Here Today... Gone To Hell!

This isnt a VR vs GNR thread so no one even think of doing it.


I remember when Slither leaked and when we found out it was the first single, many of us were extremely bummed out.

Slither in my opinion turned out to not be the best song on the album.


That being said, If "Better" is the best song on CD will u be encouraged or discouraged?

Its kinda weird but i really like anything Axl puts out, and id probably listen to CD all day long

I'd say the same.  And yes if the best on CD is the what we've heard then I'd be a little dissapointed.

Yes I'd be happy. ?I'm already happy. ?I think the leaks we've heard are great. ?If there are better songs on the album, that'd be a bonus. ?But I'd be satisfied if Better, IRS, The Blues were the best of the crop because I'm sure I could find the other songs quite enjoyable. ?There's probably less than a handful of GNR songs that i could do without.

I won't be happy if there's another "My World" on it. That is one of the worst songs of the 90's for sure.

At this point, I'm so ecstatic with MOST of what I've heard that I'm simply looking forward to fully mastered studio versions.  I'd be lying, however, if I said that I wasn't expecting 1 or 2 more songs that eclipse what we've heard.

Eh, I'll be satisfied - I don't think we've heard the best or most interesting stuff the band has to offer, but most of the stuff we've heard has been pretty damn great.

The Blues and Madagascar are mini-masterpieces... and I don't throw that word around lightly.

Yeah, I probably would be a bit bummed out if Better was the best they had to offer, I mean it's a good song, but man I expect AMAZING stuff on CD. This album has years in the making and is supposed to be epic, not just ok.

I'm satisfied so far, most of these songs are not done yet so the studio versions will make them that much better. ?Overall the new songs are GREAT, but I expect "better".

Yes, I don't really rate by singles. If the single is a great song that's obviously a good start but I reserve any judgement about what the album is like until I hear more songs or when I hear the whole album. Based on the live  versions, demos etc I've heard, regardless of what is a single, it's going to be one of the albums that will be a pleasure to listen to back to back rather than picking out individual songs (unless I don't have time to hear them all in the particular instant)

If Better is the best song on CD I will be very discouraged.

But it honestly sounds like its not... so I'm not worried. Prostitute would be my best bet.. on that setlist... the man who did the orchestration said it was the best one.. ect.

Id be a bit disappointed if "Catcher In The Rye" didnt make it. 

I strongly doubt "Better" will be my favorite song off of the album...its not even my favorite among the leaks. 

I will be pretty disappointed. No two ways about it. I think Madagascar and TWAT have the potential to be epic studio songs, but the quality of the rock songs is just not on par with where we expect a GNR record to be given the pedigree of the band. I think that the demos we have heard are awful close to what the finish product is going to sound like, so unless the other half the songs we haven't heard are out of this world Axl has wasted an awful lot of time making this album.

Define best - because I cannot - All of the leaks are pretty much burnt out now - so anything new that is solid will most likely have me calling it the best anyway.  That aside - I think not -  I think part of the secrecy of all of this, is that there are quite a few songs not heard yet - and not heard yet for a reason -  Better is a great tune - but I think if it comes out - we can expect some cool shit

In regards to "Better," it's not my favorite of the new songs, so by extension it's not the best that the new album has to offer IMO.

Still dying to hear The Blues in its studio form...  :drool:

Do you think that they would throw TWAT or Madagascar as the first single? While Gunners may love these songs, I've always felt singles are the songs that appeal to the most people. I would be bummed if Better was the first single because, like a poster above me, I really expect this album to be epic on so many levels. Better is a great song, and I can't judge until I hear the studio version, but I hope that the other songs are, well, better :hihi:

My answer is "yes".

But only after hearing them perform IRS & Chinese Democracy live at MSG last Friday. ?

Better; IRS; Chinese Democracy; The Blues; Madagascar; There Was A Time: ARE ALL BETTER than anything I have heard on one album since AFD.

I'd be content, but not "happy." I recall some talk somewhere along the way that none of those leaks were considered the top flight material. By the way, Better is not the best leak ... it's Catcher in the Rye. Catcher and The Blues are the best new songs. Better is cool though. If all the songs are at the level of those, CD will be a very solid record. For CD to be superior, classic, etc., there will need to be songs above those. Like two or three.

I would be happy... ?I don't have an official "ranking" of my favourite GN'R songs, but Catcher in the Rye would be in my Top 5. ?TWAT would be high on the list as well.

If there are songs that I enjoy as much as The Blues or TWAT, well, I couldn't ask for much more.

No offense but I don't think many would agree with you. Yes, those tracks are better than most of UYI, but I wouldn't say they're better than "Don't Cry," "Civil War," "November Rain," "Estranged," or "You Could Be Mine." They may be just as good as those tracks, but not better.

I'm still waiting to hear a song that tops TWAT. If that one is the best, I'd be satisfied.

I think the leaks and live songs are fantastic, not thrilled with "Catcher in the Rye" but I LOVE Better, IRs. Madagascar, The Blues and Chinese Democracy......THey are AWESOME!!! If the record just had those 5 songs, i would be happy!!!!

I dont consider Better to be the best song. But I get your point. No, I wont be disappointed if we have heard the best Axl has to offer. As I said along time ago, the songs we've heard from CD are the best songs I've heard since Soundgarden released Superunknown. Axl could release an album of only the songs we have heard so far, and it would be the best album anyone has heard in years, and would hold its own in the GNR discography.

Yes.  The damn songs get stuck in my head all the time, and everyone at my work knows intro to better from me humming it.  Each of the songs have their own little "niche".

Better was the type ofd song I was craving for the new album. I will always love Madagascar,CD, and The Blues but I knew those songs werent singles{maybe the blues is}. Better proved to me that this band can put together an anthem type song.

I would hope that they have 1 more song or 2 that is like Better. in terms of Anthem/all out rocker

If they do, IMO this album will be mind blowing.

I love all the new songs. Including Silk Worms. The only one I never got into was Rhiad.

But I think we all take the fact that we havnt heard a studio quality track yet for granted. Meaning when we hear these songs like Madagascar, The Blues, IRS ect on a clean clrisp studio cut we are going to be amazed. Partciualrly Madagascar and The Blues. I firmly believe we will all look at those 2 songs with much greater appreciation when we have the studio cuts.

We have yet to hear MAdagascar in its purest form since Rio 3. The studio will probably put the Rio 3 version to shame.


man i cant wait for this album...it better be 1 of these next tuesdays!

in closing, I think CD has been what i expected thus far. A little bit of everything. Thats why Axl is great. He gives u a littl ebit of everything and then something more. And that something more is what we have yet to hear....

I think that quote sums it up. Particularly teh last part about it holding up to the old material. Even after the band broke out the "old" new songs many people had doubts about this band and album. Some said the songs were solid some said it didnt live up to the hype, etc. But after the last batch of leaks I have noticed a complete turnaround on most of those viewpoiints.

There really arent any questions, concerns, or pgs upon pgs of threads anymore debating whether the band and the album can live up to old gnr and the hype. Now its more along the lines of how much better will the studios make the songs. SLOWLY but surely this band has erased a lot of the negative vibe that used to be all over the gnr community. ANd they did it mainly thru the last set of leaks....THE MUSIC{that brings a smile to my face, and most old time posters know y}....but als thru the great tour they have going in 06, th eband hanging out and "caring", Axls more visible, etc...

Everything seems to be falling into place....

I am fully convinced that the material will not only stand up to the old stuff but it will also add to the legacy of gnr....gnr will go down as having 2 GREAT periods of music. And as fans I dont think we can ask for much more than great music. Some want the old band, some dont...It is what it is. But if we have great music, thats what counts. And so far, for me atleast, they are making some killer tunes

TWAT and The Blues are a couple of the best Guns songs ever to me so I have no problem if those are two of the best on the album.  But I also know that there's some great material we haven't heard yet.  The only songs we've heard that weren't written before 2000 are Better, Rhiad and Madagascar.  We haven't heard anything else that was written from 2000-2005

The main reason i can already say with 100 percent confidence that CD will be one of the best albums ever is, I am still not sick of any of the leaks.


i have been listening to the Blues and madagascar for almost 5 years now and i am still not sick of them, same with the recent leaks.

These songs are timeless and stick with u forever.

most music today is disposable and after u wear it out u never listen again these CD songs so far will be in my soul for 50 years like the rest of the gnr songs.


the leaks destroy most of appetite and UYI  so i am thrilled.


Better isnt my fav leak either but since its rumored as the first single, thats why i used it as the example.

If Axl puts out a song EVEN BETTER than ''There Was A Time'', he should win a Nobel.


same here, that's really a weird sensation, but I feel exactly the same.

well when i heard civil war first time i was disaointed,but when i heard it on uyi 2 iwas impresed

so don't make decision witthdemo versions

Id be pretty disappointed if they were the pick of the bunch

I believe the Blues could be the biggest gun, but Im hoping there are a few more unheard jaw droppers waiting in the wings

I'm very satisfied with the demos and live tracks but still I'm waiting for something even better. But I think that the final versions of these tracks we have already heard will fill that spot partly, and I assume CD is going to be amazing in it's entirety.. as an album.

Well, I wouldn't say Sweet Child or Jungle were their best songs, but they made great singles!

So I think Better is a great single, but not the "best" song.

There's probably a "Coma" or "Breakdown" on the album.

