Here Today... Gone To Hell!

With all the threads on the greatest hits and various news stories, things are getting complicated. People are getting upset about GH, losing faith in CD, getting angry, getting depressed, going on shooting sprees (ok, maybe not the last one).

I'm posting this to try and make some sense of it all. Bare with me here guys...

I understand the cynisism of many board members, hell we've been through some shit with this band, but we've got to look at things with a little logic.

1). We've lately had a sudden spurt in products starting with WTTV and UYIs on DVD, followed by this greatest hits album

2). According to a couple of sources (not proved), CD is done and the release date/promotion is being planned. Now the main point is that besides these 'rumours', Mysteron has also said the same thing, which I choose to believe because of the number of times he has proved himself to Jarmo.

3). Labels are out to make money. I'm sure we can agree on this point  ::)

Now, my deduction from these points are thus:

The record label know Chinese Democracy will be coming out soon. They also know that Contraband is coming out soon. They quite possibly have guns n roses under contract for a greatest hits.

They release Greatest Hits and the DVDs because a).They want to get the guns n roses name out there to help promote CD and b). Because of these albums coming, this is the time to get the best results out of a greatest hits financially.

Chinese Democracy is released around the same time as Contraband to generate publicity and sales. Around the same time that Rock in Rio IV is set to occur - one of Guns N Roses favourite and biggest gigs.

Other notes:
1). A reason they decided to postpone greatest hits was because CD wasn't quite ready.
2). Axl doesn't want greatest hits because it'll draw attention to VR, and he wants to draw a line under the new band.


Now..... someone tell me something more plausible.

@~$%Muther

Is that possible? Maybe Geffen expected more music to be released by know, maybe GH's has been planned this whole time.    8)

Speak for yourself..... :hihi:

I think all your points are sound.....to be honest i have no idea whats going on - if there is a plan I'm obviously far too stupid to see it....

I don't speak for everyone, I just said some people are getting mad, etc.

As far as a plan goes? I don't know either. This just seems to make sense to me business wise. And lets face it, that's what it's all about for the labels.

Someone came up with a stupid(?) rumour that GH was always planned for release a few months before CD. It could well be a possibility, or it could be something that was decided on recently

@#$%Muther

It doesn't seem plausible from a business perspective. A Greatest Hits  with a poor tracklisting of old songs isn't going to promote the band in any way. If it contained something new I'd completely agree with you but it's obvious they didn't put a lot of thought into it. If this was done to promote the band I think it would contain something new and interesting to get people talking. Who is going to get excited over a half-assed cd of old songs?

If it was done to promote CD I don't think Axl would be so against it. If he was, they surely wouldn't continue on with it knowing it would cause further delays.

The bottom line is that the record company wants to make  money and their best chance at making money is by releasing CD. Believe me if it was ready to go within the next 6 months they'd be spending their time maximizing their chances to make money on CD, not wasting their time on some GH which does absolutely nothing for CD. It would make much more sense from a financial perspective to release CD now and then GH later down the line not the other way around.

I Hope it's true...

It does make business sense.

1). We know all about CD, die hard fans are not being aimed for.
2). The target is getting that guns N Roses name all over shops, etc to the general public, making them remember, notice, etc. People who aren't die hard fans will not be looking for new music initially.

You don't start advertising an album in stores and stuff 3 months before release so a GH album is a way of getting the name out there.

Also, like I mentioned, If GH is part of a contract, when else are they gonna release it?  After the new album? That would be ridiculous at any time once CD is out. If it's coming then this is the ONLY time for GH

@#$%Muther

No, it doesn't make sense from a business perspective. Releasing the same  songs that gets played on the radio already does not make sense. People hear these songs already, what exactly is there to make them take notice? Like I said, if this contained a new track or a re-recorded old track it would make sense, but it's just the same ol' stuff that we hear on the radio as it is. It looks like very little effort has went into this so who exactly is going to get excited over this? Very few people will get excited over this. When you are promoting something your goal is for maximum exposure, which this clearly does not do.
This simply reeks of an easy and quick way to make a few bucks.

Oh yeah..... there's that as well. I don't think it makes the greatest business sense. I agree it's just been thrown together. What I mean is if they wanted to make a quick buck out of GH and have a little publicity, now's the time. When else could they do this?

I don't think it's the major huge marketing scheme for CD or anything

@#$%Muther

I agree.  Wasn't the title to Geffen's press release about the GH something along the lines of "never before".  

CD must be near... which is why they have to get the GH out of the way...
problem is... its not far enough out of the way.  they should have done this before...
the timing is just bad from the bands point of view and us fans of the new GN'R who would prefer if the spotlight was reserved for the new band and the new music.
The record company just wants to cash in on the old band while they still can

As far as competiton/hype and comparisons between VR's release and GN'R's release its inevitable...  though I don't think there will be much musical basis for comparison

You brought up some interesting points that I agree with.  Now that we know that greatest hits will be released. (probably)  It does make sense that it was orginally delayed so it can be delivered around the same time that Chinese Democracy will be released.    

And for everyone that has been saying that this greatest hits cd has a poor track listing, try to listen to me for a sec.  When I first heard about what songs have been chosen, I was like WTF?  Now I am like, thats smart.  They chose all of the songs that have been the most succesful in the music business which means that these songs have made the most money for Geffen.  Just read any of the media reports about the GH.  They talk about this song was #1 for a while and this song was #3 for a while and so forth.  The song selection might not be the fans favorite choices but they were chosen because geffen figured out that if they chose all of the songs that made the most money as singles and put them together we have a big money machine AKA greatest hits album.  Anyways, just my thought about it.  

Very good point. GH is there just to make some money from the general public. There is no way they could do this after CD is released. People will be buying Chinese Democracy. GH would be redundant.

There are two possibilities being mentioned for the release of GH being now:

1). To put pressure on Axl to release CD. I don't buy it cus all members/mysteron/other sources point to CD being very close, so why put the pressure on now? Why not a year ago?

2). CD is close, and GH is part of the build up as discussed above.

@#$%Muther

It could all be a major coverup. Same thing happened before the Illusions came out. Announcing a GH album.

Death Kube K,

With that mentioned, how or what was the reaction from the fans then regarding a GH release?  None of us had internet or computers then (I know I didn't).....does anyone remember if there was a big stink about a GH album coming out then?

I don't remember anything about a Greatest Hits release in 1991.

I remember hearing rumors that they might release EPs with different themes back in the late 80s.



/jarmo

Everyone needs to chill out.  GNR is scheduled to play in May.  Let's see what Axl does then.  Forget about the Greatest Hits.  Don't buy it and see what Axl does in May.

I don't know how widespread it was, but at least two employees at two major music retailers were convinced that a GH was coming out in September '91.  That's what they told me when I asked 'em about Gn'R, and they were both floored when Billboard broke the "Illusion" release date story in August '91.
I don't know if the label had anything to do with this or not, but it is interesting, I think.
/Mike

There are two scenarios where a GH would make decent business sense:

a) CD is nowhere in site and the label wants to recoup some of it's investment.  They'll attract casual fans, and probably some new rock fans, who want to sample the album. Also, considering it's relative proximity to the VR release, you'll get new VR fans who might want to sample some of the band members old material.  Remember, they don't need to sell lots of units to make money on this, because costs to produce are relatively small.

b) CD is very close.  GH can drum up band exposure in the short term (debatebly, admittedly, considering this material is all from the old lineup), and in the long term offer new fans, created by the release of CD, a cheap way to sample GnR's back catalog without having to invest in 5 albums (6 in you include Live Era).

The question is...which scenario are we gonna get...

It was on release lists, at least at US retailers, as a GH release in late June/early July of '91 right up through August when Billboard broke the "Illusions" story.  I know that amongst my friends, it wasn't so much outrage as it was a "WTF?  They only have 2 (really 1.5) albums...how are they going to compile a GH album?"

That's weird since most fans knew about the Use Your Illusion albums months in advance.

I mean, they were on tour since May 1991 and Axl kept talking about the albums, why would they release a Greatest Hits in Aug/Sep 1991?

Wait, that reminds me of some more recent events.....  :hihi:

I remember reading articles where they said UYI was coming in early 1991, then summer 1991 and then September 16th. Don't remember anything about a GH.  :confused:


/jarmo

I agree, it was weird.  And we did all know that the UYI albums were coming.  But, like CD (well, maybe not JUST like it, but like it in a microcosm), the UYI albums kept getting pushed back.  They had no "real" release date.   Then, in late June/early July (can't remember exactly when..but I know we were on Summer Vacation from school), the GH album appeared on the release lists at all the local record stores.  And the response was as I described above.  Nobody (at least not any of us) ever thought it could be a "cover" for the UYI albums...that was something no one had ever done before.  Then, in August, Billboard broke the story about the release date...which was the same date as the GH album.  Within days (a day, maybe..hard to remember), the GH album was gone from the lists and the UYI albums appeared in it's place.

hang on a GH was replaced by UYI how long before the actual release.

Is it too far fetched to think the same thing is gonna happen again?

Is all this suing business a cover up, surely that's too ridiculous. That would be the cover up of all time!

Would be great tho  :drool:

@#$%Muther