Here Today... Gone To Hell!

rumor has it the record label told axl to fix some things on Chinese democracy before it could be released, Scott weiland talked how he was censored by the record label on certain lyrics he could say

with the shit music out today will the record label allow axl to be innovative and change the musical landscape? or will they fight axl till he comes out with shit that sounds like everything else out just to fit into todays format

whose to say this isnt the big holdup on CD, maybe axl is frustrated and having a power struggle with the label cause they want shit to sound commercial and axl wants to be new, therefore axl is stubborn and just isnt doing shit until something happens

i just hope the record label, who always fucks shit up, will get out of axl's way and let him do things his way instead of tryin to make it sound like a better version of linkin park or something

if chinese democracy comes out with 12 songs each of 3min 30seconds, you'll know the record company has won.


can't get more radio friendly than a format like that.

If the scenario were true I believe Axl would be working to release the album under a different label, instead of doing that  : ok:

There's a good chance the album will be radio friendly. You're assuming there's an Axl vs Label dispute, which is just an old rumor.

Besides, you really think Axl would let this happen after working on this album for so long?

They've given him 10 years - i don't think their intentions are to interfere

Scott didnt say that...

The record company encouraged a "clean" edit of Contraband so that it could be sold at Wal-Mart and such, and that required modifying the lyrics by muting out the cursing.  Weiland wasnt happy with the compromise, but did it anyway.  And radio/TV outlets expressed interest in censoring the word "poppies" in "Slither," which angered Weiland.

But the record company didnt interfere with the lyrical content in the regular, unedited album.

I agree with Izzy. If they were going to interfer, they would have done so a long time ago. I think they know they have a good thing and they are willing to wait it out like the rest of us. They didn't give him that much money if he hasn't proved it is worth it.
I hope this cd changes the way rock music is defined.

Axl wont have a problem doing a clean version I suspect in the end, as we all know there are 'clean' versions of all the GnR albums on the shelves anyway.  It's nothing new.  But if you want the kids to experience your music, you have to make small compromises sometimes... saying (for example) 'bad' instead of 'fucking bad' isn't a big deal....

Anyway, stop worrying.

I wouldn't doubt that the label is sticking there collective noses into the production of Chinese Democracy. Think about it, they signed a contract with Guns N' Roses however many years ago, and in their eyes the cd has been in the works since 94'. They lose money and the band loses noteriety with every passing year, of course the label wants it to be comercialy successful. They are in it to make money. If they had some kind of assurances that they would be getting three albums in a respectable amount of time, then they would probably be more comfortable letting Axl be creative, but in his ten years of missed dates and missed opportunities he lost his right to waste their money to creativity. Geffen can't afford a commercial flop that is "creative genius" lost on the masses. If your the Beatles and you have 20 something albums, you can afford to throw a risky album out their.

booker i couldve sworn in that rolling stone article how scott talked about being censored, why else would he write that on the website about censorship sucks?


there are plenty of albums that are masterpieces but do not sell well cause they arent easy digestible shit

rhcp's by the way is one of the greatest cds ever from song 1 to 16, it sold just over a million in the US

my point is will the record label try to make axl do some radio friendly garbage just to sell more cds

Geffens job is to make money, not distribute poor selling masterpieces. The record label (especially in this instance) has every right to set themselves up to make money. If they think that a release with 6 or seven possible radio singles will sell 10 million copies and make them back everything they have lost in ten years of failure from Axl, than God Bless them..... Axl can comeback and release his opus for a second album.

The record company probably hasnt lost as much as we think regarding this band. Their old sales alone are raking in big bucks consistently.

I don' t think we need to be worried about Axl changing any musical landscape.. ::)

They commited 13 million dollars (confirmed?) for Chinese Democracy. Therefore they are expecting CD to make them that money back alone. I dont think that Gefffen is excited about raking in the 50-100k copies a year that they sell of the back catalog. I'm sure that they have lost all interest in Axl's artistic vision and just want him to release something that will appeal and sell copies. Why live off of old album sales when they feel that a properly groomed "CD" can make them millions...........When Axl becomes the Geffen cash cow again then he can decide to recreate "The White Album."