I was kinda disappointed when I first heard the leaks, but now I've settled for the fact that CD isn't going to be the great masterpiece 14 years in the making that I expected it to be, so I can appreciate the songs much better now. I have actually lowered my expectations after hearing the leaks, so I won't be disappointed when the album comes out. I have to be honest though, I have six CD's on permanent rotation in my car: "Julliete and the Licks - Four on the Floor", the first Audioslave CD, the leaks (IRS, Better, TWAT, CITR), a mix disc with some VR, Black Sabbath, Ugly Kid Joe, Metallica, etc..., Slash's Snakepit's Ain't Life Grand and GNR's greatest hits. Discs 3 is the only one that I usually skip entirely. I'm sure it has something to do with the mixing and mastering qualities of the leaks though.

I love Better and I think it is the best of what we've heard so far.  If that was as good as it got though??  I think I would be a little bummed out.  I just have a feeling that CD has so much more to offer and hopefully has songs that are better than Better. 

Now if all of the songs we have heard so far are the top songs off the album and everything else to come would be inferior to our current list of the songs we've heard, I would be let down.  I like all the new songs a lot but I think after the wait we have been put through (And the many years and money that has gone into this album) and all of the other ups and downs over the years, I expect MUCH more than CD, IRS, Rhiad, Madagascar and the Blues.  TWAT and Catcher in the Rye are some top songs and it's hard to do better than those, but I have a feeling we will get better than that.

I don't know... maybe it's because we've been hearing some of these songs for 5 years already.  I almost wish we didn't know as many songs as we do right now, so when we give it that first listen the experience would be that much more special.  But we might know over half the album and I think that's only going to hurt our satisfaction.  It will be like getting 5 or 6 new songs instead of 13 (or however many will be on the album) and I think it's only going to make us want MORE right away... like it won't meet our expectations no matter what.  I'm trying to explain what I'm thinking better than I am and I'm so tired right now... Hmmm... Even though we are getting the whole thing, it will still feel like just a taste of it because we will be familiar with much of the album already, thus making it less fulfilling.  Does that make sense??  Oh fuck it all anyway, I'm too tired to be typing anything.  Forgive me if that makes no fucking sense. 

Disapointed I guess.

Not that the songs we already know aren't good, they are amazing IMO.

But I do hope that there's masterpiece(s) here and there that we haven't heard yet.

I would be mad... Better and Maddy and blues had better not be on the album. they suck imo.

I think you'd better get used to them :hihi:

Iam.. and im sick of em.. they are not nearly as good as anything on AFD..... They sould too poppy for me...

I think the songs we have would already make this one of my favorite albums.
I'm sure the chinese democracy or rhiad or something like that will sound a lot better as a studio version, but that's what i'm mainly curious about. Madagascar, The Blues, TWAT, and Catcher are all slower more mellow songs. Better and IRS are great but in totally different ways... i'm just wondering exactly what other rockers there might be, and what they'll sound like.

I think most of you are setting yourselves up for disappointment.....

The vocals on THE BLUES and MADDIE studio version should be AMAZING..

Although Merck did say IRS wasnt in the top 10, they do seem to think BETTER is a
top gun from all the hints we have.

I do believe, Prostitue, Mad, Blues, and TWAT will be the best of the ballads since
he went out of his way to put orchestration on just these 4 tracks.

For rockers, we'll get basically 4-5 more songs that are on par with IRS and BETTER.

All in all it will be a great album, but wont have another "WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE".
Songs like that come along once in a lifetime for a band....Dont expect "Better".

Obviously everyone will be disapointed...

TWAT, Maddy, Better, are all class songs so why would you be happy if nothing else on the record is better?!?!?!

Of all the songs we have heard none of them were worth waiting this long for.... IMO....

That album will be a killer i think (hope) ?::)
By the way: Everybody is always talking about it being NOT a double album (13 songs theory). We have been told so many crap by management and Gnr that it could easily be that we will recive:
-a double album or (at least) more that 13 tracks
- a dvd included

Brgds

yeah a DVD or a double disc would make it worth the wait... but if the cd has just mixed and finalized versions of the songs we have heard since 2001 i would just download the thing.....

Of the songs that do seem very likely to be on the album, i only really like better, twat, and the blues. i'd like citr & omg on there but that seems unlikely. i'd also like more hard rockers like better. 

With you all the way man. citr is awesome!!!

if there isnt songs better than the demos than i will be VERY dissapointed, cause i dont think the leaked songs are that great. Or any of the other ones hes only played live, like chinese dem, maddy and all that.

i wish he'd get out of ghetto beats syndrome.

Great guitar playing however.

For me the greatest GNR songs arent wttj or scom


my favsare Estranged,coma,The Blues and Madagascar


CITR is my fav leak, so much heart and emotion in it.

Now that we MAY be getting closer to a release, I wish I had not downloaded the leaks (or listened to the live stuff).  I think the album will sound less dramatic because half of the songs will probably not be surprises.  There is something special about that first time (or first few times) you sit down and play a new CD front-to-back and are completely blown away and surprised by sounds or songs you have never heard before. 

So, I can appreciate part of the reason why Axl and management have tried to keep everything under wraps.  It's like opening Christmas presents early:  there is an immediate gratification, but, in the long run, it kinda spoils the day itself.

I'd be happy with TWAT, Better, IRS, CD, Madagascar, The Blues, CITR

I would be disapointed, but it is of no fault of Axl's.  If the leaks were unintentional, then we kind of spoiled the surprise of a portion of the Chinese Democracy songs.  If CD does get released someday, I am hoping there will be new songs I have never heard that will blow me away. 

I honestly believe that "Better" is one of the greatest GNR songs I've ever heard. Having said that, if the rest of the album was even close I'd be overjoyed!

Yes and no.

We've already heard demos of songs like TWAT & CITR, which despite whether or not they'll be on CD, they are obviously instant-masterpieces.

I'm sure Axl's got some other big guns in store for the album. Plus, personally, I think Madagascar is a better song, than Better, and Madagascar will be on the album.

But just imagining 'what if'... if Better was the best song we're gonna hear... I would be disappointed. Better is a great rocker, and an awesome song, but it's certaintly not worth a 15 year wait for original material.

you havent heard much of GnR have you?

I agree.  All the leaks are good songs, but not GREAT.  Thats how I feel about VR.  The album came out, the singles were released, it kinda just came and went.

It'd be sad if a GNR released an album, it did ok and then in 2 years nobody cared about the songs.

I like all the songs we've heard, including Pitmans masterpiece, Silk Worms. I would be a little disappointed if there were no better songs on the album, but that's most likely because the wait have been so long and the hype built so high. However, I truly belive there will be atleast 1 song on Chinese Democracy that will put everything else to shame.

Bottom line, if we get 3 albums of the type of material we've heard, I'll be thrilled. But I don't think that will happen, there will be better songs.

I think the leaked songs is up to the standard of a Use your illusion 3.  :love:

At this point I'm not expecting it to be the greatest album ever.  I think the longer the wait time, the higher expectations will be.  But God knows how old some of these songs are going to be in terms of when they were written.  Those expecting it to be like the second coming of christ are going to be in for a let down  :-\

I expect it to be a damn fine album. But not earth shattering.

Hope I turn out to be wrong.

- IRS, The Blues, Madagascar and Catcher In the Rye have the potencial to be as legendary as the old tunes

- TWAT has the potential to be a great song (maybe legendary if they change the 1st part)

- Chinese Democracy has the potencial to become a good rock song (if they keep the new intro)

- However I don't believe in "better". Exept the outro? wich sounds great, I don't like that song very much, at east the demo version (Live versions sound better).

Madagascar and TWAT has the potential to match UYI top ten and that means legendary.

Inspired by Nesquick I'll list some of the reasons why I think certain songs don't reach all the way up.

There Was A Time

Lacks a little on the chorus.
The bridge to the solo needs a little spice. Think Rocket Queen outro.

I.R.S

Lyrics are bad
Vocals lack a little rasp
Non prominent guitar

Oh My God

Bad chorus
Bad solo
Bad production

Won't comment much on the bootlegs, but 02 version of The Blues is pretty flawless, Madagascar sound pretty badass on the Boston promo, CD could need some structure work but it's still pretty good. SW and R&B would be fine as they are with proper sound.

The outro is the same as the intro.

In my opinion the album is def gonna be worth the wait. I've listened to Madagascar, The Blues, and Chinese Democracy since 2001 and they still arent old to me. And those are just live versions. The studio versions are gonna be amazing.
As far as the leaks, Better is phenominal, TWAT is a masterpiece, I.R.S is a great straight-up rock tune, which from the live shows sounds like it has gotten even better, and Catcher is a beautiful beatles-esque ballad. And from how Sebastian described "Sorry" I know I'm gonna dig the fuck out of that song.

no matter how many unheard songs we get on the album, to me its gonna be worth the wait. All the new stuff is right up there with the old stuff to me and I cant see any of those getting old to me. They will always be fresh just like the old stuff.

I have been trying to listen to less of the new songs so I can have that feeling of when I first heard Better again. I cant describe that feeling, but I have felt nothing like it before. I was in heaven.

Bring on the album, I cant wait. :drool:

The lyrics are good to I.R.S
Its just the fan interpretations are bad.
People say the chorus is bad, but is a metaphor.

LOL. where were you in 87-93?

BTW, IRS is one of the best Rock song i have ever heard.

Wasnt old enough.

Wow, thanks for telling me :P

Bad lyrics are bad lyrics no matter what they represent. You could write new lyrics that represents the same theme.

To put it simply, YES!

