Here Today... Gone To Hell!

http://www.home-ed.vic.edu.au/Otherways/AgainstSchool.htm

Liberals use schools to force their agendas on our children. Public schools are for people who had no business having children. If they did, they would have arranged homeschooling or had a fine private school ready for them. It's time we go back to traditional values.

Oh boy, I think you may have just disturbed the hornets nest Walk.? ?:hihi:

Are you serious?

I went to a public school.

Not every family can afford private schooling for their children. So does that mean only rich people should have children? I don't think so.

We don't live in a perfect world.

You might have turned out better than most. If so, more power to you. The point is, schools pander to mediocrity and talented students are grouped with lessers. Education isn't the schools' purpose anymore. State run schools are even bad for democracy, if you're the type who thinks that democracy is good. Students have few rights while in school, and they don't take their rights seriously when they're finally let out. They end up electing representatives who want gun control, higher taxes, and bigger schools to factory farm more drones up for the state.

People need humility. The average person needs to realize that there are a few who are better than they are. Schools don't accept this. Compare the amount spent on special education to the amount spent on "gifted" programs. Even the title of the program is offensive: it implies that their abilities are undeserved. Smart student's aren't "gifted", they're intelligent. Call them what they are. Unfortunately, in this stupid egalitarian society, they're cursed.  :-\


I do. People unprepared to have children shouldn't have them. You don't have to be rich to homeschool children, and private schools aren't overly expensive. You tend to get what you pay for, except when the goverment's in charge. The cycle of poverty continues when students go to bad schools and become bad parents.

The amount of money wasted in public schools is unfathomable. Football teams, marching bands, sex education, and plenty of other programs create an opportunity cost. The money could have been spent on science fairs, math bowls, trips to museums, and other important things. Or better yet, a tax cut!


Let's try and change that. For one, I'm sick of paying taxes for schools that don't work, even when I have no children and would never send my children to the schools around here. Hell, I'm sick of taxes, period.

I kinda agree with you Walk.


It really pisses me off . when I see a school lay off tacher ,the turn around and build a new football field .

www.fredoneverything.net

Check out articles #225, 192, 178, 147, 116, 63

They're all interesting, especially 178.

You're making yourself sound like a fascist.

Finally, another individual who isn't brainwashed into thinking the government can solve all of our problems.  I went to a public school and it was essentially a celebration of ignorance.  I only wish I could go back then knowing what I know now with my political science degree and let these teachers know just how full of shit they are.  Any person who quotes Michael Moore needs to be shot, let alone educating our children.

I read some of that site. This man is just like you. He says things, making broad generlizations, with no footnotes, sources, stats, studies anything. Just talking to talk.

Walk will say anything and I have said in the past that I doubt you believe much of it. You just say it, to say it.....

Half the shit in your first post, is just that....shit. False, and just kind of nuts....

If it types like a duck.....


Wow....nice.

That's America for you.

Getting dumber everyday.


I'm curious...is this an official libertarian stance? Or just you feel this way?  ::)

No, he is not.

Why is someone always a fascist when they don't beleive that stupid ideas and bad programs shouldn't continue. ?Liberals bitch about how we're destorying this planet with pollution and overpopulation but it's the new desire to save the dumb and stupid that's dicking our world up. ?I'm a libertarian but I'll come right out and say that not everyone should have a right to vote. ?People need to have a vested interest in society or they vote for what's just best for them with no personal responsibility. ?It's quite commom to vote to take money and rescources from someone else under the image of a soverign authority so that your life is easier. ?Problem is that communism and socialism are fucking failures but we keep letting dipshits have their say in it. ?Maybe if we increased the standards in education dumb ideas might be weeded out.

Democracy on your terms only....'eh?

And you wonder why the F word came up?

Fascists believe in a strong state educational system to control the nation better. My view on schools is Libertarian, which is the exact opposite of fascist.

Interestingly, schools were once fine places to learn. They served society well for years and gave us generations of diligent learners and thinkers. Things only went wrong in the 1960's, when liberalism and socialism became more mainstream. Hmm...

haha, dude, you are nuts.

Put up or shut up.

Give us some facts to back your baseless claims.

Here you go.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0923110.html

Low test scores...whippie. ::)

How does this link show that schools are "Liberals use schools to force their agendas on our children"?

Answer: It doesn't.

and "Public schools are for people who had no business having children"?

Answer: It doesn't.

Nor does these test scores explain why "They (students) end up electing representatives who want gun control, higher taxes, and bigger schools to factory farm more drones up for the state."

Answer: It doesn't.

or "Compare the amount spent on special education to the amount spent on "gifted" programs."

Answer: It doesn't.

Please, show us this "comparison" you speak of.

How about this statement? "The cycle of poverty continues when students go to bad schools and become bad parents."

Where is this shown on your link?

All public schools yield students who grow up to be bad parents? Huh?

Where is the info to back this statement? "The amount of money wasted in public schools is unfathomable. Football teams, marching bands, sex education, and plenty of other programs create an opportunity cost. The money could have been spent on science fairs, math bowls, trips to museums, and other important things. Or better yet, a tax cut!"

Answer: Your link does not support this claim.

Obviously you haven't been been around schools lately. Football, music etc is getting cut (especially in Jr High School) and/or now costs the parents out of pocket money. Or they have drives to create money for these things. Sex Ed is not something were extra money is being spent.

Or how about this one? "I'm sick of paying taxes for schools that don't work, even when I have no children and would never send my children to the schools around here."

Answer: No where in this link does it provide information that public schools don't work.

Are you aware that MOST PEOPLE go to pulic school? Then those same people, go to college? More than every before. Doctors, lawyers, engineers, judges, all of which have gone to public school.

You are a complete idiot. For real, you have to be the biggest jackass on this boad. And that goes for ANYBODY who agrees with you...

is Walk a real person ?

Nope, no human is actually stupid enough to say the things he does, i'm guessing he is some kind of defective robot

Real or not, his attempt to use the word 'liberal' as an insult is some of the best comedy the board has produced

''Liberal'' a definition by that always unreliable source...the dictionary

Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded. 

What a terrible thing to be! :rofl:

yup.... LOL......


if you want a true gadge on the flaws of the "public" education system look at budgets. in most  areas of the US is it not ture that school boards have 2 seperate budgets that schools work out of. one based on accademic preformance, and one based on athletic preformance. if school A preforms at the average based on marks they receive the average x budget from which they hire teachers etc. if they preform below avg based on marks they receive a lower budget % x-%=budget total. if they preform above they receive a higher precentage budget, x+%=total budget. the same is true for sports they have x budget for sports preform well get higher budget, win a few state championships or finsh high get new stadium, and preform badly get lower budget..... maybe not enough to replace the basketballs.

in the case of a lower budget on the educational side does it not translate that you are going to have to hire crappier teachers to fil in your spots laying off better teachers soo that yo will not have voids in your class romms that dont have a teacher?

the problem is not with the shcools them seleves completley its with the boards that adminster them. fix the top end fix the system....... as for private, stsdents are locked into a non free thinking enviroment where conformatory is required, if you are outside the threshold of what is deemed proper then your are tossed out, or not allowed in regardeless of your parents pay scale.

What a load of bullshit. First of all you have no evidence that public schools are all liberal biased. Second of all there are parents out there who simply cannot afford to send their children to private schools, or can afford to stay home from work on a daily basis to home school their children. Third of all, in some countries including my own it is impossible to continue to third level education without passing official state exams issued by the government. And also these exams are only given to official government recognised public and private schools, and not to parents who homeschool their children.

And on a social level, public schools are, in my opinion and experience the best place a child could possibly go to build relationships with children their age, beyond nationality, colour, gender, and class. Whereas in a private school only those who can afford (upper class) to be sent there are present, eliminating the multi class element present in public school. And, most of private schools are exclusive in their genders as well as class. And with home schooling the child is completely separate from their piers. And is getting no social training.

I don't want democracy on my terms only SLC.? I want a democracy where the people vote on what's best for the longevity of the country.? I want a system where the politicians represent the people with logic and rationality as their motive; not emotion.? Our public education systems are funded and regulated through democracy.? Don't you think it at least prudent to let those who are successful and have a vested interest in our country be the one's to have a vote?? No where in my argument am I stating that voting should be restricted to gender, race or religion.? I whole heartedly support school vouchers where parents can send their children to a school of their choice.? What pisses me off (sorry, I know profanity isn't allowed all of a sudden)? is when the parents who live on welfare, refuse to get a job and pop out 8 kids with different fathers have the same vote as the guy who works 60 hours a week and actually helps fund the education system.?
 When this country was founded, only white, male property owners could vote.? This was so because anyone who owned property had something to lose for poor decisions and was generally educated.? I'm not advocating that only white men should vote, but people should have to own property and at minimum have a high school diploma before they have an equal say in how our system should be setup.? Explain to me how that's a bad idea?

Anybody that says somebody should be "shot" for quoting another person in this country.....

Wants democracy on their terms.

Then you wonder why you hear the F word too......

I was speaking somewhat sarcastically with regard to shooting Moore supportters, but I'll be sure to dumb it down from now on so that you're not confused.? Secondly, when did you gives two shits when someone used profanity.? I know that you used it multiple times in your posts.? Is this just another attempt for to try to claim some kind of moral high ground based on your double standards?? This is a Guns N' Roses forum, so excuse me if I don't talk in my academic tone (however, many of my professors used profanity in their lectures and my college "Ohio University" is ranked in the top 50 public colleges in the nation.)

F word meaning  facsist......not fuck.

Oh...you are sarcastic now....sure....

Truth be told I wouldn't be heart broken if Michael Moore was no longer with us.? However there is a huge difference between not caring if someone shot Moore or his staunch supporters and actually endorsing or taking part in such activity.? Would you shed a tear if some Oswald type wasted Bush?? I think not, but I've never seen you suggest that you would endorse the assasination.?

Right when I gave SLC the award for stupidest post this week . . .

Do you want the ribbon back now?

So I get knocked for being "stupid" because I stated how most people feel about "the other side" in politics.  Since most of you are liberally impaired, how man of you would be upset if Bush, Cheney, Rice (input conservative here) were on a ship and it sank in the middle of the Atlantic?  I'd bet my bottom dollar you'd be dancing in the streets just like CNN's footage of Muslim's celebrating in the middle east after 9/11.  Not caring or even gaining a bit of utility from the untimely demise of someone you consider a stain on the human race isn't fascism.  If I said that Bush supporters should be shot I'd have 30 posters calling me a genius and enlightened - which leads me back to the original topic.  Someone is considered "enlightened" in America's public education system only when they hold an extreme view not in accordance with contemporary America. 

Did you go to public school with Walk or what?

Here's my two cents on this subject:

I went to public schools many, many years ago.  When I first started school, we had a dress code and by the time I graduated high school, most girls were wearing practically nothing to cover themselves up.  My how times had changed!

We had to pass a series of tests in high school to determine whether or not we would be receiving a high school diploma or high school certificate.  Hint:  the diploma means you were smart enough to show up for the tests!

For the most part, I remember most of the kids who attended the high school I went to did not want to be there at all.  They would rather spend their time in the parking lot smoking pot or just hanging out with friends.  So there was a majority of kids sitting in class who didn't want to be there and just created a disruption in every class so the teacher would give them attention and waste 90 percent of the time disciplining    :(

For me, I hated school.  My opinion of school and learning changed when I went to college and was able to see what learning was REALLY about!

Public schools have some excellent teachers and hopefully those teachers can have a positive affect on a child and their education.

Actually I was referring to the original post by Walk.  I should have made that more clear.  But when I reread your post, I understood why you thought I was referring to yours.

Not in any school system in our neck of the woods....or in our STATE, for that matter.

I wonder where you get your information from...???

Because the government is now elitist, in nature, and wouldn't adequately represent the thoughts, views, needs, or wants of a particular % of the population.

And you're left with a substantial group of people who now have to live "under the thumb", without representation of any kind (ie: their vote), of a government they have no say in.

That's why it's a bad thing.

Maybe its just an american problem, because here in Australia public schools are fine (the majority of them).

I went to a public school. A very very very good public school. Most people in my grade did very well in the final exams (called the HSC in Australia). We had good teachers. If i had the choice of going to a public or a private school i would most definetly pick public. Private is so expensive, when you can do as well at school in a public school.

For my dollar, you'd be wrong.

I don't want to see Bush, Cheney, Rice, or anyone from this administration DEAD.? I would hardly wish that on someone I just disagree with, on a fundamental ideological basis.? I might want them out of power, but not dead.? And I would be SHOCKED if anyone, conservative, liberal, or independant, actually wished death on anyone from the "opposite side".

As for your "enlightened" comment at the end....that's your opinion and certainly one I've not seen "proven" by any research.

In our public schools, politics weren't even discussed, except in Poly Sci.  Until I graduated, I don't think I could have pinned down a single one of my teachers politics....and I can only pin them down now, in a few cases, because they've run for local political office (3 Repubs, 1 Dem, 1 Independant).  Now, of course, that hardly matters as it's anecdotal information, but realize (as I've just pointed out) that your experience is not the sum total of information on the subject....

hmmmm broad genl swath of nothing

to what do you wish info?

which breaks down your grandure?

wait i really should start making you work right.......


what do you want me to reply to

hope there were not too many 4 letter words there, cause you did go through that poor public system