Here Today... Gone To Hell!

I know this isn't the most exciting of thread topics, but every once in a while I'll listen to Live Era and scratch my head when the rant after Mr. Brownstone comes on.

My question is...why was it included on the disc in the first place? The material on the disc(s) was taken from such a vast array of sources and little instances like this rant, in particular, could easily have been edited out. Why would they purposely leave it in (or add it, perhaps...not sure if that particular rant ACTUALLY came after THAT performance of Brownstone or before THAT version of ISE)?

My only guess is that the producers figured, 'what's a GN'R live show without a rant? we really should include one if this is to be a true to life live performance.' But if that's the case, then my next question is...why THAT rant? Of all the classic Axl rants we heard on bootlegs (and now youtube) why did they have to pick the one that sounds more like a Public Service Announcement than an actual rant? Are we supposed to say, 'hmm...Axl really DOES care about his fans and doesn't want to see them get hurt. Thanks for looking out for us, Uncle Axl.'

I don't know...I can see why he may have said that at that particular show, but to include it on a live disc...just doesn't seem very Rock N' Roll to me.

How 'bout you guys?

The whole purpose of the rant's inclusion is to add 'spice' to the "live experience" of the disc.

Simple.

I almost wish there was a rant before every song...lol


? ?better than listening to Move to the City and the 976-horn section. I do love the intro to Yesterdays. They really could have done much more with this release if they put more effort into it which is strange considering Axl is such a perfectionist.

? ?Live Cds are for the diehards why not make them a little more interesting... KOHD from the freddie tribute man how many times have we heard/seen that, the same goes with all the tracks from Tokyo I'm sure 95% of the people who bought this cd have the videos. I personally do not think this Cd or the Tokyo videos do the GNR live legacy justice at all. But they do have their moments It's alright is fuckin magic!

I think that rant is great. It's one of the coolest things about Live era, in my opinion.

not to be an ass but, i wouldn't call that a rant.. it's more showing that axl always was concerned about the safety of the fans

Same.

Axl doesn't talk, he rants.  :hihi:

I think they want to show how powerfull were the shows that the band done. we can imagine, listen to this rant, the show was full of people and full of crazy fans.  : ok:

Rants and openings add to the live experience. I miss hearing Sabbath's It's Alright before Nov. Rain.
Also Sail Away Sweet Sister and Grand Funk Railroads "Bad Time" before Sweet Child O' Mine".

The album represents how a GN'R show might've been.

Starts with Nightrain, ends with Paradise City.

Often at the shows Axl did say something, hence the addition of that part.




/jarmo

Agreed.  They are plenty more Axl outbursts that would qualify as a rant before this one.  That being said, I'm still glad it was included.

i love that it reminds me now of when i seen them in edmonton. Axl stoped the show during brownstone and told everybody to take a step back and someone was being a fuckhead i guess and Axl through his sorry ass out "YOUR GOING HOME HA HA YOURE GOING FUCKHEAD" fucking cool show. best one on the canadian leg I'am sure.

Dude!! Move To The City is awesome on the CD! One of my favourite live GN'R songs!

Sorry man never liked that song.

it's a piece of history cuz that is the show at donnington where those kids got crushed

Actually, it's from a different show.

All except for Axl's rerecorded vocals, its exactly how a show would sound

Thank you.  Hit it..... 
i think it is just for effect too.  i usually skip over it, but i dont mind it. 
I do think that Move to the City is the worst of both those cd's. 

Estranged is the best.

i've always wonderd what he says at the end of it.... sounds like "kidding!"

Nah it's "Hit it"

actually ive seen boots that the recordings come from. he didn't rerecord.

Just a thought but are you guys talking about the rant when Axl talks about people to take a step back.If so the copy of live era I have it's not Mr Brownstone it's It's so easy.Cause I don't recall any rant before Mr Brownstone.

Its after Mr. Brownstone...On the same track

Which show is the rant from?

London-- August 31 1991  : ok:

Axl gave almost the same rant as this, almost word for word between It's So Easy and Mr Brownstone at the Glasgow show last year.

do you have a youtube video of this ,
or link for souce???