I've heard Madagascar, The Blues, IRS and Better live and I totally love those songs. ?I've denied myself TWAT and CITR out of respect to the band, so can't say for sure but I expect I'll like them, they're GN'R after all. ?Chinese Democracy (the song) and Rhiadh & The Bedouins (sp?) are also cool, although could maybe use a little improvementin the studio. ?A newly recorded version of Oh My God would kick serious ass, it deserves a re-recording due to the failry shitty production of the original, but could become legendary imo.

 :hihi:YES.  I'm on board for every new track we've heard.  Just like i liked AFI and UYI1/2.  Lets releease the dman thing already.

Then you just can't understand... :)
lol.

I think Slither, in terms of a "rock song" is better then all the leaks.  Can't compare it to madagascar or twat or CITR or the blues, but it totally destroys CD, IRS and Better.  And I"m not a huge VR fan, far from it.  But that one song is just amazing, esp in comparison to the rock leaks we've heard.

I bet. Dont get me wrong, I love the old band and the old music. When I first heard it, I had never heard anything like it. and thats why they are my favorite band of all time. But I do think that all the new tunes are great and could be right up there in the end with the old material.

Slither amazing?  :P

And then I actually gives Contraband 3 out of 5.

Yeah you can, just have to listen to them as much as the guys who were born earlier did. :smoking:

Yeah Slither is a good song, but its nothing compared to Axl's stuff. Its pretty much a STP song with Slash on guitar. Nothing special.

Some might say that Axl's songs are staight up rock but I respect him more for not making a bland straight up rock song. He's being experimental and trying different ways to make a rock song, expanding the boundries you could say, and I think its paying off.

I've read through this thread and most of the posters seem ungrateful to me. ?I mean, what the fuck do want?? ?You want bigger better versions of November Rain and Coma x10????!

Axl's written some really good songs and for my money one or two could would walk onto a best of cd no problem. ?Seriously folks, it's time to move on from the sleazy rock 'n' roll on 1987. ?Axl has changed style because he's changed. ?Get over it. ?Seriously, answer me this, what the fuck do you people want?!!

 ?:rant: ? :peace:

I don't know, a civilized discussion about music perhaps?  What do you want?

madagscar-wht to say "geniously song",apsolutely the best which i heard in last 10 years
the blues-excelent song,very good lyrics and beautifull melody.potentionaly big hit
better-excelent rock song,and iwillhope on cd it willbe withhard rock arangman
twat-something like breakdown (one of my favor)
citr-very hard song,something like quenn -show must go on
irs-i like it a lot

for other songs i hope it won't be realised on cd

Yes but I'm hoping there's a "Don't Cry" or a few other mellow songs on there. I don't want something with all hard rock. "The Blues" is sort of my bag, It's like the new "November Rain".

In fact, I find myself comparing just how similar some of these sound to past songs. Perhaps Axl wanted a fimiliar album that peeps could relate to.

Some answers   ;)

Yes, definately. Having more songs at least equal or almost equal to Better, I.R.S, The Blues... It'd be fantastic.

Now, if let's say, the songs we've heard so far turn out to be among the worst of the album...  :drool:

Well then, the answer is this: The perceptions your questions are based on are off. Everybody wants what everybody wants, excellence. That does not equal disappointment.

 :drool: X 100

That would be unreal.

the main thing ive noticed that is missing from the new gnr songs are riffs.


axls melodies are incredible,the lyrics and melodies are great, the music is good and the solos are good but so far we havent really had any songs that have that memorable hum along riff.


Gnr have some of the most recognizable and greatest riffs ever but the new songs lack that.

that being said, axl's vocals,lyrics and melodies make up for the lack of memorable riffs.


I hope there are some riffs on this album that make u pump your fist. so far though this album has been without and that concerns me some.

Agreed. I would probably faint if there were nothing but better songs on the record.? :yes:

^^Oh, and riff's... Well, I agree to a degree, but that damn intro part from Better NEVER leaves my head. Heck, all my friends hum it now too, and most of them has never heard the song. They think I'm a nutcase for singing it all the time  :hihi:

I think Better got what you're missing. Not the classic GN'R riff, but it's still a memorable one.

Well that sounds like a good response? ?Not sure it really answers my question. ?I suppose what you're trying to say is it's all a matter of opinion? ?Well that's fine, if people don't like GN'R that's up to them. ?But the way people on a GN'R board are ?knocking the new stuff amazes me.

It's not that amazing when you take the proper factors in mind.

If you're on a GN'R message board it can be for different reasons. You like the old band, you like the new band, you like both bands, you're curious, you work in the media, you're there by coincedence, you're a hater etc. and so on..........

That by definition will result in alot of differing opinions. The most prominent one being that altough this is called Guns N' Roses, it does not really sound like Guns N' Roses. I see alot of quality in the new material, but it's a different kind of quality than we've been used to from the old band.

