Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Well, I'm not sure if this is the right section (mods, feel free to move the topic), but here it is...

My friend Fuckin' Gunner interviewed Ron Thal to his website and the guy told some really interesting stuff about his career and, obvious, Guns N' Roses. It's an exclusive interview to the Brazilian site www.nightrain.cjb.net (http://www.nightrain.cjb.net), but it's in english too: http://geocities.yahoo.com.br/nightrainfg/nightrain/entrevistas/005.htm

Hope you all enjoy it!  : ok:

cool read...and for all the fans out there who doubt bummblefoot..hes a standup guy. I have been talking to him for weeks.


btw check out my site...your boy younggunner is 2004 wiffle ball champion of the world
http://www.leaguelineup.com/welcome.asp?cmenuid=1&url=njswingers&sid=553416593

That was a good read, although I don't like reading parts about coming in and still laying down some solos for the CD. You'd think we'd be past that point already if the thing is supposedly ready to go. Also, his comment about making positive comments about Slash and VR hurting his chances of making the band sound about par for the course. That shows that they (GNR and management) are obviously watching what is going on with that band.

I am bummed Bumblefoot didn't make the band. Looking at his interviews he seems like a real stand up guy and is totally open with his fans, which would be much appreciated among the GNR fan base. He certainly would have been appreciated.

looks like a nice guy, >GNR management sucks  :P :P :P :P :P

He heard the studio version of "The Blues"? Damn, I HATE this guy. Them having him come in and lay down solos pretty much guarantees that Buckethead's parts are being re-done.

What Ron was talking about is exactly what I meant when I said I thought management lied about why they approached him, and how they covered their asses by getting him to issue a "retraction" on his website.  I think they wanted him to replace Buckethead, and were pissed that he went public, regardless of the fact that his intentions were good, and then got him to issue a "retraction" because they didn't want it known they wanted him to replace Bucket.

The fact that his chances would be hurt by talking positively about Slash and VR is beyond stupid.  I hope that is just a rumor.

Ali

Ron seems to have been honest this entire time and everything with him has been on the up and up.....why would he just make that up? Its not even like he got all bitter after this happened and starting slamming everyone, he just seems to tell his story like it happened. Would it really surprise anyone if that was said to him?

Naupis, I'm not saying that Ron is making that up.  I'm saying it would stupid, childish and petty on Managment and Axl's part to hold something like that against him.  I just hope that they aren't that petty.  After all, Richard Fortus went to a VR show in NYC.  What's Axl gonna do, fire him because of that?  :hihi:

Ali

the link didn't work for me

Did you tried this link? http://geocities.yahoo.com.br/nightrainfg/nightrain/entrevistas/005.htm

It's geocities, maybe you should try a few more times...  ;)

Nightrain: What's your favourite GN'R song?

Hmmmmmmmm... Rocket Queen, Mr. Brownstone, Don't Cry... hard to say, I like all their old stuff... SLASH KICKS ASS.


No wonder they didn't want him :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Not completely, mind you:

"[..] they were looking to replace Buckethead, there would be a few solos left to finish the CD, then start touring, [..]"

Based on this, I might even go out on a limb and suggest Thal would've only put his signature in a few solos originally done by Bucket, instead replacing his stuff altogether.

With that in mind, I wonder even more why they can't just have Finck do it.

How fuckin stupid can this Bumblefoot guy be NOT to have known that going public was gonna piss people off?? If there's one thing that everyone knows about the GNR world is that if you're an "insider" at any level, you DON'T say shit about shit!!!? And for those of you who are gonna try to use the argument that "rumors were going around so he went public to address them" .... well that don't fuckin' fly because who the fuck started the rumors???? It had to be him!!!? He had to tell someone about what was going on and then that someone told someone else and so on and so on.? ?:rant:

I agree with SOH ... just have Robin do it.? : ok:

Damn I would love to hear the studio version of the blues. I guess we'll see it...'soon'.

worked now, thanks man! : ok:

Can't help but feel bad for the guy.  Seems so nice about everything.  I guess he didn't really agree with everything they wanted anyway.