I think you're wrong because they played Bad Obsession after Mr. Brownstone on that show and "hit it" doesn't fit BO.
I don't have that audio recording here so I might be wrong though.

listen to the live era at ABOUT 2:20, and watch the youtube of this song (pretty tied up) at the same time..they are different.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLsGK5xl9MA

But look what track he says "Hit It"... Its from Its So Easy.... Not Mr. Brownstone

Bingo! But he doesn't say "hit it" before ISE in Paris, and that's the show where that song is supposed to come from...so this is confusing. That whole album is pretty confusing if you ask me...

I think toward the end of the song is from paris.... Fucking I dont know  :hihi:

You're right...Screw it

Nope but I was there. There might be a video of it on YouTube, there were some high quality videos of that gig on there before not too sure if they're still there though.

QUESTION: FROM WHERE DID THE SONGS IN THE ALBUM,"LIVE ERA '87-'93", ORIGINALLY ORIGINATE AND WERE THERE ANY RE-RECORDED VOCALS ADDED?

ANSWER: MANY SONGS FROM THE ALBUM CAME FROM MANY LIVE CONCERTS RANGING FROM 1987 TO 1992. ABOUT 1/3 OF THE ALBUM INCLUDED RE-RECORDED VOCALS.

SEE BELOW



TRACK SOURCES:

Disc 1
1. Nightrain [Las Vegas, 1.25.92]
2. Mr. Brownstone [London, 8.31.91]
3. It's So Easy [Paris, 6.6.92]
4. Welcome To The Jungle
5. Dust N' Bones [New York, 5.16.91]
6. My Michelle [London, 8.31.91]
7. You're Crazy [Tokyo, 12.10.88]
8. Used To Love Her [Tokyo, 12.10.88]
9. Patience [1st half - Mexico '93 OR Paris, 7.13.93; 2nd half - Paris, 6.6.92]
10. It's Alright [Houston, 9.4.92]
11. November Rain [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
12. Coma [Omaha, 4.10.93] * ^

Disc 2
1. Out Ta Get Me [London, 6.28.87]
2. Pretty Tied Up [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
3. Yesterdays [Las Vegas, 1.25.92]
4. Move To The City [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
5. You Could Be Mine [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
6. Rocket Queen [Las Vegas, 1.25.92]
7. Sweet Child O' Mine [Paris, 6.6.92]
8. Knockin' On Heaven's Door [London, 4.20.92]
9. Don't Cry [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
10. Estranged [Tokyo, 2.22.92]
11. Paradise City [Las Vegas, 1.25.92]

* Japanese & Vinyl Releases Only
^ Not 100% certain the date is correct

For Live Era-vocally-I can tell you a lot of info. For example when you're a person that collects over a hundred audio and video bootlegs you start to see the changes and different sounds that the band had through years. Axl's voice to me, can be easily defined by eras or certain live shows. His voice is very dynamic, which means that it sounds different in almost every bootleg, but stll having a basic sound for a specific era. I can give you a list, pretty close to the actual list of re-recorded vocal tracks:

Disc 1:

-Nightrain: This is pretty obvious. Axl could just not do these type of screams from 1988-1994. His voice is very high, but has the tone of Axl's current voice. This Nightrain is close to being flawless. If you want a good representation of what Axl's Nightrain truly sounded duing that time period you can liste to the 6-17-93 Buenos Aires, Argentina show. Or you can listen to the Tokyo DVDs which have more access.

-Welcome to the Jungle: certain sections of Welcome to the Jungle were re-recorded, for example the best example I can give you on this song is Axl's final scream at the end where he says "you're gonna die", not many people notice it but his voice is very clean in that scream and in various certain sectors of songs, but at the same time he can give out a growl which only pertains to the late 90s/early 00s. RIR3's Welcome to the Jungle can be comapred the best when speaking of 'the new rasp'. If you're not a fan that's familiar with live shows then it will be very hard to distinguish this track.

-My Michelle: This song is just as easily distinguishable as Nightrain. Axl's 'new rasp' is very punk-ish and high, while Axl's 'old rasp' persay was very angry and deep. A good representation of Axl's 'old rasp' is the easily accesible Freddy Mercury Concert performances. His voice in this track sounds very refreshed, and again, flawless. There's a ceratin tone to his voice, again, that can be associated with Axl of the late 90s/early 00s vocals.

-Used To Love Her: Now, much of this tracks was left untouched, vocally. This was a 1988 performace, which is easy to tell since Axl's voice 'deteriorated' as this year went on. (Axl's voice in Donnington '88 was almsost non-existing, it was pretty horrible) The only vocal section that was re-recorded in this song was the last verse were Axl sings:

"I used to love her
But I had to kill her
I used to love her, Mm, yeah
But I had to kill her
I had to put her, Oo, six feet under
And I can still hear her complain"

If you listen to the album right now, you will be able to see this right off the bat and you'll go "Ha, how did I miss that?"

-November Rain: Axl's voice is very clean on this track. It is the exact opposite of what Axl's method of singing November Rain used to be. If you listen to any 2001-2002 bootleg then you'll hear that Axl's voice sounds almost exactly the same on this record compared to those performances. This is horrendously easy to tell.

Disc 2:

-Pretty Tied Up: Axl's voice in this tracks is just exactly how I described it on My Michelle. It is almost flawless. His pitch and tone is exactly how I described it for My Michelle, so you can pretty much get the general idea.

-Move to the City: The vocal track was obviously re-recorded here. Axl's voice is just very stable and strong. In the orginal show, where this track was derived from, which is the 2/22/92 Tokyo show, his voice had more of a gargled glass quality. It sounded like he was gargling glass, originally. Axl uses a much more mature 'raspy' voice here. The tone is just as deep as it was during 1993 but without 'all the jangled mess'. His voice is cleaner and stronger in this track, you can make out the words more easily.

You Could Be Mine: About 1/2 of this song was re-recorded vocally. Axl's new voice can be easily distinguishable right at the start were he says:

"I'm a cold heartbreaker
Fit ta burn and I'll rip
your heart in two
An I'll leave you lyin' on the bed
I'll be out the door before ya wake
It's nuthin' new ta you
'Cause I think we've seen that movie too
With your ass in the air!"

This sounds like almost nothing the Axl of the early 90s would do. His voice is very punk-ish, high, and clearly shows his 'new rasp'. Now some growls and screams were left alone. The 'rapping' part was clearly left alone. His voice is very tired and angry in that section. Now there is a part that you can clearly tell was re-recorded. I'm speaking of the scream in the middle of the song. I'm speaking of the scream right before "You've gone sketchin' too many times". His vioce is extremely clean, something the early 90s Axl would never possess.

-Rocket Queen: This track is the most obvious re-recorded track out of the whole record. This track sounds amazing. The entire piece was re-recorded. Again Axl's 'new rasp' which is very punk-ish and high pitched is used here. Even though it's re-recorded, this is one of my favorite vocal 'performaces' of Rocket Queen, period. Axl's voice is so close to perfection. The outro is just 'so' the Axl of the late 90s/early 00s. If you compare the outro of Rocket Queen here to the outro of Rocket Queen to any 2001/2002 performance then you will almost get the exact same sound, it is uncanny.

-Sweet Child O' Mine: All I can say is that Axl's voice in this track is very raw and deep. It was indeed re-recorded. You can hear this especially whenever he does any type of screams, they are just too clean. There was also a re-recording error here that I caught. Right at the end where Axl makes those dozens of screams he ends singing (the re-recorded Axl), but about 1.5 seconds later, very faintly, you will hear the original vocal track ending, after the song had already supposedley ended. You have to pay real close attention to notice this. I encourage everyone else to listen to this as this clearly shows this tune was re-recorded.

-Estranged: This is the last track of Disc 2 that was re-recorded.Axl's 'normal' speaking voice for the first few minutes was left alone, but right after the piano solo there comes the re-recorded vocals. Now, another error can be found here that will clearly give the re-recording enigma away. The music to this track originates from the 2/22/92 Tokyo show. Now I may not be the only one that has caught this. In Tokyo's vocals Axl sings the words:

"And you don't talk so loud
An you don't walk so proud
ny more, and what for"

In the original vocal track right after the words "and what for" Axl says "Nooo" with the same type of voice. Just watch the Tokyo DVD and you will notice the "Nooo" I'm speaking of. But listen to this, in Live Era right after the words "and what for" (which were re-recorded) then you will very faintly hear the "Nooo" being muffled out. You have to pay real close attention, but after the words "and what for"" on Live Era you will hear a very silent "Nooo" that was muffled out to give way to the re-recorded vocals.

Trust me, Live Era was a very complex process.

If you can't tell, then your ears have not been exposed enough to the live and studio sound of Guns N' Roses through out the years to make a solid opinion.

i'll second you on that man, i was at the glasgow show too,and i remember the "rant"

'Axl in lafayette', thanx for copying and pasting my 'Live-Era' post as your own. ::)

2. Mr. Brownstone [London, 8.31.91]

adding that this is re-edited musically and vocally for sure.? compare the tv report from 8/1991 (mtv slash-interview wembley91): vocals totally different + matt missing a typical drum fill in the beginning right before the main riff/band kicks in together....but hups, on live era its there?? :-X

If you listen to his rant before Mr Brownstone at Glasgow (21.07.2006), a show I had the privilege of being at, his rant there is very reminiscent of that rant on Live Era!

Wait your site says MYGNR... Isint that form gnrontur.com  ???

Heh, no dude; I'm not John M. :hihi:

It's just that I wrote that post, which was later used in the FAQ section of Mygnr, in first-person perspective so when the other guy pasted it, it sounded like it was something he came up with. I'm really not one to complain, but it's just fair to give credit where it's due. That's all. :yes:

Yeah after the fact i saw the site difference... Thats why I changed my post... : ok:

i'm not an expert on axl's voice or the various "eras" it has gone through. but i do know that it would be extremely hard to go back and "re-record" vocals for a live album such as this.

its not that easy to go back and just delete the vocal track on a live recording. there are open microphones all over the stage (ie duff's vocal mic and slash's vocal mic, and especially the drum overhead mics) that would pick up fragments of the vocal audio. you would be able to tell that theres another vocal being added over it.

the drummer has speakers pumping axl's vocals right at him so he can hear the song himself and keep up with it. those vocals would leak into the drum overheads, and you can't take these leaked vocals out. one example is in estranged - the second part comes from the tokyo shows in 92, and when he says, "now that you've been broken down...you dont talk so loud / you dont walk so proud ./ anymore / and what for?" right after that on the tokyo video you see that he says "wooo!". they try to take the woo out on live era - and the casual listener can't hear it. but if you listen closely or with headphones, you can hear that its still there.

so, i don't buy this talk that the vocals were re-recorded. that would be very very hard to do cleanly.

oh also, i should say that there is a difference between "rerecording," literally re-tracking the vocals, and just simply adding effects. it is VERY obvious that effects have been applied to the vocals to make them cleaner and even retuned or pitch corrected, etc.

i think that when you hear differences in the way his voice sounds, its because of the effects that are being applied. the raw bootlegs have no effects on them, and you would be surprised how much of a difference this process has made. in fact, i would venture to guess that the reason you think axl's voice sounds on live era like it did at the 2001-02 shows is because he applied similar effects - after 13 years in the studio, he has found some pretty advanced sounds that he can create by combining his voice with various protools plugins.

in the world of recording, its definitely fair game to go back and apply effects to audio recorded live. i think most people would agree, however, that going back and actually retracking a "live" album in the studio is out of bounds...its like cheating.

meant as informational, and all the props to you...

do you think every band member had the chance to re-record the parts they thought needed to be fixed???

Pretty sure Slash rerecorded some parts as well as Axl.

Plus, why is it that there's only Slash's guitar on Rocket Queen? Maybe on Estranged too... I can't quite remember. But I definitely know there is only one guitar on Rocket Queen.

The whole album has signs of being messed with long after the originals were recorded live.

I agree with that huge post which originated from Idianna Rose (?). It's obvious that the vocals were re-recorded on those tracks to anyone has has heard so many boots over the years. As for Slash re-recording i don't know. But i do know that during RQ and Estragned you could hardly hear Gilby anyway, look at the Tokyo dvds. Is he even playing?