Here Today... Gone To Hell!

personally i thought axl's voice in 2002 was good because he had an even wider vocal range which is really increbible, and i was wondering two things:

1. what did you think of axl's voice in 2002?

2. i know it's hard to predict but do you think it's possible that axl's voice has changed through 4 years of practice, to maybe grow even stronger?

1. i think axl's voice was ok in 2002, although it wasn't the voice i knew.

2. i prefer his voice from the illusions tour so i hope he'll get closer to that in this tour

I felt his voice was ok, i was more than fine with it. My issue was that he was often out of breath and therefore missed notes, and sounded weak. I don't think it was his voice that was the problem, it was a lack of preparation. I think he'll be ready this go around though.

It's gonna be hard (until i hear his voice) to convince me that his voice has gotten better over time.  :-\

but is it possible that his voice can grow stronger in 4 years? that's what i would like to know...

on a side note, i can't believe we are actually talking about axl rose touring in 2006 8) unreal! :drool:

I love the 01/02 voice. Love the highness of it. Hope it hasn't changed too much.

also, by "strong" i mean a little rougher, anyone who heard his screams during the 2002 tour can confirm that axl's voice is infact very strong...

I don't think it was his vocal capabilities that let him down in 02. I liked the sound of his voice. Just listen to November Rain where he was seated and not running around, when i saw him he sounded great. I think he didn't put enough effort in to being in shape, if he had been in shape he would not have become winded. He can still hit his notes, but he can't be sucking wind all the time. His voice unto itself is still very strong.

The positives of his 2002 vocal technique were that it allowed him to have a higher range than he formerly had during live performances, and he was able to not progressively wreck his voice during concerts like he did in 1991-1993.

The negatives were that his voice sounded whiny and less emotionally attached to the lyrics. If I want to hear "Rocket Queen", I don't want to hear some whiny, weakened voice singing it.

I guess we'll find out in 15 days if he's changed technique.

Exactly - the 2001 bootlegs sound worlds better than the 2002 ones because Axl was relatively in good health for those shows.

From recent pictures it appears he's lost weight since 2002, so I'm hoping his performances will be better this time around.

I would hope he is putting everything he has into getting ready for the tour. If he comes out winded again, especially in NYC and Rio, which will both be very high profile, the press is going to kill him, and he knows it. I know im biased but i think he will have it together when he takes the stage.

well i'm sure he has prepared for it alot, i think we are in for something amazing this time around, i think his preparations must be about done though because lately uncle axl's been in new york partying and living it up... :beer:

He seemed like he was running out of breath most of the time.  I hope it sounds like it did at the Ritz in 88.  This higher pitched voice would be alright if he could sustain it.  I mean, he can't even sing Jungle anymore.

People who say his voice was good in 2002 are a little bit deaf.  His voice isn't that good anymore.  Sure, he still can sing the high notes, but that rough edge is totally gone.  He doesn't have that powervoice anymore.   And like gnrkid03 said, he was indeed running out of breath most of the time.  And it's a bit stupid to believe his voice will grow over the years now.  Maybe if he lost lots of weight since '02 he'll be less out of breath, but that won't change the sound of his voice.  On the album his voice will sound better because when recording it, he didn't have to sing for two straight hours.  Just bits and pieces.  And it'll also be better thanks to a little bit of technology.  ;)  I'm not bashing Axl, I'm still a fan, but a realistic one ...

Anyway, it could be worse, listen to James Hetfield nowadays, ouch, that's painfull.

don't compare axl to that wash-up, thanx ;)
anyway are you sure that his voice can't grow? it's still strong, listen to the screams he did in 2002, also if he has been practicing alot then he can make it stronger, don't you think?

exactly..anyone that knows anything about singing knows that the vocal chords are like a muscle. The more you sing the stronger it gets. Being that he hadn't sung in 8yrs, lack of breathe support was a problem. But as the tour progressed in 2002 you could hear his voice getting stronger. I'm sure it'll be great on record

no since he hasn't sung live in years..it takes time

it appears he gained weight. he was in very good shape in 2002...I saw him on the streets. 2001 different story

have you seen the recent pics of axl? he looks buffed now.


but wouldn't it be possible to do this through practicing?

wasn't he saying that he was experimenting with?his voice during the 2002 tour????
I think i heard it somewhere ?::) ::)

Anyway, i think Axl will be prepared this time. ?I don't think we need to worry about the band because they sounded pretty tight on the last tour.
It remains to be seen what is going on with the third guitarist..

judging from 2001-2002 I don't think he practices enough

when did he say that? and they will definately sound better than ever, i believe we are in for something extraordinary this time around. i've never been prouder to be a gnr fan! :beer:

I say just wait two weeks and then all these voice questions will be answered.

I think his voice was amazing during the '02 Tour.

Higher & lower notes, vocal range extended, powerfull screams (Live And Let Die :o) but way too whiny sometimes ...

I'm not missing that rough edge a lot, because it's still there, but Axl doesn't fuck up his voice anymore like he did in the Illusions Tour.

Listening to Sweet Child ... on the Tokyo '92 DVD is painfull. But the Boston '02 version is amazing.

i know that but i'm just very eager and curious : ok:

Ok the general consensus seems to be that people would prefer that Axl sound more like he did in the UYI tour. Personally I think now he has a clear precise singing voice which wonderfully with the new songs they played i.e. Madagascar, The Blues even Riyadh and the Bedouins. However, that type of singing doesn't work on songs like Welcome to the Jungle, You Could Be Mine etc. So I hope the new material is more adapted to his style.

Also here I present a bit of proof that Axl can still sing like he used to. It is probably mostly to do with physical health and his singing ability but this rocks. This is a clip of Nightrain from Pukkelpop 2002. Enjoy : ok:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEVHeqko20w&search=NIGHTTRAIN

I think Axl knows if this tour isn't completely mindblowing, and CD is delayed again, Guns n' Roses is effectively dead in the water. We'll still love him, but he'll be seen as a joke. I think it'll be great. Leeds 2002 knocked me on my ass! and i love his new mellower voice. I agree he did seem breathless sometines in 01-02, but rather that than knackered voice like the tokyo vids.

I don't have any idea how it will sound now, but my favorite voice wasn't hollywood rose or the end of the illusions, I liked it somwhere in between with high points and rasp.. I'll know on may 12th..

the funny thing is that i like the scom voice on the tokyo dvd's and not that much the voice in 2002. i mean, it was ok but i would've preffered that roughness from 91-92. it.s just a matter of taste probably. like someone said earlier about rocket queen in 2002, his voice didn't suit the song imo

His voice in 02 was to high, he has  a mickey mouse sound at times.. I remember when he was like mtv good night his voice was so damn high.. He had a high voice in the old days but he had a stronger sound.. I think if he was being judged on AI they would say very pitchy... WHo can really tell what 2006 will bring, 4 years older, 4 years more rest..

that's all the proof we need right there, axl can still sing like he used to! : ok:
and i believe this tour he will be even better, he will blow the hinges off the gates! ;D

yeah, maybe he'll sound like minnie :D

there are a few things to factor I reckon

a) his voice isn't as strong as it was (especialy in the upper register).This is due to getting older and earlier years of misuse and abuse

b) he was unfit and out of shape in 02 and hence less able to project

c) he runs around the stage to much becoming breathless

d) he was unprepared in 02, it seemed he hadn't bothered to prepare sufficiently

I hope he has learned from 02 and address's these factors accordingly

I was wondering about Axl's voice last night too. I wan't keen with a lot oh how he sounded on the 2002 tour, but on the demos he's pretty good. I do prefer the Illusion tour sound that what we've heard recently... but I guess we'll wait and see. He's certainly looking a lot better than in 2002 anyway :)

The less he runs around, the stronger he'll sound.  That goes for any singer.  You try singing while you're literally running across the length of a stage all night.  It ain't easy, folks.  Thankfully, there are no side stage areas at Hammerstein; it's all front stage-facing.  So he won't need to run around to play to the entire crowd.

Stage dive! Stage dive!! ;D

we don't need axl breaking a hip at his return show.. If he dives grab the rings ;D

Axl's voice was decent on the last tour, but I personally feel that it wasn't the best on songs like My Michelle and Think About You, maybe even Patience. We know these songs to be from an era when Axl's voice was so rough. If anyone wants to hear the effect of his new voice on the songs just listen to The Blues from RIR3

As someone who has had some vocal training, I can say with confidence that if he wanted to have a rougher edge to his voice, he could - all that takes is pushing it harder. The ability to produce a clear note is what a singer loses over time, especially when the voice is over-used. If vocal cords are functioning well, and properly trained, air flows through them in a smooth stream and you will hear a clear note. If they are over-used, or if a singer's technique is bad, nodes can form on them, which are roughly equivalent to getting a callous. This harder formation prevents a clear stream of air from passing through the cords, and consequently a note sound rough or uneven. If anyone has heard the difference between how Brian Johnson sounds on Back in Black compared to more recent AC/DC, it's a great example of someone who has really messed up their voice.

As far as how that pertains to Axl, it's going to be interesting to find out. He is a bit of a freak vocally anyway, but in my opinion, he sounds better trained at the 2002 shows, and more operatic now - more like Tate or Halford. On the UYI tour, he was definitely injuring his voice. No one who sings that hard can have longevity in the ranges Axl sings in.

I like his voice in 2002. He was very good, the only problem is sometimes he ran out of breathe and when he ran you could hear the shaking in his voice. But other than that he just needed to add a little bit more grit, sometimes he did it perfect and others no so much. Plus, I think he sings this way to save his voice, and make sure its consistant for the whole tour. Without it hurting him.

His voice on the Illusion Tour was very tired. It was pretty much like he was just screaming. Although, I think 1993 is the best he has ever sounded live. You could tell he started taking care of his voice. But 1991 and 1992, his voice was just tired and too gritty. He sounded nothing like the records. But I still do like the aggressiveness of voice from back then.

If he mixed his voice from the Illusion Tour and the 2002 tour then his voice would be perfect, in a live setting. Obviously his voice on records is phenominal.

But then again, Axl's more of a performer. He perfects his voice on the record and then when he tours he's all about putting on a show. I think he's willing to sacrifice the quality of his voice in order to put on a show. Which I can totally understand because if I go to a show I dont want to see a band just standing there in one spot just bobbing their heads, its boring. Thats another reason why Guns is my favorite band, they always put on a good show, both old and new. And thats why Axl is my favorite artist, because he's a great singer and a great performer.

Apparently, you can ask Steven Tyler about all the above, as well.

I'm pretty sure that the throat surgery he had to have recently was to remove the nodules described above.

from the boots i heard of the those shows in 2002 it didn't sound all that great....as for 2006....I'll let y'all know in about 3 weeks

As the tour progressed, he sounded better and better.  By the Boston, Hartford, and especially the MSG show.....I think he sounded great.

I was at the Hartford show and he sounded amazing.

Me too! :)

He did sound amazing.

Very Cool. Its still one of my favoite nights of my life, but I think May 14th will be in front of it.  : ok:

I wouldn't know because I had tickets to the show the night after the MSG show :hihi:

but i heard from people that were there that it was a fucking awesome show.....one of which will be going to the 5/17 show w/ me

Hartford ruled all, I wish there was a sb from it. "She'll be coming around the mountain when she comes" 

Perhaps Axl could just slightly rhasp his voice, not too much but just a little?  I would take a 2002 boot over a 91 boot any day.  He sounded like a dying from in some of those 91 shows.  I'm glad he's attempting to protect his voice now a days

it depends on the shows you`re judging on.....  his voice was simply AWESOME in albany, cleveland and new york 2002...

his voice was the best at vegas 01-01-01 imo. i like how it`s  raspy and very high at the same time.... really great...

 in 1991 his voice was really fucked up the most time...  listen to the last couple of songs from noblesville 91... his voice was fucked up and it`s a pain listening to it :no:    in 1987-1990 axl was perfect though...

i think his voice in better has that rough edge everyone is talking aboutr. whats cool about better is that during the verses he doesn't sing high, he sings relativly low but with that raspy edge to it. it sounds amazing.

I agree, in boston 02 he sounded amazing singing the new songs: madagascar ,the blues; whereas in leeds 02 he didn't sound as good.
I think his voice was really tired at the UYI tour shows because as the band were very popular,they were playing to massive crowds, so axl had to sing louder so they could all hear and he ran about a lot, so they could see him(and cos he wanted to put on a great show).It is weird that from 1986-1990 axl's voice was spot on, but after that he didn't sound the same.I still loved his voice though. ;)

His best voice was between 1985 and 1989, pr?-AFD and AFD erea. Listen to "You"re crazy" or "I used to Love Her" from the Fox night show in 1988, listen to the accoustic part of GNR-Lies, Listen also to the 1985 (or 86) pr?-AFD Roxy/troubador shows at L.A. (on youtube).
He sounded like Janis Joplin. Phenomenal.

great post. just look at Chris Cornell these days. of course he still sounds great on record

I'm sure you're right, and what boggles my mind is that it's the 2nd surgery of its kind he has had. He came back from the 1st one sounding good, but every time I hear him doing that high screaming it makes me cringe because you can't go on doing that forever and expect to still sing Dream On, Back in the Saddle, etc. Cornell is another good example, and Robert Plant is as well. The male voice is not meant to sing in those ranges! (Sounds good, though)

a male can sing in that high range. the key is to not strain but then its not rock n roll without the straining..it's opera

I hope he's more prepared for this tour. Not that he wasn't in 2002.

I hope he sounds in NY like he did in vegas, Rhasp, although I think the pitch was off

Ive said this from the beginning

1. He learned how to sing properly That rasp and all that on the Illusion tour was cause his throat was fucked up.

2. He can still do it but this new style saves his voice and doesnt fuck his throat up.

3. Axl needs to turn his fucking mic up. I have no idea why he is so low in the mix.

4.Axl doesnt hit the high notes with his normal vocal power anymore, its almost like he has to go falsetto now to hit those notes which explains the lack of power.

I'm almost positive Axl had the nodule surgery done in the early 90's. There was a bigger than slim chance he wouldn't have been able to perform again. This happened to the Spin Doctors vocalist.

axl never really hit the high notes in the past. his voice was raspy but not THAT high. his voice was really high at pukkelpop out ta get me for example... or on IRS.  i guess it`s just the extra weight that made him miss the high notes in 2001-2002.... you know.. he ran around and got out of breath at times and his voice was very shaky.... listen to twat for example. there`s no rasp at all, but his voice sound awesome though : ok:

I thought he sounded terrible in 2002. It sounded weak and on some songs I just thought it was horrible. I hope it has changed since then.

I say I believe this is true, even though he might not have said it personally. Take a listen to Paitence from MSG '02, and compare it to the studio version. Almost a perfect match...I have faith.

from the boots I heard of that tour I thought the same thing but I didn't hear the NYC or hartford shows, which apparantly, were the best of the North American tour

Axl got better and better with each day on the 2002 tour like some people already pointed out. I'm sure he'll sound fucking great on the new tour! Especially the later dates, or so I think.

i fucking hope so!!! :yes: : ok: ;D :drool:

It should be great.

Like warose said, no actually in very early days he used to hit the notes as high as but not as easily and stable as in 2002. Not in varied ways either.

Matter of taste. Like it or not, his voice was strong being backed up with proper vocalization especially in the new songs in 2002.

Yeah..
In the new songs Axl sings like a God! The old once also..
There sure is something new and powerfull in Axls new voice

There is one huge thing most of u are overlooking.

Axl has NEVER been that great of a live vocalist anyway technically speaking.


He makes up for it with raw emotion and venom but when someone says Axl missed some notes, that makes me question whether u ever heard any early GNR stuff.

Axl isnt that type of singer to sing with perfect pitch throughout, never has and he never will.

as i said.....   people who`d like to discuss his current voice/voice problems should listen to noblesville '91 before to know what they?re talking about.

If Axl can still be the great showman he used to be, I wouldn't mind if he lip synch . i would rather see him lip synching to a voice that sounds good than  sounding like shit,  it hurts the performance.   I know I'll get flamed for this  . You may start the attack now    :hihi:

I agre
Rock n Roll is not going on stage and sing perfect pitch throughout , is all about your atittude the real deal what yo see is what you get and AXl was a crazy motherfucker savage on stage !!! the Best from man ever

noboy will attack you...  but i`d be seriously dissapointed if axl`d lip synch. if he`s not able to perform and sing live anymore, he should simply drop it. that?s my opinion.....

but i`m pretty confident he`ll kick ass in 2006 :peace:

youre right to a point

he was missing alot strength in 02 tho, strength that he had in the old days - listen to Tokyo vids - shocking live vox from Axl, but he still had the power, rawness and strength

In 02, he relied on a dodgy falsetto in many instances

His voice was fine in 2002, but sometimes he ran out of breath.  The new way he sings is less damaging, he can still do the old voice, as shown on IRS and Better and at times during the 2000-2002 shows, but singing that way live night after night can mess your vocal chords up, so this newer, cleaner style will help his longevity.  But his voice was never an issue to me, the "problems" in 2002 came when he ran out of breath, Axl appears to be in good health these days which is a good sign :peace:

Great point, he was never flawless at the old shows either.  Axl has always placed a premium on energy over sounding perfect.  He's running, jumping and dancing all the time.  He could just sit still and sound cleaner, but people go to the live show for the atmosphere and the energy, if they want perfection stay home and listen to the album

Axl could do his 88-91 style and last 2 years, or play it safe and last 20 more years

I opt for 20.

I thought the production of the shows during the 2002 tour sucked, crew members were fucking up, they had sound problems sometimes, and Axl trying a higher pitch with the micro phone sucked.  I thought in RIR 3 he sounded fine, so if he sounds like that, itll be pretty good.

1. Axl in 2002: a sad and pathetic version of the 1991 Axl.
2. Who knows what 2006 will bring. We will see.

I think the newer voice tops all of Axl's past performances.  It will show in the New York comeback shows.  It better, I'll be there opening night wearing my bucket!

why the fuck would you do that?


axl would rather lose his voice mid-way in the performance and still put on a kick-ass show than resort to lip-synching which even the rolling stones have. axl is the last great frontman indeed.

I would take 2 -3 yrs of 88-91 style Axl over 20 yrs of the current voice.  Besides he's old now  I don't give this new Axl more than 3 yrs before he calls it quits.  So I say screw the "playing it safe" and give me the old Axl  till his voice gives up.   I'll take it one step further  if Axl sings llike he used to in this European tour and his voice gives up and never sings live again  i would be satisfied.  Atleast we were able to see Axl at his best one more time.   

Gaah SwingTrader you keep making me go all teary-eyed!!

Axl was never a brilliant singer but he compliments the music they play. In 2002 he sounded more like a singer than he had ever previously done in my opinion. Perhaps he wasn't in perfect physical condition to sprint around etc. but for me it's always been about confidence. You can't expect a guy to dissapear for 9 years and come back sounding like his last show was the day before. As the 2002 tour progressed his voice became stronger and he was singing well. You could even hear a little bit of that raspy nature in his voice here and there...

Just give him time.

Err...WHAT?!
How can you SAY that!!? Axl has always been an AWESOME singer!!

I can say that quite plainly. He was never a brilliant singer. He had this screetchy voice, which was sometimes torture to listen to i.e. Live Era SCOM. Rubbish. He sounds dreadful there. Axl sounded great in 1988 but by 1993 his voice was worn so badly that he litteraly grunted through songs. Brilliant performer but as a live singer he is no Freddie. :-\

well  his live voice was always amazing except for some shows in 91, 92 and 93 : ok:

No kidding. No man can hit those notes without going to their falsetto/head voice - that's what he has been doing all along. Not even the highest tenor can hit 2 E's above middle C without going to head voice. Pavarotti couldn't do that. Like I said before - he just isn't pushing it as hard now. I find it hard to believe that people actually think that he couldn't sound that raspy anymore - that is not how vocal cords work! Anyway- if you think that Tokyo is one of his great vocal performances, I really don't know what to say. There are literally places on there where he is singing and producing more than one note, because he can't clean it up. I can't watch those because his voice is so messed up. On the other hand, by '93 he had really gotten a lot back, which makes me wonder how he did that. There was no time to recover from surgery...

I remember reading in a High Times interview with Sebastian Bach back after Skid Row and GNR toured in which he mentioned that while on tour he tried to use the Cooking With Cannibis cookbook to make treats so he could save his voice on the road. He later went on to ask if they had an extra copy he could get for his good friend Axl Rose. Perhaps Mr. Rose wolud indulge a little too heavily some nights, or perhaps days off. :smoking:

Not to mention the F#  he hits beautifully on the new songs.
I think it's in contralto/ countertenor's range. Tenor usually doesn't go that high. Up to about the first A above middle c? Good post requiem.

He had far stable voice in 02 than in the past. save that the falsetto he tried on a couple of old songs might have sounded a little dodgy, IMO.

As close to studio voice as possible.