Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Hey, I saw a lot of threads about "Better" being the new single maybe next week.  I just emailed our biggest local rock station about it, and here's the response I got:

Hey Dan,
 
"I haven't seen any dates for the new GNR single.  I'll check with the record label on Monday."
 
JP

If anyone else has emailed or talked to their local radio station...post it here.   : ok:

is this allowed to be discussed?

This is what the program director of a local station sent me:


I've heard that the album will be out on Nov 21.
 
My Geffen/Interscope rep hasn't returned any calls or e-mails, so I thinking they're trying to be 100% sure that it's going to come out before they do anyting.
 
Thanks for the e-mail.
 
Adam Chandler
Program Director - Middays
WIHN 96-7 I-ROCK

Why wouldn't it be?  What would be the point of stopping people from talking about stuff?  There are tons of other GNR message boards.

small rock station in upstate ny and programmer of new music mondays says he has heard nothing
tom

I would be surprised if H-D would be using a different song than the 1st single in their ad. ?I can't think of any music I've heard in an ad from a new album that wasn't a single.

I emailed my station, but have yet to hear a response.  I am not expecting anything of subtance if or when they do respond.  In fact, the boobs said they didn't think GNR was going to do a show in my town, and they were wrong.

So why do a select few radio stations say they have the new single?  Are they lying?

Yes.

not per se. They could have the Better demo that got leaked. And since there is a big chance Better will be the single soon, they've got 'the single' but they actually have the demo version of it.

 :confused:

Stop worrying about it - its obvious that the ball starts rolling this week. Enjoy the ride!  : ok:

That station in CT played the leaked demo, not the new single like they claimed.

These radio stations claim they have something exclusive to get listeners, but in fact it's the same "old" leaks.

Playing them on the radio is in my opinion wrong. The band, or record company, didn't mean them to be played on the radio.



/jarmo

its the weekend, they aint going to get any response from anyone in the record company until tomoz, depending on where you are in the world!

Jonx

Remember after the leaks countless small rock radio stations claiming IRS was the new single and they had a mastered copy etc and it would be played shortly and it never materialised, they were lying, these radio stations probably are too.

(response to if had any information on a GNR single)

96 Rock in North Carolina

I still think "better" will not be the 1st single.

Why?

All evidence point to it being the first single.

- No DJ received the 1st single yet - it could be anything - "better" or "prostitute" or "This I Love" or "The blues"....we don't know.
- No DJ received the studio version of "better"
- Nobody said "better" will be the 1st single. Did Merck say that? Did Axl say that? Did Mysteron say that? There is no valid source and no proof.
It's speculation... I remember last february everybody said "IRS is the new single"... including the DJ... everybody believed it.... and everybody was wrong.

well, mayb the reason davidson website isnt putting up that special ad yet is because they're 'waiting' for the single to be released first? its 'better', then something else..during the tour. hopefully.

Be prepared to eat your words, though.

why use a song in a new add if it's not the first single???

especially from a band who hasn't released new music in years.

does that make sense to you?

no one has said it wont be the 1st single!

I thought i heard the the DJ on wccc say something like, i don't exactly remember word for word, but i could of sworn i heard him say when they played the demo yesterday that they will be getting the single next week anyway so why is Axl hassleing us so much, were gonna play it anyway. And goes on to say, well what can they really do? Were gonna have the single, what does it matter if we play the leak today and single next week, when its the same song.

I dont agree with playing it on the radio, once management requested it not to be played. An artist should have a right to say what can't be played, escpecially if its a demo and not the finished product. ?:smoking:

If it is the first single, I think it is cool that Axl would choose one of Robin's songs instead of something he crafted on his own.  Does anyone else agree with me?  The public will like Better.

If indeed it isn't Better, it won't be the Blues or a slow uptemp song like that, NO WAY. It will still be a 'rocker' no matter what song is released and that's just how it's done. I don't think the DJ even claimed to have the new studio version as he said they were getting it next week. He made that pretty clear yesterday. I have no doubt in my mind that Better won't be the single. It's on the HD commercial and I just don't see them using that for a tv commercial, but not releasing it as a single. You can't really compare last February to now, because the album WILL ACTUALLY be out in a month or two's time. I hope it is Better so GN'R can start getting some new fans on board for this albums release. Better will be the best song we have heard to get OTHER peoples attention, besides the hardcore GNR fan.

Actually it does, if Better is the first single, people will hear it in full, (most of us already has) so when people see the commercial they know how the song goes.

But if Better is not the first single people who see the commercial won't know how the rest of the song goes which can lead to the point where they dig the song and wan't to hear more so they become potential buyers.

Plus the band gets more attention, new song (for us) as the single plus part of a new song in the commercial.

I'm still figuring it out myself so I'm not sure if you understand what I mean

Exactly. You hit the nails.

You do realize this is Guns N' Roses we're talking about here. I think very well that Better will not be the first single. If the album is indeed coming out November 21 like some are predicting then it wouldn't be a horrible idea to give the public a taste of Better and a complete version of another song.

We all are just looking at this in different ways. Some believe because it's in the HD commercial it will be the single and others believe it won't be the single for that reason. This is GN'R we are talking about as you said and knowing that, anything could happen. Honestly, I will be happy when the single comes out, regardless of what it is BECAUSE IT WILL BE A NEW GN'R FUCKING SINGLE!!!!!!!!!  I think that's the most important thing to remember right now. Whether you are right or I'm right or someone else is right about what the single will be, I don't care as long as I'm playing it on my stereo.

I didn't forget all those rumours about Prostitute beeing the 1st single a while back... just wait and see...

Think of the excitement level if they release a new song know one has heard before vrs. releasing Better, which is a great song but most have heard in one form or another.

It makes more sense to release a song we've heard before, because people know it.  People have heard it live, and will buy it because they remember having a good time at the show.  Others would have heard the demo, and won't even need to hear the single... just to know the song title and that they liked the version of it that they'd heard.
Plus, potentially 10 - but more likely 7 - tracks of 13 have been heard already.  I'm sure Axl wants to keep the rest under wraps until the album is released.

most of us hardcore GNR fans have heard it but most of the general public have not. Most are only vaguely aware Axl is doing something new. 

I work at WMMS in Cleveland and I've had my eyes/ears peeled for months (ever since the weeks leading up to the Hammerstein gigs)

 There has been NOTHING yet... no single, no release date, no nothing.

 "Guess we'll have to wait and see..."

yeah, but i guess Singles dont get releasedates. They can hit the Radio right away, maybe with a couple of days warning..

And it's perfectly feasible that only a select few people at radio stations even know that it's happening (if it is happening).  They could be under contract not to tell more people than they need to to add to the surprise.
So, unless you're one of the people at the station that would need to know, you wouldn't know.

Yeah, when the most popular DJ's of rock stations have "exclusives," that probably means that not even the employees of the station other than the top boss of everyone knows what the heck is going on.

ah,i just wasnt sure coz of all thats goin on  :peace:

exactly,with the song coming soon in an ad im sure its gonna be the first single.

can a single drop at the same ttime as the album or would that be stupid?

well singles are normally released before in order to promote the album.

of course.but how soon before an album are singles usually released?

depends, i think its common for a single to be out 2 months before an album, however iron maiden released a single and then an album within a few weeks.

GNR could release an album in the next two weeks and easily be able to release cd on Nov. 21st or 28th

I don't see why people are so sure that "better" is going to be the first single, it's just a leak.  Out of all the songs that are prepared to go, why would a leak be chosen as the first or any single?

AR

Maybe because it's the best rock song on the album. It's the best one we've heard at least. Plus those dudes on the radio said they had been informed that they would be receiving Better as the first single in a weeks time. And on top of that it's the tune HD is using in their ads, and commercials pretty much always use a single so that people recognize it immediately. We won't know for sure for a few more days, but ALL signs point to Better.

"We"? Who are "We"?. Speak for you. I prefer IRS 1 million times over "better"? 8)

the live versions of better that i've heard fucking ROCK!!!!  the little clip i heard in the ad was only so-so...not as fast or heavy, it was ok, but not great.....if that's the best song off the cd it will be disappointing.....catcher in the rye should be a classic

For the love o' God no-one knows what's on the album apart from what we "know" from one o' the things we're not allowed to talk about. There could be lots on it we have'n heard yet"! Here's lookin' forward to the release and the end of the speculation! :rant: :confused: >:(

Oh, "Sorry", but have YOU heard the whole album? Fuckhead?
No, I didn't think so


AR

The moment I saw GNR perform "Better" at Hammerstein I was convinced it was the first single. Axl has new signature moves for it and the band's energy picked up.
 
We have so much evidence now--( the Harley thing, the radio station anticipation, etc.) And if you haven't heard the Harley clip I can tell you for sure it is cleaner than the demo. So this ball is rolling.............

And it truly is a great song--and all signs point to it being on the radio--for real---really soon.

And the CD--almost probably definitely late November/early December--there are sponsors on board now.

Like the guy said earlier---enjoy the ride!!!!!!!!!!

You don't have to get angry, hes just saying the signs point to 'Better' being a single, its recognizable and a good song

Couldn't stations get in trouble for playing leaked material?

Yo, you have 9 posts and you are already mouthing off to people? You need to watch your mouth.

Back on topic, I have a horrible feeling that if Better is the first single, it will either be a massive success or the biggest flop in music history...I am unsure which.  :nervous:

Yes, but they'll probably just be told not to play it, what they call a "cease and desist". I doubt GNR wants to bite the hand that feeds them by getting into legal action with radio stations just befre they finally release CD.

i agree.  gnr need radio stations right now to play the fuck out of whatever single they do release, they just want people to hear it exactly as they intend it to sound.

Besides the motorcycle promotion, I'd agree with you.

exactly, why would there be a motorcycle promotion of a non-single song?

I checked the stations list of songs played from the weekend and "Better" is not listed.  Did they play the whole song?

No, i dont think he ever said that, but this is what bandita said at mygnr

http://zeit183geist.proboards62.com/index.cgi?board=gnr&action=display&thread=1161447615&page=1

To confirm........

I heard him talking about "Better" after playing it. He said it was the demo (which you could tell) and was asking for listeners opinions of the song. Overall the feedback was very positive.

I called him up and told him I had seen the new band a few times, and how I thought they did not get a fair shake at it from most media. He agreed. He said that a few years ago he was negative towards GnR and Axl using the name. He then said that he eventually just dropped that view point and decided to give them a chance at the NYC gig(s). He said he went with a bunch of friends and was impressed by how good they were. He kept turning the conversation back to "Better" and how great a song he thought it was.

He told me that his manager told him about the Harley Clip and he had ripped it and wanted to play it on air. The DJ said he chose to play the demo instead, since it was the entire song. He claimed that his boss was a little hesitant but said "We will have the single next week anyway, so what is the difference? They could ask us to stop playing it, but we will be playing the real thing next week anyway."

SLCPUNK from HTGTH spoke to the DJ at WCCC and he said that Better is indeed the 1st single-

Just reporting the news, take it for what it's worth

Sounds promising.

Won't be a shock if they have a single next week and its Better.

thats obviously promising news i dont think its really a question about Better being the single.

Time will tell...

I hope it's true.. a polished Better would be awesome..

No word yet here at my local rock station.  I'm a DJ on 106.3 The Buzz in Wichita Falls, TX.  So we're not exactly a big market or anything, but at the same time we haven't heard anything yet.

Actually they did not claim it was the single (when I listened anyway.) They claimed they would have the single in their hands next week (told to me on the phone.)

For all you baseball fans.Maybe axl is throwing us a curve ball,make us think its "better" but it will be something different,maybe even better

My humble opinion is that, regardless of whether there are other songs on "Chinese Democracy" that are more progressive or technical musically or whatever, I think "Better" works well as a first single, not only as a 'rebirth' of the classic legacy for longtime fans but also to bring in new fans. It might be a bit too simple or repetitive or whatever, but it could appeal to all different musical fans..  Whether it is "old school" classic rock fans, younger kids getting into rock music, and anybody in between.

There's a share of classic riffing in there typical to the old GNR sound, a fair balance of guitar soloing/technicality for novice and virtuoso guitarists alike, a great simple catchy melody, a good groove, and most important of all, a heavy badass breakdown/bridge that'll have all the women going wild as the solos build up and Axl starts to prance around the stage wildly and scream the bridge ("i never wanted......." etc)

When they said they would have the single next week were they refering to oct 23rd-27th or oct 30th-nov 3rd?

Better is a good choice for a single because

1. it is a good song

2. it is one of the leaked songs

The band IMO is adament to keep the rest of the album under wraps. I expect the first single to be one of the leaks.

i agree, i dont feel the other leaked songs so far that the mass appeal better is capable of having. ive never had anybody say they didnt like better. most people are blown away by it.

also, i dont want a 'new' song from the album, i want at least 1/2 the album to be completly new to me. it will take the suspense out of CD if we know most of the songs before its released

It would make sense if it is one of the leaks that way it's not something completely new and they've managed to get feedback based on the leaks, and also they've played it live..Out of those three songs I think "Better" would be the best single...."I.R.S." might be a bit too repetitive in parts..and "There Was A Time"....in no way is it a bad song I fuckin love it...But it would be a better 2nd or 3rd single because it's alot more dramatic, a bit more of a ballad..a good first single would be one that is a hard hitter with alot more energy and one that kicks you in the head..Hence I think "Better" would be the most appropriate single at this time

Because in the Land of Nesquick, anything that has Buckethead on it cant be a single.

In the land of Nesquick, the only thing deemed single worthy is a song that only consists of Axl singing and Fortus strumming a guitar....

personally,i think bucket brought something special to the songs we heard him on.but on another note,im glad he left.not sure why though??? supose we will have to wait till the next album to hear wht Ron can bring in

Can someone tell me what the whole "Harley" thing is about with "Better"? ?I was gone for 4 days.

Are we allowed to post a link to the harley commercial with Better?  They have pulled it and replaced the song with Paradise City for the time being. 

There was a new Harley commercial put online last Friday which featured Better playing over it. Apparently someone at Harley jumped the gun and it was put online when it wasn't supposed to be yet. That same commercial has now got Paradise City in there for the time being.

That could happen with any Nu-GN'R song. We don't know how the public will react cause it's very different from the classic GN'R - other players, other music style.

I really like Better - but my brother, who was a huge GN'R fan back then (and he still loves the classic band) said it's crap, all of the new songs (except CITR) are much better.

Your brother said they all suck, except for CITR?

HUH?

CITR is great, but that's probably the most un-GNR song of them all.

Does anyone else think the melody in CITR sounds very very similar to VR's Fall To Pieces? Or is it just me?

It's just you.............

It's probably the most original GN'R sounding.

Don't even go there. The CITR leak is from 1999. So Axl didn't rip off VR.

He wasn't implying they did. He just asked if anyone else thought it sounded similar.

I don't, personally. Sounds nothing like it IMO.

Easy, easy. I'm with you. It's just when he finishes the lyric "guess i'd have more fun" (or however it goes), and the guitar part kicks in, it sounds similar to FTP imo. Guess no else hears it. No biggie. Keep in mind, Axl's been working on this shit for years... over a decade.


Apparently, jeezus...  :nervous:


I disagree. To me it's unlike the traditional GNR sound like Silkworms & OMG. The difference is, with SW & OMG, they went more modern, whereas CITR is different, but reverse. It sounds more classic rock. I can definitely hear the Queen references in CITR, when Axl made the comment some of the arrangements sound like Queen.

OK, I apologize then. I don't really hear it, but then again I try to avoid "FTP" as much as possible (it's such a cliche ballad...very average).

well as im a myspace whore...

I sent the better song 2 all my mates most said it fuckin rocks and cant believe its GNR

any other myspace whores do the same!

 : ok:

Oh GOD how I agree with you.

I really like CITR. I didn't at first listen, but I gave it another chance.

That song is very, very good and reminds me more of The Beatles, (which makes sense if you think about it) with a more modern/updated feel to it. :yes:

I like VR, but I usually don't listen to Contraband much mainly b/c they're at the end of the alphabet on my iTunes list. Same goes for The Who and ZZ Top (two bands I don't like, but LOVE!). But "FTP" definitely is not a good song in my opinion. It's just the ex-Gunners trying to recreate Axl's balladry from UYI but with a much lousier frontman. At any rate, I do love "Slither" and "Sucker Train Blues."

The opposite. He thinks Better and CITR are the worst works of Nu-GN'R.

Then he's either lying or has no sense for music  ;D

Alot of people are like that. No offense, but the whole "Nu-GNR" bit is played out too.

This is Guns N' Roses, not Nu-GNR.

I don't see the facisnation around Sucker, and alot of fans love that one. Slither is probably their ONLY song I kinda like, but at it's best it's average.

To me, so far from what i've heard, Slither is the best i've heard from their offerings (yes, I do own Contra), and to me Oh My God surpasses Slither, and that's on GNR's lower list for it's newer stuff.

To me, even the best from VR, doesn't even match to the worst of new-GNR.

VR talk goes in the VR section.



/jarmo

I hope "Better" won't be a single. I hope Axl and his new gnr has something better to offer to the fans. :-\

It's not "new-GN'R". It's GN'R ::)

Why keep on calling them 'new' or 'nu' GN'R when they've been together longer than the other line-up ? It's Dead horse.

IMO Better would be a great single to launch the album. It's appealing. That's what the band need, a quick hit. So they'll have exposure.

Maybe there's some big guns we haven't heard yet ? Half the album is still unknown ...

I couldn"t have said it "Better"

I think Better will be the first single cos it sums up GnR's attitude toward being noticed.
the 'awkward' intro adds to the effect when the guitars explode into life. People will be clamering to hear the newgnr then this cat like axl jingle thats somewhat unsettling (for want of a better word) starts up. New listeners are gonna be like wtf? then BAM it starts into life and people will then sit up and listen. exactly the same strategy for the tour. low key (to the US market) European tour, odd appearances here and there nudge people into thinking what Axl is up to then an all out assault on the US inc. release of the album (following the single) and things will explode.
I expect to hear today or tomorrow, I would start another sweepstake thread but i may get banned ?;)

I think "Better" will be the single.  Why else would they pump it up like this?  Anyways, I hope Catcher in the Rye isn't one of the 13 songs on Chinese Democracy, because it's good, but not that good, and it's not even 100% GNR...the lead guitar is Brian May from Queen.  I don't think a song like that should be on the album.  Personally, I haven't heard of many songs with a different lead guitarist (not from the band) on a big album like this.

All I can say regarding the first GNR single in 12 years is that it "Better" not be anything we have heard yet.
I have come to like the new songs, only because I have listened to them many times. I consider TWAT, Better, Madagascar, The Blues, Oh My G-d, IRS to be good and some great moments here & there.

But WTTJ, YCBM, Don't Cry, PC, SCOM, and others jumped at you in the 1st listen. These songs take 3 up to 15 listens to like (Better took me 15 listens). THat is unacceptable for a first single, the first song you draw people into. If the DJ's don't like that 1st hook & the melody in the first listen & the listeners don't like it enough, it will fall flat & so will record sales.

I am confident that these track leaks & live performances are songs that will not be released as the first single. Axl can't be dumb enough to fire his "big guns" before the album blows up.
Here's to hoping.
 ;D
MNW

The single isn't going to be targeted at those that want another WTTJ or YCBM. It's targeted at the public.

Hog shit! It's like "Star Trek" and "Star Trek: The Next Generation". Although some like the latter (like me), and it's ok to call it just "Star Trek" and still talk about Picard and the likes. However, when referencing the original series and the next generation in one conversation, one must put the suffix in there to distinguish. It just so happens that the most commenly chosen way of describing post 96 GNR is calling it "Nu-GNR" or "New GNR". Nothing wrong with that. And just for the record: I think, not sure though, that the longest a specific GNR line-up has been together must've been about 4 years, with Steven on drums. I could be wrong though, as I don't really know what line-up changes there have been in the late nineties.

there`s also a version with finck on it.......the original version...


axl himself said newgnr by the way....

Nothing on are system at work (HMV) just chinese democracy priced ?13.00 deleted title

have called universal and all are major supply teams pinnacle ect ect they have no information at all

Well not only that, but the song is 7+ years old now...  I don't think I.R.S. should even be on the album.  If it were up to me, the only leaks on the album would be "Better" and "There Was a Time."  Those two songs caught my attention, and I liked those songs right off the bat.  CITR took me about 20 listens to starts liking, and I still don't really care about I.R.S. that much...  But that's all my opinion. :)

Well, from what I've seen in all the "neo GNR" bashing that Slash is gone,blah,blah,blah the PUBLIC WANTS A NEW WTTJ or YCBM - and that IS the problem Axl is facing!

Well, I say that if they can't deal with it...fuck 'em!? They won't like GNR's new album no matter what, just because Slash isn't in it.? This whole album could be better than Appetite for Destruction, but some people are just too thick-headed.? GNR will get new fans from this album...

Amen brother! :beer:

why don't "blend" this thread into the other "BETTER" thread

To all those that oppose BETTER:

It should come to no surprise that they are picking a leak as the first single.
From a promotion standup, its the most logical way to go, in that many are already
familiar with the leaks and its been played live to many fans around the world.

It's also common knowledge they'd release a rocker first...So either IRS, BETTER OR CD
would likely be the first single...I think most fans prefer BETTER to IRS (although it may
be close).

I wouldnt be surprised to see The Blues as the #2 single, followed be whatever other
surprises the album has....Although I wouldnt hold the same weight to the #2 single
as #1.

P.S. BETTER will easily go to #1 on the rock charts...Anyone want to wager on this?
Ill wager up to 2k and we can have Jarmo hold it in an escrow account (on the
condition that BETTER is released as #1 single and MTV plays their video) until
it hits #1 in US market, or obviously has no chance at going #1.

The "Rock Charts" is not important. There is one real singles charts, it's the Top 40. and there is one real albums charts, it's the Bilboard Top 200.
Think global.

I still think the leaks were intentional. NOT Catcher, but the first three. Management did not become active on the forums until CITR leaked. I think someone who had it got less scared after the other three leaked and figured since other people were doing it he would be okay to let one leak, too.

I just find it ironic that Axl mentions TWAT and Better as his favorites in RS and - whaddaya know! There they are.

I think it was a way of getting the names of the songs out there, building up some more hype, then letting the songs go and having people say, "Hey, that song Axl was talking about last week is online! Cool!"

It got people interested and helped advance-hype the tour. People had more faith after hearing the demos that they *were* making music after all.

I honestly think it was a brilliant marketing scheme.

After CITR leaked, management quickly found the leaker by sending people onto the forums. I was one of the first people to have the leak. Someone sent it to me and asked me to post it on MyGNR. I said I wouldn't because I didn't want to have any responsibility for this. I told my story on the forum and right after this all these newly-registered users contacted me asking for tons of information on the guy who sent it to me. One of the people who asked me later was basically determined to be some sort of plant.

It sounds like a wacky conspiracy theory but think about it - it's great marketing. What better way to reinvent interest in a defunct band than release some tracks onto the 'net and get people speculating and talking again?

I'm not dissing completely on the songs put out thusfar by the new GNR - they will make for a great record. But I doubt these songs will be singles if they are already out. They are obviously out for a reason, to give fans a sample of what is to come. That's what happened with Silkworms & Rhyad and the Bedouins. A song that will make for the 1st GNR single will need to hook people in on the 1st play, which was the strength of the past material.

There's nothing wrong in saying that GNR needs a song that plays to old strengths. Isn't that why Axl kept the name?

MNW

I believe the billboard top 200 (which is NOT global btw, only US MARKET) is determined by actual sales, which is pretty cool, so CD should do well here.

The Top 40 charts on the other hand, are derived from airplay and sales with the emphasis on airplay..Each time a single is played
from MONITORED radio stations, 1 point is scored...Unfortunately most of the monitored stations are TOP 40 stations, thus it is very unfair
to realistically compare a rock single to a pop single....Only a ballad would have a chance.

I emailed a DJ at a local station that plays all the hits about Better, and if hes heard anything about it, and this is what he had to say about it.

(its in the form of a .jpg due to Gmail refusing to let me copy\paste. Emails and such have been blurred out to prevent harassment and such. Also, to clear it up, My original email is at the botom of the page, and his reply is at the top, you can find the WIFC site and http://www.WIFC.com)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v335/dadud3/GNRDJEMAILBETTER.jpg)

Cool man  : ok:

Wonder if hes heard the leak or the actual single though.

It's just the demo.

No one has the single yet.

It hasn't been shipped to the stations.

I mean... ermm... can we say that? I don't know what we are/aren't allowed to talk about at this point regarding the song.  :-X

I still think the leaks were intentional. NOT Catcher, but the first three. Management did not become active on the forums until CITR leaked. I think someone who had it got less scared after the other three leaked and figured since other people were doing it he would be okay to let one leak, too.

I just find it ironic that Axl mentions TWAT and Better as his favorites in RS and - whaddaya know! There they are.

I think it was a way of getting the names of the songs out there, building up some more hype, then letting the songs go and having people say, "Hey, that song Axl was talking about last week is online! Cool!"

It got people interested and helped advance-hype the tour. People had more faith after hearing the demos that they *were* making music after all.

I honestly think it was a brilliant marketing scheme.

After CITR leaked, management quickly found the leaker by sending people onto the forums. I was one of the first people to have the leak. Someone sent it to me and asked me to post it on MyGNR. I said I wouldn't because I didn't want to have any responsibility for this. I told my story on the forum and right after this all these newly-registered users contacted me asking for tons of information on the guy who sent it to me. One of the people who asked me later was basically determined to be some sort of plant.

It sounds like a wacky conspiracy theory but think about it - it's great marketing. What better way to reinvent interest in a defunct band than release some tracks onto the 'net and get people speculating and talking again?

Wacky is the norm with GN'R. ?Yes odds are they were intentional.

Ain't that the truth!

Hey, by the way, are you Sandman from MyGNR?  ???

Nope. No relation

Aww shucks.

You suck then.  :-X

 :hihi: Jus' playin'! I didn't think you were him because his avatar and posting style is different.

VERY TRUE

The big problem with some newgnr tunes (especially "better") is that some great musical parts are mixed with some incredible shitty ones. As a result, you get mixed feelings. There are some great moments in "better", but some others are absolutely catastrophy, really (that intro is...dear lord...even worst than My World, really!).? The big problem is that song is very irregular. There is no logic along the song.? The parts have no link between them. There is no coherent structure. It's like a puzzle, do you see what I mean? it goes through 1000 directions.
On the contrary, the intros of jungle, sweet child, you could be mine etc... were mind blowing. First note, wowowowowww, earth shattering. The magic invaded you from the 1st note to the last one. Thoses songs were built not as a puzzle, but as an empire, and that's why GN'R 87-93 stormed the world. You couldn't resist. It was too good.

I tell you, the intro will turn a lot of people off. I forced myself to listen to the rest of the song when I first heard that intro when the song was leaked. and I'm a fan. I prefer to be honnest. I don't like to lie. I like to call a cat, a cat. I'm a fan and I forced myself to listen a dozen times "better" before starting to like it. It says it all... sorry.

The intro to better is PERFECT it grabs your attention because? you are like WTF is then, then it goes into axls great lyrics. I think the song is killer and its like nothing else out there. It mixes pop, industrial, and metal/rock all into one. Its an amazing song. Listen to the song on JUST THE LEFT speaker if you dont like the intro.

just because the intro isn't some hard rock guitar thing doesn't mean it isn't good. i think the entire song, top to bottom, is inspired. but then again my interests are probably different from those who don't like the intro and the middle. my other favorite tunes of the year are cheated hearts, broken boy soldiers, crazy... stuff like that.

I love the middle part. but the intro has nothing to do with beeing hard-rock or not hard-rock. That's not the point. Either it sounds good, or it doesn't. That's as simple as that. It could be hard-rock, blues, jazz, Rn'B, techno, or Bossa Nova, whatever, it doesn't matter. It's called the first impression, and it's very important. I listen to everything, from Ennio Morricone to Britney Spears and my favourite music is Funk/Disco Music (along with Classic Rock music of course). I'm absolutely not strictly hard-rock.

I love the intro but HATE Axl's screaming in the middle-I cringe when I hear it. I could live with the middle if you took his screaming out-just instrumental. People have different tastes about what sounds good Nessy-will you ever learn that? ???   The fact that you listen to Britney Spears just answered my question...... :rofl:

(I tried to post this already?)

Anyway, can someone paste the Better lyrics here?  I am having a hard time finding the thread!  I am looking for the lyrics that come after "inspiraration"...

Thanks

Better


No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better

No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better

The hardest part
This troubled heart
Has never yet been through now   
We've healed the scars
That got their start
Inside someone like you now

Well had I known
Or I'd been shown back when I longed you?d take me
To break the charms
That brought me harm
And all that won't erase me

I never would
Not that I could
No matter what you'd pay me
Replay the part
You stole my heart
I should have known you're crazy

If all I knew was that with you
I'd want someone to save me
It'd be enough
But just my luck
I fell in love and baby all that I wanted was

Now I know you better
You know I'd know better
Now I, know you better



So bittersweet
This tragedy
Won't ask for absolution
This melody
Inside of me
Still searches for solution
A twist of fate
A change of heart
Cures my infatuation
A broken heart
Provides the spark for my determination

No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better ohh
No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better

All that I wanted was

I know you know you know better
You know I know you know better
Yeah you know me better

(Solo)

I never wanted you to be so full of anger
I never wanted you to be somebody else
I never wanted you to be someone afraid to know themselves
I only wanted you to see things for yourself

(Solo)

All that I wanted was

Now I know you better
Now we all know better
All that I wanted was

(Solo)



If I were you
I?d manage to
Abhor the invitation
Of promised love
That can?t keep up
With your adoration
Just use your head
And in the end
You?ll find your inspiration
To choose your steps
That won't regret
This kind of aggravation

No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better
No one ever told me when I was alone
They just thought I'd know better, better

I could not disagree more. Loved that song right off the bat. Did it really take you "15 listens" to "get into" "better"? Than I guess it would take you 50 listens to get into "Dark Side of the Moon" and a thosand listens to get into a German opera.

The lyrics are important just for the English native language people. Believe me, those who speak foreign languages don't mind the lyrics because most of the time we don't have the time to understand them, we just listen to the melody. So does "better" have great lyrics? yes. Does it matter for me? No. When you listen to a song that isn't in your native language, you just care about the melody. I heard many people saying that IRS has shitty lyrics. But guess what? i don't mind, the melody is awesome to me and I prefer IRS? (or another new song) over Better, even if I know the lyrics are far better in "better".

I would like to add that although "Better" takes a lot of twists and turns, everything works and is coherent. Just because it doesn't follow a verse-chorus-verse doesn't mean it lacks structure. Ever listened to "1983" off of the "Electric Ladyland" album? That song is a fuckin' trip, all over the place, as is "Light my Fire" by the Doors. In all three songs, you, the listener, go though twists and turns, but it all works.

no
its Abhor without a doubt

I hear 'Avoid the invitation'

Its without a doubt abhor
http://download.yousendit.com/FFBBDDF848D85699

Now who think its avoid now?

Dude, check your PMs!  :o

"Better" is a killer tune but i'm surprised that it's going to be the first single. I knew the Electronica/NIN style intro would piss off the old mullett loving "Joe Dirt" fans that are left over from the 80's. I love electronica and NIN, and I'm glad that Axl is trying to push the envelope. I would be so choked if Axl was doing retro rock like Wolfmother, Raconteurs, The Killers, and countless other boring bands. After saying all this though, I think Axl should have gone with a more old school rock song to kick things off, and get the "Joe Dirts" of the world to buy the album.

yes, the fans who made gnr where they were ::)

I thought the song was awesome the first time I heard it. It has also been the only song that I have heard that I instantly said "if they release that as their single, it would be huge". Love the intro, love the arrangement, great song.

'Better' will reach a large audience and will appeal to a lot of different people. The Mullets will hate it though, especially the intro, but i'm pretty sure that is not the audience they are going for these days.

Joe Dirt?????  Umm ok..you mean old?  I'm 38.   I guess I'm Joe Dirt.     :rofl:

I still hear 'avoid', even on the demo and the Donnington Monitor mix. 

Plus it also makes more sense.

No. ?He means, 1978 Camaro driving, fat girlfriend, redneck fans from the 80's...

How can you hear avoid? And said avoid once live and abhor every other time.

i think joe dirts aren't necessarily old, just stuck in a certain notion of what gnr should sound like.  i think these fans are more likely to sport a mullet and stonewashed jeans but i've seen some 13-year-olds wearing that shit.  :o

Even in that slowed down clip, I clearly hear 'avoid.' No doubt in my mind really but I think it depends on what you are listening for.

I agree i used to always heard avoid until someone said it was abhor then I started hearing that.
Btw did you like the remix

I did like the remix. Thanks for that. Can't wait for the studio version this week.........*knock on wood.

I've loved 'Better' since the first time I heard it, and I've always hoped that it would be the first single. I felt that it should be the first single; of the leaked tracks, 'Better' is the catchiest and hardest rocking, and it has great lyrics, too. Whereas I love all the new leaks, a song like 'TWAT' for instance, which I'm now in love with, took me several listens to fully appreciate. 'Better,' on the the hand, was immediately enjoyable; I couldn't get it out of my head for weeks; I'd walk around singing "No one ever told me when I was alone, they just thought I'd know better, better," or I'd be singing the chorus. I don't understand the bitching about the intro, because I love the intro. I think it's so cool; and Finck's guitar playing at the very beginning could very easily go on to be as recognizable as 'Sweet Child O' Mine' or 'Paradise City.' Okay, that's probably not likely, but I do think it's just as recognizable once you've listened to the song a few times. The whole song is very unique; it's unlike anything I've heard before. I think I've probably watched the Rock Am Ring performance of 'Better' like 100 times. I get chills each time I hear Axl scream "I NEVER WANTED YOU TO BE SO FULL OF ANGER!"

I'm also glad that the first single is one of the leaked tracks, because like someone else said, I want the rest of the CD to be a mystery when I get it.

And, I never thought about this until now, but maybe this is also a statement from Axl to the world, saying that this GNR is 'better' than the old GNR.

"Better" is the BEST of the new songs, along with Madagascar.  This will be the PERFECT single.  I've played it to SEVERAL people and they all love it.  Just can't wait for the public response.

all the people ive played it to love it, no lie. some are reagetton fans.

I believe a songs greatness is based on the vocal melody over guitars/instruments or whatever.  Axl's melody with Robin's guitar and hopefully Bucket's short shredding session is perfect for this song.  It has every element you need for a single.  Perfect pick.

Better is an amazing track. Its a great choice for the single. Its got a lot of cool elements. And it all works. If the album has 2-3 other songs on par with Better combined with what we have already hear, CD will be better than the Illusions by a lot and will blow anything out there away....

CD is already better than AFD.


Chin Dem > out to get me
Better > rocketqueen
IRS > anything goes
Blues > think about you
Madagascar > You're crazy
Catcher in the rye > my michelle
TWAT > night train


PS
Booker for this post read my sig? : ok:

dave how can you say its better than AFD when you havnt even heard the album yet? AFD is a timeless album that very few can top. I seriously doubt that CD will be able to capture the RAW ENERGY of AFD.

CD can be an all time classic? but lets not put it on that list yet....

AFD and CD are 2 different types of albums. You cant compare each others songs head to head like that.

Thus far CD had produced 1 anthem type song whereas AFD produced 2{WTTJ and PC}

The other you cant compare because they are more Illusion type songs than AFD type

So you disagree with the CD songs I think are better than the AFD songs?
I disagree.
Will a song on CD be bigger than SCOM, WTTJ or PC probably not but that doesnt mean on the whole CD isnt gonna be better

Anyways getting back on top.
I would take Better over most of the songs on AFD with the exception of the three I just named.

No, I agree some CD songs are better than AFD songs. The point is that as an albuma s a whole, AFD is on an elite level. The album as a whole made it that way.

Cd can go down as one of the greatest albums of all time, and I think it iwll, but to say its better than AFD right now is insane.

you cant compare TWAT to TAB, or Madagascar to Anything goes..etc...thats nuts. They are 2 completely different kinds of albums.

The UYI combined are better than AFD, I dont see your point.
Better is also better than a lotof the songs on the UYIs.
Better is probably in the top 20 gnr tracks ever.
Better could be a big hit.

Is there a reason that a single hasn't been released yet?  Merck has already said more than once to the press that the album is coming out this year.  I understand they don't want the public to hear any more unreleased songs but they could easily release Better or IRS as a viable single at this point as these songs have both been available to the public for months.  Release single and put it up on iTunes, I don't see what harm releasing IRS or Better at this point would do even without a video

^^I  hear ya. A single needs to drop ASAP. The shows are not selling out, and new material might help that.

I think the single is gonna be release when that Harely ad drops. And that ad is gonna drop late Oct which is now. So I think we will get an offical single anytime now

Yeah they are touring in support of the album if the public actually heard a new, official Guns N Roses single on the radio nationwide and not just the few stations here and there it would be a big help when it comes to selling tickets

Not might, it WILL help sales. "Better" will be the single and it kicks some major ass. People like that song. People outside of the GN'R forum circle that I have listen to this song, like this song. The announcement of an album and a new single will show the american public that this is not a glorified cover band. But this is a great band. With great music. People will buy tickets for their shows when this single hits. ?:smoking:

Better WILL ?be a big hit. As will the album.

My point is that its very hard to compare the GNR albums to each other. That goes for the Illusions as well. Thats the beauty of GNR. For me atleast. They have such a diverse catalougue thats its hard to compare and isolate the material against each other.

I firmly believe that CD will be just as good as anything the old band has done. The material I have heard so far is definately standing up to old gnr and then some. The new songs are a part of gnr history that are expanding the GNR sound while still sounding like GNR.

Cd will provide great lyrics and great music. My doubts of this album, band and sound are long gone. My doubts of the media giving this album a fair shake are diminishing as well. Over the past yr GNR have recieved more and more positive press. And how sweet that is.

Instead of comparing CD to the old stuff song for song Im gonna judge it from the standpoint of does it stand up to the GNR name as a whole. And thus far it has.....

CD, the follow ups, RObin,Richard, Brain,Tommy,Bummble, Dizzy and Pittman are all going to be part as the 2nd era of GUns N Roses. Down the road people will realize that this band will have had 2 great bands with 2 great periods of music....and as a fan I cant ask for anything more

Well I think with the Harley Davidson ad that Better is clearly gonna be the single and it should drop sometime this week.

Any ideas on when Better will be on the commercial and what channels it will play on?!?!?!

Best bet is during the world series

hmm that'd be nice...guessing since it IS going to be the only new track released to the public, that it will be the single.  I guess there's really no doubt about it now...

We are all inherently unique and everybody has a different opinion so I don't have a problem with your favoritism of certain songs over others; however, your argumentative approach is infantile at best. Don't expect anybody to take you seriously if the extent of you reasoning is a greater than sign.

Too hardcore fans this album is already "better".  Nothing will top Appetite in anyones eyes, no matter what Axl put out.  Better is a great start though...

agreed.

i was kinda hoping it'd be a completely new song, but whatever... almost everyone seems to dig Better, so...

I dunno... I just wish they would hurry up with the new ad.  I really want GNR to get the ball rolling!

One of the greatest aspects of GNR is that they have a VARIETY of songs with its own texture, topic & melody. We may like the songs on different levels relating to us, but collectively, they endear us in different ways to Guns N' Roses.

I would have never gotten into GNR had I not heard WTTJ, Nightrain, November Rain & SCOM. & those were HIT songs
Afterwards, it took maybe 3-4 years for me to like the rest of the GNR catalog. No really. I used to skip on songs like "My Michelle", Mr. Brownstone, Dust & Bones, Coma, the Garden & especially Rocket Queen. But when I saw Axl perform them live in many of the DVD's I own, I grew very attached to them because these songs meant a lot to him & the band. It probably took less listens for me to like "Better" than "Rocket Queen". Doesn't mean they're bad songs, but they are not HIT songs. I only like Better because Axl performs it passionately. How could you compare it to "Dark Side of the Moon"? Isn't that analysis "over the moon"?

That's my nature as a music fan, whether I like it or not (I don't care about anything else).
I accept that people love the new songs, but you need to accept that there is no hit we have heard yet that anchor the new album & will bring the LEGIONS of fans back to the fold, whose opinions matter on the business-side of GNR. BETTER does have a weak intro & Axl does not sound good in the beginning (it definitly is not his intro to WTTJ or YCBM "I'm a Cold Heartbreaker".)
Madagascar & The Blues or TWAT or IRS will make for good singles, maybe 3rd or 4th after the album comes out. TWAT looks like a classic - but even those songs don't make for a 1st single. Even Estranged was never a hit - & that song is our favorite.

Is it really true that Axl has nothing left to hide? Did he really put out his big guns already? Or is everyone just guessing & making up hypotheticals?

I want to hear the answer from this coming tour.

MNW

Reply from 97.9 the Loop (big rock station in Chicago area)

Hi Dan,

I haven't gotten any word about the new GNR being out next week, with this band you never know what's really happening. I have heard that there will be new music but exactly when is still unclaer.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help, stay tuned because when its out I'm sure we'll have it for you on The Loop!!

Take care,

Bill Klaproth

so how can you say..

Better IS a hit. Mark it down. Better will make it extremely hard for the naysayers to downplay this band and album. CAse Closed. If they were releaing CD, maybe even IRS they would have a lot more to stand on. Better leaves them witht here dick in there hand.


I think we have heard 2 "Big Guns" so far. And that is Better and TWAT. I think the final product of TWAT will elevate it to Better status.

I believe CD will have another 1 or 2 "Big Guns" . And if that is correct, we are in for a treat. And the fans, media etc will all give this band props. FOr the most part, it has been positive press regarding this band over the past yr.

Songs like Better will re establish the GNR name.

This album will live up to its hype. The album will stand up to the old gnr material. Axl has been captain once before he can do it again. Are there any musical doubts of this band still? The countless threads of how this band musically cant do it ended when the leaks came out....

When everyone...including us, hear Axls voice on a legit, fresh,crisp format we are all gonan get pumped up again that rock is back. Nomore bootlegs,no more demos.

A legit studio produced song will erase the remaining doubts....

My thoughts exactly. CD will suffer of writing songs outta riffs and ideas without having a a general idea. This makes incoherent songs like Nu-GN'R wrote. This 'let's jam and then I'll build up the songs by listening the different ideas' is a dead end street musically. Dive in and find the monkey  :confused:

Nu-GN'R has great moments but doesn't have songs just some patched-up works without any structure.

Chinese Democracy "hits" may not have been popular during the time AFD came out, but with the competition today, CD's songs will be hits.  You just can't compare the old GNR to the new GNR stuff.  It's like comparing Janis Joplin's hits with Brittney Spears' hits...  :smoking:

No matter what song you pick, you can't satisfy everyone. ?Of the songs we've heard, Better is by far the most radio friendly and the most appealing to the mass market.

And if you don't think Better, and to a lesser extent Maddy, are sonically complex with in-depth structure....you don't know music. ?You could level the charge they are OVERLY complex, to a fault, but not that they lack complexity and structure all together. ?There are just layers and layers of sound in there......which is what makes the tunes so soncially interesting....much like what Estranged and Coma were on the Illusions albums.

Must EVERY discussion decend into comparisons between the old and new.....which then bash the new band's output?

Personately, I need to hear the STUDIO versions of each new songs now to make my judgment.

I'll agree with that.  And one more thing.  I wasn't  bashing the new GNR shit.  I was trying to make a point.  What GNR has now, is going to be the best stuff in the modern rock world...no doubt about it.

beg to differ.

like not everyone is a zeppelin fan or a fan of oasis, u2, eminem etc, not everyone in the world had/has much of an opinion on gnr of the past.

It's the hardcore fans of AFD era who tend to think nothing should top appetite. Probably that's it for them. I hear there're people who prefer early Beatles songs to those of their latter period.

Better will introduce people nicely to the 21st century GNR.

Chinese democracy will turn many non gnr fans into the fans. and some of them will discover the gems of old GNR afterwards.

Cd, IRS, better, omg, riyadh are to my mind in no way inferior to wttj, pc, and scom. To the future fans minds as well, I reckon.   :smoking:

I think CD should be the first single:........

1) Its the title track of the album
2) A catchy opening riff
3) Judging by Axl's vocals on the Boston promo studio cuts - sounds absolutely amazing
4) Quite poppy - not as industrial sounding as better
5) Says goodbye to the old GN'R with glimpses of old-GN'R style music, and introduces the new band with glimpses of New-GN'R

It's obviously the first single if it's being featured in a new Harley Davidson commercial. Anyone see this yet? I saw it on You Tube and read a couple of news releases on google news.

I've seen that firsthand already... ?One of my best friends and my girlfriend both listened to the new GNR, and it got them into the older stuff, too. ?: ok:

Sorry.....CD will be an amazing album.....but nothing will ever touch AFD.....it's just the way it is.....I was in 7th grade when that album came out......that album turned into a culture and changed the world......I am hoping that CD does the same.......but it is HIGHLY unlikely.......

I think CD should be the first single:........

1) Its the title track of the album
2) A catchy opening riff
3) Judging by Axl's vocals on the Boston promo studio cuts - sounds absolutely amazing
4) Quite poppy - not as industrial sounding as better
5) Says goodbye to the old GN'R with glimpses of old-GN'R style music, and introduces the new band with glimpses of New-GN'R

I think CD would make a great first single also.  Maybe that is why they havent been playin it live.  So they could bring it back fresh for this tour when it hits radio.  Maybe they are gonna open with it. :-X :peace:

CD is a terrible first choice......it ain't gonna be a single period. It's an ok song but doesn't have enough bite for a single.......Sorry but that's not gonna happen.

Thanks for clearing it up Mr. Merck  :P :hihi:

Better is the expected first single, but it is yet to be confirmed

But then the question becomes: when? ;D

And then the answer is: soon!  ;D

who expects?

who confirms?

Anytime buddy....and my name is SKINFLICK to you pal.... :hihi:

Good choice.

I love Mysteron's little juicy tidbits. Don't suppose I'd be pushing my luck to ask if they plan on cutting a video for it?!  :hihi:

Get over it already Better is not going to be the first single.

Like Axl said before we are holding are big guns back.

Better is not a "BIG GUN"   :hihi:

thank you

but in february it was one of his favourite songs so i say it's prolly one of the "BIG GUNS"

you're welcome

I don't think so.  Its a good song, but the amount of hype around new disc, the long wait, many casual fans will be saying "this is what we waited for"???  Better will not be on the radio for months like WTTJ and SCOM were.  If Better is the best that CD has to offer then I think we're in store for a major disappointment.  Its a good tune, but it doesn't blow me away.  The middle is the only redeeming part of the song.  The first single should be a song that is on the charts and on the radio in heavy rotation for months.

Same for me. I hope it's not the best track they have to offer...

Singles are not always the best song a cd. I ussually notice that they pick a catchy tune for most singles, one that will stick in peoples heads. Better is one of those songs that will stick in peoples heads. It may not be the best rock song ever, but its still a great rock song with a catchy tune. It will be accepted by the public, and it will help cd sales.? :smoking:

When did Axl say this?

During the 2002 tour.  I think it's time to fire away.

Years and years ago.

Bottom line is, when it takes 13 years to make an album that critisism is valid. Critisism like that unfortunately takes away from a song like Better, which I believe is probably the best song GnR' have made since the AFD days. Is it the best CD has to offer? I hope not, but if it is I won't be dissapointed.

This is the way i felt about I.R.S. & TWAT.? No way casual fans should hear these first after all the hype.? IMO, out of the tracks we've heard, Better is the perfect attention grabber and most catchy, radio-friendly rocker there is.? I'm with the masses in hoping that there are other songs from the album that are better and harder rocking, but for right now if you asked me to choose from the songs we've heard so far, Better is the most sensible choice to get people hyped.

The casual fan isn't waiting for the new GN'R album. At least not in the U.S. And not from my personal experience of talking about GN'R in many places in the U.S. Most really just don't care. Or say stuff, like: ? ?really GN'R is working on an album??!! No way!! I didn't know that, I wonder if it will be any good. ? ? Better is a song good enough to get them to listen to more and thats all you need. ?:smoking:

4 years ago.

No offense to you guys who say better is a "catchy song" "radio friendly" etc...but you sound like record execs and not rock fans.  I mean, if you genuinely think better is an amazing song, then thats cool, to each their own.  The best Guns song since AFD???  well, thats just ridiculous, sorry.  ::)

but anyways, i hope CDs and the songs on it aren't just attention grabbers and radio friendly rock songs.....I want songs that if I was 14 would piss my parents off, songs that grab your balls and rip out your soul the way AFD and some UYI songs did.  THAT is gnr, not a song whos intro sounds like Mr. Hanky is singing it.   I don't know dudes, it just doesn't do it for me.  Like i said, take out the heavy middle part and I think its a VERY average tune.

I think if you weren't a GNR fan, you wouldn't think so highly of it.  I could be wrong.  we'll see  :peace:

I mean, do any of you find yourself humming the guitar parts to Better the way you STILL do to WTTJ, SCOM and PC????

I don't think its the best they've ever done either. But I belive its a great song. GN'R was what you said it WAS, they had songs that grab your balls and rip out your soul. Thats true. But its a different time now. Its? a different band now. The sound is more modern, more progessive. I belive in todays rock climate, it will be a hit. In todays radio market, and MTV generation, if a band wants mass success they need a catchy radio tune. Better is that song. I as well hope its not the best off of CD and I dont think it will be. So many bands today play singles that aren't as good as other stuff on the Album. I also belive the label nor Axl wants to put a brand new song as a single, with all the leaks that have come out. I think they have stuff thats better than better. No pun intended. But picked the best of the leaked tracks that will appear on chinese democracy. And the best leak that will give them the best exposure in today's market. Axl has said he wants to progress from Appetite not relive it. This is progession. This is different then what we've heard from GN'R before. This single will be a hit. This single alone will sale albums? :smoking:

i've never hummed the guitar parts to those songs. i do hum the 'mr hanky opening.' i think better, in its way, is as good as those songs. don't shoot me...
what was it axl said? some people are going to say 'this isn't axl, this isn't gnr. but some songs you'll like.' i probably won't come back here when the album is out because the people here are all going to trash half the album.

I think a song like Better attracts a lot of new fans. For example a lot of my friends who werent GNR fans really liked it, but it didnt grab me that much with the exception of the middle section..

I've gotta admit i'll be dissapointed if thats the first single. I am really hoping we'll get another huge WTTJ or Sweet Child type song.

just the heavy bit in the middle.

really? I'm humming the song all the time. The best part is the first two verses, as I think the lyrics are magnificent.

^^I find the last verse to be absolutely fantastic.

Just use your head and in the end you'll find your inspiration
To choose your steps that won't regret this kind of aggrevation

everyone i know who i've played better for loved it. And 99% of those are NOT remotely GNR fans or into anything GNR related. it's an amazing crossover song. it's crazy catchy, but modern, quirky, unconventional and ass kicking. what the fuck more do you want??
i think it would make an amazing first single.

I want an instant classic, a song that will still be "radio friendly" 20 years from now.  Sorry, Better is not that song.  I want a song that says "now THIS was waiting for".  Better is not that song....good song, but not a 10+ year waiting song.

I personally don't really care if "non die hards" or non GNR fans like it b/c its a cross over song...dont' you think REAL GNR fans should like it first???  If the album sells 10 million copies and its average at best, I'm not going to be happy.  Britney Spears sold a ton of records too but her songs are punchlines now, yet they were radio friendly and catchy etc.....

like i said, and i mean no offense truly, but you guys sound more like record execs then guns fans - dont' you want to hear songs in the same vein as the ones that made you fans to begin with?!?!?

Of course I want.... but man, there is no Slash anymore. How can it be "as good as before" without Slash? it's impossible. and "better" prooves it: it's good but it's nothing like the 87-93 erea. It's like asking The Chicago Bulls to be as good as before without Michael Jordan... it's just impossible.
Plus there are 3 guitar players, wich is even worst because none of them has enough space to shine and to show his real talent like Slash.

dude............................

gett..... over it.....

finck and the rest will start SHININ after CD is released. fuckin wait for it. SLash didnt 'SHINE' until AFTER AFD came out   :confused: :confused:

Frozen.....you got it ... lol  : ok:

its a Full CD we are waiting for. You could be mine is a killer song, but not the best of the illusion albums. But i guess it was the first single.
And for the people beliving that there will be fillers on CD! Dream again! Every song on this album, will be damn good. If we get it the was Axl and Guns N Roses wants..
Better is perfect for a fist single, in my ears.. A cool video behind it would also be killer :D  : ok:

<i>dont' you want to hear songs in the same vein as the ones that made you fans to begin with?!?!? </i>

Bands evolve. So must GNR. And as long as the change is gradual, why complain? It's not like the new material and old material is day/night. Just a little less bluesy and more modern, but you can definately still hear it's GNR.

dude thats the most sense youve ever made.

I like these new songs that I've heard. And I am glad Axl is not trying to relive the past by attempting to duplicate Appetite. Nothing you will ever hear will take you back to the spot you want to be at. You expect to much. I expect a lot as well, but I am over that sound. I love Appetite and I will forever, but I don't want this band to make songs "like Appetite" or songs like the ones that made me a fan to begin with. I love Guns N Roses. I love this version of Guns N Roses. I love these new songs by Guns N Roses. Will I be dissappointed if better is the best song off of the new album?? Damn Right I will be. But I love the sound of this new band. Some people fail to relize it may have the same name buts its not the same band. It should sound different. It will sound different. Not everyone will like this album. I'm ok with that. From what i've heard this album will kick ass and take names. In the end you have to ask yourself if your ready to move foward? If your ready to let go of the past? I am. I have. And I love what Guns N Roses is doing now. And I loved what they did than. But I do not want this band to sound like it once did. All I want is for Chinese Democracy to live up to the name Guns N Roses. From I have heard I belive it will. I grew up listening to Appetite. And now I am ready to grow old listening to Chinese Democracy?:smoking:

Well said.  "Better" has a lot of different parts but they all fit together.  Its kinda like the song Axl was trying to write when he put out "Oh My God."  The two solos by Robin and Buckethead are two of my favorite solos ever.  The first show starts in 2 or 3 hours!

EDIT:  "I grew up listening to Appetite. And now I am ready to grow old listening to Chinese Democracy"

me too dude!

Agree. Better is a catchy, poppy rock song with serious industrial elements. A great choice to introduce Nu-GN'R to the public. The song isn't Earth-shattering, but I really like it.

How could Axl's new band sound as Guns N'Roses without Slash, Izzy and Duff in the new band ? That, my friend, is impossible. You may like Axl's new band, but to like it because it sounds like Guns N'Roses is the worst reason to love it. It's cool to evolve, but to change everything is a whole different story...

Concerning Better, I hope they will release something better. I mean this song isn't a patch on former GNR singles like Welcome to the Jungle, Sweet Child O'Mine or You Could Be Mine (first single from the Illusion albums).

Amen to that!

why the fuck do you have to bring the old lineup into this?   dude the old band has been gone for a long fucking time.. maybe you should get over it already.  : ok:

Sorry Jimmy, but I am not the one who brought the old line-up into this : Demon Wolf did. : ok:

I feel the same way. I still cannot understand how people don't think all the material we've heard so far doesn't sound like Guns N' Roses anyways!

Look, Axl's band could be playing polkas and mazurkas, you still would say that it sounds like GN'R.

The fact is that Better doesn't sound like anything done before by GN'R. You may think it is great that Axl chose this path or, on the contrary, you may think it wasn't a good idea.
But saying that it sounds like Guns N'Roses is plain absurd.

GN'R isn't AC/DC.

They've actually managed to still sound like GN'R and add some new elements to their music.



Now, please go and discuss your love for the old band in the Dead Horse section.



/jarmo

Jarmo,
I've been polite with everybody here so I ask you to be correct with me.

As far as it sounding like GNR, thats undisputable to a degree because its Axl singing and hes pretty instrumental in the GNR sound, but musically it doesnt sound like GNR because its a totally different band. Theyre not being difficult or praising the old band but just speaking the truth,.

imo, Better mops the floor with 99.9% of all GNR's old songs.

So which 0.01% do you like? My World?

I didn't say I disliked the old songs. I just think the new songs are lightyears ahead of the old tunes in every shape and form. I love the old songs but in all seriousness they aren't even on the same scale as the new ones, save a few.

The .01 % was Locomotive ;D

Better is a kick ass song, and perfect for a single.

What the band needs is a catchy song, with Axl's signature voice and the GN'R sound, even if it has evolved.

It's great.

Don't turn this thread into an Old vs New bullshit thread ...

And to those who are still calling the band Axl's new band, here's a clue : it's called Guns N' Roses : ok:

I hope Better is chosen as the single; it showcases the evolution of GNR in a way that I believe will be accessible to the majority of 'old' GNR fans. ?My opinion is based purely on the live versions I've heard at the shows I've attended but, musically speaking it has, to my mind, the hook of SCOM, along with both the anthemic quality and dark edginess of PC. ?Lyrically, Axl provides us with his trademark raw, powerful emotional honesty and unique vocal talent; qualities that brought him success before and I believe will do so again. ?Whether it'll set the charts alight, I've no idea as I don't follow them these days. ?But if the music buying public still have any taste whatsoever, it will be a massive hit and pave the way for the release of CD.

That's your opinion and I respect it. Nevertheless, at the shows, people are way happier when songs like WTTJ, November Rain, Nightrain or SCOM are played ?than when Better is played. This is not an opinion, it is a fact. And I suppose it will be like that forever.

I wonder why... ::)

PS : yes NicoRourke, I know it is called Guns N'Roses... But is it justified ? The editor of French magazine "Rock & Folk" sent me a message a couple of months ago. According to him, it is not justified. He's not the only one who thinks like that.

Could it be because people have been listening to those other songs for 20 years, but more than 90% of the people in the shows have never even heard about Better?

just wanted to say that since febuary there is not a day goes by that i dont get in from work an the first song i,ll put on is better it fuckin kicks ass ive even got it on my phone and ive played it to a lot of non gnr fans and they all love it and said it should be a single i think its gonna make a lot of ppl stand up and listen and judging from the new ones ive heard this album will more than stand up to previous gnr albums and ive been a gunner since appetite yeah i was gutted when gnr split but i love the new band and i cant wait for them to be seen as guns n roses not just axls hired hands they fuckin kick ass .

The band needs a WORLDWIDE radio Hit. Something like "One" of U2, a song the entire world would fall in love with all over the world. An instant classic.

Hell no. If Guns N' Roses ever release anything as contrived as 'One', I'll be very disappointed. Better is a great melodic song, with still a sharp enough edge. The day GNR are universally accepted as something your mom and grandma can all enjoy, will be a very dark day for rock n' roll.

"Led Zeppelin didn't make tunes that everyone liked - they left that to the Bee Gees".

Exactly this is what separates GnR from the likes of U2 or Bon Jovi, and no I'm not comparing U2 or Bon Jovi in terms of musical style but rather their appeal.  U2 and Bon Jovi make "safe" music that's inoffensive.  GnR has always had more of an edge to them and a certain element that scares away a portion of the fanbase for bands like U2 and Bon Jovi.  Fuck appeasing everyone

Damn straight, brother!!

whether or not its justified isn't the fucking argument.  damn.   weren't you already told to take this shit to dead horse?   

I couldnt have said it "better"  ;D

I don't understand why you think Better is not a instant hit.   It's a straight, pure rock song, taking all sorts of elements and blending them into perfection.  It's way more catchy than IRS (at least, in the demo forms we have), for any sort of large, mainstream audience.

It doesn't matter whose opinion matters on these boards regarding "Better."
On the business end, it matters a whole lot to the financial future of GNR & Sanctuary's $13-15 million investment.
I'm of the opinion that its appropriate for an album of "GNR" songs, but not as a single, particularly the first.

I still believe the 1st single is something we haven't heard yet. I don't know why, but I have a hunch.
You can never predict what GNR/Axl will do.
MNW

I think Better is pure poprock - and I love it.

I'm still not quite convinced that Better will be the first single - But it's a good choice if it turns out to be true. It's got an edge and it's very, very catchy - rock stations will be all over it.

If it ever gets released to the public, that is.

It's the first single.

Everything points to it.

I think it's a good song to introduce to the public, although I think TWAT is better from a fan's perspective.

I found something interesting that may or may not have already been brought up.

Thursday, October 26 - Saturday, October 28, 2006 is the official Florida State H.O.G. (Harley Owners Group) Rally. The rally is being held in Ft. Myers Florida, which just so happens to be with in minutes of Estero... which just so happens to be the site of GnR's show on the 27th.

Could that rally somehow coincide with the launch of the Better commercial, single, and maybe even a release announcment...

well, the commercial is supposed to debut in Late October, so it wouldnt be out of the question..

I really doubt it...but nice observation. Could happen! At this point everything's speculation.  ;D

That is tomorrow.. interesting.. nice find on that..

its a matter of hours now, and we'll find out. It would be great!

Yup, and Axl had time to perfect live over the last 4 months. If I can't recall, I don't think it missed a set in Europe.

This is very interesting to me, being a Milwaukee-based fan.? As most of you may know, HD is headquartered here in Milwaukee and the band plays here 11/29.? Too bad it wasn't 2003...
HD could've brought in GNR instead of Sir Elton John to play their 100th anniversary concert. Definitely would've been "better" received by the bikers! 8)

anybody knows if the new "better" demo is the final mix, the one that is 11mo ?
It sounds more as a finished product, possibly the new single...

Haha, im suprised they didnt start rioting.

ditto save that I can't really say that about the blues maddy and twat....IMO these are about on a par with the best oldies...no, wait for the album...and that GNR doesn't have 10000 old songs, does it?

@ Locomotive98
Music reflects ones heart so there is no superior or inferior in music.
If you don't like a song that's that. Maybe the song is not for you. If you don't like an album, that's that. perhaps the album is not for you. If you don't like any of upcoming new songs by the band or the performances at all, bye then. the band positively is not for you anymore.

Or cd may change your mind. Even so it won't hurt the greatness of afd, uyi and lies a bit, will it?

@ CAFC Nick, I see your points. cd is the song that made a believer of this band out of me.
I think CD will work its best on the album (Yep, that's where most songs prove their true worth), like the sgt peppers title track, while better will have a wider appeal for its positive, cheery feel, like many have mentioned. there is bounce in the song that bounces the whole band. that bounces the listeners.


Exactly.
The fact is that this is gnr. Why should it sound like guns n roses? It sounds gnr. This is how GNR sounds.

Did estranged sound like rocket queen? I guess not. nevertheless it was GNR.
likewise, what you hear now is the GNR sound of our time. And I love it.

- The song needs a chorus (I mean a real one). No chorus = no success as a radio single.
- It also needs to be reworked compared to the demo version. Especially the guitars. I don't like the texture of the sound on the demo. It sounds sloppy.
- the band needs to re-record the song with that kind of guitar sound texture/sound instead of the one on the demo:
http://www.west-wind.com/wconnect/photoalbum/better%20riff.mp3

Do you hear the difference? it sounds much louder and fuller here.

It sounds funkier. I like that better than the demo, too.

I think this clip captures the sound and energy the song would have in a studio cut:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6tyLRPEEOl0

The demo is not finished and you can tell with a bit of improvement it would be a funk-rock masterpiece.

I love that little breakdown in the clip I posted, and I love how Axl gets into it a lot when he plays it live.

I would have started a new thread but I don't have the exact quote..... and i don't want to be told to use the search function again.

Didn't a radio station say they'd be getting a new single today?   I may be wrong so please be kind... is this true?

nesquick you`re starting to get on my nerves.....

I called WRIF (pretty much the only rock station that matters in Detroit) yesterday and they seemed to be 100% clueless about a single.

They are generally pretty straight forward with fans so I'm hoping the single is just gonna drop at the station soon and they actually haven't heard anything about it yet.

I love better but Im not keen on the tone and texture of the guitars in places.... I think on the harley add the lead guitar lines sound VERY flat in place. Almost like its just computer software playing the lead!!!

Better will be first single tho and axls voice sounds unreal on the harley add. Its like classic axl to me.

Donald Rumsfeld: this is very complicated stuff. good people are working on it. there is no daylight between the two sides. you people are simply looking for something to put in the papers. its very complex. we'll work on it. we'll come to some conclusions. just the fact that you ask this question means that you don't understand the situation. we'll let you know when we feel there is the need to do something. this is not a case of knowing what happens next. obviously we don't know what happens next. however there are good people working on it. what Americans should do is let us get on with our work and not be concerned about the timetable. the timetable will work itself out over time and all this will be clear. eventually there will be an announcement. then you will all understand. till then it will naturally be unclear. we have hopes. we have aspirations...

Raven did tell SLCPUNK that WCCC would be getting the single this week...or rather, told SLC that his (Raven's) manager told him (Raven) they'd be getting the single this week.

From other posters comments, Raven told them the same thing.

While Raven is a nice guy, he does sometimes like to fuck with people and/or talk out of his ass (especially when he's trying to cover it).? I had talked to the musical director and program director (well, emailed and then talked) last Friday when this whole thing started and neither knew anything about a coming single.....of course, things could have changed by Sunday when SLC talked to Raven.? But, so far....nothing.

"Everybody back off!!!"

 :hihi:

ZZZZzzzzzzzzzzz

Maybe Robert Plant and Jimmy Page should also re-record stairway w/ a chorus.

this is a demo version,and every man who have a litle expirience in music production will tell that

Thanks for clearing that up pilferk.  The last thing we need is misinformation setting us up deliberately for disappointment.... and wearing out patience thin.  I guess sometime soon is the word then and not this week.  Thanks. 

The band SHOULD, the band NEEDS, bla bla bla... Same old shit.  :crying:


I mean, you've been complaining way too much. Is it really the band that should make something out of it or maybe it's YOU who needs to move foward or accept it?

From what I heard on the H-D ad, Better final version will sound a lot like the demo, even the guitars. So, get over it, it will not happen the way you want to.

do you wanna bet with me,that you aren't right

i see guitar in better like in "locomotive" or "pretty tied up"

We already know it isnt... 8) ;)

umm...they have no clue if  its the first single"bettter" that is...basically the dj played better demo last wk b/c he likes the song...they got a call from universal and wont play it for now

Its funny, I like this song alot, But there are so many people who have heard it and say "what is this shit?", "go and listen to some NIN or something" I do see their point, If this wasnt GnR id probably hate it too.

Apropo of nothing, if you look CD up on wikipedia and then click on the song better it will send you to a brief write up on the song which implies (some would say states) that CD is already out! :hihi:

Everyone should know the answer to the single this week question now. Sometimes DJs play around. Sometimes they play around and watch the fan reaction at the message boards.  When we know it, they will know it.  News proliferates fast on the internet. Or as Jack Black calls it, internets.

I heard that some motorcycle company have bought some old GN'R stuff(better being one of them). I also heard that it will feat. on an ad for the company and therefore be released as the first single...all rumours though!!

where the hell have you been for the past couple of weeks or so ...... we already know about the Harly ad ... old news

CJ

I'm thinking that was probably sarcasm.

well half of the time you cant tell with some of these dumbasses  : ok:

CJ

I know im probaly gonna get shit for this but im gonna post this anyway.  I've heard a rumor from a friend who heard on the radio that Guns N Roses will release Better on Election Day and that a video might be on the way to MTV mostly a collection of live Performances ( I hope not ) but we will see I hope its true but you will never know for sure.

Which day is that ???

I wanna say Nov 7th

1st tues in November is election day

Yeah , the OTHER better single thread wouldnt have been a good place to put this.  ::)

Why don't we just make 126 different threads that cover every day we think and album and then single could be released on. Then we have everything covered and I'll know not to click on another thread that is just a 'hunch'.

Cheers.

actually there's only 60 days in the year left...

even though I think better is one of the better of the new songs I have to ask why would I want a song I've heard siz million times as the first single.. It would be cool to introduce new music

^ the general public hasn't heard it "siz million" times. They matter more than you.

It is new to the music buying public! Hardly anyone outside of forums/music websites will have heard Better. If Axl was making music purely for his fans he wouldnt have kept us waiting for 15 years!

Jonx

well I don't know who he's making music for, he only tours all the time without promoting anything with dates..

Im not entirely convinced that its his choice to be touring. Inland Invasion before Better he says that us "downloading motherfuckers" are the reason he is touring, that its "all our fault" that hes touring and that they are the "facts". Convinced me!

Jonx

HE said the reason he was playign the song was cuz of us downloading motherfuckers... not the tour.. ..........sigh people stop reading way too in depth (reading into stuff that makes no sense) about some statements about somethign at hand. etc.. etc. etc..  i'm sure this has been said before...

HEY!!! I have dial-up right and i don't have time to look through everybodys comments so i just post it and hope for the best!! sorry if i repeat, but what if guys hadnt heard about it. i'll bet some people on this site didn't!

At the first Hammerstein show when Axl called the crowd "Downloading motherfuckers"...didn't he have a huge grin on his face? Yeh he seems pissed off because of that  ::)