Not everyone should, can or will see it the same way. I believe that is your answer.

I would be a bit disappointed but I will be happy as hell that this CD chapter in GnR is over.

Why has Axl wasted his time if the rest of the songs on the album are on-par with the leaks and live songs we have heard? ?You make it sound impossible for Axl to make an album that will meet your expectations. ?What you are saying is unless the other half of the album is equal to the greatest hits on AFD & UYIs, then Axl has wasted his time.

Maybe the new songs aren't at the level of the best AFD & UYI songs but IMO they are good songs and better than what is out there today.

Slither is not in the same world as Better

I think that's more than 50% of the problem with alot of "Fans" these days.

There have been many changes in the songs over the years. Just listen to this awesome version of "Chinese Democracy", listen to the drums,
it's better like that: http://youtube.com/watch?v=NVmb-dIgriE

That's very true.

They could have a reunion and release an album and many fans here will still complain about it not living up to THEIR expectations. ?I guess that's what happens when you have made epic/groundbreaking records in the past. ?

I'm sure I will not read any review here before I'll listen to the album. Some of you talk like, no matter what, they can't win.

Anyways, if Better, Rhiad (yeah, I love this one!), TWAT, The Blues, IRS (at least the live version) and Madagascar are the best tracks, I'd be happy.

<--- would not be happy

I think its all a matter of opinion. so saying the songs we have heard so far are the "best" is hard because of the wide variety of genres that will be on CD. look at AF, i know its all the same genre but the point is still the same. SCOM and WTTJ were the main singles and are considered by alot of people to be the best but some people prefer Rocket queen. I think CD will be alot like that, some peoples favourites will still be the leaks, others will be other songs.

The it'd be a pretty damn good album!

Yes, no doubt.  :hihi:

I dont want this thread to getinto a VR/GNR debate but the only new songs SLither is better than in my opinion are rhiad,silkworms, Chinese Democracy and thats about it.


Alot will be personal taste for example many would say Dont Cry and NR are the best illusions but Estranged,Coma and Breakdown are my favs


so it all depends really.

i hope there are four or five new songs that are as good or better than better/madagascar (my personal favorites.) any other album and that'd be pushing it but this is 'chinese democracy' after all.

Hmmm, might just specify why I think the new songs aren't the best thing since sliced bread (or appetite or uyi for that matter).

I'll list them in ascending order of quality (in my humble opinion ofcourse):

The songs I really don't like much:
 - Chinese Democracy: doesn't really flow, feels kind of forced together, if you know what I mean.
 - IRS: Simple melody and chord structure, chorus not catchy, drum computer thing sucks ass (hope that's gone on the album), love the solo though!
 - CITR: Not really what I'm looking for in a GNR song, somewhat boring actually. Kinda like "So Fine", although that at least had the novelty of having Duff on vocals.

The songs I can appreciate:
  - The Blues: sounds like something from UYI, a lot actually. So still not on par with AFD, but at least there's a common thread in the story now. Chorus is pretty good but the 'whiney' guitar riff is annoying.
  - Madagascar: Nice epic song, although the synth brass sounds too 80's for me, I would've loved it if this part had been played on piano (like a fan once did, was posted in appetite for collection a while ago if memory serves correct). All in all a very decent song, sauf the movie quotes of course, but that has always been an Axl thing, so hey...

The songs I like a lot:
  - There Was A Time: great guitar work, very good verse melody, nice structure, ass kickingly cool break ("There was a tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiime" part), decent bridge. Too bad about the chorus though, that could use some work. I think a cleaner studio version might fix that, but I'm not entirely sure about that.
  - Better: Great rocksong, has a really modern vibe to it without sounding intentionally "nu". Fan-tas-tic lead guitar work. The only thing that I really despise about this song is the in- and outro. Those are really horrible, Axl sounds like a eunich there.

General remarks:
  I love the new lead style and am actually impressed by the lead guitar work on the leaks. And this is comming from a major slashhead, so don't take that lightly. I still cringe when people call Finck the next Slash though. Robin, although an obviously talented player, is nowhere near the bluesrock player Slash is. Finck actually strikes me more as the next Izzy though: his lead work is nothing spectacular or particularly inspiring, but he has the songwriting skills and his chops are adequate enough to get by with the occasional lead spot. I really hope Axl will play out the Finck card like that and integrate bbf (who still has to convince me like bucket did) into the actual band and the songwriting process. Tommy and Fortus play their parts well, no remarks there. I dunno about Brain yet, loved his Primus work, but I don't know if he can thrive like he should in a plain old rock and roll setting like GNR is, I get the impression he gets bored by it. But then again, there's not much Brain on the leaks (if any at all, who knows), so maybe his studio work in CD will convince me.

As I've said, I'm a real Slashhead and I'm very open about that, but I'm also open and honest about my opinions about the new band. I hope the usual "defenders" will take it for what it's worth.

