Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Think back to when Guns were just breaking out. They actually did seem as "dangerous" as they were being portrayed in the media...

So, if someone told you back then that in 5 years time they'd have 12 band members on stage, with two keyboardists, horns and girls backup singing on Paradise City, what would you have said?

How about in '92... If someone was to tell you that GNR would be around 12 years later under a different name, with the singer from Stone Temple Pilots singing for them...

Or how about that Axl would disappear for the better part of a decade, and the "dangerous" band would be totally replaced. The drummer from that band who played Wynona's Big Brown Beaver,  Slash would be replaced by the guitar player from that "new" band Nine Inch Nails who hardly even have much guitar work, and such.

This isn't negative. I'm just trying to maybe make some new fans realize what this whole GNR story has been like for people who were around from the start.

ITs been a journey. And you either are along for the ride or you jumped ship, or you find things to bitch and complain about. or you have faith and keep pullin for a good outcome that all the fans wil be happy with, but you cant please everyone.

Damn dude, best question asked on here in a long time. Kind of fucks me up too.

Let's break this down:

1-"So, if someone told you back then that in 5 years time they'd have 12 band members on stage, with two keyboardists, horns and girls backup singing on Paradise City, what would you have said?"

Answer: I would have laughed and told them to shut the fuck up. No fucking way, no fucking how.

2-(let me correct this one) "If someone was to tell you that Slash and Duff would be around 12 years later playing in a band with the singer from Stone Temple Pilots singing for them...

Answer: I would have probably been happy to hear they would still be alive. But I would tell them there was no way Slash would play in a band with anyone but Axl. Get the fuck out of here.

3-Or how about that Axl would disappear for the better part of a decade, and the "dangerous" band would be totally replaced. The drummer from that band who played Wynona's Big Brown Beaver, ?Slash would be replaced by the guitar player from that "new" band Nine Inch Nails who hardly even have much guitar work, and such.

Answer: See Answer number 1.


Yea...you know to be honest I had a hard time with GNR during the Get in the Ring Tour. It really all seemed very wrong to me, and I should have expected what happened to have happened. I was one of those fans who said WTF is this, when listening to the UYI's. There was some good tracks mixed into tripe bullshit. I still think that today. And with all this time that has passed, Appetite hold up better then the Illusions.

I started listening to it again (Appetite), and found myslef rediscovering why I fell in love with GNR to begin with. Before the darktimes. Before the Empire. It really is an amazing, amazing Rock album. My belief is, is that it is one of the greatest albums of all time, ever released. That is the GNR I love. That is who I changed with and who kicked my ass, and those who didnt like it could suck me. They were the coolest motherfuckers who were as talented as they were just plain badass motherfuckers.

It really pisses me off that they, in all honesty, got gay. But I don't blame Axl or even Slash or Duff, or Izz. Axl was/is a fucking Mad genius with Mad genius ideas. That can't and shouldn't be restrained. It doesn't surprise me CD isn't out.

But jesus dude, in a million years I would never have thought it would have gone down the way it has.

I discovered gn'r in 1991 but i can answer to your questions:

1-"So, if someone told you back then that in 5 years time they'd have 12 band members on stage, with two keyboardists, horns and girls backup singing on Paradise City, what would you have said?"

Answer: why not? I love the use your illusion erea. I grew-up with it. especially Use 2.

2-(let me correct this one) "If someone was to tell you that Slash and Duff would be around 12 years later playing in a band with the singer from Stone Temple Pilots singing for them...

Answer: Same here than the guy before: I would tell them there was no way Slash would play in a band with anyone but Axl. Get the fuck out of here. and vice- versa...Axl without Slash? no way in hell.

3-Or how about that Axl would disappear for the better part of a decade, and the "dangerous" band would be totally replaced. The drummer from that band who played Wynona's Big Brown Beaver,? Slash would be replaced by the guitar player from that "new" band Nine Inch Nails who hardly even have much guitar work, and such.

Answer: i think I would have vomited. It's still very, very hard for me tor see Robin instead of Slash. I just don't understand this choice and probably never will. Hoppefully, I hope Robin will surprise me on the record, I give him a chance though, but I don't hold my breath. Is he really the right guy for this band?? I still don't know.

12 band members.  Not exactly.  I wasn't a fan of this BUT, they were not always on stage.  And they did compliment some songs very nicely, ie.-Move To The City / was awesome with the band.  Teddy Andreadis was killer on harmonica in Bad Obcession, & I always likes him over Dizzy anyway.

12 years later, no doubt, with Scott Weiland singing, better than what Axl has been up to :hihi:


On the "new" GN'R : WHO CARES ABOUT THAT SHIT ANYWAYS???

No one could have predicted what GNR has turned into. The band breaking up right after AFD would have been more likely than the current satire of rumours, leaks, fake leaks, speculation, metaphors, fake release dates, revolving door of band members, etc. The power of AFD is the only thing that keeps the legacy somewhat intact. Its hard to believe that GNR keeps getting new fans considering the past 12 years of bullshit. Appetite for Destruction is what keeps the fanbase from dwindling into nothing.

I would have said you were fucking nuts.. in 1987 gnr did seem dangerous.. They really seemed like who they were on HBball.. The ritz show in 88, wttj.. I always saw them as just a band that fucking rocked that didn't need those gimmicks.. I was really looking forward to afd type music..

i always remember seeing the SCOM video i knew the band as my dad had the album but had never seen them and i just remember thinking how cool the guy with a hat and no face looked but as for being dangerous at that time the only dangerous thing in my life was the lego blocks i kept leving on the bedroom floor as i was 8-9 years old

Good post ryan_of_lax! Yeh interesting read. It has been a crazy ride. I have been a massive fan since day 1 of the band. But I guess times and things change for a reason and we are now gearing up for the next chapter of the band as it is now! I for cant wait to see it!!

i agree dude, i can't wait for CD to be released cos I think VR album sucks! no offence to those who dig VR okay? :peace:  i believe in axl, the mad man with a brilliant mind!  : ok:

Yes, they were hardcore dude, They were stoned and drunk all the time (Public displays of ths type were virtually unheard of), if you pissed them off they kicked your ass, their lyrics spoke for themselves, At the time it was very rare to hear the words "fuck off" or anything like that in a song.


I'm with buddha on this motherfucker, Gay, gay and gay. I would've hated it in '87, I hated it in '92 and I still hate it now. The reggae thing sucked too btw.


Again Buddha read my mind, I loved STP and all, but for Duff and Slash to be alive!! and not to be playing by Axl's side?! Get the fuck out of here.


Not a NIN fan now or then. Or Primus for that matter. But for Duff and Slash to be alive!! and not to be playing by Axl's side?! Get the fuck out of here.

Unlike Buddha, I was pretty impressed by UYI's....for the most part. There are songs I don't like, but on the whole, they are really fucking good, but, I remember reading the lyrics sheet in the Cassette tapes and I was like "Oh God they are gonna break up" cuz in lies and AFD all the songs were credited to GnR, in UYI's they each had individual song writing credits, that told me they weren't as strong as they once were :( . AFD was the benchmark though. That and the second half of Lies Lies Lies. On the same train of thought, When TSI came out, I was like "Get the Fuck out of here!!! This Sucks" To me I felt as though that album was a cash grab, meant to feed of the success of UYI's, and SIDHY? Is that really sung by the same band that put out AFD like 6 years prior? WTF!!!!! :rant: I guess i can understand people liking that album (not really though) but to me, and everyone I knew that liked GnR in '93 thought it sucked balls (big hairy, sweaty ones at that : ok: )

I'd have said "Yeah , life can throw you many a curveball and anythings possible."  But then again , I was only a teen then so I woulda probably been drunk or high and told ya to stop tripping me out.  :hihi:

For me things started to change when Steven was kicked out of the band, then Izzy left, and then I started noticing the horns and the background singers.  They totally lost the RAW edge on stage, but I thought the UYI's were great.

You know, for me, the illusions seem forced. There is some great pieces of music there. But its a difficult listen because there is always something in the music that is right around the corner that is going to fuck it up. Coma rocks hard...but then the bitches chime in. That kind of thing. They really became a self parody by that point. Normally that takes bands years to get to the point GNR did in 3.

The VH1 special really fills in a lot of blanks during this time, and how they just became so separated. I remember this time so clearly too. GN'R and Axl could absolutely do no wrong. Axl did duets like with Petty and shit and they ruled. Appetite owned the universe. Lies came out and that added to the controversy and yet was beautiful. Its almost like the invasion of body snatchers after that. They just weren't the same. And I felt that, and I think deep down you all felt that too. The UYI's seemed so fucking awesome, and GN'R was still in this do no wrong weird trancedent zone. The hype was huge. But then reality hit. Maybe years later for some.

You know its kind of like the first Batman movie. It looked so fucking great at the time. Fans were finally getting this awesome dark Batman we all wished for. Not the colorful gay rainbow shit the comics became during and after the Adam West TV show. We all wanted to love the movie so much it hurt, and that blinded everyone. But then time went by and the reality hit that the movie was a pretty bad translation of the books, and it was a pretty bad movie. Then with each passing sequel it got worse and worse and gayer and gayer. But you know what? It turned out ok for my boy.

Batman Begins came out and got it right. Maybe Chinese Democracy will do the same thing, and make up for the time that lost its way.

Um, Actual I can say that yes I saw it coming.  Remember that Duff's brother Matt played horns for them live in 1985 and 1986.  There was always a touch of glam and blues.   I really think the finished version of AFD was not Axl's vision, it was the A&R people at Geffen's.    Look at how Anything Goes and You're Crazy changed pre-Appettite, listen to jumping jack flash and heartbreak hotel live form 1985 and 1986.  GNR was never about hard rock, it's always been something more and something different.  That's probably hard for people who's first exposure was seing WTTJ on headbanger's ball to understand.   I think UYI and to a lesser extent Spaghetti incident is more of what Axl was trying to acomplish.  That's why I cannot wait to hear how that  vision has morphed into CD.

from what i recall, the add for the lead guitarist (Slash) was something like Heavy-Metal/Glam/Punk Guitarist with blues roots. or some shit like that.

What do you mean AFD was the A&R people's? Who recorded the album? I've never heard any member of GnR say that AFD wasn't what they were looking for, ever. But i have read that the record company gave them all kinds of drugs and booze to help their bad-ass image along. :hihi: tough life huh?

Geffen A&R man: "Here party for free all the time, and play music, just don't die k? cuz then you'll be under breach of contract"

GnR: "Uhhhhhhh, ok : ok: "

Before the breakout, they were not the multiple platinum seller rock stars nor the once biggest band in the world. Just a bunch of young waifs and strays trying hard to look streetwise, to make the loudest noises.
Seeing as how the dump Wagon jumpers moan about the band legency as if it had gone through the mud or discuss how CD must make a commercial success to live up to it, I honestly doubt if those ppl would have supported the band back then. Yeah, listen sods, There were people who supported the band simply for the love of music even when the rest of the world saw no worth in it until it made it. I assume those fans ether just lost interest in the band after AFD success or like jazjme01, are supporting the band more than ever now. I can relate to those first timers for their pure passion.

To all the above questions:

"Youre fucking crazy!!@"

I totally agree. It was also never about metal or anything like that. It makes me cringe when i hear people associate GN'R to metal or hard-rock. All that is pure clich?. Maybe they touched to hard-rock during the AFD erea, but They never were metal-head, at least not Axl,?Axl's heroes are elton john, queen, aerosmith, Elvis prestley...listen to his music, that's very bluesy. It doesn't sound metal. Listen to USI 2, it's almost a blues-rock record. That's why this band was so different, they never were clowns like cinderella, poison, slayer and all those metal/hair-metal heads (and I must agre with Cobain on that point about heavy-metal, he hated that). GN'R was beyond that, they were much more interesting musically. They were more Classic-Rock oriented. Look at izzy, the man is an absolute southern rock/folk fan. Gilby explained he never was into heavy-metal, but more into good old fashion rock n' Roll. Slash is a zeppelin and aerosmith fan, Duff a punk one, There is no metal out there. Hoppefully.

That thing about the add for a Glam/Heavy-Metal/punk guitarist is from a Headbangers ball interview that i have. I can upload it if you want to hear axl say the words himself. Everything was Glam in the 80's in LA. they had no choice.

Izzy is responsible for a huge chunk of writing credits. I mean listen to the tunes!!! The ones that are most hard rock are the songs izzy wrote. Gimme a break dude.

anyway What about axls influences like Nazareth or Slash's inflences of AC/DC? In the 70's aerosmith and Queen were pretty heavy weren't they? definately hard rock at least back then shit like slayer and pantera and whatever wasn't around in the 70's Sabbath was as heavy as it got (oh but they are classic rock too right?). (Dude, Bands don't start with a classic rock label they earn it) Dunno about the elton john thing ??? just cuz he played a song with him? he was more pop-music wasn't he? Elvis? I don't think so. That cover was prolly a joke. Didn't his parents only let him listen to like elvis and Jimmy swagart or something like that?

I wasn't there but I hear that little Axl would get a smack or two just for singing a elvis song.

this sure as hell makes us realize we have no possible way of knowing what's next. but if history is served we won't even be capable of imagine what it is it might happen with gn'r :beer:

"GN'R were never about hard rock"?

I think a more accurate sentence would be, "GN'R were never JUST about Hard Rock."

Listen, we all know Steven Adler like to suck dick for coke. But beyond that, he was a man on the inside and that has to be respected. Steven Adler said in the VH1 special, that they believed they were a gang, and wanted to kick everyones ass with their music.

On Appetite there are many layers that seprated them from the Hard Rock only genre. I never considered them to be one-dimensional, and Appetite is absolutely not one dimensional. But it was focussed. It has direction and it has purpose.

I agree with the dude above that recognized the problem when GN'R went from GN'R to individuals who needed their contributions isolated and identified seprately in writing credits. Maybe it was because some worked harder then others, who knows.

Regardless, this time (UYI's and tour) was painfull. Totally bittersweet. Some sweet moments of honest GNR goodness and moments of complete embarrassement.

Funny thing is, I was less embarrased for the GNR circa 2002, then I was of the Get in the ring GNR. The new guys seemed more bare boned, stripped down and real. Yea they are cooler now and there isn't even an album. Weird.

Not to sound like an old curmundgeon.....

Back in '87 we did not have a forum or the Internet en masse to discuss shit like this. Bands back then were something else, and certain things were still more "mysterious" (I wouldn't say "dangerous"). Rumors were so ramapant, they were legends, not just rumours. And when the band came to your town, you met up with other likeminded people and tore the place apart (see "Judas Priest Parking Lot" for a visual idea). Things were A LOT MORE culturally segregated amongst other social values. At the same, things and people were a lot more indignant and conservative. Thus, why GNR was such a breath of fresh air (until Nirvana came along and the whole shithole went up in flames). They were too real. How could a disaffected youth (railroaded by the Reagan regime) NOT like them.

Moreso: Metallica RULED back in 1987. Cliff was dead, Jason was filling in, and they were still on the Master or Puppets Tour. METAL UP YOUR ASS INDEED.

Another point: Tommy was headlong on the Please To Meet Me Tour with the Mats. SLAGGING on Axl and GNR.

What happened in 1991 with Illusions? Same thing that happened to The Clash and Sandanista! C'mon did you really think Axl, Slash, Duff would still be around churning out stuff right now? Great bands aren't meant to last long. Get used to it.

And now-with the neverending tease of "WILL HE OR WON"T HE???": Name another band of Guns' magnitude where the main character has done something like Axl.

IT"S TOO EXCITING TO GIVE UP NOW!! 18 YEARS. AND COUNTING.

(I'm kinda rambling, but hopefully you get my point) :drool:

Fuck, I totally do dude. And you're fucking right.

I really don't know if the world understands that mass celebrations that will be going down if this album does get released. I know I will be a crazed fucked up motherfucker if this drops. It jsut might be 1987 all over again. Just much, much more.

Nope that was Queen ;)

The comment about Elvis is from the same Headbangers ball interview as the add for the lead guitarist.

He says all he was allowed to listen to was old elvis presley and Jimmy Swageart (sp?) religious tapes. I dunno about anyone else here, but i would be pretty resentful of that shit. If it wasn't a joke then how come it was never released officially ??? It has a studio recording.

i'm not trying to be "cool" or anything because it's basically an age issue, but if you were a fan back in 87/88, there was no way in hell you would predict what happened in 92 on gn'r live shows. if gn'r still have any cred is because of the AFD days. ok, the illusion era was great because our favorite band was the biggest band in the world, and was all over mtv, radios, mags, etc..
but 87/88/89 just had that aura! right band and the right time, and a really kick in the ass in whole rock'n'roll industry. and if there's a word that can describe my musical taste is diversity, but i've never felt anything for a band quite like those days of gn'r.
i wish i would've been in hollywood in 85/86 though!

haha i agree. Ive been thinking about that a lot. I dont think even we understand what its gonna be like when have this dam album in our hands. I cant speak for everyone but for me the album and this whole thing has been a part of my life. The coming to the boards, the "defending", the anticipation, excitement, downfalss,yada ydad yada....basically day in and day out for the past 4 or 5 yrs for me.

Its hard to grasp the fatc that 1 of these decades we will have an album that contains completed  studio tracks with lyrics and vocals from Axl. FOr me thats hard to comprehend because I have never anticipated an album or wnated an album more than this. Plus I never go the chance to experience GNr first time aorund with the old material. Many of you people here already know what its liek to go to a CD store and buy a brand spanking new, anticpated gnr album. I dont...but i cant wait....

i think it woul dbe cool if we could have some sort of gnr fan convention.

Ok, you're right about old Elvis Presley and Jimmy Swageart religious tapes as I saw the interview. :P
Yet, as to the Queen song being banned by his dad, I'm not convinced.

On the day the album is released, we should all go to Richard Branson's store dressed as vintage Axl :rofl:

A convention seems like a better option for a band that is done. Well....that may be the case with GNR, I really hope not.

It isnt Star Trek!

I would never have imagined that they would have a piano on stage and female backup singers etc. That was totally different to the AFD days.

However I loved the UYI CD, even though at first I thought it wasnt as good as AFD and loved the evolution of the sound and the live vibe.

I still would be shocked to hear that Axl would see Slash and Duff as his enemies, and that the three would be slugging it out in court for years. I also would never have thought that Axl would just disappear the way he has..I still think that his disappearance is weird.