Here Today... Gone To Hell!

One side is a regular CD, and the other side is a DVD for digital 5.1 audio. This is a new really cool technology that artists are slowly starting to support. There has been pretty much crap released in this format, but that is all about to change in May.

Specifically May 3rd when NIN album, With Teeth is released. Artists are rereleasing many albums in this format, so maybe I shouldn't have said crap earlier. There just hasn't been a new album supporting this that is of any significance. VRR have (or are) releasing a DD version of Contraband for instance. And Downward Spiral was rereleased on a DD too.

But what makes the new NIN, With Teeth, so cool, is that it is among the first albums to be solely recorded in a digital 5.1 sound field. Its not like other albums that are being remastered. That makes sense? Its a pretty important album because of this, and sound wise, should be very impressive (assuming you have a kick ass 5.1 set-up).

Chinese Democracy should support this as well. Its not mearly a trend, as 5.1 for DVDs aren't trends. SACD and DVD audio are clearly more immersive then a prehistoric surround stereo CD.

Axl being a NIN fan clearly is well aware of Dual Disks. Chinese Democracy would be that much more state of the art technologically, and be that much more kick ass if it was released and godwillingly recorded in 5.1 like With Teeth.

I know, I know, this would delay CD further. I am hoping Axl is keeping touch with technology. He loved NIN because they were ushering in this newer sound. And this will be the case again this time.

It's like playing a PS2, GameCube, and Xbox, when you could be playing a PS3, Revolution, and Xbox 360.

Its the next generation in technology, and Chinese D should be on the forefront. Better then an album thats sound is dated, technologically,  before its even released.

At this point he could put it out on 8-Track and I`d be happy.

great idea, i hope this happens.. even if not at first, eventually!

Bejesus.

By the time Chinese Democracy by Guns n' Roses is released you will be able to download it into you brain via the 'shopping' icon that appears on the left hand side of your vision, provided you have the latest Microsoft chip fitted in your ass.

Haven't laughed so much in a while..jesus, we're going to that era all right..soon.. :hihi:

me too  :rofl:

Well, NIN are using it, and I'm gonna guess it will take some beating with regards to the best album any of us are likely to hear this year. :peace:

LOL

Uh what? Have you been to a Best Buy lately dude? Format might be young, but its here, and isnt some gimmick, that may or may not take off. Record companies and retailers are fully endorsing and promoting this format, because they are seeing it as a way to get people to buy the albums rather then downloading (stealing) it.

Not only can the dvd side, have the music in 5.1 (Like with the new NIN), but it can contain special features found on DVDs (footage, videos, behind the scenes, commentary tracks, etc). This along with the ability to also play the cd side of the disk in your car/home cd player at about the same price as a regular CD.

Check out this link to get a better feel for what I'm saying, and read some of the comments and shit. Widescreen and Sound & Vision have some cool articles on this format too. Everything is going in this direction, and Chinese D needs to jump aboard from the start.

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/7207720/brucespringsteen?pageid=rs.Artistcage&pageregion=triple3

You can also check out amazon for a more complete list of albums, and a cool video for DD.

i said the exact same thing.

id rather have a seperate DVD to be honest, i always scratch the fuck out of my CDS, so id rather they just include a DVD seperately

Judas Priest used that technology on Angel of Retribution-and thats the reason I downloaded the album RATHER THAN BOUGHT IT.

Consider this-You've already got to worry about scratching a cd and it no longer working.  Imagine a double sided cd-you scratch one side of it, and you have to replace it.  I'd much prefer artwork on one side of my disc, and a bonus dvd thrown in.  Shit, it only costs about 3 cents to press a disc anyway.

Also-some cd players wont play dueldiscs, as the plastic is too thick.

Just what we need, more reasons for them to go back and do more mixing and 'final touches'.

And the only people that look at Chinese Democracy as a release of any magnitude is us GnR fans. Honestly, it might be a nice addition, and a way to add more selling value to the album. Once the rabid do or die gnr fans pick it up expect sales to become very average.

i was just about to say that.. Brides of Destruction's Here come the Brides is on a dual disc. i've only had it for a month and half and its already scratched to shit.. the dvd side at least..

If I had to choose between DD or a DVD included with my copy of C.D. I'd take the DVD - as long as it was the 0.1.01.01 Vegas show.

lmao

I think my problem is that GNR, of all bands, have the releases that took no time and money before they were wrapped and put onto shelves. While every band has released 5.1 music dvds, GNR release the joke that is WTTV, and the Tokyo DVDs. They suck cock, and are an insult to GNR. GNR should be given the full treatment just like everyone else, but their not.

So what happens now. Does GNR continue to produce bare boned amateur dvds? Or do they get with the program.

With everything that is seen from them at Best Buy, Chinese Democracy, the album that took 7+ years and $13 million, will release as a single CD release.

To be honest with you. I don't really care if you think DD is a good format or not. I am not even sure if I like. But I do like digital 5.1. If any of the GNR albums rereleased on DVD audio, I would be the first in line to get them.  I love that shit. More and more people are waking up and hooking their pads up with some sweet settups. DVDs are huge today, and people are getting with the program. Blu-Ray/HDDVD only reinforce this.

Shit I would be fucking thrilled if GNR released a DVD proper like.But shelf space is being made today to make room for Dual Disk releases. It is exciting a lot of people in ways that albums with an included dvd never did. Its the latest cool technology thing.

Guns N' Roses, whenever CD arrives, needs to get with the program.

To answer some questions I saw.

-NIN will release With Teeth, as a regular CD as well.

-Dual Disks are selling for $13.99, about the same price as regular CDs.

first off 5.1 surround is awesome...  yes definitely would want CD in this format  : ok:
i don't know anything about dvd audio but if its not something that can play on all cd players it should be offered only as an option so that it doesn't hurt sales if it won't play on all cd player (so have the 'regular cd format' available at the retailers (best buy, etc.)  AND then the dvd format available to order on line along with the regular cd format
as far as having dvd extras on the flip side of the audio - hey if its all for the same price? that's great - though yeah IF for the same price you can just get a cd AND a dvd in the same package i'd probably prefer that
about the comments about your cd getting scratched - aren't you allowed to burn a back up copy of a cd once you buy/own it...
then you can keep the original cd in its package safe from scratching and play the burned cd (which is supposed to be the same quality)
don't know how this would work though if the cd is made so that a copy can't be burned from it -- but you should be able to burn a copy for yourself legally if you have purchased it

i like the idea of the cd coming out with the best sound technology available - such as 5.1 surround
and yes - any dvd needs to have 5.1 surround as well (the welcome to the videos dvd release was NOT even decent audio quality - much less 5.1)
i did not purchase the us release of the illusions dvd because i already had purchased the import - the import IS in 5.1 and sounds way better than the welcome to the videos dvd that was released by geffen

and for the record (pun intended  ;D)... i'd love to see a limited release of CD on vinyl...  would make a great collector's item/novelty and i would get it JUST for the larger artwork  : ok:

There was actually a discussion, although it be a strange one, about how GNR might be waiting on or producing some kinda new listening technology, but it's silly. More and more albums are coming out as a DD release, like Judas Priests new album, 'Angel of Retribution'. It's a good format, though I'm not too much of an audiophile...

Alright. After thoroughly taking in the Dual Disc format last night for the first time, with the repeated listenings to the new NIN's "With Teeth," I honestly am blown away by the sound quality of this album. The Audio of the Dolby Digital version laughs at the regular CD. I know that "With Teeth" was recorded in 5.1 to begin with, so the DVD side is the way the album is meant to be heard, which accounts for it sounding better then even the other DVD audio disks I own (which are all remixed and remastered to take advantage of 5.1 but weren't created in that soundstage).

What I am saying is, is that it has exceeded my own expectations and anticipations. I really hope you get a chance to experience this in this way as I am. Listening to the regular CD side at work or in my car is strange sounding now. The differences between the two are startling. Its night and day, leaps and bounds (or whatever lame ass cliche that all say the same and get my point across).

I really REALLY hope artists begin recording their albums in 5.1 now that the road has been paved. The quality of the audio is so much better here and just one listen of "With Teeth" dual disc in a digital 5.1 surround settup, is all that is needed to make believers. Its an awesome effort.

I am convinced now that Chinese Democracy, unlike all previous GNR releases, needs to be 5.1 from the get go (whether being Dual Disc or a seperate included DVD). I may be becomming an audiophile but for an album to have taken as long as it has, to not take advantage of technology and release on stereo only, is as sad as it is lame. I want to hear this sure to be masterpiece proper like.

yea fucking yea "I wouldn't give a shit if CD was only released on 8-track." I am glad those with this mentality are enjoying their black and white tv's with a knob control, Beta Max machines, and pong.

What is the major difference maker between stereo cd and 5.1 dolby? Is it the increased soundstage or the clarity due to the differing compression techniques? If dual disc offers an obvious leap forward in sound quality then I'd be inclined to support releasing a DD, but if there isn't a huge difference in clarity and if remixing stereo doesn't make the same impact as music recorded specifically for the format then I don't see the benefit in adapting this particular album to dual disc.

If it takes longer to record in 5.1 then GNR should stick with regular CD but it would be cool.

StoneTempleRoses

Yeah. Haven't we already heard that it's to be released with full use of the up-to-the-minute technology?

Yes dude, there is a HUGE difference between Stereo, and Digital 5.1.

Stereo, you have 2 channels. Left and Right. Digital 5.1 you have Two front speakers (left and right), Two Surround Speakers (Left and Right), a Center Channel, and of course the Sub.

Its a more natural sound field where the audio envelopes you. In video games (only the Xbox for now) or movies, if something comes from behind you, you hear them coming from behind you (and you know if its coming from behond your left or right side). If a ship is passing over you, you heear the shit strting in front of you, and as it passes over you then behind you, you hear jsut that. Say in the new Star Wars DVDs, when Vader uses the force (like choking some fool) you here a powerful bass that you can feel in your chest coming from the Sub. You feel the force reverberating and pounding you. Thye Center channel is a better and more important speaker then either the front 2 or surround 2, and provides significantly improved clarity and more natural sound (voices).

Now, there is a thing called Pro Logic (2 and x now), that can take stereo and try to simulate it into 5.1 sound. But the stereo has to be encoded for it (like what PS2 and Gamecube games use). But its not as natural and the bass (Sub sucks).

Like I said before. Just listen to the differences between the Stereo CD side of "With Teeth" and then flip the sucker over and play it on a DVD player with a sweet 5.1 settup. Its staggering. Its a major "Holy Shit!" kind of difference. NIN music also has layers and sounds that can trip you out and fuck with you, and lends itself perfectly to this. And "With Teeth" being recorded in 5.1 makes it the best example of this. It's 2005, and it is time to get with the program.

if you listen to the Dual Disk in your computer and your computer has only 2 speakers how do you get the 5.1 sound, do you need to have a surround systemto get the right sound?

StoneTempleRoses

I don't like the Dual Disk idea.
Who really wants to have to listen to their CD all the time sat between 5 speakers?

I mean, its ok for a movie when you're actually watching something.
But for CDs, I don't expect it to take off.

It will work for bands like Nine Inch Nails and Pink Floyd who make full use of soundscaping. But for normal rock bands, whats the point? Who cares if the reverb of a guitar comes from behind.

I don't think this will catch on. The general public don't care enough about it.

Holy Fuck, you dudes are scaring me.

"Insert Quote

I don't like the Dual Disk idea.
Who really wants to have to listen to their CD all the time sat between 5 speakers?

I mean, its ok for a movie when you're actually watching something.
But for CDs, I don't expect it to take off."

The Dual Disc. One sie is a CD that CAN BE PLAYED ON ANY CD PLAYER. The other is the DVD THAT HAS THE REAL VERSION RECORDED IN DOLBY DIGITAL 5.1.

You dig?One side CD, other side DVD.

"It will work for bands like Nine Inch Nails and Pink Floyd who make full use of soundscaping. But for normal rock bands, whats the point? Who cares if the reverb of a guitar comes from behind."

Listen to The Beatles Yellow Submarine DVD, the Doors Riders On The Storm Audio DVD, and the Revenge of the Sith Soundtrack DVD (included with the regualr soundtrack). Then come back and apologize.

"I don't think this will catch on. The general public don't care enough about it."

Too Late. Check Amazon for an example. At around the same price as a CD album, and already being heavily pushed by retailers like Best Buy and record labels. Even without it, this applies to a complementary DVDthat gets packaged together with certain CDs. I am more referring to the Audio here anyway.


"if you listen to the Dual Disk in your computer and your computer has only 2 speakers how do you get the 5.1 sound, do you need to have a surround systemto get the right sound?"

Yea dude, you can play the CD side of the Dual Disc on your comp. But you won't get 5.1 unless you have the surround settup with a receviever that supports dolby digital, the optical or coax cables, and the speaker hookup.

If you want to hear the way the album was meant to be heard, you have to listen to it in a digital surround settup. Listening to the CD of it in my car, then coming home and listening to it again in my little theater room here at home....its like two different albums.

5.1 rocks!   \m/(-_-)\m/

and okay yeah cool... i get it  ;D

one side regular CD

one side dvd 5.1

that would be kick ass  : ok:

You can't get the 5.1 onto a cd, only a dvd?

But don't they also include a PCM stereo mix on the DVD side? In case you only have two speakers but want a better sounding stereo version of the album.


It looks like the record companies think DualDisks are the future so I wouldn't be surprised if CD was released on that format.



/jarmo

Yes they do, but it's not garunteed (inclusion of the PCM stereo mix). I have dual discs with and without. It all depends on the quality of the 5.1 mix and any extras they are including (videos, documentaries, etc.). On another note, the Velvet Revolver CD was released in dual disc, but without 5.1 and only the PCM stereo mix.

Aaron.

DD format sucks, and I would not want CD in this format. DD has too many bugs in it.

Dave dave dave... 

Answer me this my friend. Would you rather have Chinese Democracy released only as a stereo CD, or with an included full dolby digital 5.1 version (whether that being an included DVD OR DD)?

Don't get hung up so much on DD. Its more what it and regular DVDs represents audioly. To me, after hearing the new NIN now extensively, the difference betweeen the DVD and the regular CD is as much a difference as Full Screen is to Widescreen. Because like Full screen, with CD stereo, you are only getting part of the picture.

DD also does not suck. No one I know have had any problems with it. I would rather have the entire soundfield then only part of it. I am not saying its better then getting an included DVD, but its better then getting just a regular CD. What about if albums still were released in Mono? Isn't there a big difference between Mono and Stereo? 5.1 isn't a little better then Stereo. Its a much MUCH bigger difference then what Stereo is to Mono. This is why movies have been using it for years, and is why the music industry is going in this direction as well.

More and more channels are going High Definition, Blu-Ray and HD-DVD are merging for the next level of DVD HD, and there are things like DVDs being included with CDs, and now the Dual Disc. You guys can either move back to Bedrock, or accept the new technology, and treat yourself to a significantly better and more immersive way to see and hear the things we all love in movies and music.

Thats what this is about. That is why I am excited about what NIN has done, and what more and more musicians are m oving towards. I just want GNR to be cutting edge too (technologically). The music quality shouldn't sound dated before its even released.

Just look at all the probs people are having with the  NIN DD disc. If he is going to do this release two versions then.
When you have two sides to a disc is much easier to scratch plus its thicker than a normal cd, and wont fit in some slot players.

Man what problems? You just made me check some NIN message boards ...what are you saying dude?

Give a link dude before you make accusations like that.