The only salvation that this album has so far in my opinion is TWAT.
That song will be a classic.

BUT every GNR record has had 3-4 classic songs. Madagascar is great as well & Better is good & IRS is good. But GNR is going to need to pull off a couple of more surprises in their new album to make the 15 years of waiting well-worth it.

I still believe that the 1st single & most of the hit songs on these new GNR records are songs we have not heard yet.

MNW

Ive always felt GNR fans overrated AFD to a degree.


to say THe BLues isnt better than anything off Appetite to me is not true,

ITs better than OUt Ta Get me,Think About you, mY mIChelle, ANything Goes, You're Crazy by far in my opinion.


I like it better than Its So easy,Nightrain,PC and Brownstone as well.

I'll disregard that last statement ;).
I have to correct myself though. I didn't mean to imply that "The Blues" is inferior to every single song an AFD, which I suppose might be understood from my previous post. It was more of a "if you pick a random song from AFD, odds are more than 1 in 2 that the AFD wong will be better than 'The Blues'" kinda remark, I guess. I think My Michelle and Anything goes are better than The Blues for instance. Easy, Nightrain, PC and Browstone whipe the floor with it, Think About You and You're Crazy are on my "skip list", and The Blues won't be, I can tell you that right now. So yeah, not on par with AFD material has been stretched a bit, but I think the general gist should be obvious now.

 :no:

ROTFLMFAO  :rofl:

Better takes a huge steaming cow pattie turd on Slither.

 :peace:

From what we've heard so far, and what they say about the 'big guns' being held back, if this is really the case, CD is going to be one epic album

Better - Even if there are better songs, this is a good single, a fairly straightforward hard rock, but doesn't sound dated, has the industrial elements etc. It's a good song to bring back old GNR fans in as well as settle them into the modern GNR sound, and at the same time, considering the resurge in popularity of rock, whether it is garage rock or indie or whatever, alot of new younger music fans will like it as well.

Madagascar - What can I say. A big fucking epic. Studio version of this is going to be devastating.

Chinese Democracy - A pretty simple, straight ahead song. Sounds like Nirvana. Killer intro. Can't see why people wouldn't like it.

The Blues - It might take a bit of time to grow but this could be a big hit. Very melodic, catchy, great lyrics. Bit of a "November Rain" kind of vibe but alot more rocking so people would love it.

Rhiad - Haven't heard a clear enough version but it sounds like it has potential.. It sounds like it would work for a soundtrack for a sci fi movie or something.. Pretty evident NIN/industrial influence

I.R.S - Sounds closest to old GNR (from what we heard so far). Killer live, but the studio version should be great. Straightforward rock song, not alot of industrial/electronic sound in this apart from the short drum loops. Older fans would really like this

T.W.A.T - Could be a big single or hit with fans. Very melodic, almost melancholic, great lyrics, has a good balance of softer parts, hard rock, guitar solos all over the place, the end is epic. Fucking amazing song

Catcher in the Rye - Reminds me of the beatles a bit for some reason in parts of it, but this could be a very popular song, and a crossover as well. Very melodic and catchy, fun lyrics, just a great modern rock song yet with a classic feel

So if there are songs that can top these, fuck, i say people better just stand aside because this album is going to be dangerous.

Great fuckin post man. I agree with almost everything you just said.  :peace:

Its odd, I'm so used to waiting for studio versions of the songs we've already heard that I haven't even wrapped my head around the fact that we can expect 7 or 8 songs we've never heard at all.  :o

i wouldn't mind. the stuff we've heard is strong, i love all the leaks and live songs. Axl's still got it.

i can't help but think theres still some unheard gems that well be on the record? that we will all adore once the album comes out : ok:

I won't judge this albums songs based on crap quality demos. ?When it's out I'll let you know.

mmmmmmmmmm.............    seriously, if that songs are the best of the CD I just wil buy it just because it's guns n' roses...  to be honest .

but first before judge anything have to listen to the final result of the songs that we already know....

This is in no way a diss because I Love "The Blues' more than words can describe but I always considered the Blues to be what November Rain wouldve sounded like Minus Slash's Brilliance.


The Blues is still a vocal,melodic and lyrical masterpiece but I always considered it to be what nr would be without slash.

Great fuckin post man. I agree with almost everything you just said.  :peace:

hey thanks man, i hope i didn't seem to biased but honestly, i listen to this stuff alot more than the older GNR material. actually i listen to it more than most of the mp3s on my ipod, and thats about 4GB worth of various music. i spend 1-2 hour bus journeys repeating IRS, Better, The Blues, Catcher in the Rye and Chinese Democracy over and over, and these are just rough demos and live versions.

if there's one criticism i have towards chinese democracy, it's that it's going to make me neglect almost the rest of my cd collection.

I guess you could be right, since the only part I don't really like about The Blues is (presumably) Robin's "whiny" guitar work.

thats ridiculous.  Robin's guitar work and Richards bit at the end is amazing ...   The Finck solo is one of the most beautiful pieces of music ever...  I dont see your precious Slash doing anything better.

Listen, I've just about had it with your eternal Finck defending, are you mr. Finck himself or something? I mean, fuck! People can make up their own minds about whether they like Finck's playing or not. There is no need to be condescending about Slash each and every time his name comes up in a comparison. If you really like Finck so much, maybe you should let his music do the talking instead of trying to put down other players to make him look better. Yes, I know, you like Finck, fine! That's your bloody right and no one is going to make you think otherwise, but puh-lease, stop defending him like he was your own son, ffs.

Great post.

Rhaid is possibly have to be a song for something sci-fi. It's the only new song we've heard, that I don't like. Maybe it could be tweaked into something atmospheric.

T.W.A.T. is in the same vein/family as Estranged. If you like Estranged, you're gonna love T.W.A.T.

The Blues is a great song, but personally I don't think it's as 'big' as some think. To me, it's no different than a So Fine. It's a small ballad imo. Still a great song tho.

Catcher In The Rye reminds me of a classic rock song. Has a very Beatles meets Queen with Axl Rose on vocals sound to it.

Personally I think Rhiad has changed a little from '02. The reason I say this is because they have it listed as an option on the setlist, and yet they still havent played it yet. They have played all the other new songs, bar Prostitute and If The World (If this is even a new song), but those have just been added. I cant see why they wouldnt play Rhiad if it hasnt been changed because people have already heard it, and they have played it in the past. So I'm guessing that the song has changed a little bit, and thats why it hasnt been played yet on the '06 tour.

Just my humble opinion.

waiting for "the general", "prostitute", "seven", "sorry", "this i love". hope those are the big guns; among the leaks i only see two songs as true classics: "better" and "catcher"

I second that!  I agree nearly word for word with what Ben said about the songs.  And without sounding like an GnR lemming, I'd be thrilled to have the masters of the new and/or leasked songs alone.  Some of these songs already rank in my top Guns n' Roses songs as they stand now.  So just the thought of having these songs, along with the other new material that we've yet to experience, wouldn't leave much room for disappointment. And if they songs we've heard were the best on Chinese Democracy, then that would still leave alot of room for the rest to be great as well...

SLASH HAS FUCK ALL TO DO WITH GUNS N ROSES IN 2006.

Newsflash: this band is gaining more fans with every show.. and that means the current members of the band.    I'm not here for nostalgia.   I'm not here for the fuckin old band.  I'm certainly not here for Slash.   Robin is my favorite guitarist and when I see someone post their slash troll garbage I will defend him.

But why... why man... I mean, you seem like a nice guy 'n all, and I don't know you, that's for sure, but why... why do you take it as your mission to defend Finck? What good will it do?

He is playing his own songs..... Finky fink is playing slashes songs so your argument is silly.

The discussion was about Robin's work in "The Blues".  Not the songs in the set from the previous albums.   

I stand by that statement.   Slash would not have done anything better than Robin did for that song.  What Robin did fits the piece absolutely perfect.   

I would hope there is something heavy like "Locomotive"

Mr. Finck is playing 2-hours tribute to Slash every night..... :/

And mr. JimBob - you are saying that you aren't at the concert "for the old band" ... But the current lineup of the band plays whole AFD for Pitman's sake ... And you're listening to the songs that THE OLD BAND wrote.... I just don't understand that part, otherwise i have no clash with your post.




M.

Couldn't agree more.  Its a huge reason the new tracks usually get the SKIP on my Ipod - I dug them a lot when they all first leaked, but none of the rockers have any staying power for me.  The guitar work seems uninspired and very bland.  The guys in the current lineup are capable of a lot more.  The solos are pretty good, but the rest is soooo average.  The new songs are severely lacking in "sing a long" type riffs that are all over AFD and the illusions.

I know. I'm sick and fucking tired of these comparisons. It's not the majority folks. It's a small minority of Slashite trolls, who anytime one chord is played by Robin, Richard, or Ron, they will say "Slash could've done it better". Robin could be playing a new song, and his material could be the equivalent of Brain May on 'Bohemian Rhapsody', and they'd bring up these stupid comparisons.

None of the new songs we've heard need any help from Slash. They are fine the way they are, and in many places the guitar work is better.

You're not going to hear me listening to Sucker Train Blues, and say, "That would've sounded better with Robin Finck on guitar". No, it's not about that. Fuck that shit.

Fink didnt write Sucker Train Blues so of course it wouldnt sound better....

hehe i will go ontopic again

i will be very happy with the new album if these leaks are the best song we have heared

damn they all rock !! :beer: