopefully they won't be viewed in a negative way cause that isn't how they were intended. Just honest observations from my perspective.

Sometimes you have to be blunt because some people refuse to fucking get it.


But that's how it is.

I don't need to read post after post about how the show last night sucked because of the setlist. You know, by people who weren't there!

I don't have to login here every day to read about how this isn't GN'R.

I don't need to see posts calling Axl a liar because he "promised an album to be out in March".


In addition, I don't need to log in and read posts calling Axl or any other band or crew members liars because you don't agree with what they said. Some of you are happy to believe magazines and journalists who have no idea about the GN'R camp, but you're also quick to dismiss anything that comes straight from the band as lies.




/jarmo

That's a crock of shit and you know it. I've stated time and time again that Scott's voice is shit and his lyrics are weak.

PS. Stop acting like a 12 year old and take that quote out of you're sig.  ::)

Stating his voice is shit is different then criticizing his range. And also you say that stuff over and over and its gotten rather boring.

Respect to D for opening up and tells how he feels


I too feel that this place kinda is on it's way to lose it because of some shitty things, it's not as fun as it used to be IMO it can be because i'm falling in to a fucking depression again and if i do i hope i can have this place to get my mind and thoughts away from my real life

I don't really care if it's gotten boring or not. As long as I'm allowed to post here I will post my opinions. And since I don't go around breaking the rules I don't see any reason why I won't be posting here in the future. So you're going to have to deal with it or find somewhere else to post, because me and my opinions are not going anywhere.  : ok:

same here,, That attitude of Support the new Gnr 100 % or fuck off is childish.. I love Gnr.. saw them last year 4 times, Traveled to see them,, but you guys are turning what used to be a great GNR board into a GNR vs VR board.. so, I cannot like the old members and the new ones at the same time?? ?can't I support both ?bands?? do I have to agree with every compliment new gnr keeps getting even though i dont agree>? fuck that.. ?

When Chinese Democracy is released, And yes I said WHEN cause I truly believe it is coming out, Are we gonna be forced to love every single song and not be able to say we don't like this or that?

Cause if thats the case I'm not even gonna bother with any threads if they have to be worship fests.


Jarmo I totally understand your stance on negativity for the sake of negativity, but to me, if a dude pays his cash for a ticket and isn't happy with what he has seen, Why is that viewed as being a hater or a non supporter? Maybe he just didn't like that particular performance?



Just check Jim Bob's posts

Its like everytime Jarmo posts, U see Jimmy Bob post right after reitterating everything Jarmo said.  Jarmo should get a fuckin leash to keep him on its getting so absurd.

As far as I know, constructive criticism to a certain degree never was the problem.

It's the lies and bullshit that is the problem.

Fair enough, you didn't like the show.

But to then say shit like "the band looked bored" or "everybody left" is just bullshit.


We're not interested in being a vehicle for people to spread bullshit about the band. That's what the newspapers and magazines are already doing.



/jarmo

You can't really say people saying the Band look bored was bull. The band may have looked bored to that person.

Awesome

I can one hundred percent agree with every bit of that.

Just like I supported your stance on the leaks etc etc.


I agree with Timothy to a degree.

I mean hell, the VR show I went to, Slash looked bored as hell, He barely fuckin moved, same with Duff. Doesn't mean I hate them or am tryin to hurt them, Just sayin my opinion they looked like they wanted to be anywhere but in Atlanta Georgia.

You mean when five other board members are saying how amazing and into it they were?



/jarmo

Yes.. It's all subjective

absolutely, majority isn't always right.

I guess for you the one Slash fan who went to the show with an agenda will be right and the GN'R fans who loved every minute are wrong...  ::)



/jarmo

Not saying either is right or wrong . Just you can't call their opinion bull shit.

nope, but it doesn't hurt to see everyones opinion.

Stating a lie in order to make the band look bad is fine with you?





/jarmo

How the hell can it be a lie if the person was their and that is what they seen?

Now if the person wasn't their and said that then yeah they are full of it.

    * S: (adj) exaggerated, overdone, overstated (represented as greater than is true or reasonable) "an exaggerated opinion of oneself"
    * S: (adj) exaggerated, magnified, enlarged (enlarged to an abnormal degree) "thick lenses exaggerated the size of her eyes"




/jarmo

And that can only happen if said person didn't like the show  or thought that some of the members of the band looked bored?

You could also say that some go the positive side of the field and make something sound better then it was.

Jarmo dont u do the exact same thing to VR and Scott though?

Its almost like u have drawn a line in the sand and its like GNR or bust and if u like VR FUCK OFF.

Wow. You really don't expect a bunch of GN'R fans to enjoy a show?

Holy shit. I thought it was obvious that a fan site isn't the place where you'll find the "objective" reviews.



Why is that such an issue to some of you?

It's like we're not allowed to say great things about the band.

Is it that old "haha, those losers are such ass kissers! At least I didn't like the show (or would never admit it in public)!" thing?



/jarmo

Jesus fucking christ.

Yes I would expect a buch of Fan to enjoy the damn show. Just say that hell some might want to but not.


Why is it such an issue if some one doesn't like something about Guns N' Roses? Does That make them any less of a fan?

Was does everthing have to be black and white with you Jman. Their is a whole vast amount of colors out their ,. 

The things we're discussing are pretty black or white.

Either you tell the truth, or you don't.



Maybe you really didn't understand how the Internet works. One guy posts something which isn't true and then somebody else copies it to another site and there we go.

"I heard Axl...."


Just earlier today I read that Axl had said he'd never perform Don't Cry again. I don't recall that and the poster couldn't provide a source. Yet he believed Axl had said that.

All it takes is one guy.....





/jarmo

I get what you are saying . But that senerio is quite then one we were talking about. So Yes it's a lot more then being only black and white.

How the hell can you tell a lie based on your own opinion about something such as what you thought of a show.?


Now I no that Next time I see guns in concert if it sucked and I didn't like too not say a damn thing . cause I will just be labeled a liar.

When I watch a boot, I will tell u, there are things I love, things I dont love so much.



Am I being a hater cause I dont particularly like all the guitar solos they use to do? It just seemed the momentum would get stifled cause the show would be kicking ass and the momentum would just drop cause of all the long solos but then again unless its Tommy Lee flying around the arena doing a drum solo, I don't really enjoy solos all that much.



As I was saying, I thought Slash and Duff appeared pretty bored at the VR show I was at even though other VR fans thought they kicked ass the entire night.

We had different opinions, Maybe my expectations were too high, I don't know but it happens.

I for one always found myself bored watching new boots once Axl left the stage.

Im not making up shit, its just how I feel.

You obviously didn't read what I said.

People often say shit to validate their "review". So a guy goes to a show knowing damn well that he won't enjoy it, but instead of admitting his bias, he'll post a review.

And in order to make his opinion more valid, he'll add "half the crowd left before the encores and the band looked bored".

Suddenly his bullshit is making his review seem legit. I mean, no wonder the show sucked right?


Then it turns out none of those things were true....



/jarmo

OH ok, Sorry

Yeah I agree with u on that, I know a bunch of people who hate something without even giving it a chance and that drives me crazy also.

Plus it could be the person watching the show. If they are tired, in a bad mood etc etc, they may not get the full experience. I honestly have a hard time believing a GNR show could be boring. If u are any kind of fan and see Axl in concert and don't enjoy it, U should definitely check your pulse.

So because some may do that  it mean all reviews that have something negarive to say are bull and full of lies?

All I am saying is that not everybody that didn't like parts of these show went their excepting to not like it.

I was answering the question about why I have issues with some of the so called negative reviews.

They are written by people with agendas.


They spend years here whining about the setlist, buy a concert ticket, whine more and use the "I went to the show, I know what I'm talking about" excuse.



I can't really see how a GN'R fan wouldn't like a GN'R show. You get to see the band you love play the songs you love. How can that be bad?




Last year, some of the whining was because they were "late". So on one night of the year, everything doesn't go according to your schedule. Is it that horrible?

It doesn't matter that you saw the show of the year, you just need to whine about one detail....


I don't understand those fans.




/jarmo

I agree with you Jarmo.

I don't think a fan would not like a show by the gunners. Saw them last year and it was easily in my top give shows ever.

With that being said. I do think that s sometimes you can be having a bad day and even a kick ass show might not seem as good is it really is. But that is the way you seen said show.

How come you statements are all one sided? It's some peoples choice to like a different line up gnr , and some of it has to do with the new gnr members. If you can't handle the fact that peoples opinions are different then what is wrong with you?

I clearly stated I support new gnr , the only problem is that for some reason it bugs you that I prefer the old gnr , I still support the new line up as I said.  I don't have to give blind loyalty to either VR or GNR

Oh wow.

I have no problem if you happen to think GN'R died when Steven was fired.

Fine, it's your opinion.


But don't come here because you're not welcome!




That's your choice.

You might just wanna think a bit about what you post here.




Like I've said in the past, you adjust to the place you're at.


You don't go sit among Yankees fans wearing your Red Sox jersey and yell "Yankees sucks!" or sit with English football hooligans in a German jersey yelling "England sucks! I know I'm right!".




/jarmo

Youre being an asshole for no reason now when did I ever say

"GNR died with steven was fired"

I've never sat here and posted " NEW GNR SUCKS" as you make it seem in fact quiet the opposite I said I respect them and that they are an amazing bunch of musicians. The only thing that bugs you is I have a different opinion , I prefer an older lineup opposed to the new.

Insults?  :no:


It's called an example. You can use it to prove a point.

If you actually had a point to prove, you might understand the concept.


You don't bug me! I couldn't care less what you prefer. Everybody here has their own opinions. That's thousands of things that apparently bug me.


But don't come telling me how I should run this site.




/jarmo

But what point are you proving , you make me out to be a gnr hating person who opposes the band as you said

You don't go sit among Yankees fans wearing your Red Sox jersey and yell "Yankees sucks!" or sit with English football hooligans in a German jersey yelling "England sucks! I know I'm right!".

I don't do that , if it didn't bother you what people preferred than we wouldn't be discussing this , because you could care less about what people think or prefer. When did I ever tell you how to run your site.

That I don't care what opinion you or anybody else has!

I respect the fact that people have different opinions and views.


It doesn't mean I have to invite everybody to our place and welcome them. Especially when I know they'll try to fuck things up for the rest of us.




/jarmo

Fair enough... But the thing is , as said before , I think when some one says

I like old gnr but support the new line up no matter what

only the first part is ever heard.... :peace:

I'd like to take a moment here and open up myself now... :peace:

Some maybe say I am a Axl nutswinger and all that since I am positive and stuff,
thats pretty fucking far from the truth actually.

I'm not very impressed with GunsN'Roses at all, I'm tired of the old albums, the new songs I'm bored with and I find the boots to be "ok".
God I LOVE the singer tho, it's amazing! :peace:

I hate how Axl doesn't scream at the opening of WTTJ too. And Jarmo just sucks for not posting anything about Buckethead here. :hihi:

Chris and Buckethead are some of the elements I find intresting, and Axl's voice. The others are great doing whats been done forever to me.
I could go on too, I like the prodigy a lot. Give them a baseplayer and turn the guitar louder...voila'

And in intensity, GunsN'Roses doesn't compare to The Prodigy live at all, AT ALL!

Now, all you people who talks about "constructive critisism"...do you really wanna hear me pipe off and whine how The Prodigy are better (they are)-
-and how it sucks EVERYTIME Axl doesn't do the opening scream to WTTJ? I could... ;D

For me, I just don't see any reason or feel for posting it. And I think most here are grateful for that :P
On a fansite, it's just natural code we post supportive, not to exlude being objective...but you get tired of the same peeps negativity time after time.
Nothing wrong being honest saying how you feel but balance is the keyword. :beer:
hi :wave:

I disagree, I've made it known that I think Lies is the greatest thing to come along since sliced bread, some people might disagree, and there might be an emotional attachment to that album for me but it gets the most play here. I love the old stuff, love the new ... what I've heard, and look forward to the future.

I wonder what people thought of the Yardbirds?

bazgnr - Thank you for putting into words exactly how I feel about GNR, especially the highlighted text regarding the current situation.? Quite apart from some excellent gig reviews, your post easily wins 'post of the year for me', so far.? ?;D? : ok:

When the touring is temporarily suspended and all goes quiet on the news front, it's exciting to think that the time is being spent progressing the album's release, even if the exact details of the work involved remain unknown.? I know some people would prefer a steady drip of information but actually I appreciate the silence because of the way in which this increases the anticipation and heightens the suspense of the album's eventual release.? To me it makes sense to keep it quiet until all is ready to go, so that none of the launch impact is lost.

I feel, like you, that the live shows and new material point to a new and glorious era in the history of GNR and hope that the media is capable of putting prejudices aside and really giving the music (and the musicians) the opportunity to win them over.? The old and cynical part of me realises that this is unlikely to happen but, until it becomes a reality, I refuse to let it dampen my spirits and optimism that GNR will reign triumphant again.

the lateness was an issue for me, and as far as i could tell, everyone else who booed because the band were late.......


to all those who defend the lateness or whatever...ask yourself this.

"if i was supposed to meet someone at 9 pm at a bar or something, and they didn't show up till 11 pm / 11.30 pm, would i be happy and accept them with open arms, "all is forgiven now??"

the answer, is "no"

its human nature to be pissed at somehting like that, and at the end of the day Axl is human, not god, and therefore must expect people to be pissed off when he / the band is late.

another question, i wonder what would happen if Tommy turned up late. Think, the band ar all there but no axl, no tommy.....Axl walks in about 1.5 hours late and says "lets go", the others say tommy aint here yet, tommy turns up an hour later....and doesn't say a word.........do you think Axl would be "cool" with that??

again the answer is "no"

but that is precisely what Axl does everytime.....there was a link to a video posted here a while back it had proper pro-shot footage of the new band backstage waiting on Axl at the stage door, and axl swanned in, in a limo walked down the corridor, didnt say hi and just walked out to the audience and the band followed, i dont get it! i would go fucking nuts!

but hey its Axl so "thats cool"
 :-\

at least have some dignity people, i think that all we have left at the moment, because patience is wearing thin

Dude, don't wait on me. :beer:

No it isn't.

That clip made it seem like that's the case.

There was even an article (http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/news/shownews.php?newsid=1778) on gunsnroses.com which mentions Axl being there hours before the show.





/jarmo

That video was from Madrid.

Dude, I was at that show.

Axl was there in the afternoon soundchecking with the entire band.

So, that was bullshit. The sound on that video wasn't perfect, and most people even thought that Mayhue pushed Bumble aside so that Axl could walk "all over him".

That wasn't the case at all...

Don't judge until you watch the entire video, a small bad quality sample is not the best way to judge a band...

ok, i didnt realise that the video was a poor represenation of what goes on behind the curtain, but it was just an aside to the main point of my post.

axl would be pissed if tommy was late or whatever.....al i am trying to say is, the lateness is an issue for the majority of the crowds on the gigs i was at.......and rightly so imo.

That actually depends.

By now most GN'R fans know that they'll watch a late rock show with this band.

Damn, people knew it back in 1993, they wouldn't know it now?

I understand that some might get pissed off, but that's how it is.

So what? One night of the year you get to watch a great band and the show is a bit late...

Live with it and enjoy the show.

Yeh, that's the thing about Rock N' Roll - learning to think outside the square you live in.

Geez, when you are married with kids and working 9 to 5 - memories such as staying up beyond curfew to hear a really cool band will become precious to you!

The Rock N' Roll movement in the 50s was all about rebellion!

there's being rock n roll, and then there is generating bad press for yourself all the time.

but then again some people say all press is good press, matter of opinion i suppose....


for the record, Stolat, you are the most annoying thing to ever happen to this board......ever, and some annoying things have happened her before!



over and out!

come on, horsey and skynyrdgirl are/were pretty annoying too, there's also others who are more annoying then stolat (not saying stolat isn't annoying :hihi:)

As are you.

i knew someone would say that, damn it really did hurt :crying: ::)

btw, i never claimed i wasn't annoying : ok:

Well, CJ, looks like we'll just have to be annoying together!  : ok:

I didn't say you were a hypocrite.  : ok:

I know its great GNR are out there touring

but still

We want an album

Tour is good and all but what everyone truly wants is the album and THEN a tour.


My whole thing is, if the album isn't finished, why tour when u could be working on the album?  What was the point of cancelling all those dates in January if the album didn't get finished?


I think Axl should give us another update like he said he would if the March deadline wasn't met.  Axl wouldn't get so much flack if he didn't keep everyone so in the dark about everything.

meh, he gets flack either way.  axl is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.   of course theres no pleasing some people.    i agree a statement would be cool, but you know as well as I do its going to be analyzed sentence by sentence by a bunch of GnR fan forum geeks for weeks and months on end and yes he's going to get flack no matter what he says.

^
I dont agree Jim


Remember when That statement first came out or anytime a leak has surfaced?


IT GOT EVERYONE ON BOARD

I dont remember reading many negative posts *unless they were deleted* at all when he gave that statement or anytime a leak has surfaced.

People want to love Axl, he just has to let us.

yea everyone pretty much got on board for the first day he released the statement in December, for like a day or so.

Do what now?

Say what??? :confused:

he means people are willing axl to do well, and hopeing that he has more success, but he just has to open up a bit and allow more "significant" press releases, even to say, "were in talks to do...blah blah" or "there some legal shit i cant talk about that is holding things up...." etc etc.

even if he said, "after a heavy touring schedule we're having a break for 6 weeks, then we're getting back together to see what needs to be done to get the record out..."

better that than the tour updates: "Today Tommy took a shit on the tour bus......but evryone knows thats not allowed! but he's just so rock n roll...we're the most dangerous band in the world..."? ? :rofl:

if there was more communication, there would be less negativity...

Axl, i love you so much and I just wish you'd let me love you like I need to.  :-[ 

 :o I hope that was sarcasm or thats the single most FUNNIEST thing I've ever read on this board hahahaa

it wasn't sarcasm.

nah i just didnt' want D to feel weird or nothin  :D

i think D means if he would release the album then everyone could love him, but until that time people wont get fully on board.  thats what i think he means anyway.

Ok, if I were Gay I would choose Axl :P

...love him?

download his album?

Spank the monkey?

Drink beer and get laid?

Axl gets hated on so much because he has been working on the same damn album for 12 years now on top of keeping the Guns N Roses name although he is the only member left.


Once he releases the album he will get all the praise in the world cause the album is gonna be excellent.

Till he releases it though, hardcore fans of the Old band will have something to bitch about and have valid complaints.



Im not asking for Axl to be Jon Bon Jovi and go on Oprah and do meet and greets with fan club members etc

but a statement every once in awhile wouldn't kill him and would go a long way to winning over the most cynical old school Guns fan.


Axl can crush a lot of the negativity and naysayers with a great album. Until he releases it, some of the negativity will be justified.

 :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: VERY well put! I found nothing wrong with that statement its exactly what its going on right now.

I don't think he gives a rat's ass what anybody thinks. If that is the case, then he probably isn't concerned about negativity or naysayers. From his POV touring is progress, not perfection. Which is sufficient enough for most of us.

i must agree album would be great no album makes me mad..... but tour..... tour takes the edge off..... kinda like screwing around when the gf is away..... lol

Oh, the old 'has a girl in every port' line...... ::)

you better not be!

nope......just many in the same port...... didnt you know were country over here.... we get into a unfulfilling relationship then we meet someone that we want to screw so we try to screw em....sometimes it fails... sometimes it works...... other times we just masterbate :D

There's been a few this year :peace:

Where?

Concerning the album

I honestly don't care about a tour 6,000 miles away as much as I am the actual album.  I've heard the songs they play live enough

I want an album!!!!!!!!!

well those fans 6,000 miles away definitely care.   and i thought you haven't seen the band live yet?   you can't compare youtube clips and bootlegs to going and experiencing this beast in person. 

damn i hope they come vegas again soon.

Well if they continue just to tour , Axl won't get respect , because going out there and playing old gnr classics and a couple new songs isn't gonna cut it in a lot of people's eyes. Either axl is gonna release this and crush everyones crits and their bad mouthing or he is gonna release it and it'll be a flop. Which would be really sad actually! But I doubt it'll be a flop. Sure axl is on tour with the band and they are doing good and what not , but at this point an album almost feels essential. I'd go see them , mostly to see Axl belt the hits out , but I'd go see them none the less  :beer:

there isn't a GnR fan alive who wouldn't love to see the band playing all the classics.   There are some who are too closed minded to accept the fact that certian people are no longer in the band and refuse to give it a chance.  fuck those people, they are the ones missing out.    the members in the band all joined as members of Guns N' Roses and they are going to play Guns N' Roses songs for as long as they tour.  new songs and classic songs alike.     I'll go see the band whenever possible, album or not.  anyone who would skip the opportunity to see the band either isn't a huge GnR fan or is stuck somewhere in 1987 and can't find their way out.

