Here Today... Gone To Hell!

As information comes in, it seems more and more apparent that Axl simply cannot declare the end of major combat operations: he's unable to announce that Chinese Democracy is complete, and to move forward.

How anyone can blame the record company for getting pissed off at this point is beyond me. As several people have mentioned, the Beatles ENTIRE CAREER (from their first meeting with George Martin in early '63 to Paul announcing he had left the group in 1970) was shorter than the recording of this album.

What a rip-off for the fans and for this amazing group of musicians that Axl put together, and then left to rot.

As proof I offer you Axl's own words from nearly 2 years ago:

AUGUST 14, 2002: Axl Rose interview for www.gnronline.com

"There are a lot of new songs that were just done in the last year that we feel that ?okay, well that bumps a lot of stuff off the previous list but it's time to stop that now and wrap up the baby. It feels right, the timing, and a lot of things. We?ve sorted it down to what songs are on the record. What the sequence of the songs is. The album cover art is ready.

This thing is starting now and much like Use Your Illusions that went for two and a half years, this thing is going to go off and on for the next two or three years and we?ll see how it goes."

I have no doubt that the band must have some fantastic and amazing songs in the can. Probably several albums worth. So many reports (Rolling Stone, Moby, Brian May, Zakk Wylde, and so on and so on and so on) confirming this.

Why can't Axl Rose let this album go?

cause axl is an asshole that why!!!

My feeling is it's insecurity.  Axl's insecurity is a double edged sword.  One on hand, it pushes him to always improve on the music he has.  Which is why so many GnR tunes are timeless.  On the other hand, we may never get to hear what he has because he's never truelly satisfied.  

I beleive that when Axl finally comes to grip with his own insecurities, we will get Chinese Democracy... in the meantime, it gives us something to talk about on the HTGTH message board


-F

it may very well be insecurity, but how can you be insecure about something that is virtually guaranteed to be amazing? (based on every report we have heard.)

He made it sound (in 2002) like the album had essentially been done, and then they had recorded a number of new tracks that knocked some of the oldies off the tracklist. This made sense back then, because the final lineup (with Bucket, Fortus, et al) hadn't necessarily been around for the earlier incarnation of the record.

But at this point, there are no more excuses. This is why I think it makes total sense for the record company to turn the thumbscrews on our Uncle Axl. These perpetual 'finishing touches' are driving everyone crazy!

one last question: why did Dizzy say the label has the album if this is not the case??!!

Did I miss something?  Who said the label didn't have the album?

Because it's Axl's baby that's why. : ok:

Because of that, he'll release it when he wants to. :rofl:

Not when you or I or anybody else wants it to be released. :nervous: :confused:

I think it will be out this year so, calm the fuck down. :rant:

Everybody should just get off Axls back and relax a bit. :beer:

That's good advice.  Take it.


-F

yeah, arguing and stressing out about it isn't going to make axl release it any sooner, so....let's just relax and go with the flow people.  lol.  I know, I'm lame.   : ok:  

A possiblity/ an excuse, whatever lol   COuld be that they have been working on the 3 mentioned Albums.  Maybe there is a running concept to the albums, a thread which he as an artist wants to get right.  

I'm sure just a little more dialect with fans, would have kept things calm and people wouldn't be pissed off and demanding shit.....Wonder if he realises it could be that simple.  

I would rather have an album that took 20 years to make but was perfection from start to finish than one album every 6 months.

So fuckin what if it has taken awhile? Rome wasn't built in a day

When we hear this album we can say whether it was a waste of time - but at the moment all we know is Axl and friends are making the greatest rock album in history

Maybe it's better to forget about him? Careful, Axl, we still love you.

because he is insane, and insecure.

maybe axl will release it when he's in his 60's!

http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/02/21/wilson.smile/index.html

In a nutshell:
Its the defining moment in his career

Because, like his toadys on this board who bow down to him, worship his every move, & defend him no matter what(like the doormats they are), deep down he's just a sad, pathetic, angry, disturbed person incapable of getting his shit together.

Alright, time for someone to slam Slash. Or Metallica. Or Lincoln Park. Or Bon Jovi. Or anyone who's achieved anything over the last 12 years.

Oh, I forgot. Everyone "betrayed" him when they left GnR. His bullshit actions are totally justified. :confused:

IMO, it's not Axl holding it up. It's something legal.

I agree with anarchy and feel the same way as you dude. :yes: [headbanger]

Only one reason makes sense for why Axl won't let the album go....the material just isn't that good.  And he doesn't want to do anything to tarnish the image that GNR (while completely disfunctional) at least put out quality music.  The stuff on the album may not measure up to UYI and AFD so he is scared to release it.
I know the songs I've heard so far don't match up to UYI and AFD.

/Tulip

So you don't think Axl has had anything to do with the delay of like 4 years since Axlsaid he was wrapping this up?  Let me get this right.....you actually believe that the record company is behind the delay and not Axl?

Incredible.  Precious, really.

/Tulip

hey tulip you dont think the blues, maddy, and chinese dem match up to anything on AFD or UYI's? how can you say that.  I think personally the Blues will be a huge hit and be played out on all popular radio stations the same with maddy.  

I believe he's trying to make the first perfect rock record. : ok:

What you mean to say is


"As RUMOURS comes in, it seems more and more apparent that Axl simply cannot declare the end of major combat operations: he's unable to announce that Chinese Democracy is complete, and to move forward"

If you were looking for information on why CD isnt out you need look no further than the interview Dizzy did a few weeks back where he said it wasn't Axl holding it up.

Please stop inventing crap. The info is there if u take the time to wipe away the shitty rumours and the crackpot theories.

And Dizzy has been right zero times in the last 7 years so we should believe him.

Gheesh!!

/Tulip

Well with this album time will only tell, I cant wait for it if its going to happen it sounds like the record is done there are still things to sort I think the band wants to be really pre-pared for this and get everything right and its taking a lot of time.

This may be a stretch, but I think Axl may be attached to the album. I mean, he's worked on it every waking moment for close to 10 years, I think he'll miss it. It's just something he'll have to deal with.

i truly doubt axl has been working on this record consistently for the past ten years. im sure he has taken several weeks or even months at a time. like after the floored 2002 tour im sure he went back home and fell out of touch with management and the bandmembers so he could collect his thoughts, and further rethink how to conquer the odds against him and make a go out of this project. i believe this album was 99.9% finished in teh fall of 2002, just the tour made a huge mess of everything and each detail of the future had to be rethinked entirely as 2003 was most likely spent tour planning and album perfecting. i have no doubts its legal issues plagueing axl and Geffen that are holding CD back :-\

I don't buy the theory that the songs aren't good. Too many people (Moby, Zakk, Brian May, Rolling Stone, etc.) have indicated that Axl has at least 17 excellent songs in the can. And don't forget that Axl himself indicated on August 14, 2002 that the album was essentially done. Tracklist chosen, album cover ready.

I also find it odd that so many people suggest the album isn't done now, but it will be a masterpiece in 2006, or 2008, or 2071, or whenever Axl gives the green light to release it. That is nonsense. Everything we've heard (including from Axl himself) suggests that it was done 2 years ago. They could have recorded a whole new album since then, but come on. At some point you have to put something out!

Also, what record company executive in his right mind would start a fight with Axl or delay the release of fucking Chinese Democracy if they have it in their hands?

Certainly the band has created a spiderweb of lawsuits around itself, so who really knows? Still, it certainly looks like axl keeps promising to hand it over but never actually does!

One minute "This sucks. Why won't the band tell us anything. They obviously don't give two shits about us and are doing it solely for the money"

The next minute "I don't believe them."

See what i'm getting at?

And before you say it's just at Dizzy, think back to all the discussion we've had about Axl's claims about the three albums. People were sure he was lieing, yet were demanding updates.

I believe the album has been pretty much ready since 2002 but it wasn't released because the tour was cancelled and you couldn't release anything off that disaster. The album will be released after or during the next tour.

Axl didn't fuck up the last tour it was the Amp Gnomes, those bastards are tough to get rid of.

thanks, captain obvious.

hmmm...you really dug to resurrect this old thread.

Maybe, Axl's about ready to let it go this time.  :)

it's what i do :rofl:

I think one factor is the amount of material. They want to finish as much as possible before the first release so subsequent albums won't be another super long wait.

Also there are probably a lot of legal issues he's involved in including the slash and duff lawsuits, stuff related to the last tour and so on...

another big thing could be the band members who have come and gone, which is kind of like a catch 22 because im sure one reason why they left is because it was taking so long!!!

So I believe these are the main reasons....

you know... at first I thought you may have a point there.

But then after thinking about it I don't think its so much THE defining point in his career as much as it is his one chance to prove what kind of driving force he was in GNR.  As much as people may not want to hear it, Appetite was the defining point of his career.  I really don't think its possible for ANY members of GNR to top that success. 

I have one question.

Who is this character-


(http://www.chinesedemocracy.com/images/avatars/194530048044371caa520d4.gif)

Basically, Axl can't fuck this up. If the album isn't perfect, then GNR will be done.  People will dismiss him and that will be the end of it.  Imagine if Axl had release an album in 1998 and it had been mediocre.  People would have dismissed the new band for not living up to the old name and would have said Axl didn't have any talent.  He's got the almost impossible task of writing one of the best albums in the history of rock.  Given that in 2002, Axl seemed to change his mind about releasing it before the tour even cancelled, there must be some odd things at work...

everyone knows the cd has been done for years

To every one else, but not in the eyes of a perfectionist

: ok: :yes:

I totally forgot he said that.  It kind of makes you nervous that it will never come.   I do think he is trying to make the perfect record but I don't think that is possible.  In fact, some of the best records are the one's that arn't perfect.   I think White Stripes are good examples of this the last few yrs.  Anyway, hopefully he can muster up a bit of confidence and let it out.  If it tanks he still has 2 more albums of material right?  Let's get moving Axl.  I am already sickof hearing about Chinese Democracy.  I want to see what the one after that will be like.

I don't, I think axl is very unsure and insecure... He has made mentions to releasing this thing from end of days to wrapping it up .. I don't care who has changed since 99 the album is at least 7 years in the works plus whatever he wrote himself pre new gnr..  he is a rich man with a lot of yes men so he is in no hurry, the record companys should be pissed..Axl is lucky the entire album didn't leak out..

Now I know Chinese Democracy is gonna be huge... cause I saw some things on MTV  Latin american, and they barely talk about guns n roses...   

can you say that again... Chinese d is going to be huge because they barely spoke of gnr.. ???

Lincoln Park? You've got to be kidding.

It's been so long at this point he can only hope to release a really great rock album. It's never going to live up to the hype you, me, the press, and everyone else has heaped upon it. It's become the stuff of legend. The best word to describe this album's release is Anticipointment. It's going to be good but there's all this extra crap built up around it: the money that went into it, the amount of time it took, Axl replacing the entire classic lineup of one of the biggest rock bands ever...

Don't get me wrong, I think it's going to be an incredible album. But is it going to the perfect, shining, save the ass of rock and roll savior some of you think it's going to be? No way.

One can hope.

What's with the resurrection of the old threads?

It's not even Easter anymore FFS.

People saying this BS is as old as waiting for this album. Your a band for crying out loud! Release the stupid album, It wont be any better next year, than it was las t year.

People saying this BS is as old as waiting for this album. Your a band for crying out loud! Release the stupid album, It wont be any better next year, than it was las t year.

People saying this BS is as old as waiting for this album. Your a band for crying out loud! Release the stupid album, It wont be any better next year, than it was las t year.

I mean, they have not spoken about GNR in the past 6 years as far as I know, and suddenly they are talking about the hottest upcoming albums... and Axl was there.

i beleive that because the Guns thing got so big before and now the guns have changed with only one original member (axl himself), i beleive he is scared that all this time he has worked on this album, its going to be a flop, i beleive he thinks he's a genius, and doesnt want this to flop, he wants it to be the best rock album ever!!i beleive he wont even release it, and the original guns will reunite and record a new lot of material!!!

fact is fact, axl is scared

I hate linkin park but anyone can say they have been a huge success....

I highly doubt this.

I think the defining moment of his career was "Sweet Child O' Mine" - it's his, and Guns N Roses', most famous song and probably the only one that will be played with any regularity twenty years from now.

BUMP. Anyone?