Here Today... Gone To Hell!

after all these years it didn't happen and all the guys he recruited that stayed faithfull wound up getting zero out of their wait?? Anything is possible, I wanted to hear since most of us are axl fans if that would change your feeling towards the man..?? Just food for thought, just as the album can come out early 2006 it also might not... Discuss because I am curious, I know people have developed feelings towards new member

no.

I can liken this story to Kurt Angle of WWE. He feels that he needs to carry on wrestling classics(despite his mounting neck and body trouble) to be remembered as a legend even though he has done enough.

I feel Axl has done enough to be remembered as one of the best already. So i kind of feel.............No i wouldnt be angry. It's weird.

Even if it isn't released the whole "i wonder what it would have been like" would still stay with me.

No I wouldnt. If he felt like he couldnt do it anymore or he didnt want to do it anymore then thats what he wants. Its not like he owes me anything.

Personally Id be angry.. it wouldn't be fair to the fans or the band. I'd still respect Axl's old legacy... but to me he'd lose alot of his luster

    -jack

No.

I don't mean angry at hi because he didn't give you a product, but what baout the band members that he promised things to that stuck by him only for him to just walk away.. That's what I was talking about, consideration for your band members who waited so patiently and always backed the project

Ah...................if i was actually in the band, i'd be pissed for sure.

I guess that's the chance you take when you  join a band led by Axl Rose.  I would not be angry.  I think I'd have more respect for him if he just gave it up instead of stringing people along for years, both bandmembers & fans.   

I wouldn't be angry.

As for the bandmates, they seem to have other projects and haven't voiced any frustration so far.. I honestly don't think they mind either way.

 I would be angry because he led us on all these years believing an album was coming. But if he feels this CD isn't good enough, or will tarnish the GNR legacy, then he should give up and announce it to us fans.

 :rant:FUCK YES :rant:

Let me make something clear.. in my last post I said I'd be pissed.. but it would be different if he said "It's not good enough.. I dont want to tarnish the GN'R legacy, im sorry for leading you guys on." If he said that.. and was honest.. I would be ok. (Even then though.. why not release an "Axl Rose" album?)

On the other hand.. if it was just some press release.. or him just never saying anything (assuming that we'd eventually assume it wasnt coming out).. then id be angry.

But im not worried about any of this.. because Chinese Democracy WILL come out. And it WILL be worthy of the GN'R legacy.


    -jack

I don't think he'd ever admit that he didn't want to tarnish the GN'R legacy with the feeling that Chinese Democracy was a mediocre album.  By doing so he'd be saying that the former band was better than the current line-up.  Don't see that happening because Axl seems to project the feeling that his new version of GN'R has evolved from the older days and is way more multi-dimensional which subsequently means he thinks it's better now.  In his mind he probably feels he could release an album with nothing but static on it and it'd blow away anything he did with Slash and Co.  The problem for him is releasing an album that's up to HIS standards (not the old lineup's) and one he feels he put his absolute best effort into.  If and when he ever gets to that point, we'll see Chinese Democracy.

Well, since I do not think it will ever come out, no I would not be angry.  It is what I expect of Axl. 

It appears he may have already given up on this, he hasn't told us anything to the contrary has he? The band members may be saying otherwise but at the end of the day it's all up to Axl, and he hasnt told us jack since March 2004 at which time he said we would get an announcement in a few months. It's the not knowing part which is frustrating and angers a lot of people, if he just came out and told us one way or the other at least we would know. I must say though, yes I would be extremely dissapointed if he has given up on the project because from what we heard it had amazing potential. I would always love Axl for what he has done for Rock music but would be angry that he had the chance to possibly save the current state of the genre and threw it away because of his unrealistic perfectionism.

While we're on the subject of why the album has taken so long, I really think the feedback from the 2002 shows was a blow to him, obviously there were a lot of good things said but I think Axl may have had a problem with some of the criticism especially people saying 'The new songs sound dated', I don't agree with that statement but that would be enough to send Axl back in the studio for another 3 years to update and add to them.

I think Vasoline and Kayoss both make good points. I don't believe Axl will ever 'give up', but we may never see the album or hear from him again, which I think will be dissapointing. Its not something I would get angry about (who the hell could I be angry with?), but at the same time I think we should be given a taste of what we could have had...

Anyway, there's been so much $$$ put into this, I don't think Axl can give up on this project.

i'd be pissed off!!!

I think if Axl wants to give it all up to do whatever the hell he wants, fair play to him.

He helped create 'AFD', and for that alone we should be grateful.

Well if even if he did give up...Its good to have closure. I'd rather know it wasn't coming out than wait for years on end, stringing on tiny bits of information and rumours and supposed release dates

I'd be angry but not be surprised. Wait, angry is not the best word, I'd be fuckin' disappointed. To tell the truth it's sad that the man had a lot of talent, he is gifted, and hasn't done anything in the last 12 years. It'd be easier if he said that 'Hey guys, it's over, I don't wanna do this anymore', but instead of doing this he acts (acted) like there would be a chance for his comeback. And his false alarms, wishful thinking, poor live performances and inability to finish his album made him a joke for the general public. Sad.  :'(

It won't happen unless he is incapable of working. I mean physically.
I'd really feel sorry for him.  :'(

But then again...in that case  he would hand it over to the rest of the band, I bet.
You just can't bury great materials like IRS. it's a sin against the Muse.

I wonder if in the back of the band's mind if they have given up at all..? When each year passes you just say another year gone and less word from axl.. it must really suck to know you did great work and were so patient and so close (vmas 2002 tour) to only be going in reverse 3 years later... To think where new gnr might have been by now?/ This has to always cross their mind, they must have mixed feelings, anger definetly one of them.. Sure joining axl was a bit risky but I'm sure he drew out the plan to them and I'm sure it wasn't this way.

Axl doesn't owe me shit really.... But he does owe his bandmates something for all that time they stayed quiet and with him

We will get "Chinese Democracy." Worst comes to worse, Axl will die of old age, then we will get the demos. Most of us will out live him, so there.

well  i`d be really, really disappointed!!  and i`d be very angry, not because he didn`t release it, but because he promised it.      but it would still be better if he`d say that there won`t be a new album, than if it just doesn`t come out and we don`t get any announcments from him.....

Angry, no.  A bit miffed, yes.

 This was the reaction of a poster who's put up 3 posts...Magnify this reaction by 167 times and you can get a look at what my reaction would be!  I would be totally fuckin pissed off!
   :rant:  :rant:  :rant:   :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant:  :rant: 
:rant:

 On a brighter note, I do believe CD will come in '06.   :)

 

I think it's about what you want from this new gnr experience,... Do you want videos, do you want tours, or do you just want cd then you'll be happy.. I mean I am sure someone could force the fucker out eventually, but that would mean axl isn't behind it but the band might be..  So sure we can get cd and enjoy it to the fullest but we won't get the great things that comes with a album (vids tours interviews).. It's sometimes crazy how much we all crave one album...

And yet one of them makes more than 5 replys a day for the fans? ::)


Yeah, how swell!

Q:Was there any resistance in the Guns N' Roses camp in releasing your solo album?

"No, it's actually the exact opposite. [Axl Rose] has been real supportive of me and my stuff. He's listened to it all and totally championing me. One reason why is that it keeps me from barking up the tree, his tree, going "What are we doing? What am I doing?" I've been pretty straight up about everything and it works out good. Everyone out there would really love to hear me talk shit and say, "Yeah, he had me fuckin' tied by the balls, and I decided to fuck him and make my own [record]" but it's really just nonsense. I've talked about it enough where it's like now, I'm done even explaining it in those terms. [Rose] is really supportive of me and I'm totally into doing Guns N' Roses again. We made a great record together and when it comes out, I'll be the first one in line to go tour behind it." --------Tommy Stinson NOVEMBER 2004
Key words: to bark up the wrong tree

Not angry but I would be disappointed..

If a knew anything with finality, I'd be fine. If I were a band member and I knew it wasnt happening, I'd be relieved to get the 200 pound monkey off my back of being part of something that I'm constantly asked about and can't give an honest answer to. As a fan, I'd be disaapointed but relieved that I would no longer have to even consider the possibility of hearing it...i'd be free from the myth, so to speak.

rarrrr.. I felt the ::) No one said anything about the band members definetly I said if there might be doubt at all.. Like any one person of the band.. Wether they answer questions or not the truth always comes out eventually.. Plenty of times I have had opposite feelings with a job and played along until it was ovr.. You can have serious doubt but still play the game just incase..

Would kind of make me feel rather stupid for waiting this long

What truth? The truth is that you're still waiting. I don't know what you're waiting for tho.

You can't have serious doubt and volunteer your precious time to like start to send many hopeful mails on your own pretty recently. Or you mean it became a part of his job to reply to the fan mails? from like a few month ago? Bloody unlikely, however it would mean only one thing that is further concrete. Either way now he should be quite sure of its coming.

i'd be well pissed off. not w/out at least another album of new stuff.

If he explains the reasons why, no I wouldn't. He is a human beeing, not a machine.
But his voluntary and intentional silence sucks. This is very, very disrespectfull.

"You have to realize that he CHOOSES not to defend
himself in the press.  He believes that all that matters is the music."  ;)

He sells his music (when it's ready), not himself.

Angry, no. It would be sad tho seeing that talent go to waste.

agree with pepebb!
Axl wil talk when he is ready to talk
i dont see any reason why he should
give interviews and update, when
things arent set stright yet! There is
no reason to talk when tings yet to be
formal and written to the last pencil, like
Tommy said. He would just get bashed
if he were speculating out a date, and
could not hold it! Im sure Axl is the one
of us who absolutly would like to make
things happen, and we dont know shit
about what he is dealing with! Fortus
said something about outsidedesturbents.
Ill wait for him to give us the candy!
"Im still right here givin blood, keeping
faith, and im still, right here"  : ok:

Not a chance. Axl owes me nothing.

I already think Axl has quit. The fact that NuGNR has no band photo together and Axl has never photographed with them makes me think it was a test for Axl and not a real comeback, and not real GNR. He tested the waters, found them cold and packed it up.

Chinese Democracy or a band reunion will come whenever he needs the money.

he tested lots of things in 2001/2002. No doubt about it. He tested the audience reaction.

  Just because a fan would be very angry if Axl gave up, doesn't mean that Axl "owes us" something.  It would be a combination of all the emotions so far mentioned:  anger, sadness, pity, and frustration. 

  I think a person would have to be pretty damn cold to just say, "Oh well, Axl's done, but I'm not upset...even if I did wait for years and years to hear my favorite musician release his vision..."  Give me a fuckin' break.  I would seriously question your love for this band if that kind of news didn't make you angry.   : ok: 

i'd be very disappointed because of all the potential in him and the band, VERY disappointed.  that said, i don't think that will be the case at all!

I, myself, one of the veteran fans, would feel dissapointed to say the least. I'm a fan, been a fan for so long I can barely remember. To say "Axl will only release the album when he is ready and this and that..." is a bunch of bullshit really. If you trully are a GNR fan and feel this way, then you are not a fan or haven't been one for a long while.

I wouldn't be angry cause I have many things on my life to worry about other than a GNR album, however Chinese Democracy would bring me a moment of happiness. A a human being, I want to have as many moments of happines as I possibly can and Chinese Democracy would definitely make that possible.? My life is not depending on it, but it'd be nice if Axl released the album.

Just to let some of you know (how long it's been) the first news I had about a new GNR album were from early 94. I watched an interview with Slash in which he said "GNR had 17-18 songs in pre-production at that time, expect a release pretty soon". Maybe that was Slash lying or really giving an update on the album, will never know, but that's when I started to think that a new GNR album was coming up.

It's been 11 years and no album has been released (besides the GH and Live ERA). I kinda got used to this feeling really. I'm not angry nor expect really anything at this point, but if nothing ever comes out, I'll be disspointed. Yes.

Ignatius, you're right on.   : ok:

I completely agree, unfortunately  :'(

that would be funny

no

No I wouldn't. He doesn't owe us anything. Sure it would be a terrible lost, 'cause we all believe in the man and know what he is capable of writting (and singing, and ranting, etc), but angry....No!

why does everyone love to say he doesn't owe you anything?? Who the hell said he did, he owes his band members this..

It would be pretty lame if the last memories would be either dec 6th 02, or that bucket head quit speech

Stop this 'he doesn't owe us anything' chant. He owes us at least an explanation since he promised the album long ago. You know, when your dad, mom, girlfirend, boyfriend, teacher etc. promises you something and it's not happenin', than the least you can expect is an explanation.

Its like when GNR split they never announced it cos they said later that evn they didnt wanna admit it.

This new GNR has been "seperated" for a few yrs now, the dream is over.

Axl has already given up. Well thats my opin, but all pointers lead that way. Im not mad at him....but I do think he's one of the biggest losers Ive ever heard of. To have so much and become so self important, selfish and insecure to throw it all away and drive away the people that helped you get there.

I'm also getting sick of the 'he doesn't owe us anything' line. Its almost as sick as the 'live your life' line some of the people here toss around on a daily basis. If Axl hadn't said it, it would be the furthest thing from their minds.  :rant:

He probably ows an explanation to the record company, but not us. Geffen (interscope, universal) is the company axl works for (record deal signed), so they are the ones with legitimate reasons to be angry with Mr. Rose, who probably (and I don't know the terms of the contract) hasn't fullfilled his obligations regarding the delivery of a new finished record to Geffen.

We choose to be fans, we are not paying axl in advance to give us a record. Sure it would be nice to have it soon (and I think it'll be released soon), but I personally don't think I have any reason at all to be angry if he doesn't release chinese democracy. If he indeed does...great, because it will make a lot of people happy. If he doesn't, it will surely be dissapointing, 'cause we won't get to hear a probable masterpiece. But angry......common!!.

so true, everything axl says get used over n over.. Since everyone loves to quote axl he did say at the vmas that you would see cd but maybe not soon.. So you could say he owes an album in some way..

but at least they had albums under their belts and did years of touring..  Now it's like this thing barely ever started, was it over before it began?

No.
But I would rather that Axl had the balls to annouce this publicly rather than dragging this privately, leaving fans and band members wondering where his head is at. I would be really pissed if he did this, because this is the shitty way of going about your business. Almost makes me wish he had quit in 1994 when he still had his dignity.

MNR

very true...

I hear you loud n clear :'(

Which was stupid.  The crowd ain't gonna pop for material they've never heard before.  A radio single comes first, then the album, THEN THE TOUR!!

GNR toured on the Use Your Illusion material a long time before the albums were released.

Oh, and I am angry now, I want the fucking album now. I'm tired of GNR being the punchline of other people's jokes. 

for me the gnr that meant everything willl always be viewed the right way,.. The gnr getting knocked is this one, the one no one knows.

Didn't know that but at any rate it was still stupid to come out of an eight-year seclusion and tour on arguably the most anticipated album in history with no album.? Where's the sense in that?

It would have made sense if when the US leg of the tour was finishing up in Jan-Feb of 2003 the Album was released then the tour kicked into a second leg.

What makes no sense is to launch the "Chinese Democracy World Tour" in late 2002 and in late 2005 there is still no Chinese Democracy Album........ but there is a three year old botched world tour..........

Which was apparently the plan, based on what Axl told Madison of MyGnR after the MSG show, whatever happened in those 24 hours b/w that and philly must've been really f8cked up...whatever it was, it gave Axl an excuse to go back into the studio again, with the end result being, well, nothing...I also don't know if he was testing audience reaction to new material moreso than just the whole band...and most of the reviews  I remember reading both on here and in the press callled the band and the new material solid...i dont think the plug was pulled for negative reaction to the new band.

Yep, actually, but for the 'f8cked up' 02 tour, I wouldn't be here....to me Chinese democracy started on
the 6th December 2002.

Anyway, even if it doesn't results in success, one's long effort of will is not really in vain.
On the other hand, Those who that gives up even before having a try won't achieve anything. And If such ones whine over as how they couldn't get what they wanted in their life, they are entitled to be called as the real losers.

Funny the way people see him often sounds very similar to themselves respectively, as if they created their idol in their own images.

I have to disagree. ?After a lay-off like that the best thing would have been to release the best track as a radio single and have the radio wear it out for 2 months, then release Chinese Democracy, then tour. ?I just don't see how any other way would have been profitable. ?And as we saw in 2002, their way wasn't.

the 2002 tour, there was suppose to be playing like the illusions, on and off for a few years, playing in the fall n spring, multiple album releases as well.. All ended up a bunch of BS...

Yup, and it was crap. Don't get me wrong I'm always up for a new song here and there, but I always remember when they came on at Wembley Stadium to 'Right Next Door to Hell' or whatever. I hadn't got a clue what was going on - WTTJ would have been much better!

As others have said, I think Axl should at least let us know what the deal is. Throw us a frickin bone.

If he doesn't before long someone will spill the beans anyway (on a side note it looks in Amazon as though the ?Sorelle Saidman book has been delayed to October 06).

Nah I wouldnt be mad at axl, more like dissapointed cause I believed, but on the same token, thats just a hypothetical . Cuase I stil do believe, and in my gut I feel that he does too.

I think axl will work tooth n nail to get this out , not only for himself but for those who have stood by him, and I think that the people in his inner circle, (band mates, fam , close friends, ) wouldnt think differently of him if things got so fucked that he just said ok I cant do this anymore.

We the fans are just that , fans , give support, rallly behind and stick with it so long as we percieve that the players and axl are . BUt on the same token I wil always be a fan of what I have , who I met , the music I have loved and the players that made it.

CD will come beit a revitalized and the band that we know now. OR will come cause I dont think Axl would not let ,shine the music he and the others in the band did , just die .

Things are moving in the GNR front, its just gona bite you when you I, anyone least expects.

CD will come out before the end of the current tour.

It just happens that the last show was in December 2002; it's still going on. Some promoter should make a big effort to publicize the date of the next show/ after all, didn't Axl find out over the net that his own band apparenty had shows booked?

I think Axl said he found out on the internet about the shows in 2001. All of the scheduled shows were cancelled. Check gnrontour.com for explanations for it, theres a few given.

not angry..........very very very very sad, yes....... :'(

I wouldn't be angry but I would lose a lot of respect for Axl. I know he and his fans think of themselves as artists. And, the great artists take risks, win or lose, to advance their art. If he didn't release CD, then I think he was a coward - that Axl feared failure so much that he couldn't follow through on his art.

I am a big fan of The Who. I think they are the greatest - greater than GNR, but I actually enjoy talking about some of their worst songs as well as their best. I can appreciate them without being blinded by this superfantacism some people get caught up in thinking they have to be perfect.

I used to like the reckless abandon that GNR captured in Appetite for Destruction. Axl just seems to think things through to much. He needs to grow a thicker skin.

He hasn't given up already?

i guess the tour in 2002 just had the wrong name and ended to soon. otherwise it would`ve been called a succes (well... some people would always find a reason to complain and bitch about it...)

Would Axl be angry at us if we just gave up on this? ???


Exactly! Chinese Democracy started in 2002 and still continues on today........ it's not finished yet...... :yes:


RIR?

Sure, decent choice.

I would be sad, very sad. Not angry.

see I was thinking angry because some of you really love other people in the new band, so if axl didn't release this album then he would have basically fucked over tommy robin and the rest.. They;ve been the one skeeping it alive through interviews and they have been the ones telling people it will happen/..

I feel cd will be an album you could still be talking about on these forums ten years from now how it could happen anytime soon... it's almost impossible to graps the concet of it ever coming out.. it's better known for not coming out then anything

Id be sad, but not angry, however, we may never see the album, but one thing is for sure, axl will never say he gives up , we'll just wait forever untill we die  ;D

Why would he spend all these years recording and touring and getting a band together if he wasn't gonna follow it through? The only thing we have to worry about is a timeframe, but its been that way since OMG came out in 1999 so whatever.

It'll come out shortly after its ready ;)

Not really. Clearly there is a wealth of material that has been recorded. The record companies will want their investment back, so they would no doubt release what he has anyway, if he gave up.

seems now that he didn`t give up yet : ok: