Here Today... Gone To Hell!

I know, this is not a new discussion. And no one can actuelly give an answer on when Guns N Roses next album will be released.
Guns N Roses has been touring alot the last year. Starting with the NY dates, and then a great amount of Europe, and US dates.
After a couple of months break, GNR are now on the road again, playing for sold out arenas in Mexico, Austrailia and soon NZ and
Japan. New songs like Better, IRS, Madagascar, Chinese Democracy, The Blues is played live. This is also songs that have made the
way to the internet. At least Demo versions.

The strange thing at this point. Is the release of the album. Most of us, saw a glittering light at the enda of a decade long tunnel
last year, when GNR was back with full streangth. They went back to the studio to finish it up. We know they have been doing
final mixes of the album. This is what we know to this date. Its been a couple of months since the news, that the releasedate had
been delayed because of varius problems with booking time to finish the last minute stuff. I guess this is things that happens to
almost every bands. But what kind problems can be delaying the album further?

We know the band have a hadfull of shows left this summer. And who knows, maybe they are planning on doing more shows around
the world troughout 2007. But when will the cd drop? And when will we get any information on it?
Will there be more leaks before we can find it in the recordshops? I really hope not! It would be kind of sad, if there was demos
of every song. on the cd, even before we had a release date. We know there is more demos out there, and that some of the demos
dont represent the final mixes on the record. But what is really holding the release back?

This is no critic to GNR at all, and i dont care when they release it, but i will be very happy when this information, a single, or even a
artwork booklet is confirmed.

It will be interesting to see whats going to happend after the Japan dates. Maybe this is GNRs plan. To play the hell out of the current set
all over the world, before they start fokusing on the new stuff. I dont know. This is just pure speculation. And i think that it is really important for them
to give the Gunners all over the world? a good old GNR show. Before they start blowing out more new songs. Who knows. Maybe the setlist and stage
performance will change alot! The setlist played by GNR now, is FUCKING AMAZING! Reading review on this site, makes me think about GNR exactly one year ago, when they played in Oslo, the most amazing show i have ever seen.

But then again. Is the album ready now? Are we standing at the end of the old gnr era, with a new era right infront of us? But time has made us blind,
and made some of us belive this will never happend. And then! Then it all happens!
Anyway. i have lost time perspective in the GNR world. I do belive it will be out, but i dont check the messageboards or websites for a releasedate anymore. I check them to get some kind of info about the tour. But im pretty sure the shock will be big, when we suddently will get a real realease date.
And the waves set in motion. It will be unreal. But will it happen this year? Next year? Or maybe tomorrow? I guess its impossible to even make a
good guess at this point.

To everyone with a ticket in theyr hands for the world tour! You have a great fucking expirience infront of you! Dont throw it away with any "setlist wishes" Cuz any fucking moment on this show is magic! Even if u get to hear rocket queen or not.? : ok:

hi that post has no point

i predict this will be deleted

nice try tho i guess :(

The topic should get changed any way... Come on Nytunz, you should know better than posting titles like that... Getting our hope up and all  :no:

Just so you know, it's not the Chinese Democracy tour.

If it was, I'm sure they'd be playing in Europe and North America too. They're just playing for people who haven't had the chance to see the band yet.

Fans in Mexico, Australia, New Zealand and Japan don't deserve anything less than those of us who happen to live in Europe or North America.


I'm still very confident that the album will be out as soon as possible. I've always believed that.

I also suspect that once the album is out, we'll see the Chinese Democracy World Tour promoting it.





/jarmo

Well, thats exactly what i was wrighting.
But i belive it has been called "chinese democracy world tour" varius places

I know it was called that in Australia and New Zealand. But wasn't in Mexico or Japan because those places have different promoters.

As far as I know, none of the t-shirts sold out the shows call it that.




Unfortunately these kinds of things create confusion.

Soon somebody will hold it against the band "for calling it the Chinese Democracy World Tour" when they didn't.




/jarmo

Yeah, i think its  already been done some places. But its something the promotors should take on theyr bill. Coz yeah, it is confusing.
I think the album will be released when its ready. There is no reason to release it before it is. Thats why i dont complain about it.
But what can be holding it up, when it has been so close to be released?


Well, you can say that this post has no point. But when will anything GNR related have a point i some people eyes? When we have a releasedate? When anything big happens in the GNR world? I think the current tour is a big thing. And im happy for the people who get to see them. It seams like the good old discussions about what GNR actually is doin right NOW! dont mean anything to some people (not talink about you).

promoters in japan are handing out fliers with the photos of the old band.
sure thing its confusing.

hopefully the album will drop soon.
because I'm interested  in hearing the music, not reading tour updates from Iowa.

it's kinda confusing when they dont bother to mention the album at least once since february.
it seems like the album is farther from release than it was a year ago, when there was so much "signs" of it actually happening.



I think we had those threads after the 2002 tour.
and without a doubt, that was a chinese democracy world tour.

at some point you would have to think that the rest of the band is going to get sick and tired of playing other people's music when they have an entire cd of their own music that they are not playing live for the most part....it makes them look like axl's hired guns more than actual members of their own band......i want to see robin jam out to his own shit, not slash's.....the cd needs to be released before any more live shows are performed and hopefully the next tour will be primarily new music

agreed . these guys are way too good to be playing mostly cover songs.....they are so talented and they need the new material to show that they are capable of doing more than covers and we all know they sure are....just hope they get that chance.....

They will be fine as long as they get their paychecks

Then that means they did. They called it that in at least those two countries, calling it something else in Mexico doesn't change that. I know my ticket said "Chinese Democracy World Tour". I don't have a problem with it being called that either btw, I'm just saying lets not re-write history.

exactly. promoters get the name of a tour from the band. the promoters are not internet nerds like us and dont know what the name of the album is. the scan of tickets i have seen all say "Chinese Democracy World Tour" on it.....

Prove it!


I know what I was told by several people who I consider more reliable in the matter than you. Just prove what you're saying for once instead of repeating your opinion as a fact.





/jarmo

I'm not being a smart arse so dont take this the wrong way but were you told that Guns N' Roses said it was cool for the promoter to call it the chinese cemocracy world tour?


 :peace:

Ask ibelieveinaxl. That's what he claims.



I'm saying that's not the name of these shows.

As far as I know, even the t-shirts they're selling at the shows say World Tour 2007.




/jarmo

Promoters say what they want. Those japanese promoters even used old band's pics to promote those shows. That's just ridiculous. ;)
Here in Brazil, idealite says they're trying to confirm Gn'R here. They're using new band's pics, they found a lot of cool pics. Is that hard for promoters to do that? Don't think so. Even if they'll not bring Gn'R to Brazil, they're working, not getting old pics to promote the show (that might happen - I hope so).

So is what your saying that the band has no control, veto or authority over what name the tour is given?

Is it really all 100% up to the promoter? Surely at some point the band or someone in management would be at least told about what a show was being called?

So when my ticket says "Guns n Roses - Chinese Democracy World Tour" - the band was in no way aware that the show was called that? I mean even if a promoter chose that name, if the band didn't object then surely that would be because they are "ok" with the tour being named that.

If the situation is otherwise, it means hypothetically the promoter might have called the tour "Guns N Roses -  Giant Popcorn of Gold World Tour" or something else - even something offensive and your saying the band would come on and play no problems? and no one would be fired for this?

I don't see the apparent need to distance the band from the name of the tour. I know its embarrassing for us fans that the album isn't out yet. But playing with semantics like this won't help.

ITs not like we're going from something bootleg here, the official tickets to the shows named the tour "Chinese Democracy" and to my knowledge the band did not make any announcement that this was wrong. If it is...well its bad business to say the least.

memo to jarmo...look at the tickets and this guys post. whether you like it or not, the tour is the "Chinese Democracy Tour." sorry if that pisses you off but it is what it is...go ask beta about it....

if it's not the CD world tour... how is it called?

"japan australia mexico new zeland africa  tour"?

or "the world tour minus europe and north america" tour?!

or "this is not a world tour" tour?

and here's a question..
does a band have to visit every country in the world if it wants to have a world tour?

You keep going on and on about it, yet you provide no facts that the band is calling it that.



Where's the proof? Where's your proof that the band has indeed called it that?


Please show me the proof. It's all I've been asking for ever since you started the whole "the band has told the promoter" shit.

It's a very simple request.

It's not about whether or not I like it. I'm stating a fact.

You keep stating a lie over and over again. You refuse to acknowledge the fact that your opinion is wrong and it's not based on facts.

So instead of admitting that you're wrong, since you can't even prove the opposite, you just keep calling me a liar.

You obviously are clueless if you think I'd start lying just to prove you wrong. I couldn't care less about what you think of me. But you're repeating a lie about something you have no idea about.



I don't care about the tickets, which aren't printed by the band in case you didn't know..... Just show me one simple piece of evidence to back up your claim that the band is indeed calling these shows The Chinese Democracy World Tour and they told the promoter that's the name. Please.

Thank you.





/jarmo

I think you're pointless. You can't justify the fact that they're touring again without cd just because their tour got a different name: the 2002 tour was "The CD world tour" the 2006 tour was "The CD world Tour"... This year is "No Cd Tour 2007" ok(but this change seems to me just a step back), but they play the same songs they used to play during the tours before ?. So they can go on callin' it CD Tour or no Cd Tour, and they can go on for years and years this is not the point. They are not touring to please some fans that haven't had the chance to see the band yet (yeah, maybe in 2030 they will play in Guadalupe, just to please those fans, right?), they're touring to make a lot of money playin' old songs, and they're doing this since 2001.
C'mon this is not the band wich is expected to play vintage songs, this is the band that got to play Chinese Democracy, you can tell people al the stories you want, but the truth is that Chinese Democracy is still a big utopia, and that's why they've made this step back.
I remind you that Axl Rose unce upon a time said: i don't wanna be linked up forever to AFD. Well,  20 years after he's still playing it.

I dunno what's the big deal about the name. IMO, it's more just a reason for those who wants to whine about something...

As far as I know, Idealite is not even a real company - they don't have CNPJ, which means they are not legally registered. How can they do that if they claim to have years of promoting shows in Rio?

It's amazing how so many international websites are still repeating the bullshit created by Idealite, stating them as the biggest Brazilian promoters. They don't even have a real cast.

you're way too aragant and confused and a hypocrite. you say im a liar because i disagree with you.....on this board, anyone thats says something that you dont agree with is either wrong or a liar or both.....

Funny, because a lot of Mexican and Australian fans are very happy to have seen them this month.


As far as I know, Metallica are also gonna play some shows this summer. But they're not calling it the "New Album World Tour" either. Odd.....




/jarmo

who gives a crap about metallica..this is guns n roses....plus, i think its great that they are touring...its awesome and its cool those people got to see them play the same setlist since 2001...

No, I'm not arrogant. I just asked you nicely to back up your claims.

You have failed time after time after time.


Why do you keep ignoring my simple request?

If you make some kind of claims or post your personal opinion as fact, don't be surprised if you get asked for proof.

It's just common sense.


Now, please tell me why you refuse to back up your claims with some facts? If you're so sure about what you say, I don't think that's gonna be a problem for you. Right?


So once again:

Just show me one simple piece of evidence to back up your claim that the band is indeed calling these 2007 shows The Chinese Democracy World Tour and they told the promoter that's the name. Please.




/jarmo

Yeah, because all of them were at the 2001 shows on Vegas and Rio. ;)

i dont know what you want for proof. what proof do you have? you talked to beta, etc??? i dont have a signed letter from axl about this. i have spoken to my promoter and label friends that are very close to this situation...so, i guess if i dont have a letter from axl, then im a liar....

But Metalicca are expected to play old song because they're are Metallica 3/4 of them are still there after 20 years. This "new" gnr wrote CD so we want to listen Cd, not AFD...It's good to see Axl playin old songs,just like VR do, but this band got to play CD.

exactly. this version of gnr needs to play and produce the new stuff.....im sure the new guys (and axl) are sick of playing the old stuff no doubt....just like axl said in 1989 "i want to bury appetite."

So, you can't prove the band is calling it that and that they told the promoter to use that name.

But yet you keep repeating it as a fact.


Why?



/jarmo

can you read? i just told you how i know. but i dont have a signed letter from axl about it. you act as though you are the only authority on the band...well, you're not. tell us all how you state it as a fact that the tour is called what you say it is??? you just state a conclusion: since jarmo said it, its fact...sorry, im not gonna buy that...im not a jarmo yes man i just told you my proof, let's here yours. you never stated yours.........sorry, bud.

Well if you knew anything about me, you'd know that I don't lie just to argue with people (including you).

I know what I know because I heard it from a very reliable source.



I don't consider myself an authority on the band. Those are your words.

I do take some offense to being called a liar by somebody who couldn't back up his claims with facts.



So next time you wanna have a pissing contest with me, you might wanna keep in mind that I'm not gonna be in the fucking thing if I know I'm gonna lose before it's even started.  :)



/jarmo

so you know a source??? wow that was really powerful and compelling proof.....and you do consider yourself an authority...you just backed it up by saying if you know anything about me (inferring you know all because of your "sources") well, im not buying it...im no authority, but ive been around the band much longer than you , but i dont have a website where i can delete posts and bash opinions that i dont agree with....

I think you're both wrong talkin about the fuckin' name of the Tour. Who gives a fuck about that? Really...We really got nothin' better to do than talkin' about this?

This is more interesting:

1)The abscence of any reference to Chinese Democracy underlines that Chinese Democracy is far from to see the light
2) " ? ? ? ? ? ?" ? ? ? ? ? ? ? " ? ? ? " ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?" ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? doesn't mean: we do this to please some fans who are very happy to see us; we do this  for the purpouse of makin' a bunch of money thanks to the name gnr or the axl persona.
3)People today follow this band because of the expectations they got on chinese democracy,this is the only reason of the surviving of this band, and speculating on the gnr name and goin' on with the delay of cd is very sad and boring: they will be a band when they'll play their material, not something that someone else wrote 20 years ago.

http://www.proboards.com/index.html

 : ok:

i agree with you, totally. this thread just got out of hand when i agreed that the band is calling the tour a certain name...the bottom line is that it is great they are on the road and it sucks the cd isnt out.....

Hey, congratulations! Good for you. :)



Yes, if you knew anything about me, you'd know that I don't post rumors and state them as facts.

Meaning, if I correct a rumor and say it's false. It's probably because I checked with somebody and not just because I think it's false. You know?


If I think it's false, I say so. "I think this is false because....".



I'm sorry about your lack of a web site for all those moderating needs. Not much I can do about that though.





/jarmo

no problem about the lack of a website, but thanks for your concern. i just keep (attempt to) you honest on this one for now...

I used to work as a promoter and it is possible for the promoter to name a show or a tour but If the band doesn't like it then it wont be named that. I never worked on something anywhere near as big as GN'R but I'm guessing the basics would be the same.


 :peace:

exactly. a band as big as gnr has the final say over the name of their tour, not the promoter...

It  seems  to me  that  there are two issues here:
1. what is the tour being called or promoted as? That answer can come from the people in Mexico, Australia, and now New Zealand.
2. whether  the band is responsible  for naming the tour. That question cannot  be  answered definitively unless one is inside the band or inside management. So there  is no "proof" that can be offered  by a fan/outsider. It is a specious request  and simply not possible. 

Of the two issues, the more important  question is number one, what  is the tour being promoted  as, and the second issue seems to be a diversion from the main question and not worthy of discussion because it is, ultimately, unanswerable, unless  we get a public statement from  The Man  himself.

There you go again stating your opinion as fact.

I disagree and I'll even tell you why.

I think promoters do a lot more work than you think. GN'R list what they need for the show, the promoter takes care of it and sells the tickets.

GN'R shows up and plays.


For example, I don't think GN'R chose the opening bands in Mexico. Do you?

Unless somebody in the band is really into the Mexican music scene. I suspect the Mexican promoter found those bands.


Same thing with openings acts in certain markets in North America (Toronto, Ottawa, Quebec, Halifax, Auburn Hills etc.) and Europe (Finland, Norway, Greece, Turkey etc.). All those shows had at least one local band opening.



It's possible to acquire that said information from individuals who are highly knowledgeable  in the matter.



/jarmo