That is true , if you'd skip on GNR than you may be mentally retarded lol. I mean honestly I'd love to see this band establish a name for themselves ( I don't know how to explain ) like I want them to make their classic hits so that when i go to a concert no longer will it be to see an AFD or UYI song , but a CD song you know. Plus a lot of nay sayers can't really have anything to say when CD is released , because I'm sure with Axl and Co on board its going to be a good album.

i want to see them make some more classics songs too, but that isn't going to stop them from playing the old classics, and i dont think it ever will.  my opinion of course, but Axl kept GnR alive for a reason and as long as he is using the GnR name he'll probably also be using the GnR catalog. 

Well of course not , who wouldn't want to see Axl sing Jungle , Paradise City , Nightrain , and countless other songs. I want to see a bigger new gnr song to old gnr songs ratio is all im saying. I want to go see the show and say man I can't wait for them to play - insert new song here- rather than an old one. Because right now everyone but axl and dizzy are playing stuff made by other people , while they add their own to it no doubt its not the same when you have your OWN songs , with YOUR parts , I mean seriously can you even begin to fathom what these guys could come up with?!

It was a "kind of" apology for not meeting the tentative release date, gunsnroses.com
I know it's not what you wanted :hihi:

And some other statements, that didn't focus on the album...i\m getting mighty imptaient too :peace:

Nice Reading Comprehension Jim Bob, I said I don't care about a tour COMPARED TO THE ALBUM BEING RELEASED.


I am glad they are touring but it's time for the album to come out.

If they finish this tour and still don't release the album, to me that is just insane.

you should go see them next time you have a chance yo

Is that $12.99 really burning that big a fuckin hole in your pocket?

We've already heard like six full new awesome live-boot/DLMF songs.  Put those six on a writable cd, pick something from the "my CD artwork" thread and ... presto!!!... you have a cd in your hands.  Or better yet, download them with video from the concert boots too and make yourself a dual-disc!!!

Let the artists themselves decide if/when/how they want to get us to give them our money.

That being said .... To actually witness for yourself the phenomenon that is the magnitude of Axl's stage presence is something that hopefully all GNR fans have the opportunity to experience at least once in their lifetime.

No Offense but if u think CD is just worth 13 bucks.................


WOW

The boots aren't gonna compare to the FULL ALBUM

Not to mention videos, interviews and all of the other stuff that goes a long with an album release.



Touring is great

but I want an album!

I have the feeling that everyone here fully understands by now that you want the album...

But if you repeat it 1000000 more times, maybe Axl will send it to you before it gets released...

Sounds like you're more interested in all the "fluff" instead of the actual songs.

No offense to the band but if they think I'm paying more than that for a plain album then they'd better think again.? I'll pay extra if a dvd comes with it but I'm not paying anything above what is an average price for any album.? And I'm gonna check around for who has it at the cheapest price.? And I'm not gonna buy three copies of the same thing if the only difference is one comes in a red sleeve and one in a white sleeve and one in a black sleeve.? Chris Pitman better not think he's buying his Ferrari with my money while I'm driving around in an 18 year old car.

As far as interviews goes, they're nice but they're usually "scripted" answers that are repeated over and over and over to each different interviewer.? It's not like we're gonna get the real stories behind the meaning of every note or lyric written anyways.? And I hate feeling the what I'm reading/hearing is someone who has "mastered the art of faking sincerity."? Like do you really believe that Baz didn't know that Axl was gonna call him while he was doing that Trunk show?

Videos are cool but usually there's only like two or three made per album so IMO they're really not a big deal cause I'd much prefer watching the boots of the guys performing the songs live in concert and watch their interactions and goofs and rants.

So you can keep all the bells n' whistles.? I'm enjoying the new songs that are out there!!!

Thats the beauty of Axl though, I can't recall a time Axl has ever been scripted. Thats part of what makes him so great, just the realness that is Axl Rose and how he has never cared to tell the truth and be candid.

in defence of D, everyone knows jim bob is 100% behind gnr 2007 and anyone who doesnt should "fuck off or get on board" and all the rest of his repetative rants yet he keeps saying it because he wants to get his oppinion across like D does to people questioning him.

in defence(sp?) of myself, everyone knows you are 100% behind spamming peoples private message boxes because you dont like their posts. yet you dont really support the band anyways, so you should be told to fuck off.


edit: its "get on board or fuck off", I obviously haven't been saying it enough.  :smoking:

i sent you 5 messages once. of random stuff, because i think your an asshole. big deal. that was a week or so ago and thats all ive done, so if you wish to bullshit ok, why not post all the messages then people can see the messages were just random shit. i dont care, half the people here think your a troll anyway.

i do support the band, ive seen them live, i wouldnt have gone to see them and paid as much money as i did on ebay otherwise.

Jesus loves you

I think lots of people are trolls here but I don't pm them random stuff...

like i give a shit if you think i'm an asshole?   if i bother you that much, ignore me.   its simple.   only a stupid little kid would do something like that.

good for them, they can suck my dick.  i'm here because I'm a GnR fan, and thats more than what can be said about many who don't like me.  I'm not here to be your internet "friend" or anybody else, I'm here to talk about my favorite band.  I dont give a fuck about you.

well it would be nice, to be able to post something or read other peoples posts without the same bullshit replies from you over n over again. we get your point, so stop acting like your a moderator round here n shut up for once? ok if someone posts "ron fucking sucks" granted you should reply, but when someone says theyd like a reunion but they dont mind gnr2007 then we dont want the same get on board or fuck off, im gonna try copy jarmos posts, off you.

Thats all i have to say.

fuck a reunion.  i'm just as entitled to voice that opinion as anyone who is still sitting around on a GnR board 10+ years later crying for a classic gnr reunion.

I think Jim BoB Aka;James Robert has a kind face and probably a warm heart as well.  I don't think he's an asshole and either way I don't want to suck anyone's dick.  That would be just wrong baby.

and everyone else is entitled to an opinion as anyone who is sitting around thinking just because the new GNR line up is in the present in must kick more ass than any other GNR version or any other band.


 :beer:

Thats the problem Jimmy Joe Bob


U and the Full time GNR supporters can HAVE YOUR OPINION but Axl forbid someone else have a slightly different opinion. When someone does u guys go to shit with your Get on board or fuck off bullshit.

I am probably a bigger Axl fan than u.

Being a fan doesn't mean worshipping at the altar of Axl and driving around with a picture of him on your dashboard.

Guns N' Roses isn't all about Axl.  Theres 7 other guys in the band and some people seem to forget to give them respect.   You may very well be a bigger fan of Axl, I'm not in competition with anyone on whose the bigger fan.   

Well it would be nice to not read your predictable posts about 'sleaze' metal and bands wearing lycra having a cool image, and how sweden's the best place for music right now.

(By the way, it's really not.)

Spamming peoples inboxes is fucking low and you should grow up or go somewhere else.

Fairly easy to do when you prohibit most  (if not all) of the most pressing questions.

i sent him 5 messages. once, big deal. why dont you grow up and stop jumping on every person in the forum with your provocative moderating style.

I don't jump on everyone, just the people that behave unbelievably stupidly.  Oh, and the people I think are narrowminded fools.


Congratulations, you're both.

im not narrowminded, you just believe that anyone who doesnt like what you like is narrowminded.

i dont need to argue with you, you bore me, your tactics prey on provoking people costantly, you were sad enough once to go into the VR section and start arguments there. Say and think what you wish, but your ways of moderating here are immature. End of conversation

No, you just feel the need to lambaste other types of music and people without reason.  That's not narrowminded at all.

You're a totally open guy! : ok:

When I think of AdZ provocatively moderating I can't help but picture him smiting you while wearing a thong.

Not sure if your open mind could handle that image, mrlee :)

I'm not sure anyone's mind could handle that image!!!? :nervous:

And there I was was trying to ignore the piture painted by Destry.........only to have it brought up again!? :confused: :P

LOL  :rofl:

if that was a way of offending me in some form or way i dont know but it was damn funny either way.