Think about it Geffen gave him this money based on the fact that he was one of the biggest artists in the world, after all the disapointment (failed tour, missed release dates, poor T.V. preformances) I'm sure that they have lost all trust that he can put out...

I know we worship him, but the rest of the record industry looks at Axl (at this moment) as nothing more than a hair band has been.

in 93-94 he was in this list:
Robert Plant
Jim Morrison
Axl Rose

03-04 he's in this list:
Brett Michaels
Vince Neil
Janni Lane
Axl Rose

Hes somewhere in the middle right now.

If CD is horrible he will be in the latter. If CD is a masterpiece he will either go back to where he was or maybe even rise into the god type section....time will tell.....

As for the money. No doubt the company wants to make money on the album. And they have every right. All im saying is that its not like they broke their back to fund the band since 94. The old catologues has provided a nice lil cushion for them.

HAte to break it to you but Axl is not going to sacrafice anything on this album. This album is his life and a lot is at stake with this band and album. DO you honestly htink Axl will surrcomb to any type of pressure put on by the company? Hell fukin no. He hasnt done it for the past few yrs he wont now. The album will be how it was intended to be.

That is the least of my concerns regarding CD. As Zak Wylde said, Axl is one smart guy.
The music will make or break the band...and that is such a good thing!

Sorry, but that's wrong.

Give the guy some credit, how many of those would've been asked to headline Rock In Rio 4?



/jarmo

His place is somewhere in between, which isn't a bad place at by any means.

Unfortunately, he's more closely associated with Neil and company merely because of the scene he emerged from, hardly because of his talent

Yeah, the censorship done after the record was finished for the "clean" edit, and the censorship threatened by MTV/radio for "poppies".  That doesnt mean there was any active censorship on the unedited record - Im positive there wasnt any.  Bottom line is, despite any commercial censorship, they still put out the record they wanted to.

To even try to lump Axl in with Jani Lane is laughable...whether Axl releases anyhting or not, the music he did produce had so much more depth then anyone of the hollywood hair scene ever could collectively hope for....as for the topic at hand, I'm with Izzy, if the record company hasn't pushed musical changes on him now (and i've see no credible evidence they have), then they never will...now forcing a release may be another story entirely....

100-000*$20*10 years= $20m  Granted, proably less than a quarter goes to the actual label, but still...


Anyway, do you think Mr Perfectionist is gonna lest someone change the music he's spend a quarter of his life creating?

for anyone of u to even say that axl is in that company u should be fuckin immediately banned from this board and any GNR board

how the fuck can u call yourself a guns n roses fan and say some stupid bullshit like that


falcon are u really a gnr fan? how can u roll your eyes at me sayin axl will change the musical landscape?

why the fuck do u have such a hard on for axl and why do u want him to fail?

i get so sick of cynical, negative fucks on here, it drives me fuckin crazy!

axl is my hero and i will believe in him and his talents, and after cd is released all u negative bashers will have a big shit dog to stuff down your negative throats

some of u dont deserve to like axl as much as u doubt and diss the man

im fuckin out!

I think the label in somewhat maybe causing some problems. Although it's great seeing Axl run the show and doing it his way.

Yead D, They got tons of people wanted to see Axl fail even old band members and people wanna know why Axl is like what he is today.



 

I obviously am, I wouldn't frequent this board if I wasn't.

As for Axl changing any musical landscape, it's highly unlikely.  He hasn't been relevant in at least 11-13 years (depending on your particular point of view) while no one in his band has wrote one piece of relevant music in their entire collective careers.  

Do the math.


I have an objective view of his career and realistic expectations of his future
recordings, or lack there of.


I find blind loyalists goofy...

I don't really think the record label will do anything to spook Axl. He's proven to be a very good ally to have, and pretty much has a religion devoted to himself. He's a proven commodity, and I think the label recognizes this album's potential. If the album comes out and isn't "great" because of something they forced on Axl, they'll feel it for years to come...

Thats why if this album is a masterpiece it will be that much sweeter. ;)

im puttin every negative persons posts down, im gonna copy and paste them and save them in a special place so when CD comes out and these same people jump on the bandwagon, i can pull that shit out and call them on it


i have one question

if u can answer it, ill shut up

what has W Axl Rose ever done to make u doubt him?

is he not one of the greatest frontmen of all time? whether he releases another cd or not that does not in any way shape or form damage the legacy he built as being the wildest,craziest,most entertaining,maniacal,torutured,inspiring frontman of all time

not to mention one of the most diverse,unpredictable and greatest singer lyricist on the planet

to compare that to no talent hacks like bret micheals and vince neil is a fuckin insult! jani lane was actually quite talented so im not gonna bash jani although he isnt on axl's planet

axl will always be one of the top 10 frontmen of all time, and compare his spot to how many years he stuck around and that ratio would  put him at number 1

no one has ever did more in less time than axl rose

when axl drops the greatest cd in the last 15 years all of you will bow down and kiss axl's ass cause he is the greatest front man,vocalist, performer of my lifetime and better than ANY frontman ive ever seen!

i dont give a fuck how much the bullshit critics try to force these other frontmen down my throat and make them the greatest just because

no one in music history is better than axl as a frontman and perfomer in my opinion

and if axl fails ill still always love him and be his biggest fan and i dont give a shit if thats wrong!

Ive been doing that for some time now....cant wait till that album hits, ill have a very special post....

Amen to that

Amen to that as well....

No record of original material in 13 years.

Hardly faith inspiring.


 :yes:

From 94-97ish GNR was a lost band. Between band issues, legal shit etc. Old gnr ended around 97/98...New gnr began in 98/99....as you say do the math ;)

are u serious dude?

no new album in 13 years????? shit they didnt stop tourin till almost 1994, slash quit, then duff quit and matt got fired

do u have any idea how long it must have took axl just finding a new band alone? with the chemistry and talent he was lookin for?

i honestly think the new band has been recording and workin for around 4 and a half years , which is a long time but not as long as alot of u make it out to be

none of axl's members have wrote any masterpieces but they havent wrote any shit music either

also bucket head has proved on his solo records that he can make up some pretty kick ass cool music, now put axl's vocals and lyrics over top of some of that and it would be awesome

axl may have worked on songs but im sure he scrapped anything that slash,duff or matt played on, so im sure in 99 he may have kept some songs he sketched out on piano but id say they started from scratch

i dont know why people want to bash axl, yeah he is always the bad guy, everything is always his fault, slash and co quit, axl didnt fire them so i dont blame axl for that, they were grown men they had a choice

matt sorum confirmed on BTM that the band were pussies basically and afraid, scared to death of axl, if they had stood up to axl maybe none of this would have ever happened

if u dont agree with something but dont speak up its just as much your fault as the other persons

The fact that Axl Rose hasn't had a record of new material under any name/moniker/alias/aka is undisputable and again, less than faith inspiring.

Nice try YG..

You know what is faith inspiring? He is the same guy who brought a band to the top. He is the same guy who brings the best out of his band members. He is the same guy who can write some amazing songs.

Thats what keeps the faith. Hes a guy who did not settle on making another gnr album with a bunch of hired guns. He wants perfection. Thats inspiring in and of itself. He has made this his life.

To critisize his behavior and actions is one thing but to doubt his music ability is pretty dumb. Nice try Falcon

okay D, I'm gonna re-organize your sentences into the 'I agree' bin, and the 'I dont agree' bin, and then you can quote me when CD comes out.  ;)

I agree with:

You said it all, and it's the truth in my eyes, and that's why I waste my time on this msg board.  I dont care if others dont like him, I will always have a love-hate feeling for him.


I dont agree with:

Well I'll be honest and say the VMA's made me doubt him.  I know he's older, but he sounded like a frail, old lady out there.    We can blame it on technical problems, say "the band sounded great", yada yada, but this was his first major comeback, and he didnt sound too hot.  I dont CARE if you dont agree, because that's how I perceived it.

Cancelling shows with no reasons offered also makes me doubt him.  Why cant he be professional?  You can defend him by saying "oh, he did on the UYI tours as well", and I will say yeah, but that only makes him look worse, not better.  That line of defense is the worst.

I'm probably the only one who didnt like his RIR statement in May.  His childish comments about Buckethead should have been private - you dont air your dirty laundry in public like that.  You idolize Axl and hate BH for it.  Me - I dont care either way.  I was never really pro-BH or anti-BH.  

I dont like the ridiculous amount of secrecy in the project. It's a fucking album, it's not national security.  He isnt guarding a nuclear missile for a rogue country.  Sometimes I believe that there are 3 albums, and sometimes I dont.  

And finally, I suspect that he doubts himself more than I do.  You can bitch at me all you want, but in my mind he doesnt release the album and he doesnt do it solo because he doubts himself.   Maybe he surrounds himself with too many 'yes-men' and so he never knows where he stands.  Maybe he doesnt.  Who the fuck knows.

Yes.

1 new Axl song on a soundtrack is all we have to show from Axl in 13 years.

It's sad.

Except for your vmas complaint, you didnt bring up anything musically regarding Axl.

What song did Axl release? If you were referring to  OMG it was a GNR song, not an Axl song. To my knowledge Axl has never made or released anything under his name. Unless Im missing something ???

GNr have given us a sample of excellent songs. And if those arent supposed to be the big guns, then we are surely in  for a very special musical journey.

I've never doubted Axl's songwriting/musical ability during his times of activity.

The mere lack of activity casts a shadow of doubt.  Hell, he's been a professional musician for nearly 20 years and has nothing to show for it (so far) for 13 of those years.

Now that's pretty dumb..

Semantics..

What don't you understand about 1 tune in 13 years?

let me ask u a question falcon

how can u record a cd without a band?


he didnt have a set in stone band till 99, so he couldnt start recording till then

plus lets see he had a few friends die, his mother died im sure that fucked him up pretty good


axl, his voice at times did seem a little overtly screechy

but if u listen to his jungle scream opening the VMAS and his live and let die, kohd screams he still has it
i think he was singin so he wouldnt fuck his throat up for the studio

thats myopinion

I dont think you read the original question, younggunner.

The question was:  "what has W Axl Rose ever done to make u doubt him?"

A lot of things as I pointed out earlier.  Furthermore, unprofessional behavior on a stadium tour counts in the musical bin.  Unprecedented secrecy regarding the album is also musically-related.

I didnt mention his wife-beating incidents and all that shit because that's not musical.  It's his personal life.  If he wants to make Stephanie poop in a litter pan, that's his problem.  

Um has Axl been inactive during this new era of gnr? You mean to tell me he really hasnt been in a studio in the wee hours of the night  over a long period of time? So if hes out of the spotlight hes inactive artistically?
Lets break it down.....

Begin at 1994. Your band is the biggest in the world. Instant success, etc. The band began to have musical differences and philosophies during that time. Even if they stayed together they wouldnt have released an album until anywhere from 97-2000.

From 94-98, old gnr was in disarray. Lawsuits and musical and philisophical differences.  That is lost time in gnr land.

That brings us to 1999-present. 2004-1999 is 5 yrs. FOr the past 5 yrs the new lineup has been working on CD and follow ups.

Its sad not dumb. Its sad that such a talented band ended quickly. But hopefully this new band will continue the legacy of gnr in thier own way. And hopefully 20 yrs from now peopel will say gnr had 2 great eras of great music. And crazy guy named axl rose involved with both.

Well, that's the hope we all have.  But that doesnt mean we cant doubt him like rational human beings.  I do believe I'm as big an Axl fan as you are with the exception that I dont praise every little action of his as something a genius would do.  Some of you on this board do just that.  As Falcon said, it's pretty goofy. 'night.

Welcome to the jungle...or welcome to rock n roll.....

Although i dont condone or think what Axl did in regards to his personal life with women "badass" I dont think we need to point it out. If thats teh case we need to point out all the shit old gnr did back in the day. They were not your clean cut band. Lets not forget that.

As for the concerts and stuff. Its cool. Hey if you dont liek waiting at concerts for him to show up, dont go. Axl does things his way. You have the power to choose what you will and wont tolerate.

I agree 100%.

Like the guy said on "Behind The Music", Axl's fight to make GNR relavent with todays musical climate has taken so long with the pursuit of the mythical perfect masterpiece that whatever was relevant at that particular time has come and gone, leaving Axl back at the proverbial drawing board.

If the songs on CD are timeless, then that whole argument goes out the window.....4 yrs have past and im still listening to the new gnr songs. All of them. day in and day out. And each time they give me a chill or some kind of an emotion.

Of course not.  

There's just not much in the way of new material to judge his artistic merits
and if indeed that time away from the spotlight was well spent creatively.

That's cool.

Unfortunately, those same songs that bring you "some kind of emotion" on a daily basis inspire only one emotion in me.

Indifference.

Off couse, it's just different tastes, but I can still listen the new songs a lot and still loving them... you must agree that, if they are really b-sides, sure CD will be great.

Look I wasn't lumping Axl into that category with Brett Michaels, I'm just saying the record industry and I'm sure the upper echelons of Geffen don't hold Axl in such high esteem as you do after 10 years of waiting for an album. Regardless of of your opinion of his writing ablility, things like the VMA's and the Concert No-shows tarnish his name. Also with the success of VR until he proves he can do it alone I think he loses alittle of his "most talented member" status in the General public. And after all it is the general public that make the difference in record sales, there are 5-6 major GnR boards like this, each one has about 3000 members (which alot of are cross board members) so thats like 10,000 fans. Those 10,000 fans aren't going to make Geffen money by fawning over Axl changing the musical landscape. That is why Geffen can and will do everything to make this CD as commercially successfull as they can. You can argue that Axl isn't going to let anyone mold his vision, but they can refuse to release an album full of 10 minute Epics. Then where is Axl?

Before he can break down walls musically, which I think he can and eventually will, he needs to become a Rock Star again. That was my point...... the fans and industry heads have to look at Axl like the biggest thing on Earth and right now they don't. I think it would be in his best interest to get CD out as fast as he can and make sure it is filled more with Radio freindly Rock songs than 10 minute Epics....he needs another WTTG or SCOM not a November Rain or Estranged. Even if he releases an 8 track EP of rockers then tours into the release of "CD" He needs his name back out there with a postitive spin before he releases a big record, right now everyone thinks of the bad VMA show, no shows, and lawsuits.

WHo said all GNR are doing are just epics? Last I looked the new songs are all short, except for Maddy and that isnt even that long....Im sure there will be 1 maybe 2 epics but other than that they will be regular songs...And I hate to tell ya but Axl is not going to sacrafice anything on this album.....

Axl has said a zzillion times that the first album will be more of a rock album, and that the other albums will begin to take us into a musical journey. SO I think hes aware of what they have to do.

Tommy has said that the album will have a few anthem type songs, a few ballads, pop and whatver else....SO I think the first album will be a regular album....
Im really not sure where you are coming up with this 10 minute epic stuff.....

I completely disagree. They dont have to release an EP. All they have to do is finish the album, plan everything out and just release the single/video and begin the promotional blitz.

The key with GNR is getting this whole thing goin. Once that happens and the music is out there to be judged everything else will take care of itself. If the music is good then more positive things will come if not then as Tommy says...it will be a flop....

And btw the VMA show wasnt bad. It wasnt Axls best vocal performace but overall it was a kickass performance from the band and Axl.

I suppose it's all opinion based, but that was just painful to watch, the band was great, Axl was horrible. He was great durring the European shows just before and in the US shows after, but the VMA performance was unwatchable.


All the label has to say is take it back and fix it, we want (fill in the blank)..........
If he wants it to come out, the label is going to have to love it at this point.

We have heard 5 songs, but from what we have been told (rumored) songs like The General, This I Love, and CITR are all "Epics" and I would throw Madagascar and the Blues in the Longer Ballad category that doesn't do too well on the radio (for the most part)  


Is he?? For someone who is so aware of what to do he has been doing everything wrong an awful lot. If by "knows what to do" to piss his career away......then you are right.


I didn't specificly mean he has to release an E.P. first, but to sell an album that doesn't have more than just 1 or 2 strong radio singles....he has to have a name that the general public trusts........and right now they don't, and why should they. What has he shown the record buying public in the last 10 years other than failure after failure?? I don't want you to parrot back the argument that it Slash left in 96' and Duff left in 97' and Matt was fired......... In the long run that was all his fault. I also don't want to hear about how long it took him to put together a line up, because he chased half of the new members away also. It doesn't take ten years to write an album, and it doesn't take 6 years (98-04) to bulid a new band then write an album.

Relax dude it wasnt horrible and it was very watchable. Yes your right Axl wasnt his best that night. The opening howl of JUngle, all of Maddy and some parts of PC were his bright spots. It certainly wasnt unwatchable though....
The band was great and they were ferocious with the PC jam.

Just because they are said to be "epic" songs doesnt make it a 10 minute song. The people could say its so good because it has an epic feel to it.

We know absolutely nothing about the rumored songs so dont act like you know what type of songs they are.

The blues is a regular ballad type song. And MAddy is liek 6 min long. We all know they arent hit singles. Thats why we have heard them already....

How do you know they dont have 4 or more single type songs on the album?

Nothing other than a botched tour.....When the music comes out thats when we decide whether this band is a failure or not.....

Oh really? I wasnt aware everything is Axls fault. But if you say so ill play along....

He chased half the new members away? Lets see Bucket,RObin, Fortus, Brain,Tommy,dizzy, and Pittman...Thats 7 band members. 1 has left....Someone needs to go back to school??? And MR Bucket might come back...ya never know ;)

Says who?
Who are you to say how long it should take for some1 to take to make an album. Im glad you have acknowledged the fact that the new band began in 98. Like you said 6 yrs. And in that 6 yrs they have made 3 albums that they believe are to be as good as they possibly can be. Meaning in that 6 yrs they have invested their life in making as best of an album as possible.

Axl kept the name. With that comes responsibilities from a musical standpoint. He could have easily made a few new gnr albums by now with a shitload of playes. Instead he made sure it was a total band effort. And when that band formed they then began to make music that they hope will make some kind of an impact.

This album and band is a much highly anticpated project. You just dont release an album because  some1 says an album should only take "x" amount of time. There are album that have taken a shitload of time and albums that were done in 2 seconds....

Yea the wait sux, but atleast I know that at the end of the day, no matter how successful or bad this band will do, I know they put everything they had into this. And as a fan thats all I can ask for.

Yea you could be a lil bitch and complain and whine, and tell peopel how long it should really take, etec etc, but when its all said and done a fan could only ask and hope for a maximum effort....And as a fan of this band I know we have gotten that....

Josh Freese, Buckethead (supposedly multiple times), Robin (left out of frustration and came back), Paul Tobias (where'd he go, no mention of the man that saved GnR in quite some time)............Plus I'm willing to bet that Brain isn't far behind Bucket.

Sorry to throw that ten minute mark out there, but my point is an album of Estranged and Coma's isn't going to make the label any money and isn't going to raise the General Publics opinion of the band.

Until an album comes out they are a failure......every day that CD isn't on store shelves, is another day Axl wasted

You tell me I don't know what I'm talking about when I mention new songs we haven't heard, and you are trying to tell me that they have made 3 albums??
Funny I don't see three albums. As of right now there are no albums until he releases something and proves he has been doing something over the last 6 years.

I'm an asshole for critisizing a worldwide televison performance that 85% of people tend to agree with me on, but you are obviously not "Retarded" for blindly praising an album (or three like you say) that hasn't and shows no sign of ever being released.

JOsh was involved with the band in the very beginning stages. He has stated numerous times that he left because he knew that Axl was going to take a long time in doing this whole GNR thing. In fact, he has nothing but good things to say about working with Axl and the band....
Robin is here, thats all that matters.
And Brian isnt going anywhere...

As for Tobias. Um, he was really never in the band.
"...Now whether or not Paul was going to be officially on the album or on the tour that really wasn?t an actual consideration at the time. It was in the air as a possibility but Paul was a friend trying to help us and he had a huge respect for Slash..."
Again, who said that CD will be an album of Coma's?
Yes because it has come directly from Axls mouth. Im not saying they have 3 completed albums. All Im saying is that they have worked on a variety of material that will be put into several albums.

I know because they have been doing nothing over the past 6 yrs  :confused:

In GNR I trust  : ok:

I doubt Geffen is going to keep GnR from releasing the album they want. Guns N Roses has made probably close to a billion dollars in worldwide sales for Geffen, and they've never been kept from releasing the albums they want to release before, why would they now?  It just doesn't make sense.  This album, provided it is a good album, will sell at least a two or three mil in the US and the same overseas, GnR has such a huge and loyal fanbase that unless the album is bad, it's going to sell a lot of copies.  I don't see, given Geffen's track record with GnR, the censoring or prevention of releasing the album Axl wants to release.

That's very true. It would be nice to see one or two on CD, those long tracks, are unfriendly for radio and unfriendly for TV.

Some of you act as if Axl is sworn by blood to release stuff. It's his life, if he wants to take 5 years for an album (which is what it has really been, not no 13 years).  He's not a bad person just because he hasn't released the album. Just be patient, we'll hear it when Axl wants us to. There's no use in bashing him, because if the album came out tomorrow, you'd be lining up to suck him off.

So, whose side are you on? The artists and their arts or the record company and its shareholders?

Right now I'm on my side, and I want an album.

but you have to understand that the music industry is a business, Geffen isn't paying Axl 13 million dollars to fund Chinese Democracy so he can feel fufilled by sharing his vision with the world. They gave him 13 million dollars in hopes of making 10 times that back over time. After a while Geffen has to insure that they are going to get their money. Do I think it's right?? Do I want to see Axl put something out that his heart isn't into?? No and No, but the point of my original post was to point out that Geffen has the right to expect Chinese Democracy is going to make them money. And if they don't like what they hear from the "CD" sessions, they can make demands that the material be fixed to their liking... does Axl have to comply?? No, but that will just further delay the release and possibly cause a contract dispute and settlement of the 13 million.

Radio friendly, well Madagascar and The Blues have zero bad language in, so I guess they qualify  : ok:

Oh, animated gif, woman on bench with her boobs on show:
http://www.truecolor.741.com/00/SUDEKI.HTML
see near bottom of screen  : ok:

Radio freindly doesn't mean just "clean" lyrics. It is also the format and length of the song.

Also what is the deal with this pain in the ass website spamming campaign you've been on lately

'Chinese Democracy', 'The Blues', and 'Madagascar' are all radio-friendly, except the part where he says "This whole thing is fucked up." in the speech-section. I think all three would be huge hits...

Hey, forget about radio friendly.  I?d love to hear real epics.  :DIf you see Top 2 of best selling artist of all the time, you?ll be surprised; (hints *British*). And it?s the only way to be distinct successor of them today. I think real epics will sell like hell, for sure; cause that is what today?s rock music misses. And who is the only ones who can make them now?  :smoking: