Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Post your comments about the show here.

July 4th @ 12:00 pm ET
July 5th @ 12:30 pm ET 10:00 pm ET
July 6th @ 12:00 am ET 11:00 am ET 07:00 pm ET 11:00 pm ET
July 7th @ 09:00 pm ET
July 9th @ 01:00 am ET




/jarmo

Well, BTM is on in 30 minutes.  I have my tivo setup and my lunch out of the way.  Unfortunately I leave at 1PM to go camping so I won't be able to post anything new that might come upon the show.  

So if you watch the show, and there is any new info, post it here to give those less fortunate (i.e. not getting the show today) any info as soon as it is available.

I am personally hoping that the delay was caused by Axl in some way because he wanted to get some news out and thought that the BTM was a good, quick way of doing that.  Of course, there is less than a 1% chance of that happening.  :(

Enjoy!

-TyRod-

I watching it right now, so far so good.  I kept predicting diaster, but so far it's well done.  They packed a lot into the first 9 minutes.  it's on commercial right now.  I'll keep you posted.  I suggets everyone watch it from the begining.

Well, first comment of this thread. In the first segment Slash says that he and Steven started GNR and then they got Axl and Izzy, and finally they got Duff. I really didn't know that.

we are 30 minutes in and there has been only one mention of izzy stradlin. This portrayl is one sided and not very informative.

slash blames axl for the pianos, back up singers, and horns even though it was slash's idea.

Fooking hell!!!  Assumed it was on at midnight to premiere tomorrow...C'est la Vie....We'll have to wait

i guess izzy was only a minor part of the band b/c they mention him only twice.

Thanks for posting - I would have missed it - awesome so far.... a tinge dramatic

For those wondering.......No Chinese Democracy commercial as of yet either!!!  :hihi:

My God! What a fuckin bash fest on Axl!!! >:

I missed the first 1/2 hr, but I'll catch the rest of it tonight.  It's extremely cool to see a new Guns show though.

Chinese Democracy slated for release in Nov 2004 - according to VH1!!!!

VH1 JUST ANNOUNCED CD WILL BE RELEASED NOV 2004!!!!!


God I hope that's true!!

"Axl Rose's new album, Chinese Democracy, is finally slated for release in November of 2004"

That's pretty much the quote.

-darknemus

According to the narrator, Chinese Democracy is finally slated for a November 2004 release.

take it for what its worth

Woah.

They just said:
"Axl's new album is finally slated for release in November of 2004."

wow, huge news. Unbelievable.

Well worth the hour long crap fest.

i wonder if thats true?

axl said there would be an announcement in a few months


could that have been it?


im fuckin excited!

great show all things considered!

they had a wicked cool still frame of axl and robin, anyone else catch that?

Well, the show doesn't officially premiere until tomorrow.  Maybe that's when the announcement is planned.   Or Tuesday, hopefully Axl is taking Monday off.

Yeah I caught the still of Axl and Robin!! Fuckin Cool..

Dude I had goosebumps the whole freaking show. Finally a music network covers the greatest band ever in the world. Fucking good quick hour.

November 2004 I jumped up and screamed "Fuck Yeah!!!" Great fireworks for the 4th of July.

Show just finished.

Overall it was a real cool show. It wassnt one sided or anything like that. The first half of the show was really cool. The only negativity that came with Axl was about how the illusion tour got bloated.

The last 10 minutes discussed vr/gnr.
Nothin bad there either.

Then they were saying how Vr just cam eout and that CD is slated for November 2004. I swear to God I jumped out of my seat. It was so cool. Who knows where they got that from but it has to be some sort of concrete date. They wouldnt throw out a rumored date. SO I have to believe they got it from GNr Management.

It was a real cool show.Cool pics and footage. The footage of new gnr was real cool to. The opening was really put together nice with new gnr and old gnr.

Overall excellent show and not much bullshit.

The obivious talk of the show now is the November release date.

If that holds true then we can expect a single by October.
But who knows...we know a lot can change from now till then

The only new thing I learned from the show was that I never new SLash basically died and he was revived. Other than that there was nothing we dont already know regarding gnr in the show.....im sure it will do killer ratings when it officially premieres...peace

They said it is slated for release in November 2002.  It must be true because otherwise they wouldn't do that.  We'll see.


Overall, it was a decent show.  They did it the bets they could with what they had.  We all wanted more, but I can't complain.

It didn't really bash Axl that bad. Nothing overly negative.  if anything, Axl was highly praised throughout.

Just watched it, missed the begining. Well done. I have to say I was impressed. It was sad to watch though. Should have been longer. They only scrached the surface. Glad I watched it.

Out of curiosity, where did you find this information?

I recommend watching BTM.

All I can say is  :o

Lol @ Slash.  He was hysterical in it.

On a side note, did anyone laugh too at the Partridge family look alike and Wonderwoman commercials? :rofl:

I personally didn't think this show was done poorly at all.  I taped it for part of my GN'R time capsule.

And November 2004 is  :smoking:

It was OK.  It had exactly the problems I assumed it would have (very one sided, painted Axl to be the asshole and the entire reason for everything bad that's ever happened to GnR...hell, they even blamed him for the drinking...Gilby saying that because he was late to gigs, they'd be drunk before he showed up) but it had some interesting tidbits.

I find it amusing they started the story with Slash and Steven's band, rather than the more commonly circulated story that begins with Izzy and Axl in Indiana, and Hollywood Rose.

I think it's sad they don't even MENTION Dizzy Reed as being a member of the band.  That's complete shit if you ask me.  

I like one quote from Slash, and I think it pretty much portrays Axl the way I thought he was:

"Take everything complicated or difficult about Axl, and that's exactly why he's a brilliant musician".

I think the November announcement is, quite possibly, the biggest thing to come out of the show.  Hopefully, it's legit and not just a "rumor".

All in all, I'm VERY glad I caught it.  I actually didn't even know it was on until I surfing the channel guide about 11:55.  Man, it sure did make me nostalgic for the old days, though.  I remember all that stuff when it was happening......

Kind of what I expected although I' would have liked to have seen more of the new band...

The best line of the show was Sorum's salvo:

"I thought I'd signed up for this bad ass rock n roll band...what's with the piano?"

Exactly my sentiments Matt.

Well said.

Holy shit, they just stated that CD will be out in November.  They actually stated that.  Holy shit.  That was cool.  

-TyRod-

I won't believe it til the November date comes straight from the label AND someone in GnR's camp (either Axl or Sanctuary)...but here's hoping it's legit.  It's the closest thing to an official date I think we've EVER gotten.

Hey man did anyone laugh their ass off when RObert John made fun of Slash when a cigarette fell in between his pants  :rofl:

I laughed pretty hard on that... it was great.

The show was awesome and I loved it, I want to record it. I looked on VH1 and it is looped heavily.

I wish Axl was in it, but that is a cold day in hell.

I found it interesting that Matt said "Axl is like,the greatest frontman ever" even though he said Scott was the most talented frontman he has ever worked with.


It was a great program.It really showed off how bizarre Axl's mind really was back in the day.

I'm not really taking that "slated for 2004" thing seriously.The word "slated" to me means they are just pushing for a November release.....well they were also pushing for a release in 1999,2000,2001,and 2003.Why should we take this anymore seriously?

No where.  It was Axl's idea obviously.  Can you honestly see Slash saying "man a piano, an orchestra and some girls singing backup vocals would be cool?"

No, but that is so Axl.

That show was great.  Glad I have it tivies.  I bet we get an official announcement Tuesday or wednesday.  Well this is the most optomistioc I have been since 2002.

-TyRod-

And I believe they read it on the Internet, however I wish you were right.

A superb chronicle I thought.  It wasn't biased or derogatory towards any member.  For every mention of Axl's "iron fist", there is a mention of Slash's, Duff's, and Steven's substance abuse problems.  The show overall portrayed an equal responsibility for the implosion of the original lineup.

I was glad that there was no real mud-slinging between the band members on the show, despite a few comments by Matt Sorum leaning towards such (the "what the fuck are you doing with this fucking orchestra" comments).  Slash even made it a point to say that Axl's volatility is what made him such a great songwriter and performer.

I was disappointed that Izzy wasn't mentioned much, given the fact that he wrote a lot of the lyrics that Axl sang, and VH-1 stated early on that the lyrics were "Axl's lyrics", when he actually only wrote half the lyrics on AFD.

I was glad to see Steven Adler given a chance to speak on the band that he co-founded, as opposed to most accounts of GNR history which ignore the fact that he was the original drummer and portray Matt Sorum as GNR's drummer.

Steven's comments about his post-GNR suicidal depression were particularly harrowing.  Steven looked really good and he sounded a lot better than he has since his stroke.  Though I'm sure we'll have the stupid "Fuck that lousy addict Adler" crowd ranting about him.  I was disappointed VH-1 didn't mention his band though, when talking about the ex-Gunners current projects at the end of the show.  They could've also mentioned the fact that Izzy still records and releases music despite not being in the public eye.

I was surprised that Dizzy Reed was not mentioned at all, despite being shown in a few photos.

I am sure we'll have the typical "Slash is a liar" crowd somehow managing to find that Slash is "blaming Axl" or "the show blames Axl" or some other shit that doesn't exist, and I am sure we'll have the "Fuck Axl Rose" crowd which will deemphasize the other members' drug problems in favor of placing the entire blame on Axl, but the reality is that the show was far from one-sided.

My biggest criticism of the show is they didn't focus enough on the music.  The band's lifesyle -- while important to touch upon -- took precedent over the music, which I guess summarizes Guns N Roses' destruction.  But I do feel VH-1 could've covered the impact of the songs a bit more.

As far as Chinese Democracy being released in November....all I shall say is we'll see.

Overall though, a really good show with some great archive clips/interviews and concert footage.


No no no, Slash said that's where Guns N Roses started for him.

Great Great show, I loved it... very nice.

I wish it had all the members in it! It isn't like they would have to be in the same room. I knew Axl Rose would be in there... but I thought that Izzy might of been.

If I could have added anyone to the show I would want Duff in there big time. I thought that they should of had more Slash.

Slash told it the way it was basically, so all you Axl guys can stick it.

Did anyone else think that Adler sounded like a idiot? I guess that stroke messed him up. I think that the drugs just messed up his face, and personality probably.

I wish they would of focused more on 93-00 era more... I know not a lot happened but I think it would of been fun to have more of that.

"That is the sound of the band breaking up." Slash on Sympathy for the Devil

It did seem one sided a lot, but the show was sad to watch and it got me excited!!!!!!!!

ROCK on! worth the delay!

Yeah, I read an Axl interview from 2000 or so where he mentioned that.  He said something to the effect of, You remember that movie Pulp Fiction?  Slash had to get a shot in his heart to revive him, just like in that movie.


No, he doesn't sound like an idiot, he sounds like a guy who had a stroke.  That's what a stroke does to a person, it paralyzes facial muscles (usually on one side).  My grandfather had a stroke.  Steven is actually speaking quite well for a stroke sufferer; being young and determined have helped him immeasurably in recovering.

And the stroke does not affect the personality at all.  Steven's personality is fine, he just is limited in vocally expressing himself due to the stroke.

VH1 was again awesome!

I don't know if anyone in the UK saw it yet but it is great.

I'm sure it got some sick ass reviews and ratings. It deserves... well offically they screwed over a reunion. You people heard it for yourselves..." we're very far from that" Slash

The only person willing to do it is Steven Adler and he's the broken piece from the band.

I believe this show is legitimate with CD's release date.

I mean the show is very fresh and they would know more then us... we guess and hope they know. I'm sure they contacted Axl on the show and he obviously declined. As well did Duff, Izzy.

My favorite parts were the first 10 minutes and last 10, even though the show was fantastic!!!!

Chinese Democracy starts now...

"By the time he showed up....we were hammered"  I was laughing my ass off! It did make me miss the old guys. What a glorious mess they were..in all forms and phases. What is striking still is everyone's reluctance to confront Axl. They are simply scared of him. Even Robert John when talking about Axl and Erin shys away from saying anything too bad..."that's all I"ll say about that"..like Axl is going to hunt him down and gut him on the set. Izzy is the only one whoever really stood up to Axl and ultimately, you have to respect him for that.

No, he didnt.  He said Scott Weiland is the best frontman today.


Behind The Music  ;)

I also dont take the slated date seriously.  Weve heard similar projected dates straight from Axl himself...and nothing.  Even with an official release date, Ill reseve excitement until the CD is physically available.

Fucking bollocks

Guns N Roses was Axl Rose and Tracii Guns - there was a Guns N Roses BEFORE Slash - he joined when Tracii quit

As I said before, that dude took Slash's comment out of context.  Slash said that he and Steven were in a band, and that where Guns N Roses started for him.  He didn't say that he and Steven started the entity known as Guns N Roses period.

I thought the GN'R Behind The Music was very accurate as far as their lifestyles were concerned, but it neglected their music and other positive aspects. I was also disappointed that half of the bandmembers didn't participate. I didn't like the demonizing of Axl. It's like everything was his fault, and no one else was to blame. That was unfair in my opinion. The whole thing struck a negative chord.

A lot of it was Axl's fault.... sorry man.

Behind the Music means they don't concentrate on the musical part of it man. Perfect show.

The one thing that ticked me off was the "One in A Million" mention.  Slash's comment was dishonest.  He understood the song and what it meant/why Axl wrote it etc and then he says "I had a proble with to ebcause I'm half black etc".  Someone find his comments on the song at the time

Well from my knowlege, he has always said that - even at the time.  I haven't got sources i can link you to, but i know i have read that a couple of times.

When Axl first came up with 'One in a Million' and really wanted to do it, I said that I didn't think it was very cool.  But Axl is adament about expressing himself and he's got his reasons....I don't really regret doing the song 'One in a Million', I just regret what we've been through because of it.

---Slash, Rolling Stone, January 1991

i really felt bad for steven adler, the way vh1 showed him made him look really pathetic


it was basically a 2 hour show crammed into 1 hour, we got no back story on any of the bandmembers lives, no history on why axl is so fucked up etc


Matt sorum is still a tool
what an ungrateful fuck
"i thought i was signin up for a kick ass rock band and was like whats with the piano

Matt wouldnt be shit without Axl lettin him in the band and he just pissed me off

made the band look like a bunch of pussies

"id go to confront axl and id look and the rest of the band ran the other way"

they had a choice they signed the name away, axl sensed the tension and outsmarted the band

slash sayin most people think the new lineup is sac religious i liked that

and it really made new gnr look bad in myopinion

Ya ive never liked Matt..hes one of those people that should get his ass kicked for havin a big mouth...but this is awsome chinese Democracy in November

on another note slash didnt rule out a reunion

he said they'd have to get some say and some respect which isnt out of the question

he said we are far away from that point so i dont see it in the forseeable future

but he didnt say never!

Yeah right on D, again we agree like on everything man.

Matt Sorum needs to be served man...

He is so bitchy. He does run his mouth a lot.

Sac Religous= What Slash said right on Slash!!!

Yeah Adler did act like a fuck off.... that's what I was saying before Izzy jumped on me...

Both wrong.

See, that is what pisses me off about Slash. He just doesn't have any fucking credibility. Either the guy is the most compulsive liar or he's a forgetful fuck.

It was Slash's idea to bring the orchestra and background volcalist along for the 1992 tour, not Axl.

The quote ( for those needing proof of evidence) can be found either at  "Guns N' Roses In their own words" by Mark Putterford or at the MTV GNR/Metallica Rockumentary in 1992. If I find the freaking book, I'll post the quote.

yeah... Axl is why they drank so much  ::)
i take it like a joke... a pretty good one, too
but its not the first time I've heard that 'angle'...
(Slash once spoke about the pressure of dealing with Axl as making him suicidal)

and about Road Crew being the beginning of GN'R....
puh-leese..... Hollywood Rose=The Roots of Guns N' Roses.  :yes:  : ok:
If Steven said he started GN'R (with Slash) he'd be a laughing stock

and did anyone else thing Steven was going to cry?
shit... I'll take Steven over Matt anyday!

Matt:"I was like 'whats with the piano...? Its a rock band'"
Me:  Matt, shut the fuck up!
Matt=Additional Musician  :hihi:

About Dizzy - I was so pissed I almost cried!  What the fuck was up with that?!  :no:
VH1 needs to make an apology/correction statement at least on their site.

And yeah that was a kick ass quote from Slash.  : ok:

Yeah!  That was fuckin funny shit!   :hihi:

Matt: "What's up with the piano? It's a rock band"

Why did you accept the job then? I guess $500,000 and the possibility of taking the drum seat in GNR looked to good to be true.

It's just too easy now 10 years later to say things like that.

On a side note. Matt licks Axl balls on the making off November Rain anyway. Why didn't he say something about the piano then???

Ahhh!
you are right.  :D
Thank you for clearing that up.
so okay then... I take back what I said  :-[
hehe

come to think of it...  i like what you said also about Steven getting his 'props'. : ok:

 ???  ::)
stick what?
Slash/Stevn/Izzy/Duff were raging alocoholics and junkies.
thats what were supposed to 'stick'?

There's a difference between what the original poster said and what the reply says, isn't there?

Short time around Nov '04 I bet anything CD is coming out. My stupid Digital CD guide is a liar cought Gn'R by chance.

 :yes:

and the other post about how he makes the rest of the band out to be wusses is dead on....

how he said he'd be like 'come on... lets go talk to him' and then he'd look behind him and they were gone was funny....
reminded me of Eminem's "my band"  :hihi:

The show had a few really cool shots of Axl from the 2002 tour...
one really stuck out to me
i don't think I've seen it
I want this on dvd so i cant get some screenshots/stills  : ok:

Slash was literaly / physically propped up for phot shoots.  they said how someone would be behind him holding him from behind!  ;D

Guns N' Roses... "The Most Dangerous Band In the World"

yeah right :hihi:
they could barely stand up  :rofl:

Overall kinda felt very Cliffs-Notes version of GNR.  Maybe they needed 2hrs.

Pros:
Lots of never before seen(at least by me) footage of the band backstage, in hotels, airports,meetings, ST. Louis riot etc.

Nov 2004!  If that pans out that would be wonderful.

Slash saying axl's comments at the stones' show made him really hate him.  That was new.  Never heard him admit actual hate before.

Cons:
Skipped huge portions of time

Focused on stuff thats been beaten to death already

Axl's difficult?  Ya dont say!  been there done that

No real meaty details of departures of izzy,slash & co

Overall could have been better.  But I'll take any GNR on TV over none any day.

Hello, well you are quite the little quoter aren't you? No harm but Axl Rose was the ego of Gn'R and the mind... he wasn't as screwed up as them all, but he ran the show, and well he ended it.

Pretty much what I expected, which is to say, not much: mostly blaming Axl for everything tht went wrong during and after UYI. I really think people like Gilby and Matt should shut their fucking traps. Axl gives you guys jobs in the biggest band in the world (and alot of money along with that)at the time and now, all you can possibly do fucking do is trash everything about that era? Also blaming Axl for everyone's substance abuse problems is pretty lame ( He forced me to be an alcoholic because he showed up late to shows?).
Plus side, the Nov. mention, and the fact that ultimately, they said not even VR would overcome the shadow of the original band.

i'm sorry... I don't follow  ???
Axl was the ego of GN'R...
and the mind..?
huh?

he ran the show... well, um... and if he hadn't who would have?  
those guys were not in any condition to handle their own affairs, much less to handle the band's direction.  Ex:  If it was up to them we wouldn't have November Rain!  or Estranged  :nervous:

Axl ended it?   I disagree... but, hey this is another topic so if you want to make a new thread in Dead Horse we can discuss it there.

back on topic... that really was a wierd was a really wierd comment from Slash about hating Axl  for calling him out at the stones' show.  I mean... um... I don't get it. ? ? ?

I actually have a higher opinion of Axl from the BTM. Even though he wasn't there to defend himself, I could see his point of view based on what the other guys were saying. Like Matt's "Uh, what's with the piano?" statement... yeah, not like November Rain and Estranged are almost always in the top 3 songs of any gnr fan's list. What input did Matt have in the creative side of GNR anyway...

It also kinda made me sad seeing all the camarederie they all had back in the days. Even the behind the scenes footage when they came back from the UYI tour showed that all the guys (including Axl) seemed to be in good spirits and were getting along.

I used to subscribe to the "control-freak" characterization of Axl but after watching BTM it seems like I'm more on his side simply because of all the lame potshots people were taking at him, also watching all the clips of his awesome past performances, and it was clearly obvious he and maybe Izzy were the only level-headed guys in the band that weren't messing up their brains on drugs all the time. I did think having a horn section was a little overdoing it, but "what's with the piano?"... gimme a break. The Stones' Exile on Main street has tons of instrumentation on it besides guitar/drum/bass and it's one of the greatest albums I've ever heard. Yeah I'm on the axl bandwagon now...
NOVEMBER 2004!!!!!

Well said.. he wasnt complaining when songs like November Rain were making him a mint.

The bitching about the piano and the extras is just more self promotion for the fact that VR are the total opposite.

Yeah,that's what it reminded me of also.I think Matt is a liar and a pussy,he wasn't even a real band member,I mean he was the replacement.Matt always had a big mouth,someone should shut it for him.

Anyway,I think the show was great.I also hope that cd comes in Nov.like they said,guess we'll have to wait and see, :peace: :beer: :smoking:

well slash would lead y ou to believe the horn section was Axls idea by his bashing, but it was infact slashs idea to have them and the back up singers on tour

The ole keyboards argument.  Yeah, there is a lot of badass music with piano in it out there.  Sorum is a moron and perhaps the luckiest drummer in the world.  

So, I didn't get to see this, I don't have VH1, what performance clips did they show?  Any early stuff?

Im in Australia so havent seen BTM.. maybe someone can help me:

In what context did they say it would be released in November? Who said it? Did they say how they knew?

How would the makers of BTM know anyway?

It does make sense that BTM was pushed back and back until they could give a release time, but again, how would they know? If Axl didnt support the show, he's not going to leak the date to them is he?

Jarmo posted a link in the Appetite For Colletion section so youze can all download the BTM show:

http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?board=6;action=display;threadid=13611

I've always heard this as well but for the sake of clarification, does anyone have documentation it was in fact Slash's idea?

Hell, as wasted as Slash always seemed to be, maybe he just doesn't remember he was indeed the culprit if in fact he was.

Im at work right now, but im fairly certain there is a quote about it in the Axl-bashing Over The Top book.

I had always thought that it was Steven that Axl was referring to when he said that.  :confused:
But since Slash admits that it was him that Axl was talking about then I'll never forgive Axl for calling him out, too!!! :rant:   Slash would've been dead years ago and we wouldn't have to listen to all his bullshit lies and whining if Axl didn't force him to quit using.  :rant:

I thought he was talking about all of them, they were all using heroin at that time, I believe.  I'm sure it was embarrassing though, to have their dirty laundry aired on stage.  Then again, considering the addictive personality that Slash obviously is, addicts hate being called on their addiction.

Wait, i'm confused. i live in nyc, i thought the show was on tonight at midnight???


it came on at noon???

in 1990 did you really expect illusions to sound like they did, my guess is no. Matt Sorum can say whatever he wants, because Matt Sorum saved there ass in 90

duff's brother matt Mackagon was in the horn section, i would think he and the rest of the musicians had some hand in getting them there.

Matt Sorum is not responsible for saving their asses.

Matt Sorum should be grateful, instead of bitching about GN'R having a piano! That piano made him a mint.

Duff's brother is a chick?!  :o

The horn section we are referring to is the one used during the 92 leg of the UYI tour, the 976 horn section, which consisted of 3 chicks!

yeah matt wrote november rain,estranged,dont cry,coma,you could be mine,

matt played drums

drummers are replaceable!

they couldve got a session musician to play drums

the drums dont make uyi's sorry!

matts a good drummer but just like his braggin about the cocaine he sniffed
who gives a fuck!

and thats real considerate 2 scott

the last thing a dude recovering needs is someone fuckin talkin about it like matt

i bet scott could taste the cocaine after listening to matts dumb ass

Yes, it did appear that way, and it understandable given his circumstance.  We can debate for ages whether or not Steven was justly fired from GNR, but the fact remains that Steven feels he was betrayed and abandoned by the people who were his family and friends.  Just as he said...

I did everything I possibly could to try and kill myself.  I had nothing to live for.  Everybody who knew me that I thought were my friends did everything they could to take everything away from me.



Slash didn't elaborate as much as he should've on the "I hated Axl for that" issue.  According to past interviews, what Slash hated about that was that Axl called attention to it on stage, in front of an audience.



Okay, your opinion was blatantly biased towards an instinctive Axl defense to start with, and now you're flagrantly misquoting people.  Nobody blamed Axl for their alcohol problems.  Gilby stated (and with a laugh) that he would often be inebriated on stage, because he'd keep having martinis until Axl showed up.  Granted, the implication that Axl should be on time was there, but the fact that Gilby laughed when he said it indicated he meant it more in facetious context than anything.  He never exclaimed, "Axl forced me to be an alcoholic because he showed up late!  That bastard!"

It's always humorous how everybody always accused me of being biased towards the ex-Gunners, when we have posters like this who are pre-dispositioned to "protect Axl's ass" at all costs, even if it means outlandishly distorting what an ex-Gunner said.


Firstly, you say "we wouldn't have to listen to Slash's lies"......let me ask you, when did you change your name to we?

Secondly, you imply that we're (you're) better off with Slash dead because you think he doesn't tell the truth?

Jesus H. Christ, just when I thought I'd seen the absolute extent of all the ignorant, fanatical Slash hatred, out of the blue comes your asinine, callous, heartless shit of a post.  I don't typically resort to personal stabs, but you need to change your user name, because Gypsy, you have no Soul.

Thats really intense.

Ive always wondered how Steven went and coped after he was fired and GN'R were the biggest rock band in the world.

I admire him for his honesty, and the fact that he's turned his life around now and trying to get back out there are play music.

I feel bad for Steven, but hey buddy drugs dont pay.

I love how Axl pulled a fast one on everyone else and got the band. I really wanna hear how that went down! If he just was like "hey crack heads im takin over or its over" or if it was something else.

I hated the quote about the pianos Matt should go hang himself.

I thought it was funny as hell, I remember seeing GNR in '87 and thinking this is how a rock band should be.

I saw them in '92 and thought WTF?  This is exactly how a rock band shouldn't be...

That said, Matt knew what he was getting himself into...

I wish Matt would just shut the fuck up. He knew what the fuck he wqs getting himself into and it?s not like Axl just went surprise hay were going to use pianos on the tour , Matt was their when they recorded the fucking songs.

Its weird seeing Axl in the cool leathers at the Ritz 88 and then seeing Axl in that blue and red jacket and little red shorts during Double Talkin Jive at paris 92 for example..

But that's Axl.. eccentric.. was always going to break away and try different things..

when did the Suicide Horns stop playing with GnR?

Researching, I noticed dates as far back as 89. Funny how no one complained about their presence.

That "piano" comment was the most dumb thing anybody could ever say.  Why criticize?  Uh, do you hear how kick ass the piano work was on the UYI's?  It was awesome!

GNR still kicked amazing ass with "piano" stuff.  Matt made it seem like they stopped playing rock songs entirely.


Anyway, I won't waste any more time analyzing that idiot's comments.  Matt has always been a cheeseball, loser, faggot.  He is a former employee and was never a proper member of the band.

A fuckin men brother! i couldnt have said it better! : ok:

It seems like alot of people took offense to mr. sorum's attitude, i kinda did too, like where does this guy get off? I just don't really like that guy much, like maybe you could bitch about the piano's and stuff if you actually had a hand in creating some of the music and were a part of the band's make-up, who is he to tell anyone how they should do things? Sorum is a dousche.

He struck it amazingly lucky with Gn'R. Without his little halfass part in Gn'r he would of if anything ended up in some POS grunge band and died on his own puke. He certainly wouldnt be where he is now with VR if it wasnt with Gn'R.

Dude just watched it agian on my TIVO.  Have to say the Nov. release sounds cool, but I personally think that this could have been a lot better if they have new intreview with Axl, Izzy, Duff, or even Dizzy.  I thought it was ok, but if it was 2hrs and had those new interviewa, it could have been the highlight of the year for me.  

For everyone saying it was an "Axl Bashing", its not bashing it is what happened. Sorry to say it but my favorite singer and one of the greatest front men of all time is a little wacko and power hungry.  (Sorry Axl)

Anyway wasnt too bad but that Chinese Democracy mention really was the highlight.  

Oh, does anyone know if some of that background music played during the show could possibly be new GNR matieral?  It sounded like really cool riff and I want to know who the artist is.  Thanks

Slashisthebest

Riki Rachtman made a comment about the three high budget videos. He said something about Axl swimming with the dolphins in the "Estranged" video, and how that wasn't "very street". But, when they made that video, they weren't livin' on the streets (so to speak) anymore. They live in gated communities now and swim with dolphins from time to time. That's what rich people do. But, seriously, it would've been phony to make videos about livin' the hard street life when in fact you're livin' the good life. GN'R's always been honest and real, and that's a big part of their appeal.

What a one-sided hatchet job!  How can you have a GNR Behind the Music without Axl???   I was looking forward to hearing what Axl had to say about GNR's history and certain incidents and instead I get people like his former tour manager and Slash's publicist?  If your gonna have Gilby, what about Duff, Izzy or Dizzy?  Anyone of those guys have a more important place in GNR than freakin' Gilby Clarke!

VH-1 should have called it SLASH- Behind the Music because that's what that was.  

Matt said in '92 that when he first played NR he thought what a fuckin' boring song it is, but he later get used to play it. So he said it back then he didn't like that type of song.

I disagree Matt is some aspects, 'cause Estranged is quite brilliant, just like the guitar solos and the end of NR, but I'd like UYI (and TSI) more without keyboards in the faster songs. They just don't fit in my opinion.

And it's funny to read that 'Shut up Matt, you are a bitch, you were just an employee'. Hell, GN'R now has only hired guns beside Axl! Wake up!!! Matt isn't my favourite drummer, but they had a hard search trying to replace Steven, they tried out other drummers, but Matt was the guy for them. Same for Gilby - they got the chance to live in the biggest band of the world, but they didn't fail! Don't forget it.  :rant:

Nobody is protecting "Axl 's ass" , but you're protecting Ex-gunners ass.
First if Slash said that When he was with Steven that was when Guns started for him, sorry, but that doesn't mean that in his mind, Slash thought that he was in GNR.  So if I got this band in which I'm the last member to get there and we become very famous,  and then  I say in public TV that this group started for me few years ago before I knew these guys. But maybe you're right.

 And also if I recall correctly didn't Steven or Slash said : "Dude, we have to gat those two guys and we're going to rock". Am  I lying? Am I distortioning what he/they said?

Also if you're wife doesn't go with you to the places you want and you cheat many times. I bet you're going to say that if you're wife would have accepted go with you, you wouldn't have cheated. So what that implies?
Anyway, Dizzy you're a really fun dude.

 :peace:

Oh noooooo, of course not.  That's never the case is it?  Blatantly twisting Gilby Clarke's words out of context to defend Axl doesn't constitute "protecting Axl's ass", does it?   ::)


Oh yes, I always am, aren't I?  I'm always the bad guy who leads the iron fist charge for the ex-Gunners aren't I?  Sorry, I'm the guy who tells the truth, whether you like it or not.  Reread all my posts on this thread.  From the start, I acknowledged that the show portrayed all the Gunners in a fair light; Axl was a control freak, and the other guys were junkies.  That's the truth.  You'll notice how I don't argue with people who say Slash was an alcoholic, because it's the truth, and that was his fault.  I debate people who twist words out of context, such as what NickNasty did with Gilby's comments.


What don't you understand about this?  Slash said that he hooked with Steven, and then they proceeded to meet Axl and Izzy.  So hooking up with Steven would indeed have been the beginning of GNR from Slash's perspective.  Slash never said "Steven and I started GNR", even though that's obviously what you want to believe.  All Slash meant was exactly what he said, "That's where Guns started for me."


Yes, Steven said that, but so what?  That does not mean that Steven meant, "Slash and I started GNR".  Just like Slash's statement, all Steven meant was exactly his quote which you posted, "let's get these two guys and we'll have a kickass band."  That doesn't translate into anything more.


What in the blazes of hell are you on about?   ???


Hey man, VH-1 invited all the original members (including Axl) to participate, and they declined.  That isn't VH-1's fault.  We knew since the show was announced that Izzy, Duff, and (especially) Axl were not going to partake.  I am just glad they used some archive interviews with Axl and Duff to fill in some spaces.

I just want to say this: AXL had a vision all along. He new what he wanted and he was very open about it. They were all a bunch of pussies for not speaking up. The reason they didn't is probably because they new he was going to take them all the way, and he did. You can't stay on top for ever and sound the same as you did on your first album.

Keep up the vision AXL!!!
As a true GNR fan I will stick by you forever!!!

The thing that annoys me about Sorum, besides his ridiculous stage presence, is his hindsight insults.  If he has beefs with Axl that's fine, I understand it completely.  But the way he's; I swung at Axl but someone caught my fist, I was going to confront him but the other guys wouldn't, I hate piano; it's just like shut up buddy, he's trying to make himself look like the hero here, and I'm sure that's far from the truth.  

He went along with Axl like everybody else and didn't say shit until it was basically all over.  Don't try to puff yourself up now Mattie.  

So again, give us poor folk who don't get to see  it some more details.  

During the last segment of the show, the documentary began to discuss the breakup of gnr and then Velvet Revolver and new gnr....

An editor was talking about Axl and how he is trying to make gnr relevant again...then he went on to say how hes trying to make this mythical perfection which might be impossible to achieve. Then the narrator says as for the mythical album chinese democracy, it is slated for a novemver 2004 release. I literally jumped out of my bed in amazement when I heard this. Only because I was expecting an uncertain answer....

IMO, the only reason why I consider this legit is beause its from VH1 and its a credible documentary. They arent going to go on hersay and throw out speculation. They would ask gnr managemnt for the status of the band/album or gnr management asked them to say it.

Whether people think the band will carry out on that is a whole different issue. But the fact that this comes from credible source is a lot better than hearing it from th einternet where peopel have a lot of time on thier hand and create bullshit....

SO time will tell. It snot that far off. And if a november release is the goal, we will get the singl ein October and probably get a shitload of news anytime from august to september....BUt as we all know things can change.....

I am still seeing some bitching on here about the tremendous vision Axl had to get them to sign the name over and how they were retards for doing it and should have stood up to him. Slash argued they did that because Axl was threatening to blow the band up, and as Slash said..."we did it just to keep the thing going. If we didn't the band would have ended right there." What would everyone had preferred....them standing up to Axl and the band ending right then and there? Or Them doing what they did to keep the thing going as long as it did. For the all the bad that is spewed about the ex-gunners, when I watched that part I have a new appreciation for them doing what they did to keep the band going for the sake of the fans. We all know Axl would have quit the band right then and there had they balked. I just feel bad they get screwed for trying to keep their livelihood going and keep the fans happy. Keep this scene in mind next time people run off praising Axl for getting them to sign the name over.

If they were smart they wouldnt have signed it. And let the band end right there....

Gnr was the biggest band in the world at that point. Do you honestly think Axl would have held out for more than a few months? Not a chance. He would be stupid. Plus even if he did, he would have looked like a complete ass to the public and would be much hated.

Ok so give them a parade. Axl wanted the band rights so that when the band broke up,when and if that ever came, he could have the option of doing whatver he wanted with it.

He wanted it for security reasons.

Um, if im not mistaken, their liveyhood is making and playing music correct?
What part of all there side projects,snakepit, Vr etc is not doing that?

Dont forget all the money thats pouring in fromn their gnr sales they get each paycheck....

No1 is praising Axl for what he did. He did it and thats it. Nothing more nothing less. The band went on after that.

Relax, Dizzy... We (me and my multiple-personalities) don't really wish Slash dead.  We just wanted to see which member would be the first one freaked by that.  :hihi:   Congratulations on your success!!!  : ok:

I just found it ironic that the main thing that probably forced Slash to face the fact that he had a serious drug problem and forced him to clean his act up or he would probably have been dead years ago, is the thing that he says he hates Axl for and will never forgive him for.

And, yes, I think Slash is a habitual liar.  :yes:


P.S.  I have a soul ... I also have a very sick sense of humor, too.  :P
*singing* I want to rock your gypsy soul... Just like way back in the days of old... Then magnificently we will float into the mystic...
-Van Morrison  :)

whats all this shit bout management denying this?

i havent saw a press release from them sayin that and i am no longer believing anything from any "insider" on the board

call it being naive and ignorant but im still stayin excited over this

only scenario i can see is this

1.axl does intend to release it in nov hence VH1 reported news they got straight from uncle axl's mouth

2.management axl etc just threw vh1 that date as a hopeful type situation cause they didnt want "there is still no release date for c.d." to be on the show which would disappoint fans

3. vh1 took that date off speculation and rumor

i dismiss the 3rd one, no self respecting company would ever use heresay and rumor and present it as fact

so its the either two

for someone to say management denies it, i dont understand, cause im believing VH1 over any person on a board cause fuck someone had to tell them that, right?

 :DAll in all, I think the show was very well done. It affirms a few things for me.       1. Axl is the Beethoven of rock music and whatever masterpiece he creates will be worth the wait. 2. The split between Axl and  Slash is in the same league as the split between Lennon and McCartney, and I doubt the original lineup will ever reunite. 3. I think Axl could succeed as a solo artist, but the Guns nRoses name means alot to him and he deserves the rights to it. 4. The old band members are still bitter about money. 5. People  everywhere will continue to battle over control no matter what their station in life. 6. I don't particuarly care for Velvet  Revolver, but I think Scott Weiland is a talented artist like Eminem, even though I don't particuarly care for rap music, and if Velvet Revolver becomes huge I wonder what ego struggles will occur there. 7. Axl is so damn cute! :peace:                                        

Finally caught it! Like some of you, I thought it was slated for midnight on July 4th (didn't notice the "pm" in there  :P )

Overall...an okay BTM, but not the BTM I would have liked to have seen them do on Guns N' Roses.

Why?

Uh, Traci Guns...apparently he just never existed and had nothing to do with the name "Guns N' Roses" either  ::)

Wasn't there a guy...I think he played guitar and his name was Izzy or something like that? Apparently he was an unimportant element of this band too because they had all of 3 seconds worth of mentioning him.

I realize they needed to brush over quite a bit in order to "tell the story" inside an hour (48 minutes if you discount the commercials), but I still feel like they could've done more. Although I do feel it was a bit one sided (against Axl, that is) I'm glad that he decided not to participate in it now. I don't think they would've changed too much and Axl would've just looked like he was trying to defend himself in the final edit.

All in all, if you don't know the story of Guns N' Roses, don't rely on this BTM. However, if you just want to check out some cool footage of the band that you might have missed or haven't seen in ten years, definitely give it a watch.






Oh, and as far as Chinese Democracy being slated for November...I certainly hope so, but I'll believe it when they finally get that giant bad ball in full motion and it's chasing after me ala Indiana Jones style  :peace:

It was too short and they left a ton of stuff out, but they did a good job for an hour.

Why no mention of Tracii Guns?

Why no mention on how "November Rain" came to be, I want to find out how it started as a 15 minute acoustic thing to a big piano power ballad.

How did they get the novermber release date for CD???

Tracii Guns?  Are you guys serious?  This episode was about Guns N Roses.  Yeah, Tracii may have contributed the name Guns, but that was all he contributed.  Save Tracii for the L.A. Guns episode.

Where the name Guns N Roses originated is not important.  What is important is the meaning they brought to it, and the five originals gave that name more meaning than Tracii Guns ever did or could.

maybe vh1 got there info from buckethead (well, you never know) any other suggestions?

It was the history of the band and they failed to mention GN'R existed before Slash and Steven joined.

Hollywood Rose was mentioned briefly, so why not mention how GN'R started?

Now you might get the impression that GN'R was started by Slash and Steven.....


Dizzy, by your logic, VR shouldn't have been mentioned at all? They also managed to skip the fact that Duff, Matt and Slash were all in other bands between GN'R and VR.



/jarmo

Slash didn't mean that's when Guns started for him.  He doesnt mean that he thinks he's Guns N' Roses.  What he meant was that, he met Steve Adler and htere is 2/5 of GNR and then he met the rest of them so that would make GNR concret.  I think you might have mis represented what he was saying dude.  

For everyone else out there, do jump to conclusions so quick.

Slashisthebest

GNR only existed in a preliminary state.  Not the complete lineup that everyone knows.


Because VH-1 only had an hour, that's why.   :)


Not if you listened carefully.  If you judge by the info the show provided, you'll understand that it really got rolling when Slash and Steven met Hollywood Rose (Axl and Izzy), and then recruited Duff.  That's the lineup we all know as Guns N Roses.  Tracii Guns is moot to that equation, even if he gave them the name "Guns".


No, because Tracii Guns was never a "member" of Guns N Roses.  When the band signed with Geffen, it was the AFD lineup who signed, thus becoming the official Guns N Roses.  Everyone knows this.

And VR were mentioned because they contain two original GNR members and GNR replacement Matt Sorum, essentially letting the viewers know what the ex-Gunners are up to now.


As I said, they had only an hour.  I mentioned earlier some other stuff they skipped, such as the fact that Izzy has been releasing little-heard solo albums since his departure, and that Steven has a new band as well.  If people looked to BTM for information on Steven, they would think he dropped off the face of the earth after GNR.  So in summation, what's your point?  They left out all sorts of shit.  My point about Tracii Guns was that he was not significant enough to be mentioned, especially when there was a limited time to cover the really important details.  Just because he contributed the name Guns doesn't mean he did anything for the band.  The AFD lineup are the individuals that made the name Guns N Roses mean something, not Tracii Guns.

Gilby was part of it and he wasn't in the line up that signed with Geffen..... Neither was Ted Andreadis.

Obviously Spin magazine thought he had animportant part enough since they interviewed in him 1999. If Tracii wasn't fired in 1985, who knows if Slash would ever played in a band with Axl.  :P


Maybe I'm the only one who's interested in the early days of the band and these details might bore everybody else.  ;D



/jarmo

Regarding the "sign the name over to me or its over" story...

Duff and Slash's lawsuit says that the 1992 Guns N' Roses partnership agreement between Axl, Slash, and Duff included a clause that if Axl was to either quit or be fired that he would retain the rights to the name Guns N' Roses.  

How does this 'fit in' with the piece of paper shoved under their noses backstage scenario?

Something as crucial as the partnership agreement which not only included proposed terms for separation, but also set the parameters for the control of the band's ongoing operations (ie: the clause that deemed Slash & Axl to have equal voting power on licensing decisions with Duff having a deciding vote in the event of a deadlock)... I'd would be a reasonable assumption that such a docment that was:
a) professionally drafted and reviewed by each's respective legal counsel
b) signed in the prescense of witnesses
c) properly recorded in the county of partnership

It is also my understanding that IF someone were to 'give into' an agreement under extreme duress or not of sound mind (under the influence?) they would have a case for having the agreement nullified.  Which has obviously not taken place.

So what's the deal?

 : :DEva, you totally rock!

Tracii is thanked in the BTM credits.

It was probably some lazy writers that went "meh...november sounds good enough"

Honestly, we all know that everything in the GnR tent boils down to Axl. If Axl did not participate in VH1, I doubt he would ever tell them the release date. It could be Geffen but it means nothing if it didn't come from Axl's mouth - if he doesn't want to release it in November, I strongly doubt we will see it in November.

I just finished watching it and they dont really get into too much detail. I really missed hearing from AXl

Yeah i felt alot of the facts didnt line up.

The tracii guns thing would of added alot after on most BTM they tell why or how they picked their name.

There was no mention of Dizzy at all. I think Dizzy is as important as Gilby, I know Axl probalby wouldnt let him participate, but they gave no mention at all to him.

They didnt mention too much about Duff's pancrease exploding, (or did I miss that) an event that almost killed him.

They never mentioned "Live like a suicide."

I know they only have 48 minutes to work with but there story of GnR paints it completely different.  >:(

 :smoking: Great for old pictures

 :crying: For any useful facts

              :hihi:
         8)   :rant:    :P

                :smoking:

Also forgot the Hell Tour, The Vince-Neil Axl feud, mentions of band sideprojects, etc.....we could go on, but, really in order to tell the story of GNR, you need 2 hours, and interviews with everyone involved from Hollywood Rose up until nu-GNR and VR....and they didn't have the time or need for that...this was  ratings grabbing just for the name recogintion and conterversy it would stir up.

They didnt even say how Axl got arrested for starting the St Louis Riot. THey made it sound like he got out ok.

They sure did "paint" their own version of GnR.

Watch it again folks.


It clearly says "CD is FINALLY slated for release Nov. 2004".

Not "slated for release"

It says FINALLY slated for release

 :peace:

WOW!!!  Thanks for clearing that up.  I've been racking my brain all night about that.   :confused:

He made it out of St. Louis fine......did a couple more shows in the US, then went overseas. He was then arrested after comming back into the country a few months later (not 100% on how long that was)


My question about the BTM is........

How do we get a hold of the Hollywood Rose Video footage that they had? And, did they get a hold of alot of the raw footage from the so called "Perfect Crime" movie??

Did anyone else notice Lies being recorded in one day? I thought that was pretty ironic and cool! VH1 was inaccurate in their reporting of the sales though. They said the album sold 2 million copies (maybe just that year!) when RIAA has certified sales of 5 million in the US alone. 5 million records sold and it was made in a day. That is a pretty good hourly rate.  ;D ;D ;D

I don't get it?

 :oI watched the show again with my mother who does not have alot of knowledge about GNR except for my love of Axl, and she had a unique perspective. She said, "HOw can they do this without talking to Axl?  This really isn't as good as the show about MEATLOAF. THIs band, GNR is mostly Axl, he's the main guy. Those other guys would be nowhere without him."  :hihi: I just found her comments interesting. We also laughed about how I missed the whole GNR implosion in the 80's, I didn't discover them until 1992 because of a former boyfriend was going to take me to their concert in Long Beach and I decided to watch an MTV rockumentary about them.

I think the show would have benefited from an extra two minutes or so on "The Spaghetti Incident," broken up as follows:

1) Touch briefly on how the studio sessions went. How did they compare to the other Gn'r recording sessions, especially considering the show's implications that "everyone knew it was over" after the return from the Illusion tour.
2) Briefly discuss why Gn'R, the biggest band in the world, decided to record an album of largely obscure punk songs. What members of the band were most enthused about this project? How does this stripped-down album fit in with the common criticism that Gn'R became too bloated in the early '90s?
3) Touch briefly on the Manson cover song on this album. What was the controversy all about, and was the recording of this song -- allegedly without the other band members' approval or knowledge -- one of the final nails in the Gn'R coffin?

Overall, though, a thoroughly enjoyable show!

Ok......

I am new to this board but probally one of the biggest Guns fans that exist in the world.  Honestly, if I could have 3 wishes....one would be that the original members get back together for one last tour!

Anyway, i e-mailed VH1 about 2 years ago asking them why they waste their time on Bulls**t like Milli Vanilli, and Leaf Garret when there are better stories out there like the story of Guns.  There reply was that they have been attempting to get the story but former mambers of the band would not agree to releasing any information.  My though on VH1 is that they didn't put enough into the story.  They spent 2 hours on Nitorious B.I.G.'s Behind the Music....needless to say, I was very disappointed.

Honestly, it kills me everytime I hear a Guns song on the radio, or see one of them on t.v. or in a magazine.  They single handedly reshaped the face of Rock n Roll in the mid 80's and after the release of Use Your Illusion I and II as well.  There has never been, and will never be, another album like Appetite.  Screw the Beatles and their White Album.....I got Guns n FU**ING Roses at the top..HANDS DOWN!

I was fortunate enough to see them live on 2 seperate occassions....One in Columbia, SC and the other in Chapel Hill, NC.  At the Chapel Hill show, Blind Melon actually opened for them because Brian May was sick and could not make it.  That was a pleasant suprise!!!

Anyway, if anyone would ever like to talk music...give me a buzz.  I am on MSN all day!

In the words of Axl......."just makin my living baby, and that's enough for me!"

this show made me the hugest steven adler fan in the world. seriously, he fucking rocks.

oh and did anyone notice how gilby always referred to guns in the third person? like "They were the biggest band in the world", as opposed to "we were the biggest band in the world"

i thought that was interesting

thats the difference in gilby and matt sorum, gilby understood he was there for a paycheck and as a hired gun

matt thought he had equal say in guns which is pretty fuckin ignorant

slash,duff or izzy i can understand sayin something to axl, but matt? please!

wasnt one of axl's biggest complaints about the old band their drinking and drug habits?

i dont know how many of u in here have ever been in a band but it absolutely positively sucks tryin to be in a band with people who do drugs

u cant depend on them, they make u nervous cause u are scared they are gonna fuck up and make u look like an idiot plus they are impossible to deal with

if u dont do drugs its hard hangin with people who do

so since the band were about the drugs maybe that helped isolate axl

thats why it isnt all axl's fault the old members left

I wish Axl had been there to give his side of the story and give some insight into the upcoming GnR album.  I'm sure VH1 contacted him but he refused.  Not very surprised by that but a bit disappointed.  Other than that, I thought it was pretty well done.  And as many other have said, Sorum should STFU about the piano, some of GnR's greatest songs ever prominently featured the piano.  

Hey there fuckers!!!! I saw BTM last night and was looking forward to it for a while and have to say that I was really disappointed. I was more emotional during the Lynard Skynard BTM and I cant stand those fuckers. You cannot give only one hour for a band like Guns N' Roses. You cannot give one hour to a band that has so many egos, so many problems, so many fights, etc. If they were gonna make a GNR BTM then get AXL in on it also. If not, then dont do it at all. This band is so fuckin Rock N' Roll its ridiculous. These guys just dont give a fuck about anythin or anyone. Usually a BTM episode ends with everyone being happy and going on with their life either with a reunion or everyone at least talkin to each. Here, the front man wouldnt even give a 5 min interview. With a band like GNR you have to have followed them fromthe beginning to understand what they r about. If any1 saw the show to get an insight on them, disregard it. It did not do the band or its members any justice, either bad or good. The only good thing that came out of the BTM is the fact that GNR were on tv. I miss that more than anythin. I miss them being on tour. I miss them being in the news, bad or good. It was all fuckin Rock N' Roll. You cannon deny that. The Metallica/GNR tour was the greatest tour ever in my opinion. You have a band that has THE  Rock n Roll attitude in GNR and then you have the greatest Heavy Metal band of all time in Metallica. And they only spent 1 min on that tour?!?!?!?! It would be fucking amazing if by some miracle these guys would find a way and re-unite. There is a lot of animosity there, and u couldve sensed it in every word Slash said. Sad But True.

Saw BTM--loved it. But it wasn't perfect by any means.

There's a pretty good review of it here: www.flynnfiles.com

Flynn complains about how much is left out: "Wouldn?t Axl?s twenty arrests in Indiana, or the explosion of Duff?s pancreas, have made great BTM fodder?"

I bet Axl is Pissed. They did a lot of subtle things to get under his skin I think, and they would have been nicer if he had cooperated, so it was stupid of him not to be interviewed.

But even though they were snide about him sometimes, they were also really honorific sometimes. And Axl deserves a lot of the honor they gave me -- he IS the greatest front man of all time (maybe Roger Daltry excepted).

But he also got some praise he didn't deserve. In the lengthy review at www.flynnfiles.com , Flynn complains rightly about the song-writing credits in BTM: "The narrator claims that 'Axl supplied the menacing lyrics' to GNR?s tunes, for instance, ignoring that Stradlin penned 'Patience,' 'Mr. Brownstone,' and so many other songs."

How do you think they treated Axl: too mean, too honorific, or just right? What about the others. Do they get enough credit in BTM?

Towards the end of the program, did anyone else catch that even Slash and Matt implied that no matter how successful Velvet Revolver gets, that band will never be as important as Guns N' Roses.  Sorum's tone when speaking about touring with VR was pure compromise.  Clive Davis, who is notorious for overspending on his pet projects, will pump as much money into promoting VR as is needed not to lose face but the reality is that the few new GNR tracks we've heard, (Chinese/Madagasgar/The Blues) smoke anything off Contraband.  

It was actually a year later, in 1992, when they got back from their European tour.  According to Jarmo's timeline...

July 12th, 1992 - Axl is arrested at the JFK airport in New York, NY. The reason for the arrest is the riot in St. Louis, MI in 1991.



Yes, I thought that was interesting and really neat.  Basically that means that GNR Lies is more of a live album than Live Era.  And yes, VH-1 was incorrect in reporting that Lies had only sold 2 million, unless they meant that's how many copies it sold in its time on the charts right after its release.


He meant that VR will never be as important as the original Guns N Roses, not Axl's current "vision" (as everyone likes to say) of Guns N Roses.


It's only the "reality" in your opinion.  In my opinion, "Madagascar" and "The Blues" are the only songs better than anything on Contraband.  "Chinese Democracy" and "Rhiad and the Bedouins" are average rockers, nothing more.  And don't even get me started on that "Silk Worms" and "Oh My God" garbage.  The worst song on Contraband is better than those two.

But this isn't even the topic at hand.

Besides me already saying Dizzy wasnt in it. They also didnt mention anything on the Kurt Cobain incidents. Kurt and Axl had quite a few runins.

How come they couldnt take 5 seconds to promote Steven's new band. I am not a big fan of Addler's Appetite, but the guy gave his time and effort to come in for your crappy BTM and you couldnt give him a plug and say what hes up to?  Shame on you VH1

I thought their BTM was okay. It was geared more for the average fan who didn't know most of the story. The rest of us had heard most if not all of those stories so there is no way it could have done justice for us. There simply was no way they could fit everything in a 45 minute show. Heck,  I don't think 2 hours would have been enough for them but obviously would have been better. Of course, it made it harder for them to go deep into their history when most of the original members declined to participate.

I thought they did a good job at making both "sides" look pretty even. However, as a whole I thought it made the band look a bit bad. I wish it focused a bit more on the positive side, but of course drama sells.

The one thing I thought they should have went into was Paul Huge's involvement with the band. The reason I felt this way was because they mentioned Sympathy of the Devil and Slash says it was the sound of the band breaking up, but they never went into why it was the sound of the band breaking up. His presence on that song added a lot of tension and they should have definitely mentioned it to follow up on Slash's comment.

Overall, they did a good job telling the type of story the average BTM fan enjoys. It just happens that GNR is filled with so much drama that they couldn't cover it all.

i do like steven adler but he has to take some personal responsibility for his own actions


they took everything from me etc etc, NO steven your inability to play cause u were fucked up took everything away from u

i dont blame GNR one bit for what happened to adler, all the members could sober up enough to record whereas adler couldnt leave the drugs alone

adler screwed adler not GNR

Yeah, but Adler could of atleast gotten a push for his project. He participated in the BTM, just like Slash, and VR got a plug, they could of spent 5 seconds on saying how steve is cleaned up now and out touring in Adler's Appetite. He deserved that much

Shit!  VH-1 used their "Behind the Music" name-tag to bash the hell out of Axl.  The only point of that "documentary" was to paint Axl as a control-freak asshole (we've known this for years) and put over Velvet Revolver as the next big thing.  They told the story we all know while filtering in their little snooty comments in between subjects.

Matt Sorum is such a fucking dumbass.  He actually had the nerve to sit there and complain about "signing up" for the best damn band in the world at the time.  Pianos?  What the hell is wrong with them?  It's not like they were all over every song.  "Right Next Door To Hell", "You Could Be Mine", "Live And Let Die", "Perfect Crime", & "Get In The Ring" all sounded like "bad-ass rock band" tunes to me.  The guy got one of the luckiest breaks in rock history by being selected to play for Guns and he's pissing and moaning about some pianos?  Stupid sack of shit.  The funniest part of his comments is after whining about the "sissy" pianos and horns they eventually cut to some scenes from the "Slither" video and show Scott Weiland fagging around proving Sorum's personal hang-up against Axl.

I agree with the guy who said "Adler screwed Adler".  No further comment.

Slash's comments seemed genuine and professional.  Aside from telling a good story, whenever he criticized Axl he followed it up with an explanation for the remark instead of just mindless bashing like some of the other participants.

All in all I thought most of the show was well produced and even though I've heard the GN'R story three dozen times in three dozen ways:  when they weren't just showing their asses where Axl is concerned I rather enjoyed it but still couldn't shake the feeling that they were just trying to spit on him and hype Velvet Revolver.  

AXL - If by chance you're reading this please release Chinese Democracy and blow this VR shit outta here!  Speaking of which - where the hell did VH-1 hear that CD is coming out in November!?

I do concede that Steven was responsible for his drug problems, but GNR fucked him out of his royalties, plain and simple, so Steven's statements about everything being taken from him was accurate, because that's part of what he meant.

I've already presented all the information on that issue many times in the ex-Gunners section, and it's is a separate issue than the topic at hand.

Wayyy toooo short!

There was too much to cover for this band and the impact they had on the music industry to keep the show to just 2 hrs.

Yes, Axl was a control freak.  It would have been nice to tell a story about his childhood to show what led him to such destructive behavior.

Needed to spend more time on Izzy and more of why he left.  How he couldn't handle being so "in the limelight" and needing to be "under the influence" to perform in front of such big crowds.

Could've had Adler speak more of why he couldn't tackle his demons to stay in the biggest rock band in the world.

Nothing about Stephanie Seymour.  She had a very big impact on Axl's life.

If they wanted to really get "Behind The Music of Guns N' Rose", they could've done so without "half-assing" it.

It was nice though to step back in time.  It brought back ALOT of memories.

Very disappointing, as usual, to be "uplifted" then days later have the excitement ripped away, yet again (November 2004 release mention).

And the 60-second afterthought at the very end of the show in effect did that?  Okay... : ok:



Well if thats common knowledge...then why wouldnt they include that information?  Because its not flattering?  Then lets all whine and cry about how they brought up the other guys' addictions.  :confused:

The fact is thats what went on.  Thats the perceptions of the guys who participated.  And if Axl wanted to, he couldve given his side of the story.  As I was watching it, I thought 'Theres no way anybody can bitch about this as 'bashing''.  Unsurprisingly, I was wrong.  

It also confuses me that everybody praises Axl for telling everybody how he feels without beating around the bush, etc. but hates Sorum for essentially the same thing.  But again, it certainly doesnt surprise me.

i thought steven got his money thru that lawsuit?


i like steven im happy he's got his life in order but he blamed the band a bit to much for his problems

watchin that though if u didnt know GNR u would think axl was a prick cause he didnt have any likeable qualities at all goin by that BTM

My feelings exactly.

I found Sorums comments some of the most telling of all, he echoed almost everything I had thought/felt about the band during the bloated days of the UYI's and the dorment years thereafter.

His line about the "72 piece orchestral masterpiece" nearly made me fall out of my seat.  Funny as hell...

u guys never disagree :hihi:

im the biggest axl fan in the world but i was watchin that behind the music and i said to myself "WHAT A DICK" :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:

I loved when slash was talkin bout how they were the right band at the right time and etc etc and then he said "thats fuckin great! gave me chills watchin slash reminisce

I enjoyed that as well, Slash seemed to really look back with enjoyment at the rise of GNR..

I don't want to get off topic here but I want you to read this and tell me Steven got "everything taken" away from him:

I, Axl Part II
RIP October 1992

AXL: "The misconception is that we kicked him out for the hell of it, and that I was the dictator behind it. The truth is, I probably fought a little harder to keep him in the band, because I wasn't working with him on a daily basis like the other guys were. They grew tired of not being able to get their work done because Steven wasn't capable of it. I've read interviews where he's saying that he's straight. Most of the time he isn't. He's the type of person who wants everything handed to him, and he did get it handed to him. He got it handed to him from me. At one point, in order to keep this band together, it was necessary for me to give him a portion of my publishing rights. That was one of the biggest mistakes I've made in my life, but he threw such a fit, saying he wasn't going to stay in the band. We were worried about not being able to record our first album, so I did what I felt I had to do. In the long run I paid very extensively for keeping Steven in Guns N' Roses. I paid $1.5 million by giving him 15% of my publishing off of Appetite For Destruction. He didn't write one goddamn note, but he calls me a selfish dick! He's been able to live off of that money, buy a shitload of drugs and hire lawyers to sue me. If and when he loses the lawsuit he has against us, and he has to pay those lawyers, if he has any money left, it'll be the money that came from Guns N' Roses and myself. At this point I really don't care what happens to Steven Adler, because he's taken himself out of my life, out of my care and concern. I feel bad for him in ways, because he's a real damaged person, but he's making choices to keep himself in that damage. There's nothing we can do at this point. We took him to rehabs, we threatened his drug dealers, we helped him when he slashed his wrists. I even forgave him after he nearly killed my wife. I had to spend a night with her in an intensive-care unit because her heart had stopped thanks to Steven. She was hysterical, and he shot her up with a speedball. She had never done jack shit as far as drugs go, and he shoots her up with a mixture of heroin and cocaine? I kept myself from doing anything to him. I kept the man from being killed by members of her family. I saved him from having to go to court, because her mother wanted him held responsible for his actions. And the sonofabitch turns on me? I mean, yeah, I'm a difficult person to deal with, and I'm a pain in the ass to understand, and I've had my share of problems, but Steven benefited greatly from his involvement with me - more than I did from knowing him. Steven had a lot of fans, but he was a real pain in the ass. I need to keep him in my life for you? F?!k you!"

on topic:

My thoughts after watching Behind the Music:Guns N' Roses:

Was any band in the 80s as dangerous as Guns N' Roses? Was any band in the early 90s as dangerous as Guns N' Roses? Danger and deception followed Guns N' Roses. Everywhere they went turmoil and destruction followed them. Ah yes,beauty. (I wish Good Charlotte fans would watch this and see what real genuine insanity and what real epic artistry is like.) I listened to the Greatest Hits after watching that show. Live and Let Die has never sounded so sweet.

 :smoking:

wow if u believe axl's side that does make steven look pretty lame, i think steven did get alot out of GNR and its not like he was left broke in a gutter, im sure he had millions, now if he pissed those away once again that is on steven adler, not GNR

One of the rare times I agree with you....For the most part, even I, a big Axl fan and fan of new gnr {as well as old}, felt that for the most part it wasnt as one sided as I thought it would be. The only time it was negative about Axl was about the illusion tour and how it got bloated. Even Axl would probably admit to that if you asked him now. In fact by them stripping it down later on in that tour says it all.....

now to where i disagree with you...
Its not that Sorum speaks bluntly. Its that he has no right to really speak of the things he says. How can you compare Axl and Sorum? The only people who can bitch and complain to each other are Axl,Izzy,SLash,duff, and steven.

Just look at how gilby says things compared to Matt. Sorum acts liek he was a pivotal member of gnr. He wishes. As many people have said, he is one lucky drummer. Hes just part of the ride.

As for what he says. Its all his opinion. ANd probably some of it is true. But again for him to say somehting like " I didnt sign up for this, and what the fuck is up with the piano" is out of line". If you were so disappointed Matt, why didnt you leave? If pianos and horns were so gay and pussy for you why did you try to act all tough in the November rain video with those gay faces?
 Of course not, who would leave the biggest band in the world. SO shut the fuck up. And that piano has created some of gnrs best songs. And it put gnr in another level.
Thats my problem with sorum.

I liked how adler said "I told slash to play it again" when talking about the sweet child note. If true Adler deserves whatever money Axl gave him in publishing rights just because how big that song was and still is.

OK, here goes, Im a huge fan and this does not mean im against any member at all. First of all, Adler ruined his own life just like Dave Mustaine of Metallica. Dave Mustaine also still has a huge grudge, check out Some Kind of Monster. It has an insane conversation between Lars Ulrish and him. But anyways, did u notice how Adler couldnt even talk straight, pretty fucking sad!!! Ok, heres my take on the whole Axl vs every-member  fueds. I think Axl is a great musician, excellent front man, and has great vision. When they first came out I think there were drugs and alcohol involved heavy. But, I think Axl was very drug free. I dont recall seeing him drunk ever or fucked up on something. But, I could be wrong, but I think if he did he did much less then the others. No need to explain on others' habits. Axl wanted to experiment, evolve, and change their style. I guess make it more grand, and why the fuck not. Hes a great musician and wanted to explore, the others and their drug use probably slowed that all down for him. He didnt want to mar the GNR name with their drug use. Explaining why he wanted to have the bands name, even threated to quit right there and then if anyone didnt sign. He is very stubborn when it comes to his music, he wants it to be flawless. Explaining why Chinese is taking so long. Notice how he answered back to Kurt Loder at MTV Awards when asked why it has taken so long to come back?:"it takes a long time and a lot of effort to recreate something that was once Guns N' Roses." And also notice how Velvet Revolver now has a lead singer with a heavy heavy drug problem and how they sound like early Guns N' Roses when they did drugs. The band probably attacks Axl cuz they know he will be silent. That is the only disadvantage Axl has. But, thats it.

Well I've seen it twice now and it was pretty much what i expected, which was not too much.  The producers were pretty damn lazy considering any casual GN'R fan since 87' would know about 95% of what was covered.  Did it not seem that the first segment was a waste besides a couple of pics that I never saw before.  The narrator just said the phrase "they were a talented band living dangerously on the edge" in about 20 different ways with no insight or stories.

Then they go into how they started which seemed like there was no research done besides slash and adler's interview.  To bring up a Tracii Guns point, I didn't care he wasn't in it but to those who did, not only did he help with the name and help Axl and Izzy get connected in the LA scene, but Slash first played with them when Tracii didn't show up for a gig, otherwise he may have never been in GN'R.  So to have Adler there talkin like he was a prominent part of the founding band was a joke.  He probably had less input than Matt did in the songs and direction of the band.  Anyone who was a fan in 90 when they threw him out, didn't give two shits about it as long as the rest of the group was still around.  So I know the only reason he was featured for 10 min. and there was nothing on Izzy was b/c he's pathetic and desperate enough to jump up and do the interview.

Again there was no research done at all it was like someone reading cliff notes for a book report.  No funny stories about being fucked up or on tour.  How bout Izzy and Duff beating up the Faster Pussycat drummer and throwing him in an elevator tied up in a chair? Or Axl fighting someguy in a hotel bar for calling him Bon Jovi? Or some funny Slash and Duff drunk stories?  Or what about the 89 AMAs or Vince-Axl or fighting with the press?

They seem to cover 91-93 in about two min, which was at the peak of their popularity.  As an objective GN'R , VR, nu-GN'R fan I can say and expected that most of that part was just Axl-bashing, where was any inside info?  What about the Axl-Cobain feud or Axl-Metallica feud on tour, and if Sorum was bringing up him tryin to confront Axl y didn't he tell about the story of Axl holding a shotgun when he went into his dressing room one night?  I mean that's the tip of the iceberg.  I mean I wasn't expecting all of this but at least one of these stories or something new I never heard about would have been okay.

And I know it's only an hour, but there was absolutely nothing about Slash and Duff leaving and even Matt getting fired after arguing with Paul Huge.  At least Slash and Matt who were interviewed could say something.  I mean am I asking too much here?  Well I can bitch all day about this, but I never had any good expectations about this show, so I will end there.  That is y I never wanted a BTM maybe a 2 hour LEGENDS episode.  But as most of u know being a GN'R fan u rarely have ur expectations met!(cough,hint,cough)

That's my point.  That's exactly what they wanted you to think after watching it.

Dave Mustaine didn't "ruin his life."  Getting kicked out of Metallica was very heartbreaking for him at the time but now he is much happier with the fact that he didn't stay and turn into the laughing stock of the metal world along with them.  Dave's fans respect the hell out of him and most metal fans (real metal fans not just Metallica junkies) will tell you that Megadeth's music stomps Metallica's any day.

Everyone keep talking about this Tracii Guns part in the episode.  I have watched it several time and never seen the Tracii Guns part, or maybe I just dont remember.  Can someone tell me where this Tracii Guns part of the episode is?  

Thanks,

Slashisthebest

There was no Traci Guns mention, in the Btm

For someone who bitches about VH-1's lack of research, you sure haven't done jack shit for research on Guns N Roses.  Your stupid, ignorant, fallacious, and cliched anti-Steven comments are not even worth refuting



LOL, yea the only reason y they're not worth refuting is b/c u have nothing to back it up u smuck!  U can read the quote that someone put up about what Axl said about him a few posts ago, which I believe to be true.  And which I read in the RS interview when it came out.   And his boy Slash, which is my favorite gunner,  who he knew since high school and got him the drummer gig  never talked to him once they kicked him out until a couple years ago when he ran into him at an L.A. bar, and basically said was up and tried to blow him off after that.  So we can do this and look up shit if u want I'm goin off the top of my head and am more credible than ur senseless bashing.  U must be his girlfriend or mom or only friend cuz ur the only one that cares what I said!  Scrub!

Another point to bitch about this shit show that u must've loved "Dizzy", is that adler was about as prominent as dizzy, gilby, or sorum.  So y is he featured when he had no song writing credits.  Like I said i'm goin off the top of my head, so if u can prove that he had credits then I will be glad to shut up, but the truth hurts.  Izzy was mentioned like three times and was only featured when they said he quit and had no info after that, basically reporting heresay and no research into it after that.  SO that equals no real story BEHIND THE MUSIC which was the point of the show, I don't wanna hear shit that I heard when he left I wanna know what really went down! Izzy was a major contributor to the song writing perhaps only next to Axl's lyrics.  But he wrote some lyrics and a good percentage of the song arrangements.  Behind Axl and Slash he was the 3rd most important gunner, sorry Duff ur my boy!, so when he left it was a major impass in the history of the band.  So sorry but to see a minute on that and watch 10 min. of "popcorn" (great name) just wasn't floating my boat, ok!  

So in hindsight as everyone knows the 4 cornerstones were Axl, Slash, Izzy, and Duff.  And Adler was just one of those other guys, so like I said the only reason to have him on for 10 min. was b/c he did the interview!  U think if Izzy or Duff nevermind Axl did the interview that he would've even been mentioned never mind called, I think not!  Boo-Yah!

personally adler is a great drummer, his drumming on afd is class

but really in myopinion drummers and bassists in most bands are replaceable with a few exceptions i mean u couldnt replace flea



to me honestly the drummin on the illusions is as good as the drummin on appetite, just like if u went to a motley crue show where the chick from hole or wherever was drummin im sure it didnt sound any different

facts are without adler appetite for destruction wouldve still been one of the biggest records of all time, take izzy,slash or axl away and it wouldnt have been

so i dont see how adler got screwed out of royatlies when royalties normally only go to the actual songwriters

drums usually dont count in the songwriting process

i believe what axl said in that rolling stone interview about givin steven some of his royalties, why would he lie about money

that being said adler is a fantastic drummer and i dig him tons more than matt sorum but honestly listening to his side of the story i just didnt see where he had much of a bitch

he was given ample warnings and chances to clean up or else, he chose his drugs over being in the band
so for him to say they took everything from him sounds like something axl would say not owning up to responsibility, facts are facts, undisputable at that

if adler had layed off the drugs he wouldve been in GNR for TSI

just like the first guitarist in def leppard who wouldnt get sober, steven left GNR no choice, he and his drug abuse were gettin in the way of GNR's vision and i blame only steven adler for that

Because writing credits arent exactly everything...and all songs on AFD were written by Guns N' Roses, a band Adler happened to be in at the time.

Adler was featured more probably because he had the most "Behind The Music" kind of story.  What are they going to say about Izzy after he left?  Of course I wish they were more in-depth about everything, but when making an hour-long show, you think producers are going to focus more on Izzys solo career than Adlers downward spiral?

The show really should have been 2 hours - hell, 3 wouldve been more appropriate.  Theres just so much information.  What we got is a bare-bones overview, which is what I expected, but they really should have dedicated at least another hour to detail things such as...

Axls new-age spiritulaity fixation
"Sympathy For The Devil" and Paul Huge
Slashs Snakepit
Neurotic Outsiders/Loaded
Duffs near-death experience
Axls feuds with Vince Neil, magazines, etc.
"Look At Your Game Girl"
Live Era
The "Chinese Democracy" years with the new band
Stephanie Seymoure
Slashs hospitalization
"Oh My God"

etc., etc., etc.

So the special is good for casual listeners/viewers, but probably a bore to big fans.  But its always cool seeing that footage...

You want to debate?  Go to the ex-gunners section and find one of the dozens of Steven debates in which I have participated, in which I have refuted dozens of ignorant anti-Steven comments.  Which certainly isn't difficult because the only thing anybody ever says about Steven is "He's a drug addict!  He's pathetic!  He's a loser!"  I don't think I've ever read anything more intelligent than that (and I use the word Intelligent very loosely), and certainly not in your ignorant, hackneyed statements.

So while this is an improper forum to hold such a debate, I invite you to venture over to the ex-gunners section and debate, because I'll debate this subject to the death, and I guarantee I'll have more evidence to buttress my side than you could ever dream of having, "SCRUB".



I could debate this subject here, but again, this isn't the proper forum.  I've posted the account about Steven getting fucked out of his royalties several times, most of them can be found in "Steven" threads in the ex-gunners section.  I also addressed the Axl statements that were posted here, there are several instances of evidence which refute some of the things that Axl said there, as well as the shady, underhanded manner in which they terminated Steven.  I certainly invite you to discover some of the things I posted there.

Oh yeah, and Steven wasn't just screwed out of songwriting royalties, that also included royalties from CD sales, T shirt sales (which featured Steven's likeness), EVERYTHING.  Steven was defrauded of all royalties to which he was entitled from being in Guns N Roses.  I do concur that Steven bears responsibility with his former drug problems, but in no way does that justify the band fucking him out of the royalties to which he was entitled.

And keep in mind that when Steven sued Guns N Roses for this, the court ruled in his favor.

Okay, even though this isn't the proper forum, I have a suspicion that nobody is going to bother looking up my old posts on this debate in the other section.  So I'll post this here.

This is Steven's summary of his sworn deposition in his lawsuit against Guns N Roses.  I got this out of a "Rock n Roll court" article I once came across on the net, and I also think someone posted it at one of Steven's fansites not too long ago.   This isn't the actual deposition, it's Steven commenting on why he filed it.  Read it very carefully and you'll see that Steven addresses the statements that Axl made in that quote somebody posted.  I don't think he was actually responding to Axl's comments, because I think Steven said this in 1991, which was before that Axl interview.

Anyway, here it is....


They told me I had a drug problem, well, who the fuck were they to tell me that?  A couple alcoholics and heroin users?  Did they take some time in between fucking strippers to decide they were going to throw me out of the band?  Doug [Goldstein] took me to have an opiate blocker [in 1990], which made me very sick.  I told them [Slash & Duff] that I felt sick and couldn't record.  Slash told me we had to, because we couldn't waste the money.  I said "Money?  What about the money we wasted last year [referring to the 1989 Chicago rehearsal/recording sessions, in which only Slash, Duff, and Steven attended] when Izzy was cleaning himself up, and Axl was nowhere to be found?  Why was it okay for those guys to waste the money, but not me [in order to] get well?"  So anyway, they bring me into the studio and I feel like shit.  It took me forever to get the song [Civil War] right, and they got frustrated with me.  So next thing I know, Doug [Goldstein] has a stack of papers in front of me that I could never fucking read because they were about five inches thick!  He's telling me 'sign here, sign there' and telling me I was signing an agreement saying I was on "probation", meaning I was going to detox in time to record, or else.  But it turns out, those papers weren't really giving me that chance.  [After that] I don't hear a fucking thing from anyone for awhile, then I got these notices saying 'you're out of the band'.  Through my lawyers, I discovered that the "probation" papers that Doug had me sign were actually the rights to my partnership and all my royalties, which I was unknowingly signing away!  They completely screwed me out of everything, these guys, [who were] my friends, my family.  It hurt more than anything.  My royalties were from playing, writing, and [use of] my image such as t shirts and shit.  When we recorded [Appetite for Destruction], Slash came up with this system where whoever wrote got credit.  But then when it came time to actually divide them up, suddenly everybody was getting credit but me.  I mean, [for example] Izzy wrote the song "Think About You" by himself before we started playing it [rehearsing and performing it], yet Slash, Duff, and Axl were also going to be receiving royalties for it, since they supposedly "added to it".  I said, "well what about me?  Did I add nothing?"  I mean Izzy wrote the fucking song, I thought that's how the writing credits were determined, but the other guys were getting credit for something they didn't write, and I wasn't.  Same thing for all the other songs, Axl would get credit for songs such as "Brownstone" [written by Slash and Izzy] and "It's So Easy" [written by Duff and West Arkeen], even though he didn't write anything on them, and the other guys [who didn't write also got credit] too.  So why not me?  So Axl gave me a portion of his [to compensate for not being included], and my name was put beside the rest of theirs [in the writing credits] and that was that.  But now they've screwed me out of those royalties and my other ones too.  Two fucking albums [AFD and GNRL] that I played on are still selling and they're collecting money from them, and I'm not.  Guns N Roses T shirts with my face on them are still selling, and they're collecting money from them, and I'm not.  That's what they did to me, people I thought were my friends took it all away and said goodbye as if I never existed.  Fuck that!  That's why I [now] sue them, and I'm confident the jury will see it my way.

--Steven


And the jury did see it Steven's way, because they voted in his favor and awarded him rights to his royalties.  So there's refutation to some of what Axl said in his interview.  Though I am sure we'll still have the "Axl never lies or distorts the truth" crowd still insulting Steven.

since he got his royalties they  havent screwed him out of anything, thats my point, they may have initially but he's not being screwed anymore
that is fuckin shitty though takin advantage of him and trickin him into signing those papers, but im glad he won and got his share

his drummin does make some GNR classics, i was listening today and realized that

the part b4 "you know where u are......" part on the jungle that little tom fill he does is class
also the drum beat in paradise city makes paradise city and that drumbeat can be argued as being one of the most recognizable drum beats in rock history

also cant leave out rocket queen, i dont air guitar cause i can play guitar but where im not a great drummer i find myself air drummin some of stevens shit

especially the fill on mr brownstone right b4 the "stuck it in the middle sections

Well, I don't think he said that he is still being screwed, he meant that he was then.  And that's what I meant as well.


Indeed, AFD would not have been nearly the record it was without Steven.  If you listen past Axl's and Slash's lead parts, you'll hear that it is Steven's rhythmic drumming that carries those songs.

Steven Adlers drumming on AFD kicks ass.  

I dont really like the way Matt Sorum played the Appetite songs on the Illusions tour, he didnt have that groove that Steven had.

But, Matt did a great job on the Illusions songs.  

OUT :peace:

Hmm I wanted more of Izzy and Axl on the show but they declinde not to participate so I think they decided to focus on Steven and Slash who happened to be there to tell it.

That's pretty shitting of GnR to do that to Steven, Atleast he got him fair share from Axl

I don't buy this whole thing with Adler...first of all...what did GN'R have to gain by kicking him out of the band? They had to replace him and pay the new drummer, right? Matt Sorum surely didn't work for peanuts...

There is just too much left out of this whole story...and again we'll never know because no one wants us to know...as is with many things surrounding Guns...that's just the way it is with them.

hey yo'

They wanted a nice and cute 48 minute long GnR story and thats how they edited it. I am sure they do it to alot of other bands on BTM, its just with GnR there were so many riots, lineup changes, turmoil, they could never an accurate 1 hour story even at 2 hours it would be missing some.

I JUST WISH THEY WOULD MENTION DIZZY HE HAS BEEN IN GNR for 14 years. Give him a "lil" credit.

They mentioned Teddy Zig Zag for christ sake

matt said something like "axl was workin on a 64 piece masterpiece song and he was like "wtf"

i wonder if that was "this i love"?

sorry if already asked it, but where can I download the BTM ? I?m from Brazil ... don?t have VH1 or MTV

( NO, I DON?T USE THE HUB )

thanks
 :)

Yeah it made Matt Sorum look like a deush when he said something along the lines of "I thought I was gonna join the greastest rock band on earth, then he brings in painos. WTF .....

Matt was expecting a free ride, and when he got it he wasnt happy with the direction of things...

What a selfish motherfucker

to answer the whole "the times have changed and axls songs wont be relevant anymore"
november rain was wrote over 20 years ago and it is still a great song so i dont buy the relevant argument!!

Thanks to D, I finally got a tape of the show! Thanks D!  :)

I thought it would be a little more in depth than it was. Cool to finally see 'Rocket Queen', or Barbi as her name is.

I can't wait till the day when we hear Axl's side of the story. I wonder if Axl will write a book or something someday detailing his side of everything.

Matt Sorum really did sound like a dick when he said that shit about thinking he was signing up for a bad ass band etc..

You know.. that stuff he said about it not being brain surgery.. referring to post 1994 GN'R and writing a new album - guess it sums up the differences between the band and Axl. Their perception of the music and the future was just so different to Axl's that it was just destined to end. I think whilst the Illusions was happening, Axl already knew this.

What that guy from the RS magazine was right too, about trends in music changing 3 or 4 times while Axl has been working on the album. I guess that's a huge factor in why the album has been delayed for so long. Maybe Axl has moved away slightly from directions he had previously been heading in.

How cool was it to see the footage of all those people lining up for the UYI albums!

I've never been so eager for Chinese Democracy as I am now. GN'Rs music has been the biggest interest and hobby of my life, and although it was kinda sad and it sunk in when watching BTM that no former member of GN'R will ever play alongside Axl again, I just can't wait to hear the album.

Couple of other things..

The part I most wanted to hear was missing.. the Paul Huge/Tobias story, the breakup.. everything 1994-1996/7.. the material that was being written.. all that stuff.

And when Axl was being interviewed in the back of the car about the St Louis riot, was he about to be arrested? He had the same t shirt and looked just the same as the photos of his arrest.

didnt dave navarro film a testimonial regarding playing on Oh My God?

I agree with those who say that AFD wouldn't be the same without Steven's work.
That guy added killer grooves and provided badass motor speeding to all the tunes. Just hear the band in those 80's gigs and you'll realize what Steven was about.

I'm sure this isn't the ultimate Gn'R documental so let's wait to hear the others. Not in the near future of course.

There was no mention of OH MY GOD anywhere to be found to my knowledge.

I thought it was ok lots of Axl bashing I c yeah Dave didn't mention Oh My God but it was very one sided it could have been better it would have been nice if they asked Dizzy to contribute

I think matt summed it all up when he talked about how axl became when it was time to record new material in 1994.. It's rock n roll not brain surgery.. He sat there trying to do some 72 piece set.. It was axl's band and what he wanted, not suprised everyone left, the band became a one man show.. :-\

I still haven't seen the damn thing..... :hihi:

Easily the best comments on the show were Slash talking about Axl's new Gnr.."Some people would say that this is sacrilege...but he (Axl) doesn't give a hot fuck." And Gilby on waiting for Axl to show up for a concert. " by the time he showed up, we were hammered!" :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Matt sounded like an Ass on that show. Talking how "I thought I was gonna join the best fucking rocking band on earth, what the fuck is up with the piano" He wanted to jump aboard a cool band that has already made it big all over the world and HE'S pissed because Axl wants to do songs like November Rain? He should of been happy to be invited to the GnR camp

Matt sounded like an Ass on that show. Talking how "I thought I was gonna join the best fucking rocking band on earth, what the fuck is up with the piano" He wanted to jump aboard a cool band that has already made it big all over the world and HE'S pissed because Axl wants to do songs like November Rain? He should of been happy to be invited to the GnR camp

I kind of agree with you.? Although I still enjoy the original AFD-style music the best, I can't see how he can complain about being on the Illusion records.? Just because GNR has some piano in it doesn't mean that it's not a kick-ass band.? The fact that GNR diversified their music is one reason that they have transcended all those "hair bands" from the '80s.? Nevertheless, I think Matt probably has a strange sense of humor...I doubt he was trying to be a dick.?

I don't know from the interviews he's done post GnR he has made it very clear he isnt an Axl fan.  He even went in looking to get fired from GnR by Axl. I think Matt can be a real dick from his interviews and quotes

  :hihi: :hihi:  That's the line that I remembered most from that.  :hihi:

The footage brought back a lot of great memories!  :peace:

Steve Adler looked a fucking mess i enjoyed it but learnt nothing new nothing about the REAL reason Adler was fired and i would liked to of seen more about 2001 onwards they didnt even mention the new guys names and i dont remember Dizzy getting a mention even though he is now the longest standing member. It still stated that CD is slated for a November 2004 release on Ul version

Matt's initial reaction towards November Rain isn't a new thing. He talked about it as far as back in 1996 (http://qfg.info/misc/mattsorum96.txt), being still in the band:
He was a very strong Axl-supporter in interviews at the time, in 94-96, up to the point of mentioning turning down an offer from Slash to tour with Snakepit. He said he felt it would compromise the current GNR situation and how he had more faith in the album they were making than in It's Five O'Clock Somewhere.

That was my favorite part of the show.

Nice show

except Axl, Duff and Izzy were not interviewed

i think i watched every episode for about 2 weeks?  : ok:

I enjoyed it quite a bit, and thought it was a good basic hisotry overview. Yes of course they could of gone into more detail, but for 40mins they did well. I thought Slash came across very well, and was suprised why Duff refused to take part.

Regarding the Hollywood Rose footage... did anyone notice at the end where it said "Footage From" (or words to those effect) Cleopatra Records? Does this mean they have all material pertaining to HR?

does anyone know where i can find the pictures they used of axl during the 2002 tour in the BTM?? those were some kickass pictures..

lol! I was just about to ask the same question! Well, more specifically can someone take screen captures from the programme of the pictures?

i could've but i didnt think of it at the time..  :crying:

well i couldnt really take a screen capture.. i'd just take a picture of the tv w/ a cam..  :P

Finally saw it today (along with the a-z show). I did not see the part where they said his new album was coming out in November. Was this at the end of the show or the begining?

Show was good. I wonder how much shit they had, I bet it could have been a 5 hour show if they wanted. It made Axl look like the bad guy with all his craziness. But if the shoe fits..... :hihi:

The a-z might not be good for some of the uptight fans on this board who get easily worked up. It was fun and poked fun at the band in a good way. But some people here might get mad and throw a tv out the window.... :hihi:

i totally agree with you.. and i missed the november release date the first 2 times i saw the show.. it was at the end.. it took up 3 whole seconds of the show  :hihi:

I thought it was a good show but could have been 3 hours long, so much went on with GnR in such a short space of time!

I thought the Guns N' Roses Behind The Music was not that bad. I liked the one part in it a lot. I think it went something like this "You never knew what you were going to get, the best show ever or a roit or sometimes both". I also love the part at the end about CD coming out in November. It would be great if it's true.  :)

I like it, it wasnt as harsh on axl asive seen somethings be but it still portrayed him in a bad light, its like he is always the bad guy

Hi! A pretty obscure question but hoping someone can help. On the BTM show there is a piece of music played that I don't recognise but thought really cool. It is when they are talking about the end of the UYI tour and showing them coming home, walking out of the airport? etc. It sounds really laid-back, simple, slow guitar riff and I was wondering if anyone knew what it was. Thanks!

i'm seeing a lot of well-deserved annoyance toward matt sorum.. but he WAS right about two things:

1~ "he [axl] was like the greatest rock n roll frontman ever"
2~ "that kind of sh!t will never happen again"

 :peace:

really? it was slash?? omg i never expected that.. i thought slash was suppose to be the right laid-back cool one! ha!
i can't take the piss though cos i love november rain ::) and the horns are good on live and let die

Maybe it's not too "rock n roll" of me but I always loved the horns and piano.

Ask the Stones how Rock and Roll Piano and Horns are...

I really enjoyed it. I've seen it about 5 times now lol.
Erin

one thing doesnt make sense to me about what slash said on the btm concerning izzy leaving.. maybe someone can shed some light on the matter..

Slash: "he [izzy] felt dictated to and left"

if izzy felt dictated to, why would he leave after he finished recording the album? and didnt izzy step in for gilby for 5 shows or something when he [gilby] got injured in a motorcycle accident? if he was "dictated" to then why would he go back? even if it is for 5 shows..

or did he just leave cuz he didnt wanna be a part of something so huge anymore and just wanted to jam?

 :confused:

Izzy's 1993 statement on quitting the band....

I knew that it was the beginning of the end as soon as Steven was legally voted out for doing drugs.  That from a band that spent years doing groupies and being idiots!  But I did 'Use Your Illusion' and the tour. I'd quit drinking and drugs and been through a year's probation.  I had my own bus because I had a girlfriend and dogs, and there's nothing worse than waiting on somebody - their jumbo jet would sit on the runway for three hours while Axl blow-dried his hair.

Everything had become magnified - egos, drug habits, indulgence.  It wasn't about music.  We did fucking multi-million drama videos, like what happened to five guys playing rock n roll?  Helicopters, supermodels, it was the lamest thing.  The final straw was Axl, who was like Adolf.  He had a contract drawn up for me so he could lower me down the totem pole.  It said my wages should be reduced because I didn't move about enough on-stage.  When I heard that I was like, "Fuck this guy."  We came from the same place, helped each other, now he thinks he's the king.  I told them to do the papers so I could leave [the band].  Axl rang and said, "Will you still write with us?" and asked me to come over his house.
 
I walk up and he comes out and starts screaming, "Get off my property!" I thought, "You fucking little hayseed redneck trailer trash son of a bitch."  What a dick.  I drove away feeling like a mountain had been taken off my back.

wooo !...... axl rose, axl rose... axl .... rose .... what a douche (;D)......... but off course Izzy is *lying* ........  ::) ::)

Of course.  Anybody who speaks negatively of Axl is lying.  Right fellas?

wow you have the same name as axl's first wife- gotta be a blessing!

Yeah Izzy has to have made all that up because he cares so much what people think about hi-...no wait he doesn't seem to give a flying fuck. But yeah he is totally lying because Axl has never done anything ridiculous like th-..no wait he has.

.....and I think Axl admits to the whole "not moving around enough" thing in the 92' rolling stone interview. I don't think he makes a reference to a contract but he says it was a big problem with him.

i'm surprised that Buckethead has been around that long ....

Didnt i read somewhere that Izzy has tried to reconcile his differences with Axl on numerous occasions. Didnt he try and visit Axl at his house a few times. I think he got as far as the gates but was then escorted off the premises by security. Axl didnt even give him a chance. Shame really!

I though Behind the Music was pretty good, so much was left out tho, so much. By far the funniest comment for me was Ratchmans comment about Axl becoming less than street. "The biggest change in Guns N Roses for me came when Axl decided that he wanted to jump over an aircraft carrier and swim with dolphins. Thats when i started thinking... ok maybe this isnt so street anymore!!!" Presumably Axl couldnt get hold of an aircraft carrier so he got the next best thing.... a big ass tanker. haha!

Jonx

are you kidding? between the nunchucks flying around and all the breakdancing and all the fancy footwork during shredding solos.. he moves around a bunch..  :hihi:

Izzy in a Jne 2001 interview with Hard Rock magazine.....

The only one who doesn't speak with anybody, is Axl.  He doesn't call people on the phone.  I like to drive my motorcycle and I know where he lives.  Once in 1995, I went to ring the doorbell at his place, and he opened the door.  We hugged, he made me visit his house and we talked.  It was cool, we reminiced several times after that.  But, one day, on the phone, I found the Axl of the 90's.  He took notes of what I said, and then, no more news.  Since then, I've gone to his house for a laugh: I ring the doorbell and there is always someone telling me that he is not there! I'm happy, in any case, that he had concerts in the beginning of the year in Las Vegas and Rio.  I'm happy that his microphone worked okay.  Who knows, he might have left the stage otherwise (laughs)!

Sometimes...not all the time...but sometimes

I didn't like it at all. It was too one sided (Partly Axl's fault though for not granting the request for an interview) and did not focus enough on the 1994-1998 years which was the collapse of the band. Plus, there was no mention of Paul Tobias who seemed to cause a huge rift with the band and seemed to be a huge factor in the old band's demise.

I think it's just plain sad. I mean, even though he has severe emotional problems, Axl is (or atleast was) such a charismatic, almost mesmorizing frontman and with Duff and Slash behind him there was always magic on stage. It's such a shame that it all went down the toilet. Velvet Revolver is pretty good, but it just ain't the same. I'll still choose them over Axl's new freakshow anyday...

it seems like everyboady has seen the show, but us suckers that live in Norway havent. Why? because the Tv channels here are shitty and dont send any good music documentarys, accually, no music documentarys. Anyboady that know if i can download the show anywhere?

And...

Why isnt "in the ring" performed at any concert? Or as a music video? Can find it live anywhere and that song rocks!!

GnR 4 life!

I hope Ch.D. does arrive in the stores in nov!!!!

Please reply

Pat

I agree without Slash and Duff it just seems kind of....wrong. Axl is the frontman and the "voice" of GnR, but still..its diffrent,
Erin

http://www.vh1.com/shows/dyn/behind_the_music/81346/episode_poll_template.jhtml?place=dyn_behind_the_music&pollid=guns

 Vote Give You're Thoughts.

Try here:
http://win.thegunsonline.com/download/video/OldGnrVideos/GunsNRosesBehindTheMusic.mpg

hmm..I hope i didn't piss anybody off by posting that..

Whenever I notice someone calling the new lineup a freakshow, I can't help but think of some old grandpa, sitting in his rocking chair, going "Oh the youth of today, back when I was young..."

Just an image I get.

Dude.....That was fucking awesome!!! Thanks!

I have to say it was cool to see the old interviews, see the rise and fall, but it was a shame axl and manmy other weren't there.. One thing it did show was that when it came time to make a new album  the band was not on the same page..

I did like how slash said on mutual terms a reunion would be possible, he seemed serious because we know they'd get a massive payday as a group for this..

I agreed with alot of what matt had to say.. I also think there is some truth to what the dude from rolling stone said about making something relavent for the times, but it just kept getting away from axl.. No doubt in my mind we were suppose to see stuff alot sooner, you just don't do a single for End of Days and then make another apperance at a few shows and be missing since 2002 with no real word..

It's a real shame they couldn't compromise, they could have just tried eachother's ideas with different albums.. SOme people are big fans of rockers, some like ballads more, and so on..

It would have been nice to have someone apart of the show on the outside likey tracy  &  roberta.. At least all the members but axl... Wasn't a good show, should have been 2 hours..

Does anyone wanna sell me a copy of this cus i dont have vh1:(B


thanks a lot
Bryce

look 3-4 posts above your message and you'll see a link to the download..  : ok:

I cant download it i tried but i just cant

ME NEITHER

Hey dude, we can talk about it! I have it.

for those who wanted the images used on the btm of axl 2002, i will extract those pictures as soon as i get home today so expect them posted here by the end of the day..  : ok:

edit: sorry.. had to reformat my pc today.. lost all data.. gotta reinstall the software n stuff.. but i will have those pictures for u all.. (unless its illegal to rip stuff out of vh1 shows.. can anyone tell me if its ok or not?)

How do you wanna call them? Guns & Roses.  They aren't Guns and Roses.

VH 1 Europe will air the show on the 28&29th of october

I'd rather be an alcoholic and a junkie than a fuckin' dictator asshole saying lies everywhere he goes.

  Guns and Roses started as a band the day these five guys got together.

(http://www.geocities.com/gnrpics/415.jpg)

Hollywood Roses were Hollywood Roses, LA Guns were LA Guns,two very different bands,so stop the crap.

GN'R existed before Slash joined.

He replaced Tracii Guns who was fired for not showing up for a rehearsal or something.



/jarmo

Tracii didn't last too long,a few months,he didn't get fire,he opted to reform L.A. Guns,he never recorded a song as a gunner either,that doesn't count. What I meant was the real deal and the real deal everybody knows who they are.

Only in a name-only, preliminary  state.  When they were signed to Geffen records, the legal, official partnership of Guns N Roses was Slash, Axl, Steven, Duff, and Izzy.  Couple that with the fact that they wrote the songs and they were the players that defined the name Guns N Roses.



Incorrect.? Tracii was fired.

I wanted to take some time off.? I got a message on my machine from them [GNR] saying "hey, we have rehearsal this week".? I just ignored it.? Then the axe came down.? [They called and said] "Slash is going to play lead because you haven't come to rehearsals."

--Tracii Guns, Spin magazine, July 1999

You know what I mean Dizzy. GN'R existed before Slash joined and it exists after he left. The name of the band.

The AFD line-up, which is considered the original band by most fans, didn't exist until Slash and Steven got on board.



/jarmo

I think GN'R fans do know what IS Guns N'Roses and also know what IS NOT Guns N'Roses... You know what I'm sayin' ?

Exactly! :beer:

A November release? why would Dizzy say Feb.?  Anyway, looking forward to it!

My favourite part was when Slash said some thing about "to do it that way is sacrilege in alot of peoples view, but he doesn't give a hot fuck"  ;D

You seem to be holding on to the past history of GnR, which ent never gonna come back! That is why most of are all here looking forward to the album from the new GnR

The chances of them reuniting are indeed slim to none by i remain faithful that it will happen someday :beer:

IT WUZ FUCKING AWESOME BY THE WAY!!!!!!

At last I have seen it!!! I live in Toronto and have been jealously waiting and agonizing over not seeing it 3 months ago!!!

My take on eveything is Axl had better vision than the rest in evolving the band. Slash, Duff and co. were totally wasted about 99% of the time. I remember Axl once saying that it was hard to be around the others when they were always boozing and getting stoned (since he was sober for the most part) this alone would cause a rift to develop. I laughed when Matt said the band would get drunk, stoned, womanize.....and Axl would vanish for several days......hmmmm Axl vanish?Talk about a sign of things to come :)

I also love how Teddy ZigZag had a few words to throw in!  That guy is classic!!

I dont know if this has been posted before...

According Seoghoer, a gossip magazine in Scandinavian, VH1 will air Behind the Music with GNR, 9.00 pm. Danish time...

From VH1 Europe's site:


Wed 27th Oct @ 2100CET, Fri 29th Oct @ 2200CET



Guns N' Roses emerged from thicket of the hair metal jungle on Hollywood's Sunset Strip in the mid-80s and single-handedly reinvented rock and roll with righteous riffs and a real and present element of danger. Songs like "Welcome to the Jungle" and "Paradise City" were not merely rebellious anthems; they were autobiographical snapshots of a band that lived and worked on the edge. The band's exploits became as notorious as its music as members dabbled with drugs, booze and other forms of debauchery.

Guns' 1987 debut, Appetite for Destruction, struck a raw nerve - enrapturing teens and enraging parents. Thanks to arena-ready tunes like "Jungle" and "Sweet Child O Mine," the album would become one of the most successful debuts ever, selling more than 14 million copies worldwide.

Led by vocalist Axl Rose, Guns were a magnet for controversy - be it album covers, song lyrics, or bad behavior. And even as the band was quickly rising up the pop music food chain, internal struggles always threatened to tear the band apart. Original drummer Steven Adler was fired for his losing battle with heroin in 1990. Founding guitarist Izzy Stradlin would leave soon thereafter.

In spite of the turmoil, after the 1991 release of Use Your Illusion I and II Guns N' Roses were the biggest, baddest band in the world, with expensive videos and elaborate stage show to match. Guns stayed on the road to support Illusion for two and a half years, tours that were marred by tragedy - riots in St. Louis and Montreal - Axl showing up hours late or not at all. Founding members Slash and Duff McKagen dealt with Axl's unpredictable behavior by drinking the frustration away. Soon after they got off the road in 1993, Guns N' Roses disappeared into the world of rock myth. Band members came and went, with the only constant being the mercurial Axl Rose. A decade later, the world still awaits the follow-up to Illusion.

Behind the Music: Guns N' Roses tells the true story of this band of rock and roll outlaws.



/jarmo

I finally got to watch it. Nothing I didn't know, but the show got me so pumped! It gave another year of waiting capacity. Damn that band really was the best rock and roll band ever!

I'm just going to say, they would need to do 3 or 4 GNR Behind episodes the music to cover the entire GNR history. A shame Axl didn't get involved, neither Izzy. Quite frankly, I could care less about Duff. I won't say anything about Matt cause I dislike him with a passion, but on his favor, he did mention Axl was the best frontman ever. Apperantly, he's changed his mind recently cause I recall him saying something like Scott being the best frontman he's ever worked with.....
 
Anyway, Slash looked well. Much better than in the Illusions era. Actually, I couldn't tell, we never got to see his face anyway. He looked good though. He sounded very eloquent. I was expecting more bashing on Axl, and eventhough there was some of it, the whole show was more of a tribute to the band that achieved more in 6 years than pretty much any other band in a lifetime.

I really enjoyed the episode. It was great watching a brand new document on GNR. I have seen all of them pretty much, so I was excited as I was 10 years ago when I would watch a new documentary on GNR or read a new GNR related article. I'd get so excited you have to re-read the article 5 times to absorb what I was reading. I miss that feeling, but it was brought back today.

Oh boy, I don't think I'll survive when CD comes out.

yes, I was also very well surprised by Slash, he looks HEALTHY.

This argument is what Axl says. But for me this is just his own vision, and I don't agree with Axl on that point. I'm sorry Jarmo but GN'R was nothing before Slash joined the band. Axl wants to make us think that Slash was "just a member among other members". NO, he was not "just a member". He was a guitar genius. He had a very special status, equal to Axl himself .
Slash was also a leader. GN'R had 2 leaders: W.Axl.Rose and Slash. So nobody is going to make me swallow this bulllshit. No way. Slash was not "just a member". He was much more than that. The guy is a legend.

 I`m willing to see the show this friday but I`m pretty sure it won`t be enough!
 There`s just so many good things to remember from their life...
 
 Anyway, seeing GN`R on tv is always the best!   :yes:  :peace:

Of course Slash is a living legend, but nothing compared to the legend axl is even if he is or has been in the past kind of a recluse. Besides, Gnr wasn't just Axl and Slash, izzy stradlin was as much important as slash was, but me thinks Axl is a notch above them.

Truth is gnr is mostly Axl and gnr continues to exist even if Axl is the only member left from the original lineup. If anybody thinks this version of gnr is not gnr, they shouldn't be here waiting for chinese democracy as they all are.

By the way, gnr would not exist anymore if all the rest of the band was still in gnr and axl wasn't. Axl has not replacement, it's simple.

exept for some die-hard fans like us, 90% of the old GN'R fans think the band doesn't exist anymore nowadays...
Most of the general public isn't even aware that there is a new version of GN'R today.
For the large majority, GN'R stopped in 1993.

well, i dont think that is true! i think alot more people then we HARDCORE fans think, actualy know about GNR and the new lineup! Everytime im out with my friends on a bar or anything, and talk music with people! they know alot more then i expected! Remember that unless other bands, every little move GNR/Axl makes is firstpage stuff in magazines or music websites

havent seen this stuff, but i heard GNR won best 80's rock band on channel 4 (UK TV)

It is now November and now we wait in joyful hope   :beer:

Finally,I got to see the show last friday. :D
I have to mention that there were a lot of things that were left unsaid, specially things that only Axl could have explained. Guess he didn`t want to say anything so...forget it!
It`s just that the idea that was left,apparently a lot of times,was that Axl was insane,which I don`t believe! >:(

As you all might know,he had a lot of drama in his life,since he was a little child and that definitely explains a lot of his atittudes and the insecurities shown throughout the GN`R career.(Thank God Axl was the first one to know drugs and booze weren`t the answer!!) :-\

Anyway,I loved the fact that everybody still seems to understand,after so long,that they were the best rock band,a very unique band that made the diference in music history. :beer:

Those images,some that I`ve never seen before,made me smile. :)
I know that I`ll never-ever-forget them.It`s always an amazing feeling to watch them.
It made miss them so much!!  :'(

As the show was getting to its end,tears rolled from my eyes-you see,it`s more than ten years attached to this band. 8)
No matter how different they were from each other- and still are- that?s how a real family acts sometimes right? So it?s real sad when we see it fall apart, going separate ways. :crying:

I never got to see them live and so I was happy when I went for Velvet Revolver in Lisbon, it was awsome... but something was missing, something real big. In a lot of moments, I couldn?t help but imagine Axl there on stage with Slash and Duff. ::)

However, I hope things turn out good for Axl, because he is a unique singer, a perfect artist and he deserves all the best. : ok:
I?m grateful everyday for their existance. :love:

the official site says febuary 2005 i when the new album "might" come out.

Yeap!!! Cool isn`t??? :smoking:

GO AXL!!!!!! :peace: : ok:

i guess you mean the line "news about CD expected feb. 2005" which can be found at google. well, this doesn't mean anything. take a look at this topic:
http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=16352.0

(i don't wanna bring you down, but it is as it is).

Yeah The same gnronline.com that comes up on google that used to say "Album expected in November 2004."  It'll just keep changing until its right, I wouldn't get your hopes up too high for a February release.

totally agreed, for all we know it could be another ten years

I love the program, and enjoy much.

I love them forever

watched the behind the music again for the 10th time and steven bugs me now. never once does he take any fault for fuckin things up himself u know

and really if its any conselation to steven he wouldve only been in the band 3 more years anyway so really its not like he has missed out on too much

Steven beside be an original gunner,he played with the band 5 years,longer 
than Matt did.

exactly, he missed out on recordin the illusions and a 2 and a half year tour and then he, like the rest of the band wouldve been gone, so to say theytook everything from him is inaccurate in alot of ways especially considering the money he won from that lawsuit i think he came out pretty good.

axl,slash,izzy nor duff screwed steven, steven screwed steven

now he was a great drummer but he needs to drop the self pity shit, its not like they just fired him for the helluva it, i mean he couldnt play.

Then how do you explain Robin Finck? :P

so the show said that the new album would be out in november. Well its mid december.

damn axl, he probably hasnt even really recorded it.

A little bit of advice, never trust what's said on a cable channel that employs out of work comedians for the purposes of narrative prattle. 
 : ok:

According to my tv guide, the GN'R: BTM will be on VH1 Europe on the 14th @ 9pm.



/jarmo

it was on VH2 in UK on the 12th.

i have taped it cause i havnt watched it yet.

well!15 minutes until i get 2 see Behind the music: GNR . For the first time!

 :peace: :beer:

For those of you who've missed it in the past:


Show: Behind The Music
Episode: Guns N' Roses
Network: (VH1) VH1
Date: Saturday - October 29, 2005
Time: 7/6c PM
Duration: 1:00




/jarmo

come to England again its on every other week on one of the Channels TMF VH1 VH2 etc
 :hihi:

I can honestly say ?Behind the music? sucks, it offended GNR n' their fans from the start, if you truly take attention you can notice how many lies they said 'bout GNR to date!, they didn't speak 'bout GNR live at rock in Rio 2001, they didn't say Dizzy was the only member who continues in the band with Axl these days, they didn't say how much Axl n' Izzy supported each other before being separated in 1992, they didn?t talk ?bout Axl n? his scary childhood, they didn?t show new interviews of Axl from 2001,either there aren't pictures of GNR in Las Vegas 2001 n' Brazil 2001, what kind of ridiculos tv program is this then? ?I once thought to make this same topic just to know your own opinions too? no matter how many times behind the music is re-edited cuz they just talk 'bout incomplete truths? :rant: !, I?m so sure Axl did spit his own TV when he saw that crap at first? :smoking:

Yeah, The Behind The Music did kinda suck.  It didn't tell me anything I didn't already know except for the Slash dying thing.  And they left out so much.  They don't even mention Dizzy's name once in the whole show.

that's right n' that's why i hate that fucking tv program too  :rant:

Thank you Jarmo for the update.

I've already seen the show a few times but I've been wanting to catch it again.

it's on now... They are up to recording patience... On vh1 american tv

Thanks Mike. Got about 20 minutes left now, so I'll watch it again this evening in it's entirety at 6 p.m.

No problem, each time I watch it it really brings me back and saddens me,... Especially when gnr returns at the vmas but it's really not gnr.. Just axl dressed like some rapper with a bunch of people you never heard of..

I really like the BTM on GNR. It pretty much captures the spirit of the band as they were. They really had the image of being dangerous and out of control. it did seem biased against axl, but maybe if he'd given an interview for it, he could have evened that out.

Maybe it was not bias, maybe that's how it was (?)
In any event, I agree Axl missed his chance to have his say.

Yes, he should have participated, but he seems to want nothing to do with the old band, which is incredibly sad.

mother fucker!  i always miss seeing that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  >:( >:( >:( :rant: :rant: :rant:

It would have been a lot better if all the members participated, especially the original lineup. Of course this would take a straight 2 hour show, beginnig in the 70's in Indiana and finishing nowadays with VR and waiting for CD. ?:peace:

My condolences

How come you can get away with saying that (it's really not gnr)?  And I can't.  I get lambasted, every time, by a couple other posters.

Anyway, I've watched this show a few times, and have actually recorded it.  I enjoy watching it, but it is kind of sad - just that they were so great and then it all just kind of dissipated, and we have had nothing in years.  Also sad listening to the stories about some of their addictions and the effect it's had on them.  Had to have been hell going through that.     

I dont think so really. I think Axl will have been carefully planning how to have say when he re-appears! And knowing Axl like all us fans do, he probably wont hold back and it will be well thought out! I'm damn sure he would want to talk about the whole situation on his own terms rather than on behind the music in some come kind of slagging match with the old band members!

Of course I would've liked to hear something from Axl in the BTM, but if they could've gotten Izzy, forget about it.  That's who I want to see interviewed.