Altought he didn't need to know how the GNR fans would act in that case, it's indeed pretty wierd the way he did the whole thing. The blurb wasn't big enough and he must knew that the any info regarding a big band would spread in the internet in a blink.

Damn, he doesn't know how lucky he is to have heard 'The Blues' studio version. Argh!

I believe he said that he hadn't heard anything from the GNR camp in about 2 months prior to him posting that bit on his website.  I kind of believe that if that's the case, GNR must have already decided against using him.  So he probably didn't hurt his chances, he just pissed them off a little. 

Well, maybe he tought that it was a good reason to clarify everything.

I really haven't seen nothing wrong in his post.

This guy was about as upfront, honest, and apologetic about the situation as anyone could possibly be...Horrible fit for GNR if you ask me.....

probably because Finck sucks, the thing i find interesting is that he said "Joe Satriani was the first to tell me I'd be contacted by GN'R back in July"  I wonder if that means Joe Satriani was asked to be in GNR at one point?  that would've been cool cus Joe Satriani is awesome

You just ruined my post...  >:( ;D

Anyway, this, to me, is the most interesting part of the interview. How did Satriani know about this? Was he approached? Was he asked for opinions on guitar players?

Strange shit... I'm tellin ya...

sad but true...  :-\

This is what I've been wondering: Thal was contacted in July, with people in the GNR camp telling him there'd be some recording to do in early September. If he was right about only a few solos remaining, he would've probably managed to do it before the mastering would begin in October / November (based on what Tommy's been saying). Now, Thal goes public in late September, when he should've already been in the studio! In less than two weeks, management has denied everything.

So what we have here is a situation where CD is a few solos short to be ready for mastering. It just doesn't seem right that if Thal would've been the only choice, GNR would've just let time pass without him even meeting Axl, not to mention postponing his sessions. This leads me to think that there have been one or more guitarists being considered for the job the same time Thal was, and atleast one of them might've gotten a lot further. This means putting down some guitar tracks and - gasp - even meeting Axl.  :rofl:

Yet if Thal was the only one at the time, the CD production team is way sloppier than I thought.

All that proves is that GN'R's management team are a world-class pack of cunts. As Thal pointed out, bands need to have some form of communication with their audience, or else rumours get started all over the place. And clearly, people in the music world knew about this; Satriani knew, probably all his mates know as well. They don't tell people to sign confidentiality agreements, and then fuck them over when they talk. What a bunch of assholes. Fuck Guns N' Roses' management team. Fuck 'em right in the ear. I hope they all go broke and end up giving handjobs to strangers down back alleys for crack money. Fucking bastards.

SG

I think this news seriously sucks for all of us. CD isn't done, has never been done or mastered or mixed. GnR managment doesn't care for us to have any information or even have it's members speak their mind. I have to admit this does sound like the managment as it existed back in the day; I wonder if this attitude springs from Axl himself.

I think a February release date is in serious question if there is no guitarist to replace Bucket unless they can convince him to come back.

.
That's what I said a couple of weeks ago and what I (still) do think...

so Tommy was lying then? He said it was being mixed now didnt he?

They may be mastering now. 2 months have gone by since they were to record those solo's. In that timeframe they may have found someone to do it and we may find out soon - like we found out about Bumblefoot in Sept when he was contacted in July. But then again 2 months means nothing to Axl and Co. I am starting to truly believe Axl is Immortal...or thinks he is! ;D

I would not jump to the conclusion that the album isn't done and hasn't been mixed yet.  They talked to Ron about coming down and laying guitar tracks in September, but maybe they decided that they didn't want to have any guitar tracks recorded or re-recorded.  Also, I get the impression that GN'R has mixed tracks at various times throughout the last few years.  In other words, just because there may be a track or two that they are thinking about changing a guitar track, that doesn't mean that none of the tracks are finished and have been mixed.

I think that it is actually a positive sign that Ron didn't come in and record guitar tracks for the album.  Maybe they just thought the tracks were fine as is.

Ali

The communication on the part of the GnR camp is so bad it's truly amazing.  Ron Thal is offered a chance to collaborate with the group, but Axl didn't even talk to him?  This band is so loosely assembled it's really no wonder this album has taken so long to get done.  Tommy and Dizzy are saying that the album is pretty much finished, but then this guy is saying that as of a few months ago that some of the solos weren't finished.  I don't even know what to believe anymore, but this is getting out of hand.  How can someone be asked to join GnR and the band doesn't even talk to him to try to convince him to join? 

Who was asked to join GnR?

More Proof that slash was right when he said only 2 tracks have been completed by axl rose.

 :P

Interesting interview. I can't believe management is so unprofessional.

Slash said there were only 2 or 3 tracks with vocals on them. Thats easier to believe. Much of the music has been done for years with solos needing redone because of rotating guitar players.

This is proof?

Wow, you're a detective.

:rofl:
I don't think we should believe in Ron more than in Tommy. I really liked the guy, he seems to be pretty cool, but he wasn't in gnr camp and didn't know what was really going on by that time. Tommy and Dizzy talked about final mix or masterizing. They never talked about this stage of the album before.
Why some people only believe in the negative side?  :-\

Yeah, in that case, could be that?s the very reason he started this after 2months of no news from the GNR management, just to piss them off. And/or maybe it had something to do with his forum name.

As much as I love Axl, he's fully responsible for the album not being finished.? The reason he wants to re-record buckethead's stuff is because he doesn't want to pay him royalty fees in the future.?

Axl's a perfectionist, blah blah blah.? does the album really have to be that perfect?? would we, their fans, really make a big deal about it not being "perfect"?? i won't, all i care about is listening to gnr's music.?

Axl needs to listen to his fans more.? Fuck the press, fuck the critics, and fuck the haters.?

my2cents?

WHAT THE FUCK?!!!! IF THIS DUDE IS TELLING THE TRUTH (AND I THINK HE IS) CD IS STILL NOT FUCKING FINISHED!!!!! FUCK ME!!!!!? I'LL FUCKING DO THE FUCKING SOLOS MY DAMN SELF IF THAT'S WHAT IT WILL TAKE TO FINISH THIS GODFORSAKEN PIECE OF SHIT!!!! HOW CAN THEY STILL NOT BE DONE WITH THIS FUCKER!!!!!? BUCKETFUCK DIDN'T FINISH ALL HIS SHIT BEFORE HE LEFT? FUCK!!!

If Axl really intends on cutting Buckethead ENTIRELY out of the royalties... then we're all fucked. That would involve writing AND recording new solos for EVERY track that BH wrote or recorded on... correct!?!?!? :crying:

Hopefully, it's a situation where Axl is going to bite the bullet on Buckethead (give him his royalties by leaving his material on the album) and he just wants his replacement (whoever that may be) to at least get a couple recordings/credits on CD before releasing and hitting the road in '05. :-\

As far as Bumblefoot goes- definitely a nice guy, but as someone suggested earlier- there's just something about him that's too "fan friendly" and "interactive" to ever be a good fit with Axl Rose, who pretty much regards anything GN'R related as a matter of national security. For better or worse, GN'R has always been a band "larger than life" and "somewhat removed from the masses". It makes them come off as Grade A pricks most of the time, but it's also what gives them their "aura" and keeps them from being just another run of the mill rock band professing their love for their fans anytime they can. Don't get me wrong- some of the things GN'R puts us through are totally FUCKED UP- their relationship with us is practically abusive at times, BUT those rare times that they actually pay attention to us and deliver... THEY DELIVER. So here we all are year after year...

I think we will all be surprised how little buckethead worked on this album. From the impression I get, Bucket's 'nomadic' lifestyle made it impossible to get hold of him after he failed to show up to do his parts. Axl does blame bucket for holding up Chinese Democracy; I wonder how much time in the studio bucket actually put in? My guess is not very much.

You made a good point. Actually, in the new songs we already know, he played just a little bit (a solo or so), but the main riffs and the improved touch (like with Madagascar and The Blues in 2002) were made only by Finck and Fortus.

Whoa!
Dudes, Axl mentioned BHs contribution and Tommy referred cd as 8mens work.
And matter of course, I?d rather believe words from the members than a bumble who suggests they can?t replace their predecessors.

p-that doesn't in anyway evaluate what bucket did in gnr. I doubt very much he put in as much work as finck. I am speculating as to B's contributions but I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't amount to much.

What about Paul Huge, who was originally brought in to work as Axl's songwriting partner?

Paul Huge was never brought in to work as Axl's songwriting partner. He was brought in as a second guitar player and ended up the third guitar player.

Now he's officially out of the band but he might be in some song credits. I doubt it though as Axl said that he's the only one who writes lyrics...

I seriously think that Brain May will be on the album too. We know he did some guitar solo's and I'm 99% sure Axl will keep those. I think he is very proud that he contributed to the album so.....

Regarding Paul Tobias Axl said:

?The public gets a different story from the other guys ? Slash, Duff, Matt - who have their own agendas. The original intentions between Paul and myself were that Paul was going to help me for as long as it took to get this thing together in whatever capacity that he could help me in. So when he first was brought into this, he was brought in as a writer to work with Slash. At the time those guys never suggested one name. Nobody else. Ever.

Paul was one of the best people we knew who was both available and capable of complimenting Slash?s style. You could bring in a better guitar player than Paul. You could bring in a monster. I tried putting Zakk Wylde with Slash and that didn?t work. It brought out some interesting things in Slash but it was a different approach that ended up being overpowering and didn?t bring out the best in Slash. It brought out some interesting things and it would?ve worked to do some songs. But Paul was only interested in complimenting Slash, laying down a foundation of a riff or something. That would accent or encourage slash's lead playing. Now whether or not Paul was going to be officially on the album or on the tour that really wasn?t an actual consideration at the time. It was in the air as a possibility but Paul was a friend trying to help us and he had a huge respect for Slash. He is and this is the bottom line a good man and that's the reality behind things. That doesn't change what took place with old Guns. I feel that some of the recordings we did in that limited amount of time had some of the best playing that Slash had done at least since Illusions. I was there. I know what I heard and it was pretty exciting.?

August 2002  GN'R press release




"Oh My God"
(Tobias/Reed/Rose)  ;)


As you can see, he's already been credited as a songwriter.


/jarmo

I always wanted to hear the sound slash brought out while working with zakk...

I C what you mean.? :D OK, Let?s go over the followings.

"We greatly appreciate Bucket's contributions and remain open to "discussions" as there are obviously several issues to resolve."? Axl in March

"there'll probably be compositions that started with each of us and were compiled by all of us, on the whole record, yeah. I would be willing to wager that that is how it turns out, because Axl is the kind of guy who is always looking out for the fairest way to do it so everyone's happy." (songwriting-wise)? Tommy in September

"I think pretty much all of us in the band have some songwriting credits on just about everything. The undertaking was pretty much a large collaboration between eight people, even a couple others who aren't around anymore, but maybe started with pieces of the old band or whatever. But yeah, there is probably a lot to go around with that one." Tommy in September

"Axl as a producer is trying to get the best out of eight guys and get them all in a song, like trying to pull everyone in. You know, mush it together like a fucking piece of clay or something. Trying to form a piece of artwork out of it. It takes time."(on pretzel)Tommyin October? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

I don?t know how much work BH had done for CD that is sorta like a jack-in-the box now. But if Bucket?s role had been as modest as Brian Mays, Tommy wouldn?t repeat 8. He's checked that on the final mix of several new songs.
Otherwise......:idea:
whoops!!! I can?t say I?m dead sure who the 8th man is. He?s not Paul Tobias is he? :confused:

I was wrong about the writing part but still this song won't be in CD (well, at least I don't think it will be). I don't think Tobias will be credited in CD's songs.

Just to clear things up, Bumblefoot did not hear the studio version of The Blues. I asked him about it and he said a fan sent it to him. I then told him it was a soundboard. He later cleared it up in a thread in his forum...

shit, the MP3 I heard of that gnr song "the blues" was actually a live mp3 - thought it was a studio recording - the thing sounded DAMN good...

Great. This guy don't have a clue about know a live or studio recording. :confused:

There's no studio version of the blues :P

Hey, thanks for clearing things up!? ::)

I meant I don't think there is one period.. I believe axl said b sides for singles(how many b sides could there be?), but I haven't even heard of a single, I think those songs were just used for the live performances..

It can be heard in the Boston Promo studio cuts. I mean, I guess the old songs have pretty much at least one version recorded in studio.
And Axl didn't said anything about b-sides, he said that those songs won't be released as singles.

I think you are wrong

I think you are right, Voodoochild and younggunner.

Exactly.
Cheers for the info.
Now, that is, this Stood-up guy didn?t even look into the band he?s supposed to have considered joining for bloody 2months. He has heard only "the Blues" out of new songs and it was sent to him by someone, after all. On the contrary he seems to know of music from a certain new band so well as to.......
I don?t know that it?s common or garden. :coffee:

There is a studio version and it will be included in Chinese Democracy.

can I ask how do you know it will be included for a fact??? and for that matter how do you know the recording of it is finalised??

Well if the only song he heard was sent to him by a fan, and not GNR, then I think that should give us a pretty clear picture of how "close" he actually was to joining the band.  Is it just me, or did anyone else think he definitely meant to imply in that original interview that he had gotten the studio version of the Blues from GNR?  Perhaps I'm overly cynical, but it seems that he conveniently left out the fact that he got it from a fan.

Because it was the only question I cared to ask Tommy Stinson about Chinese Democracy.

I didn't care about release dates, tracklistings, tours, credits or anything else.

Just if THE BLUES would be included in CD. And he answered that it would be on the album.

Besides it's not a big secret...

:D I?m not certain about that but seeing many posts on the 1st page and 2nd of this thread, that bit, like many other bits from his talks, definitely tricks people so. We may as well wear glasses and see what?s under a cloak of his mild manner. There are loads of illogical lines we can point out in his story. I don?t bother making an issue of everything though.

In conclusion, the Management/GN'R was not the unprofessional one on this matter.? :headbanger:

So thanks for sharing  : ok:

BUMP!!!

Well then....

Sounds like it wasnt a smooth introduction to the wonderful world of GN'R.

Bumblefoot talking in 2004!

http://br.geocities.com/nightrainfg/nightrain/entrevistas/005.htm

laying down some parts - that could be good. It could spell, Bucketheads input into CD will remain in tact  : ok:

Am i the only one who thinks he looks like Gilby?

No!

yeah  bumping threads is cool ::)

i just tried to open that link on the first page for about 5 minutes :hihi:

Well if I had started another thread with that story the HTGTH SS would be kicking down the door.

yeah,me too.. I have always been interested in that part of the pressrelease..

just read the interview with BF from 2004, and he sounds like a nice guy :)
And he does look a little bit like Gilby to me :)

this guy will go FAR. what a cool and down to eart guy 8)
glad he was chosen.

I hope they treated him well(he joined, so apparently they did) in re-entering negotiations with him...From that 2004 interview, it sounds like he felt disrespected by the backlash after that initial post..They must have apologied and increased the offer for him to change his mind after deciding it wasn't for him.

I can't access the article...advice?

you are one ignorant person you know that ?

i found the post you quoted stupid, but funny :rofl: