Here Today... Gone To Hell!

As everybody knows or should know, there are some strange circumstances regarding Mr. Cobain's death which make it seem like it was murder and not suicide. I for one, have heard enough of this evidence to conclude that it was in fact murder.

http://www.justiceforkurt.com/ has all the information regarding that.

But, among the things that makes me believe that is:

-The model they did which showed that the shotgun was too long in length for Kurt to have been able to stick it in his mouth and shoot himself.

-There was no fingerprints on the gun found next to his body.

-Kurt had 3 times the lethal dose of heroin and so he would have been unable to shoot himself.

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Anyways, all of this plus more stuff is on that site. I think we people take a look at all of this information, they began to realize it just doesn't add up.

It's been over 10 years...

Kennedy's death has been unsolved for over 40 years now...

Time to move on dude...somethings just aren't meant to be uncovered.

However in answer to you're question, it was neither murder, nor suicide because Kurt WANTED to die...

To me at least, once you're desire to live has waned, it cant be construed as suicide or murder :-\

I created this thread to see how everybody felt about this because I think it's interesting to see what people think about certain things.  I didn't create this thread to solve this case.

Also, Kennedy's murder and cobain's death are different because everyone knows kenney got shot. But, some people still believe that Kurt committed suicide.

 I personally believe that his death was an assisted suicide. ?

I saw a documentary that talked about all this and concluded that his death was most likely a suicide. ?Hadn't he tried to kill himself just a few months before his actual death? It doesn't add up though. ?Just the facts that there were no fingerprints on the gun and that it would have been nearly physically impossible for him to have lifted the gun by himself with that much heroin in his system prove that he was not alone.?

Anyway though, I guess we'll never really know? ?:-\

R.I.P. Kurt Cobain

murder.

Kurt wasn't suicidal.
all his closest friends (all the ones who talked) said it.

It was an accident, he was trying to weaken his gag reflex by stuffing the gun down his throat, so he could be an even better cocksucker but it went off. Mystery solved.

Whether he pulled the trigger or not....

Whether he pushed the plunger on the needle or not...

To me, it was always murder. ?Because even if he did kill himself, there was one person who drove him to it. ?If she didn't pull the trigger, or administer the drugs, or "do the deed", she mine as well have.

And I think you can all pretty much figure out who I think the culprit was.

I'm not, by far, the biggest Nirvana fan out there. ?But Kurt went long before his time..and that's a tragedy.

that documentary about his death was interesting,; with the porno-wreslter guy thing. lol.

Huh, that's odd considering the guy wrote a song "I hate myself and want to die"???

Suicide. he was strung out for months leading up to it, dissatisfied with himself & who he & Nirvana was, escaped out of rehab days before..

Ashame, I'm a huge Nirvana fan, but let it be. And yes he did try and kill himself a few months prior, in Rome with 80 pills & a bottle of wine.?

 

That rome incident is listed on that site and Kurt Cobain himself said that it wasn't suicide. It was just made to look that way.

I dunno i never really read too much about it....I think he committed suicide...he had chronic stomach pains or something and had a difficult time dealing with fame....from what i understand...like i said i never really folloed it too closely but recently am interested in this story.Isn't there like a good biography about his life? I wanna read it

Denial.

there is also a movie called "Last Days" which is apparently loosely based on Curt's last days...dunno how accurate it is but it portrays him as a depressive mess.

It's a skecthy death at best, but I always just assumed it was suicide based on his behavior throughout his life, though I wouldn't rule out a certain female having something to do with it. Cobain is just such a sad case. I never cared for Nirvana's music and I feel that had he not died Nirvana probably would have faded out after a few years and not be the legends they are today. I may blame Nirvana for the sad state of rock music today, but Cobain's death was a true tragedy. It's a horrible thing whether or not you thought he was talented. I read an interview with Axl (from '91 I think) in which he says he wanted Nirvana to tour with them but Cobain refused or something, but the interesting part of the interview was Axl's comments on Cobain's behavior and how he shouldn't let things get to his head or spiral out of control or something along those lines. It was an interesting read, basically a messed up person worried that another messed up person may get to close to the edge to come back.

Let him be dead.

He's hiding out in Cuba, smoking some serious Chronic with 2Pac....

Case closed. :smoking:

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. It's obvious that hardly anybody here has the deceny to look at all the facts involving his death. I was expecting a good conversation about this but I see that most people are incapable of having this type of conversation.

You want to talk about something else from this case. A guy from a band claimed that Courtney Love came to him and offered money, lots of money if this guy would kill Kurt Cobain. He never did but he later told people about this so what did they do? They gave him a lie detector test and he passed it, they were not lies. Passed it within' the 97-97 percent change.

Shortly after that, his body was found I believe, on the side of the road. Now, isn't that strange or what?

The Dewitt/Courtney stuff is just disturbing.  It's not exactly a smoking gun, but it certainly says, to me, they knew more than they let on during the investigation.  Add to that Courtney's actions AFTER Kurt's death (immediately and in perpetuity), and something smells bad.

As I said, I don't know if her or Dewitt actually pulled the trigger or plunged the needle (or drugged the champagne)...I don't think there's enough info to level that charge categorically.  But I will say, if Courtney didn't DO it, directly, she drove him to it.

The man wasn't uncomfortable with fame, or with the direction of the band.  He was driven practically insane by a shrieking, ho-bag banshee hanger on who was completely in love with the rock and roll life style, but didn't have the talent to actually attain the lifestyle, herself.  And when confronted with the fact that the free ride might be over, she did everything in her power to hang on.  She might not have committed the murder, for sure, but she sure as hell played her very large part in it.  I think she pushed all the right buttons (as only a co-dependant can) and flipped all the right switches to make sure she got exactly what she really wanted out of Kurt.....his status and his money.  How she did it, exactly, is debateable.  But do it she did.

Yeah and did you see the guy?? He was some unemployed white trash redneck living in a trailer park in some shitty ass garage band of 40 year old men playing their 4th of July BBQ.? His credibilty? was about a zero, and I think he said he took a lie detector test, nobody vouched ever giving him one.

Look, I'm trying to offer my opinion, after deaths, conspiracy theories always come out (Elvis, 2Pac, Kennedy, I know there were Hendrix & Morrison rumors, though they never caught on as long). I was in college when it happened & I thought he faked it, it took me a while to accept it. But as I said I'm a huge fan, and I've read alot of interviews with him, and I can see right thru alot of his shit. He says he's clean, he never touched heroin after his daughter was born (who I can't beleive is about 15 already) etc etc... and the truth is the guy had problems.

Trust me, I know CL is a bitch, and probably had alot to do with driving him to the edge, but I don't believe she "hired" or wanted someone to kill him. Heck she was looking to ride the Cobain chow-wagon as long as she could. Once he killed himself she didn't have anyone to write material for her 2nd album so she got Billy Corgan to do it (Malibu, Celebrity Skin).

You'd be surprised to know he was basically messed up & high on herion ALMOST EVERY DAY since about '89.. That's not a pace one with access to unlimited amounts of heroin can keep up with before the odds of either OD or depression & suicidal thoughts gets to someone.

The thing is...there's documented proof from people that say Curt was about to throw her OFF the chow wagon (by divorcing her AND cutting her out of his will). ?Granted the divorce settlement may have been lucrative, but.....she stood to take a drubbing in the press, lose whatever status she had, and would likely have found herself a strung out and very broke junkey in short order.  I'm not saying that says she "did it", by any means, but it's fucking disturbing the way things went down...and given we KNOW she lied, on multiple occasions, to the investigating officers, we also know she likely knew more than she let on.

Again, I don't think you can point at Courtney and say she was directly involved. ?On that we agree. ?Maybe, maybe not. ?But the woman certainly put Kurt in a position where suicide was looking like the only way to get away from the shrew, for certain. ?Which is why I've always said, and will always say, she killed him. ?Maybe not directly...but she still did it. ?By her hand or his, it doesn't really matter to me.

The even bigger tragedy in all this is that Francis Bean has had to endure it all. ?I can't IMAGINE that Courtney is the most stable parent on the planet, either. ?Poor kid.

He was definitely murdered. But that's one of those things which will never be solved.
It's like Princess Diana's death. Do you really think that was an accident?

From what I remember, Kurt was ready to cut Courtney off, and considering the fact that the two of them did sign a pre-nup, Courtney wasn't going to get much in the divorce.

Kurt also re-wrote his will right before he died in which he cut Courtney out of it (the will). But Kurt didn't sign the re-vised will.? Rumor has it Courtney was banging Billy Corgan (who also wrote most of Holes album Celebrity Skin) at the time of Kurts death.

Where theres smoke theres fire.

his is fucked up..I was seriously thinking about this story for the last little while here after seeing that "Last Days" movie on TV.

I'm gonna rent that Kurt and Courtney movie, so i can talk about this with you guys.

also check this out for those who wanna listen....its a good show in Ontario, Canada called "The Ongoing History of New Music" (It might be available elsewhere i dunno...anyway Alan Cross the host did a couple shows on this story...here check it out...streaming audio : ok:

http://www.edge.ca/station/ongoing_history_of_new_music.cfm?recID=81&ell=8943&pge=1#

A very good show!! he talks about everything, each show is about an hour long :peace:

And, you don't find it odd he died right after revealing that information. And, how does being trailer trash prove that this story is fake?

This has been a very well documented part of the story.

have you read the kurt cobain "journals" thing?  he doesn't talk about killing himself in all of those journal things.

sorry to disappoint you but this is a clear case of shooting yourself in the face. : ok:

Well, that settles it then.  I'm glad you said something.

Thread closed.

So what if he wrote the damn song?? I myself have said way too many times I wanted to die, but I never meant it, especially when there are loads of shit going on in my life like there is right now. I have even said that a couple of times today, but I did not mean it.

Cannibal Corpse have a song called "I Cum Blood", that doesn't make it true.

Wait, it's not true?



Ah shit.

i think nobody wants to admit that it was murder, cause then we'd all be angry about why this is never going to be solved anyways.

fuck courtney.

I would kill myself if I was married to Courtney.   :nervous:

i would kill her instead of me

Yet a better idea!  : ok:

I've seen her vagina. Yep,wowie.

Who hasn't?  ::)

That was kind of the point of my post, but I saw it live. The curse of having a grunge girlfriend.

So to those who have had the pleasure of seeing Ms. Love that umm...up close and personal, are we missing out on anything special?... :hihi:

crabs :rofl:

Oh, man.  :rofl:

Here's a good read on the topic:

http://www.cobaincase.com/

Who wrote the suicide note?

He wasnt suicidal?

Did he not try to kill himself a few weeks earlier?

When u inject heroin its not like it wouldve instantly made him unable to do anything.

He couldve shot himself instantly after injecting himself with a lethal dose.


maybe he pulled the trigger with his toe.

There's some debate over whether he tried to kill himself in Rome or whether someone slipped him the Ruphy in his drink.  There's no real way to be sure....thus the speculation.

Courney and Dewitt were with him when it happened.  Courtney says she woke up between 3 AM  and 4 AM(there's some other documentation on that, too)....but the ambulance wasn't called until sometime around 6 AM.  That's a bit...."odd"....to say the least.  In addition, Courtney, against doctors orders, ordered him to be transferred from one hospital to another, even though it was possibly dangerous to do so.

Again, she could have just been showing her trademark bad judgement....but it's still interesting, and the pattern, when all the pieces are put together, sure paint her in a pretty poor light, no matter WHICH conclusion you decide to come to.  She was either the "trigger person" (or "hired" one) or she's a dipshit, ho-bag, shrewish banshee who drove Kurt to pull the trigger himself.

Either way, IMHO, she killed him, so.....

I believe that it was a murder...

...the legend of Cobain lives on

R.I.P Kurt Cobain - 12 years of hurt.

Even if he was suicidal it doesn't mean that's how he died.

Didb't Kurt have an incurable stomach cancer ?

I thought it was WHY he started to use heroin in the first place, to numb the pain ?

I can't recall how, but i was told he knew it couldn't be cured and knew he had a few years to live and didn't give a shit about anything after a few years but the enduring pain he was going through ?

I would have believed in assisted suicide from his " beloved" wife if he hadn't changed his will at the very last minute.

how do you know it was a cancer ?

Give me a f'n break from these mysterious deaths of famous people. They were normal people that died just like everybody else.

really ? i don't think i'll be murderer as john lennon, or i'll die like hendrix or morrison.
but the real fact is : some anonymous people have mysterious deaths, too.

and kurt's death is *REALLY* weird.

(i always laugh when i read this thing, "giiiiive meeee a breaaaaak",
typicaly american i suppose, is it a new mode in colleges ?)  :hihi:

murder, have a good look at his note, its not a suicide note, its a f'kn retirement letter to fans!!




thats bullshit dude, just because it wasnt solved doesnt mean it wasnt ment to be solved, WTF :o

So sick of hearing about kurt cobain, it's like who cares..

Can't you just skip this thread then?  ::)

no problem just wanted to say that : ok:

Yeah, but like, totally nobody cared.

I used to see it as murder, I used to think that it probably was, but people will look for conspiracy, cover up or ulterior motive in anything. That said I haven't looked at any of these sites, but since there are enough out there to convince me that Tupac is alive and Paul Mccartney is dead, maybe I'll steer clear.....

But maybe I'll read it later....

Maybe.

ok i watched the Kurt and Courtney documentary...

I dunno I still have mixed views on the whole thing...coulda been suicide....coulda been murder. I can't picture killing anybody cuz of money but that's just me...weird that Courtney's dad kinda implicates her in it.

Grant is definately conviced...he went bankrupt over this case :o that is textbook obsessive compulsive right there :hihi:

and the creepy El Diablo or whatever his name is...his story and death are bizarre. and everyone is scared of courtney

Why is it not in courts? Lack of evidence? prolly, this is just one of the things that we have to rely on the justice system to handle....if it was a possible murder I would think that Kurt's powerful freinds would petition it...like does anyone know what Dave Grohl thinks? or Krist Novaselic? or and of his other famous grunge buddies...or the record label and his manager? I mean the lack of info from these people make me think that it was a suicide...and Nirvana's last shows, kurt was pretty subdued too from what I've seen.

I think it was unintentional suicide. I think Hole drove him to it. I'm not saying she murdered him. I am saying she played a part in it. The more the drugs the more u lose ur mind. And she was a HUGE junkie at the time. She was or had always gone unrecognized, always in the shadows of Kurt, jealous, insane, attention seeking for fame and felt held back. Or so her voices told her. I don't think she's clever enough to pull something off like that AND get away with it. She's too fucked up and retarded.

Not unless she was in the room with him and they were both having a drugged out, I cant it anymore moment with one another. And she acted as if she was comforting him and she was kneeled in front of him saying, please give me the gun baby, i love you. Then she wrapped her hands around his hands which were already on the trigger as if she were going to take it from him gently. Then she pulled it. Wanting him to die so she could have her fame and fortune.




~girl

Your theory sounds a little like the Sid and Nancy story.  Supposedly, they agreed to kill themselves together; she went first and then he changed his mind.

suicide

weird huh?

When asking whether it was murder or not, this question should be asked: Who benefited the most from Kurt Cobain?s death?

The answer is Dave Growl.

It's official........Kurt Cobain is now the highest earning dead celebrity in the world.  Forbes ranked him about $5 million more than Elvis at $50 million.  Reason he passed up Elvis they say is because of Love's share of 25% being sold.